A warlock, a werewolf, and a vampire... [Game Over]

[Gentleman 3]

One thing I have observed from previous secret alt games is that players still fall back on their common biases. Just as in any regular game, the people who are bad at expressing themselves, the people who are "weird": they tend to be the first to go. People who are well-spoken, funny, or otherwise likeable tend to stick around regardless of the rest of their behavior.

As I've said before, this is part of the reason why I think people may be townreading Gentleman 6, or opposed to his being left out. I personally think he's much better spoken and less abrasive than either Gentleman 2 or Gentleman 7, and I imagine that everyone else would agree.

I myself

have already told him that I enjoy interacting with him more than I do either of the other unpaired Gentleman and would prefer to keep him alive if I had reasons to do so.


It's really easy to convince yourself that someone who isn't great at speaking, who has truly unorthodox thought patterns, or who is otherwise just awkward is scum. It's why the same people get eliminated early game after game. It's very easy to understand what I'm saying, but I think it's a lot harder to truly internalize that we all have biases against getting rid of people we like interacting with and recognize how that might shape your opinions. I don't claim to be much better than anyone else at it, but I think that recognizing it is an important first step.

[Gentleman 3]

I'd also add it's rather hard, at least for me, to get strong scum reads at this point in the game. Most players can and choose to play in a fairly lowkey fashion (no one even has to vote yet), and that makes it hard to get positive reasons to scum read someone. The best thing to do imo is to just look at who isn't doing town things.

that's probably why usually one of the low posters ends up going out in pre-dance

This is combined with the fact that, if you look at the players sorted by post-count, it's practically an even split with Ladies being the top half and Gentlemen being the lower half. I'm not surprised that my reads on the Ladies are more defined than on the Gentlemen—they've probably got a combined double the number of posts.

[Lady 5]

Okay, L6, I think my concerns are assuaged

[Lady 6]

Gentleman 3, I accept your offer to dance.

[Gentleman 2]

Ok, I think lady Earth can pair with the prince. Or that lady who offered the princess avatar.

[Lady 6]

Okay, L6, I think my concerns are assuaged

I'm still curious what bumped me up to your top town read?

[Lady 5]

It was a couple of things, but I really liked 762 as I think my tone could very easily have been construed as aggressive and I don’t really think I was in a particularly good position in thread at the time, which I think you could have capitalised on if you were scum to push me or just brush me off

Instead I felt like you gave a very measured response and then helped in the ways I’d asked to bring me into the game. I’m aware that you might be scum who saw the opportunity for a pocket, but I generally try to bank that sort of paranoia for later. I also don’t think your initial response to me where the words “nefarious clique” were used is the way you’d start off if you were pocketing me

Then on top of that I liked the way you approached L1 and got a bit iffy about how you were trying to understand her read and not trying to defend L7

[Lady 5]

Also, just as a sidebar, I think I prefer Gaia to Earth for anyone who’s using the nicknames and not the letter-number format

[Gentleman 8]

tbh ive just been calling you "miss world" in my head

[Lady 7]

Kagerou I think if I used the names I am using in my head then no one would be able to understand me.

[Lady 5]

Also acceptable, although I’d prefer miss worldwide

[Lady 5]

Wait, I ddl spoiler tags, why didn’t they work!?

[Gentleman 4]

Ok, then I’m inclined to like G2 a little more.

[Lady 5]

Also acceptable, although I’d prefer miss worldwide

Spoiler:

I’m dumb

[Lady 5]

G4 what was it that you liked about L2?

[Gentleman 4]

G4 what was it that you liked about L2?

I liked her initial interaction with Lady 1. I think L1 outed an early scumread on her, and L2 seemed to be genuinely trying to determine the motivations behind him. I think this because L2 put L1 as an early townread, so it makes sense that she was able to sort her after the interaction.
Also, I don’t really think that she has been overly defensive either.

[Lady 4]

Ok I know G3 said he was waiting until later to develop scumreads more in-depth but his continued insistence on finding people to die based on having the least to townread them on really really bothers me. It's so fence sitty and IMO pointless.

Could you clarify on how you think it's "fence sitty"? It's not as though I'm refusing to take a stance; quite the opposite, really. I

am

taking a decisive stance. It's just that my stance is based on "negative" reasons rather than "positive" reasons, so to speak.

It seems like an excuse to fall back on if your "scumreads" flip town
Like "oh they just didn't show their towniness they should have done better"
Fence sitty maybe not the right term but I don't know what would be better

I try to avoid blaming other people when I'm wrong on someone, especially the person that I was wrong on. It's not conducive to self-improvement.

Regardless, I'm still not sure I really understand. I don't get what the material difference between that sort of excuse and someone saying "I guess I was wrong" or "Wow they played so scummily" if one of their more positive scumreads were to flip town.

Why is it that you think that my "style" (for lack of a better term) of reads is more likely to come from scum? I feel I should also say that it's not as though I've chosen to form reads this way; if I had picked up on more positive reasons to scumread an unpaired Gentleman, then I would. I haven't, and so here I am.

