In post 436, shellyc wrote:mundivore can you explain further your read on satis as they're pretty townie
worsty isnt happening so VOTE: Arthur
bluebells I want a readslist asap
I think Satisfaction is probably town, but I think NK15 had good points with their initial scumcase against him—I find it particularly frustrating the way Satisfaction started acting like conftown the second he got off of E-1. Main reason I'd go for a Satisfaction elim is that it's an information dense elim... there was a lot of interesting interaction in that early Satisfaction wagon, and getting to see his role card would tell us a lot about the alignments of other people.
In post 475, Mundivore wrote:I think Satisfaction is probably town, but I think NK15 had good points with their initial scumcase against him—I find it particularly frustrating the way Satisfaction started acting like conftown the second he got off of E-1. Main reason I'd go for a Satisfaction elim is that it's an information dense elim... there was a lot of interesting interaction in that early Satisfaction wagon, and getting to see his role card would tell us a lot about the alignments of other people.
an information-dense elim on town is a really bad elim on several levels fwiw
run two solves: one ~in general~, one on the assumption he's town. how do things look?
i think that's roughly how you've approached the game, but
we can elim slimier players for the same result.
I mean, any elim is bad if you assume that the player is town lmao. If it gives the town more info, it's a mitigating factor compared to if it's a miselim on a rando (b/c scum already have all the information).
In any case, my preference for a Satisfaction elim is barely higher than my preference for a shellyc elim. However, Arthur elim looks pretty viable with shelly joining the wagon and you and Satisfaction both expressing interest.
VOTE: Arthur to
E-2
(AND I COUNTED TWO OR THREE TIMES AND I'M PRETTY SURE THAT'S RIGHT)
In post 486, shellyc wrote:Can you entertain counterfactuals and look in a world which I am town, because I REALLY AM TOWN?
sure - arthur is still scum i think? i have no idea who his partner would be. pretty lukewarm on just yeeting blueb out of a catapult tho. her reads need to develop & catch up but she's probably just best handled by night actions or something.
ah yeah obligatory night action fun: if we get a scumflip today, jailkeeper + tracker targets who go nowhere are guaranteed to be town, if they don't go anywhere (as they would not have done the nightkill)
obviously cop & friendly neighbour results are guaranteed : )
if we don't get a scumflip, jailkeeper is best served acting like a doctor and trying to protect someone from the scum nk
if someone can get an alignment result on blueb, maybe nk15, or one of {shelly,me} it'll make the post-claim game real easy
Noraa did 3 things this game. None were controversial. 1) Chatted with Arthur about my intro, 2) asked Not Known why he sheep voted at me with no comment, and 3) hopped on the Arthur wagon behind Mundivore.
Clark posted almost only fluff (the only player who I had no read intel on at all when I was at E-1). Oh and he voted Arthur.
221: TW replaces in for Noraa and scumreads Clark during his initial catchup (along with Arthur, everybody's favorite miselim). However, he gives essentially no reason. I believe this is TW distancing. Giving a scumread with no substantial case separates them but doesn't convince the town that Clark is scum, leaving them both cleaner.
Shelly subs in for Clark and all hell breaks loose. Shelly finds a few picky things about TW that call into question his motivations but it's really similar to my case on Arthur in that it feels like digging into technicalities and communication style rather than actually finding scum-motivated behavior. They lay into each other. Nobody else can really gather any meaningful takeaway from it. It smells town versus town. I believe this is intentional. Neither of them gave a case for the other that was convincing to the rest of us.
Especially interesting to me is how TW seems to have a very weak case against shelly. He doesn't seem to actually try to present a case, he points to his authority as somebody who has recently lost against shelly. Reminder: both players are calling for the others' head at this point and they are both experienced players who know how to communicate their cases.
Now at this point, something interesting happens. First, the town gets a friendly reminder from the largely town-read Mundivore. We are running low on time. Egix comes in and expresses the same concern. I begin writing up my Arthur vote and I see shelly has jumped over to him in my preview.
I make the E-2 vote behind her and I write it out explicitly in my post:
Two minutes later, shelly declares it is actually E-1 and asks somebody to force a claim.
I re-assert the count and tell her how she may have miscounted. She is wrong.
the worst expresses intent to hammer. A hammer that by now he should know he isn't holding.
Shelly again says that Arthur is E-1. She is still wrong. This is a full six minutes after the first time I wrote the count.
I quickly unvote. This is now officially the scummiest thing that has happened in the game. This sort of "blood in the water" heat seeking missile behavior is 100% scum shelly. This is her game.
Shelly provides an incorrect vote count. She's now supposedly miscounted twice? Her pedit is just a series of questions marks at my unvote. Why oh why am I holding up progress?
This was an organized gambit to get a role claim from Arthur. The timing was not an accident. That two different experienced players miscounted (one of them miscounting more than once?) is unlikely. They thought they could do this and brush it off as a simple accident. They thought they bought that with their doubledeckeringTM
