Silent Star 1: Lunacy

[midwaybear]

im pretty sure mt is town
i think I townread everyone who is trying to do the poe solve. IDK why though. votato is townie, MT is townie, and clover is also somewhat townie.
pedit: indeed, because votato asked me to post one so I did

[Hectic]

¶

Votecount 1.14

[2] skitter30:

Kanna, Nahdia

[1] lilith2013:

Tuxedo Mask

[1] Tuxedo Mask:

Clover Ebi

[1] Nahdia:

skitter

[1] Raven Branwen:

lilith2013

[1] drusilla:

beeboy

[1] midwaybear:

Dunnstral

[5] Not Voting:

drusilla, Raven Branwen, Morning Tweet, Starbuck, midwaybear

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to throw someone down the well.
The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-07-10 09:18:09).
V/LA section.

[Clover Ebi]

I really liked 754, it read to me like townie pushback to a bad read. MT, nothing actually pings me so far, so weak townlean for now.

Hm, I think Skitter has brought up some valid points though. Do I agree with all of them? No, but do I think it's just a bad read that you can dismiss? Nope. Why don't you tell me what about it is bad and I'll give you my own thoughts after. I get your read on Skitter is semi scummy so maybe I can give some new insight on it.

LHF to me has never really been something I paid much attention to and more so tried to look at the posts itself of said LHF.
pedit: @

Mod

is my vote not on midway? I thought it has been for ages
VOTE: MidwayVOTE:

[Clover Ebi]

VOTE: midway NOOOOO

[Clover Ebi]

im pretty sure mt is town
i think I townread everyone who is trying to do the poe solve. IDK why though. votato is townie, MT is townie, and clover is also somewhat townie.
pedit: indeed, because votato asked me to post one so I did

Oh I guess that makes a bit more sense, but if Votato did ask you for a reads list how did you get each of those reads?

[midwaybear]

my gut. I didn't feel beeboy's entrance was a scum entrance, votato was townie because he seemed to be trying to scumhunt and sorta people(like me), lillith because she wanted directness when scum would be fine with vague, and mt was mostly tone but she also seemed to be trying to scumhunt.
I think dunnstral is town now too, and I would move tuxedo lower.

[Clover Ebi]

Hmmmmm I can't wagon Starbuck I would feel bad. I could move to Tux...but I don't have a reason to really move either.

This is why I don't try to lead wagons much.

[Clover Ebi]

Like, I understand your response, but it doesn't really change my opinion on the situation much.

[midwaybear]

I don't know who to vote either
probably taking a look at kanna and drusilla later

[Raven Branwen]

I really liked 754, it read to me like townie pushback to a bad read. MT, nothing actually pings me so far, so weak townlean for now.

Hm, I think Skitter has brought up some valid points though. Do I agree with all of them? No, but do I think it's just a bad read that you can dismiss? Nope. Why don't you tell me what about it is bad and I'll give you my own thoughts after. I get your read on Skitter is semi scummy so maybe I can give some new insight on it.

LHF to me has never really been something I paid much attention to and more so tried to look at the posts itself of said LHF.
pedit: @

Mod

is my vote not on midway? I thought it has been for ages
VOTE: MidwayVOTE:

I definitely disliked Nahdia’s earlier posting because it looked like she was often contradicting herself but her recent posting has been good, particularly her pushback against the scumreads on her. 754 as I previously stated, reads like a townie reaction. I’m not saying that Skitter has no reason to have qualms about Nahdia but I don’t understand why she is so tunnelled on her. To have Nahdia in her PoE is one thing but I don’t know why she isn’t looking at any other slots. I do agree with you though, it would be a bad look as scum. I just don’t understand why she seems to be so confibiased on that slot. It’s somewhat concerning to me that it’s looking to me like she’s more interested in confibiasing her than sorting. I used to deathtunnel a lot and now I try to listen more to other people’s reads.

[Morning Tweet]

I am really sorry i havent been able to reread, i have needed more time than i though. I am near certain lilith is town this game so my preemptive guess is i will scrutinize whoever was pushing her earlier

For now,

VOTE: Raven

[lilith2013]

Spoiler:

Can you explain what you think I should have done instead when I didn't have enough information to feel like I could scumread you?

