Sunny 2: Rules of Im-peachment - Over!

[Gamma Emerald]

Your townpool is good

you had me at null-to-scum before, what changed that?

[Gamma Emerald]

Maria, what do you think are the odds of cake scum here?

Besides the fact Jingle W means Cakez=T Cakez is still in his town game range on my notepad. He hasn't done one of his obvious tells yet. If that changes you'll know.

Midway/Jake/Murder/Gamma are the only nulls I have and I don't see that changing anytime soon given their posting. I don't care hard enough about making the wagons swap as long as people don't hard TR Jingle.

I was already fine with the fact Dunn was TRing Maria but this is enough for me to TR her as well

[Noraa]

Maria, what do you think are the odds of cake scum here?

Besides the fact Jingle W means Cakez=T Cakez is still in his town game range on my notepad. He hasn't done one of his obvious tells yet. If that changes you'll know.

I'm not sure if I know of any of these "obvious tells" but I'll patiently wait.

[Pink Ball]

Your townpool is good

you had me at null-to-scum before, what changed that?

It hasn't. Those are not excluding

[SirCakez]

I don't even consider that game a real game
Nobody even tried and it was less than 20 pages

doesn't matter. I was UTR there and even if it was more active, I would've done just fine.

i am not using meta from that game sorry
i didn't get a grasp on you at all there

Maria, what do you think are the odds of cake scum here?

Besides the fact Jingle W means Cakez=T Cakez is still in his town game range on my notepad. He hasn't done one of his obvious tells yet. If that changes you'll know.

u better tell me what the obvious tells are at some point

[Gamma Emerald]

Good fucking luck on that, she’s never explained her tells on me and she’s used them for 3+ years

[Pink Ball]

MURDERSUNNY - townlean
Gypyx - townlean
noraa - scumlean
Zaiden - townread
Pink Ball - yours trully
Jingle - null
Something_Smart - null
Spring Breeze - scumread
MariaR - townread
PookyTheMagicalBear - townread
SirCakez - townread
Morning Tweet - townlean
PrivateI - null
Jake The Wolfie null
Gamma Emerald - null
midwaybear - townread
staypositivefriend - scumread
Cheetory6 - townread

So I got 6 townreads and 3 townleans; 5 nulls; and 1 scumlean and 2 scumreads.

Pretty confident on being right about 7 out of 9 of my townreads/leans. Almost sure that 3 out of 5 of my nulls are town but I can't call them town yet. And there is definitely one scum out of my 3 scumreads/lean.

If you want to, let's play a game: tell me who are the 6 players I'm wrong about in those groups

[MariaR]

Good fucking luck on that, she’s never explained her tells on me and she’s used them for 3+ years

<3

[Pink Ball]

I'll start: MURDERSUNNY and Morning Tweet; Jake and Gamma; Noraa and SPF

[Pink Ball]

"What's the point of this, oh sweet Pink Ball?", you could ask. Well, it's simple: I'm not voting any of my 9 townreads, but I'll only defend 7 out 9; I won't mind if you vote any of my 5 nullreads, but I'd rather not join 3 out 5; and I could vote any of my 3 scumreads, but I'm going to really push 1 of those.

[staypositivefriend]

is your scumlean on me 48 pages into the game still based on a post i made on page one? that concerns me

also, i would like to hear why you townlean murdersunny. most of his posts feel painfully null to me

[Pink Ball]

Are you answering your own question or do you want me to answer it?

[staypositivefriend]

Are you answering your own question or do you want me to answer it?

i'm prompting you to add more depth to your read, if it exists

[staypositivefriend]

FTR, my version of that list right now would roughly look something like:

MURDERSUNNY - null
Gypyx - scumlean
noraa - townlean
Zaiden - townread
Pink Ball - null (i actually really like their tone at certain spots so they would normally be a townlean, but i'm concerned about some of the progressions they've had)
Jingle - scumlean
Something_Smart - null
Spring Breeze - null
MariaR - townlean
PookyTheMagicalBear - townlean
SirCakez - townlean
Morning Tweet - townlean
PrivateI - null
Jake The Wolfie scumlean
Gamma Emerald - null
midwaybear - townread
Cheetory6 - townread

i can expand on any of these individually - being in the unique position of having meta on absolutely zero of the players here is something i'm acutely aware may be skewing some of my reads

[Pink Ball]

I have a whole case on you that I don't want to present because I have a team behind me that townleans you and don't want me to push you

[staypositivefriend]

I have a whole case on you that I don't want to present because I have a team behind me that townleans you and don't want me to push you

your team sounds based

[Pink Ball]

What's being based? I looked it up and says that it originally meant to be addicted to crack cocaine

[staypositivefriend]

What's being based? I looked it up and says that it originally meant to be addicted to crack cocaine

that's 100% what it means

[Pink Ball]

When did Cakez became a townlean for you? I remember you being the actual first vote on him and not Pooky

[Pink Ball]

What's being based? I looked it up and says that it originally meant to be addicted to crack cocaine

that's 100% what it means

They absolutely sound based then

Have you seen FL's avatar?