I suppose you're right that it's similar to just saying they played scummily or whatever
But it just gives me noncommittal vibes
I'll admit I don't think I've seen someone approach a game like this in a while

Scum wants to pair up as soon as possible. Gent 5 or Gent 9 comes into mind.

Yeah but why are the ladies excluded from this

They don't have to worry about being unpaired

Oooh fair point
I overlooked that
But a quick pairing does ensure not getting stuck with a person generally seen as scummy (like the people who are gonna be left by day end probably)

[Gentleman 6]

Ok, then I’m inclined to like G2 a little more.

What was this in reference to?

[Lady 2]

But a quick pairing does ensure not getting stuck with a person generally seen as scummy (like the people who are gonna be left by day end probably)

Does it? It could be that by random chance you paired with someone who would later turn out to be scummy.

[Gentleman 6]

One thing I have observed from previous secret alt games is that players still fall back on their common biases. Just as in any regular game, the people who are bad at expressing themselves, the people who are "weird": they tend to be the first to go. People who are well-spoken, funny, or otherwise likeable tend to stick around regardless of the rest of their behavior.

As I've said before, this is part of the reason why I think people may be townreading Gentleman 6, or opposed to his being left out. I personally think he's much better spoken and less abrasive than either Gentleman 2 or Gentleman 7, and I imagine that everyone else would agree.

I myself

have already told him that I enjoy interacting with him more than I do either of the other unpaired Gentleman and would prefer to keep him alive if I had reasons to do so.


It's really easy to convince yourself that someone who isn't great at speaking, who has truly unorthodox thought patterns, or who is otherwise just awkward is scum. It's why the same people get eliminated early game after game. It's very easy to understand what I'm saying, but I think it's a lot harder to truly internalize that we all have biases against getting rid of people we like interacting with and recognize how that might shape your opinions. I don't claim to be much better than anyone else at it, but I think that recognizing it is an important first step.

This is not a bad observation, but I can be pleasant AND town.

You've just got to get there on your own terms, buckko.

[Gentleman 8]

heh

i honestly don't understand why anyone thinks lady 6 is town. tbh she's the most likely to be scum among the ladies, from what ive read

if i had to choose someone currently unpaired to leave out, it'd probably be gentleman 4. need to think about this a bit

[Gentleman 6]

One thing I have observed from previous secret alt games is that players still fall back on their common biases. Just as in any regular game, the people who are bad at expressing themselves, the people who are "weird": they tend to be the first to go. People who are well-spoken, funny, or otherwise likeable tend to stick around regardless of the rest of their behavior.

As I've said before, this is part of the reason why I think people may be townreading Gentleman 6, or opposed to his being left out. I personally think he's much better spoken and less abrasive than either Gentleman 2 or Gentleman 7, and I imagine that everyone else would agree.

I myself

have already told him that I enjoy interacting with him more than I do either of the other unpaired Gentleman and would prefer to keep him alive if I had reasons to do so.


It's really easy to convince yourself that someone who isn't great at speaking, who has truly unorthodox thought patterns, or who is otherwise just awkward is scum. It's why the same people get eliminated early game after game. It's very easy to understand what I'm saying, but I think it's a lot harder to truly internalize that we all have biases against getting rid of people we like interacting with and recognize how that might shape your opinions. I don't claim to be much better than anyone else at it, but I think that recognizing it is an important first step.

This is not a bad observation, but I can be pleasant AND town.

You've just got to get there on your own terms, buckko.

Also, consider that I could have already asked L1 to dance, and she'd have already accepted, without me even needing to hemlock society it.

<Self-Meta>
I think scum-me here replaces in and gambits using the fact that nobody knows how much experience I'd have, pretends to be new to the setup and immediately starts looking for pair up.
</Self-meta>

[Gentleman 4]

Ok, then I’m inclined to like G2 a little more.

What was this in reference to?

Post 1050 by G3. I do think Gentleman 2's posts have been quite awkward so far, but it doesn't seem to be super agenda pushy.
I'm pretty sure Gentleman 7 is aware of what he's doing because he has posts where he's blatantly just trolling around(at least I think), so the logic doesn't apply.

heh

i honestly don't understand why anyone thinks lady 6 is town. tbh she's the most likely to be scum among the ladies, from what ive read

if i had to choose someone currently unpaired to leave out, it'd probably be gentleman 4. need to think about this a bit

oh boy...
Well I'll be here for a little bit more, so ask me any questions you may have about me.

[Gentleman 6]

I do think Gentleman 2's posts have been quite awkward so far, but it doesn't seem to be super agenda pushy.

What do you think of G2 missing that I'm a replacement entirely?

[Gentleman 4]

What do you think of G2 missing that I'm a replacement entirely?

Idk. I thought he was referring back to scarf man. I do think it's quite generous to read someone based on the fact that they seemed to be struggling with names. Both town and scum can and would make that type of post(regarding names).