I do think though that Flea’s paranoia/accusations towards like... everyone it feels like... means fae is probably town? And that I have genuinely seen them before be okay with being the vote while also still fighting against it.
In post 161, Flea The Magician wrote:1 You give me the bad vibes, 2 you feel jumpy and 3 theres absolutely no way you go around demanding vote justification 4
and just on your attackers unless you're bad news imo
(1) ok, y
(2) ok, y
(3) uh, actually I tend to do this whenever someone votes me unless I think I’ve been actively scummy
(4) why is it noteworthy that I tend to focus on my attackers? Like, I’m at e-1, I know that it’s very likely that one of those 4 people is scum, are you expecting me to not be primarily interested in sorting there?
First instance of a context shift.
You isolated 3 and 4 into seperate points. They are the same point.
"theres absolutely no way you go around demanding vote justification and just on your attackers unless you're bad news imo"
This is one point, not two.
^posts like this are just fucking awful for instance
It’s entirely immaterial that I split my thoughts into two bullet points. It changes nothing on the substance of what’s being said, nor can it reasonably be said to be “shifting the context” given that nothing changes in the meaning of what’s being said. Like if you merge 3&4 into one thing it says the the same thing
So this is flea looking at the post and going “hmm, shit, how can I criticise mena/discredit this? Okay, I guess his thought process is a bit weird to format it this way... what if I say that’s context shifting?”
Like it’s just clearly not a good faith attempt to engage with what I’m saying lol
In post 400, Mare wrote:I do think though that Flea’s paranoia/accusations towards like... everyone it feels like... means fae is probably town? And that I have genuinely seen them before be okay with being the vote while also still fighting against it.
Idk, fae don’t have that much paranoia towards everyone as far as I can see
And like there’s a difference imo between being okay with being the lim and trying to help town after you go, and incredibly performative stuff like “I’ll selfhammer” which is like... no, no you won’t, because it’s awful as town for no benefit, and it’s actively losing as scum. So you’re just saying it as a tactic
Yeah, the math on hoopla's post about scum team combos was wrong, even if all partner combos have the same chance of being eliminated, which is an assumption that goes into that math that I also don't think is true.
I think Flea's defence has been really weird, not necessarily scummy weird but imo not towny weird either.
The thing I did think was more towny was the resignation and them saying that they should die and that they were going to self vote, but if one of Flea's "beautiful" scum games involves self voting for an entire day then that really makes me not like that read.
I'm pretty happy with Flea/Ythan up top, I'd be pretty surprised if both were town here.
In post 406, Mare wrote:You think that was theater then, Hoopla trying to perk up/rejuvenate Flea?
Why go that route?
I think that given the setup there are strong incentives to try to preserve your buddy D1, especially as it’s very likely one scum has to suicide in order to elim a conftown in the form of the IC or the vig
So it’s less like “that was to perk flea up” and more that’s what was needed instrumentally to justify them both shifting to ythan
In post 393, Vanderscamp wrote:Thanks for the link, flea, but I was wondering if you were new to werewolf, not your specific games on this site
I've done this a LONG time, usually with amdrams and LARPers. I used to run some seriously weird ones that work well in person/on cam with peoples characters and not well on this format.
In post 397, Menalque wrote:Like, excepting anything else, just look at gamestate and flea’s reaction around faer wagon:
-Wagon on flea is v close to hammer
-Big push towards close of day to move it off
-Flea insisting that faer elim would be good/lying and saying that fae’ll selfhammer while actually trying hard to survive
That should really be enough, but then it’s p much additionally telling that the push is onto a non-content slot rather than onto someone scummy
I also find hoopla’s logic dubious: if, fhpov, flea-me is TvT then there’s a 40% chance of hitting scum in the rest. If it’s TvS then there’s a 20% chance in the rest of a 50% chance voting in the two of us. If it’s SvS there’s a 100% chance
So I’m failing to see what the benefit is in voting outside of me/flea unless you strongly believe it’s TvT and as far as I can tell hoopla’s point isn’t that, it’s just that we’re not SvS
Wouldnt be my first wagon I've hammered and pushed on myself. My wagon stalled out, as did the others. Those are reason to scumread me. I'm suspicious of the focus move off me, Hoopla will be getting a good looking over if I survive. (Remember I said about looking on and off the wagon? yeah.) I fully agree Ythan is a low content slot that needed more time to be pushed for anything beneficial.
