Titus v Nancy Drew (Game Over)

[Dunnstral]

I’m voting you because out of all the people in Nancy’s townbloc you are the least town to me.

"Least town" isn't a good reason at this point in the game and you're sorting in the wrong pool of players (you shouldn't be looking at nancy's townbloc right now)

Actually, it's not a reason at all. It's not even calling them scum.

I’d rather vote for scum

VOTE: SaraharaS

Why is she scum? Not seeing it?

Of course not, she’s in you blind spot.

And this jokey post feels like you're lolcatting now

[Nancy Drew 39]

i think there's a page on the wiki Italiano's been looking at: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... d_You_Suck

That’s cute. But I’m not voting you simply because you are voting me, I’m voting you because out of all the people in Nancy’s townbloc you are the least town to me. Personally I don’t feel your read on me I was reached honestly. You kinda picked a couple things out of my iso and scumread me for it instead of actually trying to sort me. You came in with preconceived notions and just sorta locked on with no indication you’d change.

@Dunn, excellent point. @Italiano why would you be specifically voting in my “townbloc”?

Given that I’m town stump and informed. How do I know you’re not actually trying to maybe possibly mason hunt with this?

[Morty and Rick]

i townread Morty btw
he's just in the lolsolve because of Mastina playing other games over this one

*a-HEM*

Spoiler: mastina is here

Okay I am finally here now; sorry for the long, long, looooooooooooooooonggggg delay, but, uhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

I, uh. Don't think it's within my capabilities to read 174 pages.

Okay I am finally here now; sorry for the long, long, looooooooooooooooonggggg delay, but, uhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

I, uh. Don't think it's within my capabilities to read 174 pages.

For a start, that means I'm gonna try to keep up with current posting, but any recommendations for me on reading and/or summaries?

Treat me as if I'm basically a replacement in this game since I may as well be one.

I suppose for a start there's always pick-spec.

Batsunami (Noraa + Morning Tweet)
War and Peace (Ircher + samantha97)
Sherlock and Watson (Krazy + PenguinPower)
Starcrossed (Kanna + PookyTheMagicalBear)
Gamma Emerald
SaraharaS
Fey
Rogue Squadron (Lunar Martian + Akarin)
Dunnstral
Clidd
ItalianoVD
Toogeloo
Olaf Pyro
5uffering Charlie and Snoopy (Marcistar + Shadowslug)
Saudade

So this is the original playerlist.

Titus is the scum treestump, right?

I don't think Titus drafts Saudade here in any circumstance. (Which is convenient since it'd mean Pink Ball is town!)
I don't think Titus drafts Dunnstral as scum, or Gamma Emerald as scum.
I expect Titus to draft players that're good as both alignments overall, and all three above fail that test imo.

Batsunami (Noraa + Morning Tweet)
War and Peace (Ircher + samantha97)
Sherlock and Watson (Krazy + PenguinPower)
Starcrossed (Kanna + PookyTheMagicalBear)
SaraharaS
Fey
Rogue Squadron (Lunar Martian + Akarin)
Clidd
ItalianoVD
Toogeloo
Olaf Pyro
5uffering Charlie and Snoopy (Marcistar + Shadowslug)

Which narrows it down to this for a start.
Here comes more speculative analysis: Batsumi is an unlikely draft for Titus. Titus knows that Morning Tweet is good as town but probably isn't as good as scum, and that Noraa's scumplay is something likely to be exposed.
From pick-spec, I think they're unlikely due to that.

I don't think Titus picks War an Peace similarly so--Ircher is a reasonable scumhunter but not to the point where he's a high-priority denial pick, and his scumgame is, presumably, not up to par. ssamantha's a reasonable town player but I also don't think she's a must-deny that Titus would highly value.

While I'm less certain of those two, it's a start:

Sherlock and Watson (Krazy + PenguinPower)
Starcrossed (Kanna + PookyTheMagicalBear)
SaraharaS
Fey
Rogue Squadron (Lunar Martian + Akarin)
Clidd
ItalianoVD
Toogeloo
Olaf Pyro
5uffering Charlie and Snoopy (Marcistar + Shadowslug)

10 names for 4 scum.

