Open 790 | Purgatory | Game Over!

[Dannflor]

I think pre-flip trolls are often more frustrating than they are useful, so thank you for that

[Dannflor]

I think I'm slowly coming around to a town read on both sides of the Cthulu/GC conflict, which I fear means Isis has to be scum

[Dannflor]

i think she's been towny but there's one thing that she's been doing that could mean she's demonic
gonna keep that reason to myself for now and reveal it later ; )

Cyhtutjldulu did you ever reveal this?

[Hayasaka]

I mean it works on like level 1 players.
But even then I claimed desperado once. I shot town during the day using fake bold tags.
The town said "rip me" because they didn't know how desperado worked momentarily. Also lost town the game.

[Dannflor]

yikes

[Hayasaka]

I think I'm slowly coming around to a town read on both sides of the Cthulu/GC conflict, which I fear means Isis has to be scum

I do think my bottom 3 is correct right now. :\
Wish I could stay and help but someone had to go to heaven.

I guess this does put a bit of a smile on my face though compared to being the n1 kill

[Hayasaka]

I just have this thing where Isis is treating the heaven like a night kill effectively.
While I think someone like GC who is town is although suggesting a poor strat like getting me to stay is at least trying to optimize it in a way that comes from town.
My main fear which keeps Isis as the weakest of my scum reads is that Isis is just a far more technical mind then my own, so to say I could understand her would just be a lie on my part.

[Dannflor]

that bothers me less than the timing of Isis dropping me in her reads does, although there could be some element of OMGUS here

I also think her reasons for scum reading me are... somewhat forced and contradictory to earlier comments. Like early in the game she advocated for stronger players going to heaven because they needed to solve from there. And based off that, I basically decided well I don't think I'm a very strong player so I probably should not be going. and then she accuses me of thinking so highly of myself that I want to stay. Which has a second issue of I think she knows me well enough to know that I have very low-confidence in my own ability.

I also don't really understand why she didn't ask me for further explanation on some of my town reads rather than just call me out on "not explaining them," particularly when she's witnessed me be a player who throws out a lot of reads in a somewhat erratic fashion because my mind jumps all over the place

I dunno I just can't shake the feeling that I am being pushed as scummier because I have to be and the pool of people that could possibly be mis-elimed is shrinking

[Hayasaka]

Like my thought process of we aren't going to ever lynch our 2nd best town read. So why should we heaven our top town read and lose the most valuable player.

If the 2nd best town read is scum they just get heavened right after Clidd anyway? So might as well keep Clidd around for an extra day phase to direct us after we take that hit. The only way this doesn't work is the 2-5% world we are all wrong on Clidd. But the only reason we don't want to go after the 2nd best town is we want the highest chance to hit anyway????

That feels like a super basic and easy to come up with thought so idk why Isis fundamentally just doesn't see what I am seeing. So even if our brains just work on different levels I feel meh about it still.

[Hayasaka]

I kind of don't hate a Walter heaven but it's not a clidd heaven. I kind of don't hate a Norwee heaven but it's not a clidd heaven. Both of those slots seem kind of comfortable in the game thread and lean town to me.

Ctrl+F walter in her ISO.
This being 1 of the 5 mentions sucks on so many levels

[Hayasaka]

that bothers me less than the timing of Isis dropping me in her reads does, although there could be some element of OMGUS here

I also think her reasons for scum reading me are... somewhat forced and contradictory to earlier comments. Like early in the game she advocated for stronger players going to heaven because they needed to solve from there. And based off that, I basically decided well I don't think I'm a very strong player so I probably should not be going. and then she accuses me of thinking so highly of myself that I want to stay. Which has a second issue of I think she knows me well enough to know that I have very low-confidence in my own ability.

I also don't really understand why she didn't ask me for further explanation on some of my town reads rather than just call me out on "not explaining them," particularly when she's witnessed me be a player who throws out a lot of reads in a somewhat erratic fashion because my mind jumps all over the place

I dunno I just can't shake the feeling that I am being pushed as scummier because I have to be and the pool of people that could possibly be mis-elimed is shrinking

ugh... I hate leaving here. I just feel like I opened up another world of topics I want to talk about.

[Isis]

Walter's last post or two creeps me out but I can't put my finger on it.