[Zaiden]

Hello. I've come back from watching Attack on Titan's latest episode. It was fucking amazing. It feels like I'm watching history in the making (just don't let me down like GoT did). And I've cooled off since yesterday. I would like to apologise to Cheetory. I've been dealing with personal issues feeling like I'm only a second choice for Flopz, Hectic and Hopkirk because they never invited me last year. Then being told I was useless and would probably be eliminated for being useless even if I was town by Cheetory didn't help. My team didn't realise this was my thought process and have since clarified with me they picked me only because I'm truly their really good friend and that they still chose me over other mafiascum players who might be technically better at this game but they still chose me because of how long our friendships go back. So I'm grateful to them and apologise for doubting my friends and lashing out at Cheetory because it was really just an issue of me being really overwhelmed in a bad mental state and struggling to internalise stuff. Cheetory if you are not scum putting on a show and are fellow town I hope I can make it up to you sometime. If you are scum who are putting on a show, I'll be pissed off but fair play and I still hope to make it up to you if I did hurt your scum feelings.

Anything I've referenced from Hectic/Hopkirk came in at about 8pm GMT. I started writing this at 10pm GMT but got distracted and played 2 ARAM games on League of Legends (because end on a win). So the final ARAM roughly finished at 0:30am? At the time I finished writing this up it was 1:45am my time and I need to get up early so rip me but I made a promise to make a post so whatever.

First off, I will focus on recent developments following my last post yesterday then reach far back to the early stages of the game after that. I like Morning Tweet's entrance so far they're a lot more active than Clidd but I'm not convinced about this push onto Nora being scum because I could believe the idea she's being pushed onto as an easy target the way I was made out as an easy target. However Morning Tweet lays out and explain the meta reason (please do this if you're using meta because if you don't say it I can't know) that apparently Nora is sitting back and spectating which is atypical for them? And then Nora kind of reacted by getting engaged into the game, which tells me this meta read must be true because otherwise Nora would have presumably said 'Bullshit. Your accusations are wrong scum!'. Also Murdersunny corroborates on this by saying Nora could very well be changing their meta but that they think it's NAI. Both Hectic and Hopkirk were confused why Nora (and anyone else) thought I was Hectic because he was clearly in another game. But her asking me twice about Hectic's read in what came across as good faith felt townie to them. They're flipping on a lot of their reads and it seems like paranoia to me. I don't think I've seen scum flip flop between reads that hard and that fast so based on my real life experience I feel inclined to believe this is town behaviour. Though I have no prior experience with them and if they've had a record of doing this as scum then I will have to reconsider that point.

For Pooky I've been told relaying Koba's real times thoughts then 180'ing on SPF seemed authentic because SPF has good reads as town. I haven't received any suggestion this is alignment indicative or anything but I thought the Pooky/SPF interaction segment was a genuine conversation where they got to a mutual understanding and agreed to hunt scum together. I've also been told to let Pooky solve Kanna. Though they were disgruntled over a technicality about a recent game where they reckon Pooky cheated because they were actually masons with Kanna. I've been told to townlock Kanna for now because Pooky has townlocked them (unless it's a joke which they do not believe it is). Hopkirk reckons Kanna probably doesn’t make 538 as scum? Though they didn't really explain much and I'm not seeing how this Pooky reads Kanna thing is supposed to work. So I won't townlock SpringBreeze like they recommended because what my team told me here about 'soul masons' was a load of gibberish that made no fucking sense to me.

For the Cakez discussion, I felt it was odd that Cakes held onto this stance they supposedly always had in 848 and only came out with it when it was convenient. So I want to ask Cakez, why did you decide to sit on those thoughts? Also Hectic says what Cakez has done so far seems pretty fakeable because they lack explanations or underlying reasonings. Hopkirk said they got off 'swagger' vibes from Cakez's early posts. As if their main concern was looking confident more than anything else. According to Hopkirk there's a chance Cakez was trying to pocket me because they keep asserting I'm genuine but they could also flip that at a moment's notice whenever they feel like if I say they don’t like. I could totally see that being a possibility. One of the scums on my wagon playing bad cop while Cakez is playing good cop.