The problem here is that I'm utterly unfamiliar with most of the names within and Titus's familiarity with them:
Sarahara, Fey, clidd, Italiano, Olaf Pyro, marcistar, shadowslug, all of them I don't know Titus's view of them and most of them I'm not intimately familiar with.

However, I will say:
I would expect {Sherlock and Watson, Starcrossed, Rogue Squadron, Toogeloo} as being a pool of fairly high-priority picks for Titus. Probably not all four of them, especially given the draft mechanic, but there's a fairly high chance of scum in there.

5uffering claimed vanilla cop
Italiano claimed vanillaizer
Fey claimed 1 shot nightskipper
Clidd claimed vt

List of claims.

Well that makes Fey probably town here. 5uffering/Italiano's claims are nai imo; could be town, could be scum. Ditto for clidd there.

Which places an initial poe for me as {Olaf/Pyro, SaraharaS, clidd, ItalianoVD, 5uffering/Charlie and Snoopy,

Toogeloo

,

Sherlock and Watson

,

Starcrossed

,

Red Eye Knights/Rogue Squadron

}. (Bolded aren't scumreads; bolded are names I believe Titus would have as high pick priorities.)

Anyone got thoughts of someone belonging in there that I've taken out or thoughts of someone still in which they think I should take out? I suppose that's a good start for me!

I can do better.

fuck yea
Papa Ball got this
Let's let him do some magic :3

PB, you, Sahara, Fey and to a lesser extent M & R and Ari have kept me from wanting to literally wanting to tear every single strand out from my fucking head.

For the record Nancy, there will be a point in this game where you'll have to determine who in this list is scum, because there's a big fat chance there's at least one. My money on Ari right now.
In other words: it's easy to have a deepwolf against you, and that's why that list of people you named probably has scum in it.

Well from that list: {Sarahara, Starcrossed, Red Eye Knights} would be the possible deepscum imo since PB is probtown and I think Fey is town as well and I am assuming M&R is us, so.

I honestly can't tell how much you're playing 5D chess so I'm not sure how to productively engage you here. But ok. Why would Toog be a high priority pick for Titus?

Because Toogeloo is a player who is consistent across alignments: as scum he won't be a deepwolf who excels at manipulating the town, but he'll be a stable rock that stays underneath the town's radar and is hard to eliminate. As town he is fairly low-profile who is difficult to eliminate, and while never excelling at leading the town, presents a consistent threat to the scum.

I think Sarahara looks pretty town.

Sure, why not?

I've got a list of nine names to narrow down for scum and am willing to buy that.

I think Red Eye Knights is the best lim right now.
-Morty

Have you ever played with either of those as scum?

For my half, for the ORIGINAL hydra, no--I've not played with Lunar Martian or Akarin with them as scum, pretty sure anyway. (Well, Lunar Martian, depends on which banned user LM was obv.)

But for Ari, obviously, yes, I have indeed seen him as scum.

I've not seen him post yet tho so have no way to judge on him yet.

Having isoed Red Eye Knights: I can say it's definitely possible either way on Ari. Could be town, could be scum, isn't strongly making me think town but isn't strongly making me think scum, either.

Gun to head, overall would say slightly more likely to be scum than town tho that's far from definitive.

Thank you Mastina.

Thank me after I catch scum, not before.

I have a pool of nine names, even if I was setup speccing correctly that's 5 too many.

I think both of these could be scum roles because I don’t see either one having benefit to town. I think Noraa probably confused 5uffering’s role with Hectic’s in Pooky vs FL.

I see where you're coming from--I don't think both are scum. Vanilla cop + Vanillizer doesn't seem like a likely scumteam combo of roles.

I see it as either:
Vanillizer scum, vanilla cop town;
Vanillizer town, vanilla cop scum,
OR:
Both claims town; neither as scum.

I don't think both are scum here so there's a maximum of one scum in that group imo.

I very much am here and playing this game now, thankyouverymuch.

[Morty and Rick]

I would expect Auro to lead the game a little more 'cause he's a pain in the ass as town, we share that trait.

Oh I can explain that--
The plan was for Auro to take the backseat to me.
I was meant to be the main poster from the getgo, from the onset.
Auro wanted me to be doing the majority of the legwork, for me to be at the forefront, for him to be the support while I hard-carried him.