Re: me wanting to heaven Walter at some point, I didn't remember saying that and found it was a throwaway comment I had made about it being ok-ish to heaven Walter or Norwee. I was townleaning each of them when I made the post and didn't expect either to be very readable in the future, Norwee is kind of a palm read and I didn't expect Walter to change frequencies that much with his style and volume. I don't actually remember how much thought I was giving those factors since it was a moot topic; I preferred clidd.

[WaltertheDunce10]

That is intersting Dann
I think I will do some isos while we wait

[Dannflor]

I don't know how to read Norweegian

[Hayasaka]

Kill walter on scum Heaven GC.
Evaluate after that?

On Walter town we should probably slow down a bit.

[Hayasaka]

Actually if walter flips town judgement day is on me... fuck

[Isis]

that bothers me less than the timing of Isis dropping me in her reads does, although there could be some element of OMGUS here

I also think her reasons for scum reading me are... somewhat forced and contradictory to earlier comments. Like early in the game she advocated for stronger players going to heaven because they needed to solve from there. And based off that, I basically decided well I don't think I'm a very strong player so I probably should not be going. and then she accuses me of thinking so highly of myself that I want to stay. Which has a second issue of I think she knows me well enough to know that I have very low-confidence in my own ability.

I also don't really understand why she didn't ask me for further explanation on some of my town reads rather than just call me out on "not explaining them," particularly when she's witnessed me be a player who throws out a lot of reads in a somewhat erratic fashion because my mind jumps all over the place

I dunno I just can't shake the feeling that I am being pushed as scummier because I have to be and the pool of people that could possibly be mis-elimed is shrinking

You really gonna post a transformative paraphrase of one of my posts and hope people don't click the link or follow too closely Dflor? In that post I was rebutting Norwee saying "heavening people is bad because they don't get to solve anymore" "actually they can". I didn't say they need to get heavened
You're getting really stretchy

[Dannflor]

why do you assume I'm being manipulative/malicious over misunderstanding

Norwee said stronger players staying behind is good

You said no, that's wrong

as far as I understand

[Isis]

I also don't really understand why she didn't ask me for further explanation on some of my town reads rather than just call me out on "not explaining them," particularly when she's witnessed me be a player who throws out a lot of reads in a somewhat erratic fashion because my mind jumps all over the place

Not discussing your reasonings unprompted was what I was reading. It wasn't the assumption those reasons don't exist (I expect you thought about them even if you're scum)
It's not a surefire indicator of your alignment but I am running out of people who can be scum too.

[Isis]

why do you assume I'm being manipulative/malicious over misunderstanding

Norwee said stronger players staying behind is good

You said no, that's wrong

as far as I understand

That is not what the post says

"Milk is good for you because it has vitamin C"
"Actually milk doesn't have vitamin C"
"Isis thinks milk isn't good for you"

This isn't hard.

[Dannflor]

It's not a surefire indicator of your alignment but I am running out of people who can be scum too.

What are your GC/Cthulu thoughts?

[Isis]

And I assume it's malicious over misunderstanding because it seems like so much effort to reach a gotcha, when I have consistently presented my philosophy on heavening over and over this phase. It's not clear. I don't think you'd think my philosophy was different and would reread it more times to reconcile it with my other posts and dismiss this rather basic "I disagree with A && B =/= I disagree with A".
Narset's progression on the topic has been much fairer

[Dannflor]

This isn't hard.

I mean you literally said norwegian's "good town strategy" of not wanting good town players to go to heaven was backwards? I interpreted that to mean that strong town players should go to heaven.

Instead you actually just meant that solving occurs both in thread and heaven and the strength of players shouldn't be a factor? sorry if I seem obtuse I think my brain is just stuck on this or something

[Dannflor]

And I assume it's malicious over misunderstanding because it seems like so much effort to reach a gotcha, when I have consistently presented my philosophy on heavening over and over this phase. It's not clear. I don't think you'd think my philosophy was different and would reread it more times to reconcile it with my other posts and dismiss this rather basic "I disagree with A && B =/= I disagree with A".
Narset's progression on the topic has been much fairer

You've been pushing clidd all phase I don't think that's inconsistent with thinking our stronger town players should go to heaven

[Isis]

GC is scum and Cthylla is

pocketing me with my favorite way to be townread

town. It doesn't have to do with their interaction necessitating any distribution. I just independently think GC's posts are scummy and Cthylla's are townier although I'm still paranoid about wordhammer and some things.
I'm not sure enough that GC is scum to feel confident I'm right when clidd and Narset seem to have thought about it and are confident about it.