I said the gamestate and my position was compromised to the extent that I am now a required removal. (well played, by the way. Excellent manipulation and adjustments)
In post 161, Flea The Magician wrote:1 You give me the bad vibes, 2 you feel jumpy and 3 theres absolutely no way you go around demanding vote justification 4
and just on your attackers unless you're bad news imo
(1) ok, y
(2) ok, y
(3) uh, actually I tend to do this whenever someone votes me unless I think I’ve been actively scummy
(4) why is it noteworthy that I tend to focus on my attackers? Like, I’m at e-1, I know that it’s very likely that one of those 4 people is scum, are you expecting me to not be primarily interested in sorting there?
First instance of a context shift.
You isolated 3 and 4 into seperate points. They are the same point.
"theres absolutely no way you go around demanding vote justification and just on your attackers unless you're bad news imo"
This is one point, not two.
^posts like this are just fucking awful for instance
It’s entirely immaterial that I split my thoughts into two bullet points. It changes nothing on the substance of what’s being said, nor can it reasonably be said to be “shifting the context” given that nothing changes in the meaning of what’s being said. Like if you merge 3&4 into one thing it says the the same thing
So this is flea looking at the post and going “hmm, shit, how can I criticise mena/discredit this? Okay, I guess his thought process is a bit weird to format it this way... what if I say that’s context shifting?”
Like it’s just clearly not a good faith attempt to engage with what I’m saying lol
Oh here we go the bad faith bollocks returns.
You separating the point into two devalues and removes the context of the whole. Instead of acknowledging this you're still poking at it determined to keep it devalued and discredited as I think it hit a nerve. For something so weak of a point on D1, youve attempted to dismantle and devalue it at much as possible. That changes the context, the direction and the point of half, and devalues the other.
You are a bad-faith player, of the two of us. I have acknowledged my fuck ups and where context has been misinterpreted, you have not and instead attempted to keep at the same point.
VOTE: Flea
Try me. This is TvS at best, and I'm the wagon of choice here as clearly stated many times. Lets do this.
In post 400, Mare wrote:I do think though that Flea’s paranoia/accusations towards like... everyone it feels like... means fae is probably town? And that I have genuinely seen them before be okay with being the vote while also still fighting against it.
Idk, fae don’t have that much paranoia towards everyone as far as I can see
And like there’s a difference imo between being okay with being the lim and trying to help town after you go, and incredibly performative stuff like “I’ll selfhammer” which is like... no, no you won’t, because it’s awful as town for no benefit, and it’s actively losing as scum. So you’re just saying it as a tactic
An elimination is required, I've given a summary of my reads and the connections and reasons.
Even if I am not eliminated, I need to be shot. I cannot see D2 otherwise I'm a liability.
To surrmise because I'm now stepping away from this:
Hoopla's buddy attempt and redirection is SAI massively.
Mares inability to create content without pressure is suspicious. Blind sheeping and reversal of read on me is well sus. Awareness of my meta but not my greatest play on site is suspicious.
Moms shift onto me is bad for Meta reasons, therefore as a whole NAI.
Menalques tunnel onto me is frankly disgusting and ngl I FUCKING LOATHE PEOPLE WHO PULL THE BAD FAITH SHIT ON ME to the point I genuinely no longer want to play here with random butts pulling this on me. You wanna hit a button that hits all my nerves? There you go.
I stand by Menalque/Mare team. Hoopla is a possibility.
Also... clearly Ythan is just gonna vote you if you’re putting it like that...
I don’t get why if you’re town you’re doing this, like, you know you’re town, why not try to hit scum. It’s pointless and whether or not you think you’re a “liability” you’re even more of one self-voting as town.
-- Or here if you just wanna see fae/faer used in context.
Wanna see how to use my pronouns? Click here