You gave about the answer I expected. I understand wanting to pressure people that are present in the thread. Though I do still find it weird you didn't acknowledge my posts after my push on Beeboy, or how others responded to those posts. Like you were apparently mindmelding on Beeboy, so did that mindmeld break when they gave reasons for unvoting me, or did you agree? Also, you say now you can continue pursuing it now that you know my view of Dunn, is this it? I kind of thought there would be more for the follow up.

What posts do you want me to acknowledge? I was catching up on like 300 posts, I only commented on the stuff I thought was important.

My reads have diverged from beeboy's but that doesn't mean my original reasons for townreading him aren't still valid. As I said, the fact that he was having thoughts so similar to mine is a good sign his thought processes are town thought processes, and I think beeboy really got engaged with the conversations that were happening and wasn't afraid to give his opinions on the wagon that was happening at the time. iirc you disagreed with my description of what happened, but I don't really feel like it's worth arguing with that because you basically seem to have locked in your idea of what happened and I don't wanna put in the effort to argue if I don't think the argument will be successful (ie by changing your mind).

Your continual lack of read on Dunn is problematic, for much the same reasons I was scumreading nahdia. Dunn's wagon was the first big event in this game and instead of giving your opinion on Dunn, you latched onto beeboy instead. That reads as if you are uncomfortable with interacting with the main wagon. The "read" you gave me in response was basically a non-read, so it feels like you went straight for beeboy without thinking about what beeboy's motiviations would have been in defending the dunn wagon there and what that would indicate about dunn's alignment. That's a missing link that I often can't replicate when I'm scum.

I mean if you're talking about Beeboy V. Me I would have expected you to comment on how it concluded. It seems like an odd omission from your catch up.

I don't think breaking a mind-meld with someone implies you don't read them as town. However, since you were hopping on a bunch of Beeboy's posts to comment that you agree and it was the conclusion of Beeboy V. Me I did expect something like "what are you guys doing he doesn't have a Dunn read?" or "I wouldn't unvote here." You know what I'm saying, it feels like a missing link.

Okay now you’re literally using the words I used about you

I talked to beeboy already about that, and at the time you had yet to respond to me about whether you had a read on dunn so that wasn’t something I felt I could bring up as an argument because I didn’t know whether you had a read on dunn when I asked beeboy about you.

I already said that I only commented on things I thought were important. During my catch-up I was more focused on how other people were responding to your interactions with beeboy, as well as the lack of Dunn read from you that persisted, so I guess I didn’t think the ending if the interaction itself was notable.

You really seem to want to 1v1 me here, and like.. your reaction to my one question to you was way overblown. Why are you coming after me so hard? Is it because you saw that dunnstral was called town for pushing me and you want the townpoints too? Sorry, no townpoints for you.

In post 488, lilith2013 wrote:
Idk if it’s really as easy as raven/nahdia but that’s kind of where I’m at

Can you elaborate on this? Something about it feels very off.

You didn't address this. What did you mean here?

both in my poe -> both had posts that pinged me -> I think both might be scum. What's "off" about this progression?

Why is like 80% of your content in the last several days focused on me?

This is what interests me at the moment.

I didn't complain about the progression. You asked if it was really so easy as Raven/Nahida, and then said that's where you
are at. That implies you view them as the scum team. Now this pinged me because its a closed set up, and this comes off like a scum slip. Because you seem to think we're looking for two scum. Why?

.........

I’m used to playing in micros. For whatever reason, I always initially think it’s two scum. I realized after I made that post that it likely was a three-man scumteam, but I still stand behind that post. Even if they’re not

the

scumteam, I’m still POEd down to them somewhat.

Why do you think it’s likely to be a “three-man scumteam” and if your initial belief was that it was two, then how are you seeing Tux as thinking this as a scumslip?

13 players -> most likely 3 scum based on ms meta?

I think Tux has picked me to tunnel in much the same way he seemed to have picked beeboy to tunnel, without showing any development in the read but rather as if he had decided that he was going to push me and picked whatever posts he could find that he could remotely paint as scummy. I wanted to save this for after he responded to me but basically his pushes on both me and beeboy don’t have that feeling of weaving the underlying threads of gamesolving, they feel like isolated interactions that he can’t link to other thoughts about the game. The “missing link” that I mentioned.