Unfortunately, this game started right as I had lifeguard training start up--I was very fortunate to have been in a hydra because if not for Auro I would've been prod-dodging due to being swamped by said lifeguard training. I felt bad for making Auro hold down the fort while I was busy when the PLAN was for ME to hold down the fort while he just chilled in the background, but it was an unfortunate necessity of life.

I'm around now tho!

[Morty and Rick]

I think REK is scum, gut, and scum flips are cool even if not informative
-Morty

Also REK is in my scum pool.
(So's Sherlock & Watson, too.)

[ItalianoVD]

I’m voting you because out of all the people in Nancy’s townbloc you are the least town to me.

"Least town" isn't a good reason at this point in the game and you're sorting in the wrong pool of players (you shouldn't be looking at nancy's townbloc right now)

Actually, it's not a reason at all. It's not even calling them scum.

I think they're scum and said so already. 4499 is why I think so. Frankly I don't care what you or anyone else thinks of it cause it's what I think and I'm not gonna let anyone else discredit my thoughts.

I’d rather vote for scum

VOTE: SaraharaS

Why is she scum? Not seeing it?

Of course not, she’s in you blind spot.

And this jokey post feels like you're lolcatting now

Not a jokey post at all. I'm 100% serious.

(you shouldn't be looking at nancy's townbloc right now)

Actually I should, because the scumbloc is wrong.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I think REK is scum, gut, and scum flips are cool even if not informative
-Morty

Also REK is in my scum pool.
(So's Sherlock & Watson, too.)

Do you agree with PB that S & W likely share the same alignment with REK because I found that really interesting?

[ItalianoVD]

i think there's a page on the wiki Italiano's been looking at: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... d_You_Suck

That’s cute. But I’m not voting you simply because you are voting me, I’m voting you because out of all the people in Nancy’s townbloc you are the least town to me. Personally I don’t feel your read on me I was reached honestly. You kinda picked a couple things out of my iso and scumread me for it instead of actually trying to sort me. You came in with preconceived notions and just sorta locked on with no indication you’d change.

@Dunn, excellent point. @Italiano why would you be specifically voting in my “townbloc”?

Given that I’m town stump and informed. How do I know you’re not actually trying to maybe possibly mason hunt with this?

Nancy what! You're getting swayed by such weak nonsense. It's obvious what he's doing here; trying to keep the attention on your PoE, which I think is majority miselims. I'm gonna politely refuse to answer because it's ridiculous.

[Nancy Drew 39]

I’m voting you because out of all the people in Nancy’s townbloc you are the least town to me.

"Least town" isn't a good reason at this point in the game and you're sorting in the wrong pool of players (you shouldn't be looking at nancy's townbloc right now)

Actually, it's not a reason at all. It's not even calling them scum.

I think they're scum and said so already. 4499 is why I think so. Frankly I don't care what you or anyone else thinks of it cause it's what I think and I'm not gonna let anyone else discredit my thoughts.

I’d rather vote for scum

VOTE: SaraharaS

Why is she scum? Not seeing it?

Of course not, she’s in you blind spot.

And this jokey post feels like you're lolcatting now

Not a jokey post at all. I'm 100% serious.

(you shouldn't be looking at nancy's townbloc right now)

Actually I should, because the scumbloc is wrong.

How do you know my scumbloc is wrong? Considering we have yet to flip scum, I find your confidence in that extremely surprising. If you are actually scum here, maybe we’ve found your team in that case?

[ItalianoVD]

If you are actually scum here, maybe we’ve found your team in that case?

Yeah maybe you did. I'm done here. Flip me, vig me, whatever. I'm not trying anymore.

[clidd]

I have a spiritual vote on Red Eye Knights. Depending on the scumcase, my vote will materialize. I'm not fossing the Saudade/PB slot anymore, they're likely town.

[clidd]

He hasn't had a single towntell since the number of votes increased.

clidd can you explain what you consider a 'towntell'?

Something that someone did/said that gives me the impression that the person is coming from a town mentality/perspective.

[clidd]

I would be happy to get a flip on 5suf, but I imagine that over time the wagon will become even more unavailable.

