Open 801: Trust Fall (Game Over)

[Equinox]

Trust Count 2.02

Gloria Cleary (1) - Necessary Sneasel

Not Trusting (7) - Fidget, Gloria Cleary, Jake The Wolfie, PookyTheMagicalBear, Rainbow Reads, shellyc, Akarin

The deadline is Thursday, December 17, 2020, at 8:00 PM EST (UTC-5), which is in (expired on 2020-12-17 20:00:00).

[Fidget]

Fidget!

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You're in the best position out of anyone in the game to choose because you already know one of the three of you's alignments..

In any case, doing something that we can read you off of would be *fantastic*. And helpful to a town wincon.

[Gloria Cleary]

hectic is sneaky

HURT: hectic

this is a bit serious i don't get the Hectic Townvibes yet and the iso has a fluff to seriousposting ratio that i dislike

Did you point this out anywhere? Hectic is very bold

[Gloria Cleary]

I agree with Gloria's thoughts on Rainbow, those same posts have me worried too.

I'm just also worried that it's not

that

much and I don't agree with her logic on Jake being town. Actually I don't agree with her logic on

me

being town in one of those posts, a lot of people were putting Hectic in definitely-not-scum territory, I don't think people trying to interfere with that in subtle ways means anything.

Well my point was that both you and Sneasel were competition for Hectic escape and Sneasel couldn’t have really known what Uncrowned would do right?

[Gloria Cleary]

EBWOP

I don't think people trying to interfere with that in subtle ways means anything.

I don't think people trying to interfere with the

pairing

is what I mean. Hectic would have probably paired on D2 instead of D1 if Gloria and I had left or whatever, don't think people encouraging... counterwagons? is a very meaningful thing to look at.

Phrased that too ambiguously.

Yeah that’s true but I still feel bad for helping out scum!Hectic.

[Gloria Cleary]

My only issue is that would Hectic be this content to leave with inactive buddy RR. or was he that confident that RR would get paired before Jake/Pooky?

Don't think Hectic meant to leave so quick, and even then, I'm not really sure what Hectic could do to save Rainbow, exactly. He was always going to leave before Rainbow does, that much was inevitable.

Hectic seemed to be baiting Uncrowned to prove he was town by NOT trusting him, so we don’t know if Hectic even wanted to be tf’d first. It could have just easily have been a gambit to make himself look like like obvtown later. So. that makes Jake’s Uncrowned shade not look great.

Maybe it’s Jake? I still think it could be RR but Idk.

Pooky did seem to try to get Hectic to tf him and I could see Hectic not wanting to as a possible attempt to make Pooky look like a buddy.

Also why would scum!Pooky say Jake seems like “demotivated town”? Wouldn’t that be counterproductive to his wincon?

And then there’s Pooky’s refusal to tf with me but endorsing us tfing together. I’m also not extremely happy with RR lack of motivation.

However Jake trying really hard to get Pooky who was at the bottom of most people’s readslists at the time to tf with him, is kind if concerning.

While I would absolutely hate to be bamboozled by scum!Pooky again, I don’t really think it’s him. I think scum!Pooky is extremely good at looking like fake obvtown if Hideyoshi is any example. And he seemed pretty happy with me (arguably his strongest defender) and Akarin being tf’d D1. I would think that scum!Pooky would try to find a way to try to keep me in the game as long as possible so I could advocate for him. If I’m scum!Pooky’s pocket, is it really in his interest to have me leave so early?

[Gloria Cleary]

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Explain this?

[Gloria Cleary]

I think an Akarin-Jake pairing would be good :3

Why does scum!Pooky do this?

[Akarin]

#905 is a pretty good case for Sneasel-Pooky and just letting Equinox sort Jake-RR out.

I kind of want to take our time on this, but I guess I wouldn't mind if we wanted to roll the dice sooner.

[Gloria Cleary]

Jake/Uncrowned

I will dub your pair

Beautiful Innocence! :3

And this.

[Gloria Cleary]

why dont you trusssst me ??

Should I? How shamelessly would you buddy me if you were scum? Be honest.

why would i feel shame when I wub you??

So this is NAI lol

I adore you too, but trust and adoration are two different things... show me your SOUL

I don’t really see this as scum theatre, Could obviously be wrong but I’d be more inclined to view Pooky as scum if Hectic had flipped town. It makes perfect sense for Pooky to want to have tf’d Hectic and give Hectic the chance to make himself look townie in this exchange.

Because later he tried to get me, Akarin and Fidget NOT to trust Hectic. Pooky trying to get Akarin-Jake and Akarin-Uncrowned and later Akarin-me is really really odd for him to be doing as scum.