[Raven Branwen]

I am really sorry i havent been able to reread, i have needed more time than i though. I am near certain lilith is town this game so my preemptive guess is i will scrutinize whoever was pushing her earlier

For now,

VOTE: Raven

Why?


Do you usually just drop naked votes on players without any explanation?

[lilith2013]

UNVOTE:

I need to reevaluate some things. MT makes me really uncomfortable with how hard she is townreading me for reasons I can’t find. having a lot of second thoughts on votato’s lack of engagement with clover who was supposed to be his strongest scumread and then apparent passiveness in trying to sort the people he put in his poe.

[lilith2013]

I’m having a lot of second thoughts about votato^

[lilith2013]

Kanna, why did you join and why did you leave the nahdia wagon?

[lilith2013]

True, I have seen that as well, so I don’t understand why either Lillith or Skitter think it suspicious that neither Nahdia nor I are being wagoned. My point was that it has been scum more often than town that has tended to go after the least charismatic slots. That’s exactly what happened in the game where I referenced RC for example. Both scum and town deathtunnelled LHF!Lovebird in that game and incorrectly townread scum!Formerfish. He had a real uphill battle convincing everyone that he was right. That’s why I’m always wary when I see LHF getting wagoned, especially on D1. Not saying LHF can never be scum, just that low charisma is a very poor barometer for reading someone on D1 anyway

My point is that if you’re supposed to be LHF, why is no one else jumping on these wagons? I know I’m town and if you’re also town/LHF then scum should have leaped at the chance to gain momentum on your lynch by following my lead.

[lilith2013]

Raven do you have any reaction to my 693 and 694? You seemed to be insisting for evidence of what skitter and I were saying and I gave you my evidence and you keep ignoring me

[lilith2013]

I can't find any follow-up engagement with clover where votato tries to engage and sort clover more, and he only started questioning clover again after I did.

pedit: my reads on you and nahdia started as independent reads.

nahdia chose to defend you, which links you whether you want it or not.

Please explain HOW? Kanna and Tux have also defended me. Are they “linked” to me as well?

I don’t think Tux has defended you? seems like he is more just taking any post I make and trying to paint me as scummy with it.

Kanna just said “I think she’s town” but I don’t feel like she was particularly advocating against your lynch.

Nahdia argued with me point for point as if she really didn’t want you to be lynched.

All three of those situations are wildly different.

[lilith2013]

What I don’t understand is why MWB so strongly tr him for that?

Okay, what’s your read on midway then?

[Raven Branwen]

Spoiler:

True, I have seen that as well, so I don’t understand why either Lillith or Skitter think it suspicious that neither Nahdia nor I are being wagoned. My point was that it has been scum more often than town that has tended to go after the least charismatic slots. That’s exactly what happened in the game where I referenced RC for example. Both scum and town deathtunnelled LHF!Lovebird in that game and incorrectly townread scum!Formerfish. He had a real uphill battle convincing everyone that he was right. That’s why I’m always wary when I see LHF getting wagoned, especially on D1. Not saying LHF can never be scum, just that low charisma is a very poor barometer for reading someone on D1 anyway

My point is that if you’re supposed to be LHF, why is no one else jumping on these wagons? I know I’m town and if you’re also town/LHF then scum should have leaped at the chance to gain momentum on your lynch by following my lead.

Not necessarily, scum doesn’t always jump on LHF but it happens more often than not but I think this take is wifom.

Spoiler:

Raven do you have any reaction to my 693 and 694? You seemed to be insisting for evidence of what skitter and I were saying and I gave you my evidence and you keep ignoring me

Raven do you have any reaction to my 693 and 694? You seemed to be insisting for evidence of what skitter and I were saying and I gave you my evidence and you keep ignoring me

I was initially very suspicious of Nahdia but I don’t agree with yours and Skitter’s take.

Spoiler:

I can't find any follow-up engagement with clover where votato tries to engage and sort clover more, and he only started questioning clover again after I did.

pedit: my reads on you and nahdia started as independent reads.

nahdia chose to defend you, which links you whether you want it or not.

Please explain HOW? Kanna and Tux have also defended me. Are they “linked” to me as well?