Also with reference to Clidd both Hopkirk and Hectic told me that scum are more likely to sub out - which also makes wary of Morning Tweet. And given the game state it seemed convenient they would immediately attack on Nora seemed quite opportunistic to me. And also it adds to my scumlean on Cheetory who said they were considering subbing out. Although Hectic and Hopkirk are divided on Cheetory. Hectic thinks Cheetory's anger comes from a genuine place where it seems like he doesn't know my alignment hence I've been attacked over the possibility of 'theatreeing' as scum. Hopkirk thinks that Cheetory's early vote on Gamma doesn't strike him as genuine town trying to form a read + his subsequent progression in logic for reads and votes doesn't across as natural. I feel like taking Hopkirk's side on this one. Even if we set aside anything personal from yesterday I don't trust Cheetory or believe they are acting in good faith. If I didn't respond to their questions immediately to me it was one post among many and I was feeling very overwhelmed by dozens of posts at the time.

Hopkirk told me he's less confident about his reads on Morning Tweet and Jake and to defer to Hectic. Hectic liked what Morning's doing in 873 and 904. She knows Murder is good at reading Noraa, and knows Pooky is good at reading Kanna, so the questions are meaningful to him. Hectic reckons based on 656 if Nora is scum, one of the scum would be one of Jake or Jingle because scum tend to be hyper aware of their partner, so she could mistake people commenting on Jake as commenting on Jingle, but it's unlikely she would make the same mistake if Jake is scum and Jingle is town. I understood what he meant about being hyper aware but I didn't get how that affects the likelihood of making mistakes. In this scenario Hectic showed a preference to Jingle being town because 865 and 877 showed he didn't care about rubbing people the wrong way and openly admitted to that, which scum would be more interested in avoiding. I didn't like Jingle's interaction with MWB comparing my wagon with Nora's in 883 and whether that was framed a dichotomy of two choices when I think there should be more options for wagons on the table. Also I'm confused how Jingle came around to a PB townread. They don't explain much here but I assume it's because of PB's support on Nora's wagon? I don't follow the logic of how that led to that particular townread. For Nora's vote on Jingle, I have no idea whether Jingle is a good player and whether they are playing below their standards? Didn't see this was an OMGUS until Cakez pointed that out - but is the OMGUS here alignment indicative for Nora? I wouldn't know but don't get the impression OMGUS would be AI is based on how hard Nora flip flop between their town/scum reads?

Finally I do agree with Hopkirk and Hectic that Gypx was shading me really hard. I didn't even realise Gypyx was throwing shade at me until they pointed it out. I want to take this moment to clearly state I wasn't and am not being coached in the forum mafia definition sense. And even if I was, from Hopkirk/Hectic POV it's completely normal for new/less experienced players to be guided by their veteran seniors and it doesn't necessarily indicate alignment. Trying to frame it as a scum thing and justifying it in 238 and 241 is extremely scummy and uncharacteristically lazy of Gypyx from their POV. Honestly, I agree. I didn't see it before but they was really trying to take advantage of me in a really underhanded and slimy way. So I'll be moving my vote onto that scumbag since this is the one of the scumreads my team has come to agree upon.

Vote: Gypyx

[staypositivefriend]

When did Cakez became a townlean for you? I remember you being the actual first vote on him and not Pooky

yeah, i was sus about cakez when i iso'd them on #912 and i voted them, but it wasn't a push that felt right to me in my gut. i liked the overly blunt and simplistic way that cakez replied to me on #963, and i (egotistically) like the fact that they were willing to follow and validate my suspicions on gypx when the rest of the thread was silent about it. it felt hypocritical for me to be suspicious of cakez for townreading zaiden so confidently when i'm more or less in the same position as him right now

[staypositivefriend]

What's being based? I looked it up and says that it originally meant to be addicted to crack cocaine

that's 100% what it means

They absolutely sound based then

Have you seen FL's avatar?

i just checked it and i am happy to see them meeting the based aesthetic

perfectly

[Pink Ball]

That last paragraph is a great insight @Zaiden

[Pink Ball]

When did Cakez became a townlean for you? I remember you being the actual first vote on him and not Pooky

yeah, i was sus about cakez when i iso'd them on #912 and i voted them, but it wasn't a push that felt right to me in my gut. i liked the overly blunt and simplistic way that cakez replied to me on #963, and i (egotistically) like the fact that they were willing to follow and validate my suspicions on gypx when the rest of the thread was silent about it. it felt hypocritical for me to be suspicious of cakez for townreading zaiden so confidently when i'm more or less in the same position as him right now

I like this progression, seems legit. I don't think you could come up with this so quickly if it was fake. Doesn't mean you're town, it means that I underestimated you; therefore, my initial scumread on you was wrong. The rest of what makes me scumread you is still there, but I'm less biased now.

What's being based? I looked it up and says that it originally meant to be addicted to crack cocaine

that's 100% what it means

They absolutely sound based then

Have you seen FL's avatar?

i just checked it and i am happy to see them meeting the based aesthetic

perfectly

Right???