[Toogeloo]

This is the day that never ends. It goes on and on my friends. Some people started playing it not knowing what it was and we'll continue playing it forever just because [repeat].

[Nancy Drew 39]

I have a spiritual vote on Red Eye Knights. Depending on the scumcase, my vote will materialize. I'm not fossing the Saudade/PB slot anymore, they're likely town.

Don’t you think it’s weird that no one is bothering to defend them though? Where are their buddies? And why is Titus chomping at the bit to kill them?

[Nancy Drew 39]

[Nancy Drew 39]

This is the day that never ends. It goes on and on my friends. Some people started playing it not knowing what it was and we'll continue playing it forever just because [repeat].

[Sherlock and Watson]

This is getting to the point where my reads are actively degrading. I don't like the push on REK. I don't like PB (alignment wise, based on push/gamestate). I don't like clidd calling PB town *now*. I don't like the inertia on Italiano. I don't know what that adds up to in the gamestate and I don't think today will be in a good place if this dayphase goes long enough that it will create the risk of me getting to a point where I let myself push PB, because I just don't see that being good for anyone involved, even IF PB is scum. I think positionally REK is probably town simply for the way people are positioning themselves on that slot in this gamestate. But I say all that and I don't even know REK is town! Maybe PB is like softbussing to set up a chain on me later or something, I don't know! I don't even care! Nancy I am not even joking when I say that if you let this game go past page 190 I am just going to overrule you and announce the day's flip and I won't even care if you had some sort of galaxybrain mason gambit in mind or something. 180 was my 'gasket point' and I know you don't want to be rushed but look at the pagecount of this game and realize SHIT NEEDS TO DIE. I know you want to go slow and you want me to be helping you more but THIS IS ME HELPING YOU. MAKE A DECISION, RIGHT OR WRONG OR WHATEVER and let this game ADVANCE before literally the entire game is just ~done~. What happens when days go this long (pagecountwise) is that my accurate reads from earlier in the game get supplanted by the reads I have on people whose reads are annoying me, whose positioning annoys me, or whose soft pushes on me annoys me. My reads are stronger earlier because I don't have as much emotional load dealing with my evaluation of the slots. And the more frustrated I get with this game in particular, my reads get worse as the page count just continues to advance. And I say that and I know that Pink Ball, whatever his alignment, just wants to play the game he replaced into *which is fine* bearing in mind that I am just *completely sick* of 200 page day 1s. No day 1 is worth 200 pages. It's just not. All that will happen is that, since it's day 1, and since we'll just *usually* end up wrong here *somehow*, *somewhere*, we're just going to get *even more upset* when we realize we spent 200 pages talking it out only to fuck it up. Mafia isn't supposed to be played perfectly, it's supposed to be played in a way that you get the odds to *slightly* tip in your favor through *slightly* above random reads. If you try to play the perfect game the game will just slip through your fingers. That's been my takeaway from the last six months.

TBH a very big part of me wants to snap to clidd just for 4585 and say Noraa was right all along. In fact why don't we just do that?

VOTE: clidd

We're just spinning in fucking circles here Nancy, CALL THE SHOT OR I WILL

[clidd]

There is not much to argue against other than "the slot is lhf", so I don't see much motivation for their hypothetical scum partners to feel the need to intervene.

Complacency about their possible elimination/push, however, can be a sign that the slot is town, but it is difficult to say rn.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Cool. So we're yeeting Gamma now. Ok.

What are the marching orders?

Msybe it really is Gamma? Titus has had weird interactions with both Gamma and 5uffering.

I still think it could be Italiano but I want to take another look at W & P. I think gunsmith could be a fakeclaim but I don’t know.

Gamma flipped out on me after the draft comment but not anyone else? Why only me?

I really think my initial solve has at least one scum in it and I have good instincts but no one listens to me. :/

[Sherlock and Watson]

I just think you're scum for saying Pink Ball is town when Pink Ball is doing stuff that is very comfortably in his scum range. Is that a good reason to scumread you? Honestly, probably not! It could even be actively terrible. But resolving your slot will at the very least get Noraa's voice out of the back of my mind, so there's that

[Nancy Drew 39]

Cool your jets @Krazy. I agree with you but if you think that push is bad, I can see your frustration actually causing them to be run up. I don’t know if that’s apparent to you or not?