I don’t think Tux has defended you? seems like he is more just taking any post I make and trying to paint me as scummy with it.

Kanna just said “I think she’s town” but I don’t feel like she was particularly advocating against your lynch.

Nahdia argued with me point for point as if she really didn’t want you to be lynched.

All three of those situations are wildly different.

Yes, but you’re conveniently ignoring the fact that you and Skitter keep pushing us together. No one has done that with either me and Kanna or me and Tux.

[Raven Branwen]

What I don’t understand is why MWB so strongly tr him for that?

Okay, what’s your read on midway then?

Ironically, one thing I did like about votato’s posting is he wanted more time to sort out MWB. I’m not sure who to vote for yet but I’m sort of getting the feeling that MT is buddying you and I’m also not tr Skitter’s deathtunnell on Nahdia, so rn, I think I’d prefer either to MWB.

[lilith2013]

Spoiler:

True, I have seen that as well, so I don’t understand why either Lillith or Skitter think it suspicious that neither Nahdia nor I are being wagoned. My point was that it has been scum more often than town that has tended to go after the least charismatic slots. That’s exactly what happened in the game where I referenced RC for example. Both scum and town deathtunnelled LHF!Lovebird in that game and incorrectly townread scum!Formerfish. He had a real uphill battle convincing everyone that he was right. That’s why I’m always wary when I see LHF getting wagoned, especially on D1. Not saying LHF can never be scum, just that low charisma is a very poor barometer for reading someone on D1 anyway

My point is that if you’re supposed to be LHF, why is no one else jumping on these wagons? I know I’m town and if you’re also town/LHF then scum should have leaped at the chance to gain momentum on your lynch by following my lead.

Not necessarily, scum doesn’t always jump on LHF but it happens more often than not but I think this take is wifom.

How is this wifom exactly? Scum want to mislynch people; I agree on the point that scum often go for LHF because they’re easy to mislynch. It’s really weird that out of both your wagon and the nahdia wagon, neither skitter nor I got any support there (although tbh if you flip town, I think that implicates votato and MT and I’m starting to doubt them for other reasons so I might be coming around to you actually being LHF. I’m just still trying to figure out why it felt so difficult to get people to vote you.)

Do you think I’m scum?

Spoiler:

I can't find any follow-up engagement with clover where votato tries to engage and sort clover more, and he only started questioning clover again after I did.

pedit: my reads on you and nahdia started as independent reads.

nahdia chose to defend you, which links you whether you want it or not.

Please explain HOW? Kanna and Tux have also defended me. Are they “linked” to me as well?

I don’t think Tux has defended you? seems like he is more just taking any post I make and trying to paint me as scummy with it.

Kanna just said “I think she’s town” but I don’t feel like she was particularly advocating against your lynch.

Nahdia argued with me point for point as if she really didn’t want you to be lynched.

All three of those situations are wildly different.

Yes, but you’re conveniently ignoring the fact that you and Skitter keep pushing us together. No one has done that with either me and Kanna or me and Tux.

I don’t think I was doing that before nahdia started defending you, only after? I mentioned your names together but only because I thought you were both scummy, not because I saw anything partner-indicative. It was only after the nahdia defense that I thought came off really strong that I started thinking about it that way.

[Raven Branwen]

UNVOTE:

I need to reevaluate some things. MT makes me really uncomfortable with how hard she is townreading me for reasons I can’t find. having a lot of second thoughts on votato’s lack of engagement with clover who was supposed to be his strongest scumread and then apparent passiveness in trying to sort the people he put in his poe.

What about Starbuck? How did her entrance affect that read?

[lilith2013]

What I don’t understand is why MWB so strongly tr him for that?

Okay, what’s your read on midway then?

Ironically, one thing I did like about votato’s posting is he wanted more time to sort out MWB. I’m not sure who to vote for yet but I’m sort of getting the feeling that MT is buddying you and I’m also not tr Skitter’s deathtunnell on Nahdia, so rn, I think I’d prefer either to MWB.

It seems like midway responded to this, did you have any thoughts on that? Quote below:

What I don’t understand is why MWB so strongly tr him for that?

I don't townread him for that; it's more like not really thinking that was scummy. I townread him for trying to sort people and scumhunt. I honestly don't think the PoE post comes from scum either.