Like if I didn’t know Hectic was scum, I’d think it could be Pooky/Jake but we know that’s impossible. And then he was opposed to Fidget-Sneasel. I would think scum!Pooky would want that pair to escape sooner than later. And then there’s the gut lack of paranoia I’m experiencing and it’s not for a lack of trying.

Scum!Pooky always has an agenda if you look hard enough. What is it in this game because I can’t see any that fits with him being scum here.

In Hideyoshi he hard defended his buddy Bulge like if he’s scum here. his play here is super weird.

Based off of tone, I still think it’s RR. Plus Hectic seemed to be kind of upset at the RR scumreads. I just picked up this sense that Hectic seemed kind of bothered by that. That’s why I called it “passionate” because he seemed a bit too upset about that which pinged me. Like a kind of scum panic like oh no, my buddy’s getting sr kind of thing.

[Fidget]

Rainbow reads was really chatty in this game (town) by comparison. They challenged people a fair bit. Not really much in the way of explaining their reads, though.

Again also chatty in comparison in this game (town) too. Still they don't really explain reads much.

Talked a lot here too (town).

Rainbow actually made a bunch of short, game-related posts in all three of those games. They didn't have readslists except for one game where they had a couple. Here, they are 100% readslist, no player engagement like they had in those. However, I do notice a big similarity where they don't usually explain their reads, and instead mostly challenge others' reads. So that's consistent.

I'm not sure if a difference in alignment has caused them to be uncomfortable engaging, or if something about this setup or whatever else has caused them to just not care. I'm not comfortable giving them a partner, in any case.

[Gloria Cleary]

Like I get where y'all are coming from, but I just do not buy that a scumteam with 2 of Jake/Rainbow/Pooky decide to approach the game like this.

Rainbow always plays like this, it's hard to get a read there

She placed Gloria and Fidget lower once they started having doubts on rainbows, but it's hard to tell if it's towny OMGUS or I mean, what purpose does it even serve if it's scum-motivated OMGUS, it's not like they're trying to push the reads. I think I'm like nulltown there

Gloria is doing her entitled "I can't believe you don't see how obvtown I am" thing, and uh, there's other meta which makes me inclined to think she's town.

The wholesome thing wasn't an alignment read btw, Gloria. Those were just personality reads.

hm.

i have the impression that town!pooky is more abrasive/spontaneous while scum!pooky loves to buddy/present himself as likeable and I think the latter is happening rn

I actually have the opposite impression of Pooky. I'm leantown on him because of the way he was trying to buddy up to me in the early game. I think in general, town!Pooky finds it easier to show his "soul" and try to convince people he's town just by how much he's enjoying himself, and power of friendship alone in a way. As scum, he resorts to it less, don't know why, maybe because he feels worse about it, or it's less fun for him. But generally he's more aggressive and ends up pushing miselims more than this kind of fluff.

This is just a tends to sort of thing though, it's nothing to townlock him for, and content-wise I don't have much to townread him for.

See the difference in Hectic’s responses to both Pooky and RR. He doesn’t really seem to be particularly invested in defending Pooky and is probably giving his honest opinion on him. His “confidence” on Pooky!town is also really strange since he had to know he’d be flipped before Pooky. This doesn’t read to me as Pooky buddy at all.

But with RR, Hectic sounds genuinely invested in clearing her but then puts her at “nulltown”.

Passion plus “nulltown” read don’t really make a lot of sense but otoh, Pooky read seems genuine, like what town!Hectic would actually read Pooky here.

Considering how likely it was for Hectic to be flipped first, this is a very bizarre attempt at scum distancing if Pooky is his buddy.

[Fidget]

Something that is funny to note is that Hectic's evaluation of Rainbow Read's meta here:

Rainbow always plays like this, it's hard to get a read there

Isn't really true. Check those prior Rainbow games. Rainbow usually talks a lot more, and the readslist spam was never a thing until now.

Does Hectic feel the need to soft defend scum!Rainbow with a defense that isn't exactly accurate.. hmm. Or maybe he was more referring to how Rainbow doesn't usually have a lot of content, which is true.

[Gloria Cleary]

Maybe if we vote hard enough, it'll become a mechanic.

VOTE: Rainbow Reads

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HURT: Rainbow Reads - coming out strong with those reads and then dipping is meh. Could you explain the Uncrowned and shelly ones?
HURT: shellyCult - waiting on answers, you wouldn't force a scumread on me now, would you?

Sneasel's posting seems okay

Hmmmm . . . now he HURT RR after that passionate nulltown read, interesting.

Hectic didn’t do that with Pooky. No real attempt to distance him at all.

[Gloria Cleary]

Rainbow reads was really chatty in this game (town) by comparison. They challenged people a fair bit. Not really much in the way of explaining their reads, though.