[clidd]

It is not exactly through PB, but rather a reassessment of Saudade's departure.

But sure, do what you think is right. 5suf stills a better flip.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Town:
Me and morning
Pink Ball
(Fey if she were not a paranoia null)
Dunnstral
Italiano
War and Peace
5uffering
Gamma

Null:
Fey(I admit this probably should be a TR but her last post telling me my reads were batshit basically made my paranoia levels skyrocket. tho I'd like to think she wouldn't say something like that as town, I am not certain)
Morty and Rick
SaraharaS

Scum:
Pyro
Starcrossed
Red Eye Knights
Toog
Clidd

[Nancy Drew 39]

Town:
Me and morning
Pink Ball
(Fey if she were not a paranoia null)
Dunnstral
Italiano
War and Peace
5uffering
Gamma

Null:
Fey(I admit this probably should be a TR but her last post telling me my reads were batshit basically made my paranoia levels skyrocket. tho I'd like to think she wouldn't say something like that as town, I am not certain)
Morty and Rick
SaraharaS

Scum:
Pyro
Starcrossed
Red Eye Knights
Toog
Clidd

I'm going to quickly go through the major changes.
I've moved Dunnstral up a noticeable amount mainly just because I am no longer SRing him. I'm not sure what was happening at the beginning of the game but after giving this some thought, it feels to me like what happened was a very very small play style clash. What it feels like is that I've "gotten used" to it now and it no longer feels scummy. Which this could just be an indicator that Dunn purposefully changed his play or I am just not familiar with it and found it scummy when there really was nothing there. Combined with Morning's TR on him since a long time ago, I have decided to let go of that SR and move him up.

Italiano is a pretty big MEH for me. I've played with him once and I found him to be the towniest person on the planet in that game but he was scum. In that game, I caught scum shelly on page 7 and then she repped out and Italiano repped in. I remember having such conflicting thoughts at the time because I have a very high accuracy rate on reading shelly. I've read her wrong once but because I thought I solved the game elsewhere so kind of just ignored her. But when Italiano repped in I was like FUCK HE'S SO TOWNY DID I READ SHELLY WRONG? Thankfully town pushed him through for me which probably means he didnt come off that towny to them but he came off very towny to me so I take the fact that I nullread him here as a sign that he is town.

Suffering is in my town reads almost completely because of the claim. I don't have a strong read on them anyway but I don't think that is the optimal lim today and I also think that nothing they have done pings scum that hard. Suffering has kinda just been a comfort SR since the moment they entered the thread. They seem so easy to SR for weak reasons and that makes me think they're town.

Gamma is weaker town than Suffering and if one of my TRs was wrong, it'd be this one I think. Idk why I'm putting gamma up here tbh he probably deserves a spot in null but eh. He's pretty eh and i have no idea how to read him so yay.

Moved Sarahara up just because she dipped from thread and so her SR faded a bit.

Pyro moved up because Morning keeps saying he's town so its whatever. I could be wrong.

Starcrossed just feels like a scumbag and idk what else to say. Morning seems to agree as well last I checked so that checks out. Scummy as hell but could be town anyways cuz fuck my reads. I'm not that strong on this read or the Pyro read(anymore ofc)

Aristo isn't doing anything and it's weird. I've played one game with him and I remember thinking him very scummy because it felt like he had an agenda. I think that Aristo does give off that kind of vibe that feels very scummy as town. It's not really scummy in the sense that he seems informed but he just constantly seems to be thinking and almost plotting. I think that comes from the fact that he is an old player (mafia age) so he is constantly thinking and that comes out on my end as plotting. The thing is that I don't see that here. I don't really SR him surface level wise but he's missing that one puzzle piece and it doesn't feel right. The only way I can explain it is he might be a vt or scum. I mean he was a pr in that one game so that could also influence this feeling that he gives off. I know not much about Akarin but supposedly they are good at being town and love being town. But ... I've seen their shadow maybe two times this game and that's a bit concerning.

Toog and Clidds silent refusal to ever engage me about my SR on them is scum indicative all the way. These are two towny players that will take the reins of any game and lead town to victory. The way they do it is not be cowering in the corner and not replying to obvtown's SRs on them.