Again also chatty in comparison in this game (town) too. Still they don't really explain reads much.

Talked a lot here too (town).

Rainbow actually made a bunch of short, game-related posts in all three of those games. They didn't have readslists except for one game where they had a couple. Here, they are 100% readslist, no player engagement like they had in those. However, I do notice a big similarity where they don't usually explain their reads, and instead mostly challenge others' reads. So that's consistent.

I'm not sure if a difference in alignment has caused them to be uncomfortable engaging, or if something about this setup or whatever else has caused them to just not care. I'm not comfortable giving them a partner, in any case.

I really do think it’s RR. I will check those out anyway. I think Hectic’s positioning around RR looks like buddies. Passionate defence but then only putting her at “nulltown” then later the HURT tag.

Also if you think Pooky is town here which I do then he has pretty decent reads and he has been tr Jake the whole game and still is but that obviously says more about Pooky. Jake offering to be the last town also looks good. She seems really casual the way she’s been joking around with everyone.
.
Humour is a towntell for a lot of people because as scum you are forced to take things really seriously.

I actually wonder if I messed up scum’s gambit but wrongly locktowning Hectic? Like people have said, he had no way of anticipating my misreading Shelley’s post as a tmi Hectic tr. Perhaps the plan was to get RR to escape first? We have no way of knowing.

[Akarin]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

This is why I'm still worried about Sneasel actually.

[Gloria Cleary]

Unfortunately there’s no RR scumgames to compare it too but it’s extremely easy for scum to hide behind a readslist and not offer up any genuine thoughts. Especially newbie scum.

And then, her initial lack of interest in trying to figure out if it’s Jake or Pooky wasn’t great and then settles on Pooky, why?

It’s also a common scum gambit for two scums to have oppositional reads on a lhf player. Hectic leans town on Pooky and RR has him in last position.

[Gloria Cleary]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

This is why I'm still worried about Sneasel actually.

But why wouldn’t Hectic have proposed to Sneasel then? Sneasel has proposed to Uncrowned, Hectic (after I called him “locktown”) and now me, so based on what Hectic was trying to accomplish why wouldn’t scum!Sneasel have put himself into the obvtown waiting position to fit with that plan?

[Akarin]

I ship Jake and Rainbow for first pair.

This does not appear to be the popular choice.

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{Rainbow Reads}

{Necessary Sneasel, Uncrowned}

{shellyc}

{Akarin}

{Equinox, Fidget}

{Hectic}

{Gloria Cleary, Jake The Wolfie}

{PookyTheMagicalBear}

{}

Jake moved from Purple in the last list to Yellow in this one.

Fidget, did you still have questions about my Rainbow-Jake thought or did that pretty much answer itself as the day went on.

I'm less hot on that right now by the way, but I was kind of hoping Jake or Rainbow would actually react to it more. Or other people.

I don't really think all the scum can be in people making a point of not trying though.

I thought you might've been reaction testing with this to see if anyone was really vocally unopposed. There's the scenario where they're both town and scum really needs to stop that from happening, since they're both PoE range. Fidget was voacally opposed, but I feel her thoughts behind it were genuine.

I also just like that latest string of Fidget posting.

[Akarin]

But why wouldn’t Hectic have proposed to Sneasel then? Sneasel has proposed to Uncrowned, Hectic (after I called him “locktown”) and now me, so based on what Hectic was trying to accomplish why wouldn’t scum!Sneasel have put himself into the obvtown waiting position to fit with that plan?

I don't understand what you mean. No one has actually trusted Sneasel at any point during the game, it's just that Sneasel has trusted a few people (Uncrowned, you, I think that's it)

Scum can't pair as Sneasel was making a point of earlier.

[Gloria Cleary]

Oh yeah, we should do a thing where we propose to the towniest people, and have them not accept. We can "clear" people if we slowly propose to the UTRs until we have a smaller pool. So we can IC people while keeping them in the game while they can continue to weigh in

Honestly, I read this more as exactly what happened with Uncrowned, that Hectic was using reverse psychology to get Uncrowned to trust him because that’s exactly what did happen.

[Akarin]

Yes, but if Hectic was paired with RR or Jake, I worry that that's a less good plan. He says that shortly after my Rainbow-Jake suggestion.

[Jake The Wolfie]

and just letting Equinox sort Jake-RR out.

Would you like to clarify how the moderator will sort out me and Rainbow road?

[Akarin]

and just letting Equinox sort Jake-RR out.

Would you like to clarify how the moderator will sort out me and Rainbow road?

No.

I feel like reading comprehension is an important skill that we should all get a bit of practice in.