Open 812 Guardians of the Fortress - Game Over

[Briar]

@Infinity, am on break in 15-30 mins, anything particular you want me to shotgun to you then? I’ll be home later and can be more thorough then but yeah.

[Briar]

Also, can you sum up your case on Ana? I’ve skimmed a bit but going in depth hasn’t happened. Also you using those smiley faces frighten me lmfao.

[Anastasia]

I don't think I've been condescending

Maybe I misunderstood that post but it read as though you were extremely confident unwnd was scum but wanted to commend them for trying, which feels patronizing. I would have been upset if a post like that had been directed at me.

I have tremendous respect for unwnd as a player, I think the world of him, and patronizing/condescending to him would not be something I would consider doing.

[Infinity 324]

You can call it a soulread I guess.

Ok, what specifically about his play looks beyond the scumrange of 90%+ of MS players?

For unwnd to be scum he would have to have crafted a seamless narrative of how he can and can't approach reading people in this game. Every time there's something that's opaque for him he comes in with the perfect emotional tenor, perfect level of frustration, and incredible depth of his thought process. It would be such an immense talent to be able to put yourself in a town mindset so deeply to be able to fake that.

[absinthe]

It has to do with your interactions with me.

Hmm. I feel like my interactions with you have been pretty typical? Get an early townread, and then spend the rest of the game flattering you.

I don't think it's been typical. But, I think the fact that this is the first open game I've played with you pushes things a little off the "typical" map of our interactions.

From meta, I've seen how incredibly focused town-you can be on mechanically solving a game.

I don't think you've ever spent any part of a game flattering me. I've always felt like I make the initial reachouts, or we don't interact much at all.

[Infinity 324]

Also, can you sum up your case on Ana? I’ve skimmed a bit but going in depth hasn’t happened. Also you using those smiley faces frighten me lmfao.

Well mostly it's just that I think her play is much more inside her scumrange than your play has been inside yours, but it also feels like she is putting a lot of effort into justifying scum!me when if she knew it to be true in her heart she wouldn't need to try so hard.

[Infinity 324]

In the interests of not having half this table informed tiptoeing around my identity/meta when I’m not actively hiding it: I’m Ydrasse.

Why did this matter much to you if I'm not genuinely sorting you anyway?

This is where we can start.

[absinthe]

You can call it a soulread I guess.

Ok, what specifically about his play looks beyond the scumrange of 90%+ of MS players?

For unwnd to be scum he would have to have crafted a seamless narrative of how he can and can't approach reading people in this game. Every time there's something that's opaque for him he comes in with the perfect emotional tenor, perfect level of frustration, and incredible depth of his thought process. It would be such an immense talent to be able to put yourself in a town mindset so deeply to be able to fake that.

Can you give a couple of examples of this?

[Anastasia]

Ana what was the purpose of 1399? Are you going to reconsider unwnd (or ask dunn/luke to reconsider him) if he puts in a lot of effort?

the purpose is to create readable dispersion,

demotivate him if he's scum from efforting and motivate him if he's town into efforting.

[Infinity 324]

But if he's scum doesn't that mean it tells him he has a chance if he puts in effort?

[absinthe]

I am floundering re getting a read on catboi here.

[Anastasia]

nope because if he is the elimination at the wall so it wouldn't matter how good his case for the gate is.

[Infinity 324]

964 and 1456 (and the progression after that) were really good examples, I can find others if you want @ffery

[Infinity 324]

nope because if he is the elimination at the wall so it wouldn't matter how good his case for the gate is.

Wait but what's the point in reading unwnd if he's going to be the elim anyway

[Briar]

In the interests of not having half this table informed tiptoeing around my identity/meta when I’m not actively hiding it: I’m Ydrasse.

Why did this matter much to you if I'm not genuinely sorting you anyway?

This is where we can start.

It was for the benefit of everyone, as I felt I had leaned too much into who I was at that point and it’s likely to become frustrating at that point.

[Briar]

For everyone else at least, I like surprising people with who I am post game but it didn’t feel like it’d have gain here and people getting pissy over me being secretive makes not a fun game.

(Not that I think people here would get pissy, but it might have been grating.)

[Anastasia]

nope because if he is the elimination at the wall so it wouldn't matter how good his case for the gate is.

Wait but what's the point in reading unwnd if he's going to be the elim anyway

his case for the gate could win or lose the game for the townside if he is town

[Infinity 324]

Infinity, did you guess my main?

Huh, okay; the scum range comment made me curious because you generally say that when I’m town, I’m really obvious town (and I agree that my scum game is... polarizing.) So I wasn’t sure where the sudden change might have come from.

@ydrasse I guess these are the posts I was more curious about. It feels like you're putting importance on my sorting process of you and I'm not sure why.

[absinthe]

964 and 1456 (and the progression after that) were really good examples, I can find others if you want @ffery

964 confused me because I feel like the differences in how unwnd and I approach the game outweigh the similarities. I felt more able to read him as a waller than how he currently plays. And he plays a considerably more opaque game than I think I do (from my viewpoint, I'm too transparent and usually have already blurted something out by the time I realize I might should have held a card closer to my vest).

1456 - I tend to townread irritability, and I sense the irritability in those posts, but the content is objectively NAI to me.

[Briar]

Infinity, did you guess my main?

Huh, okay; the scum range comment made me curious because you generally say that when I’m town, I’m really obvious town (and I agree that my scum game is... polarizing.) So I wasn’t sure where the sudden change might have come from.

@ydrasse I guess these are the posts I was more curious about. It feels like you're putting importance on my sorting process of you and I'm not sure why.

It was because my impression (that you knew my main in that moment) was at odds with things you have previously said on my play, which confused me because I wasn’t sure what the intention would be behind going from one philosophy how you view me to the next. It matters because, if you are town, you are at a place where you know one of me/Ana is scum (and broadly townread at that), so the way you approach both of us is something of note to me.

This applies to you being scum, albeit in this case you’re choosing who you think you can cast more doubt on.

[Anastasia]

Please stop talking about the stupid fucking mechanics

Both of your arguments are just hearsay and me needing to believe what you would do in accordance to how the night played out

Not what you've organically gained from it

How is unwnd not obvtown to everyone

why can't this just be scum!unwnd who is annoyed that Dunn/Lukewarm are townreading each other off some random bad mech interpretation?

[Briar]

Oh yeah, 1289 felt very different from the impression I had gotten all game of unwnd.

[Briar]

I’ve felt my read towards unwnd shifting towards being scummier, just because he seemed a bit deflated/phoning it in when he was joking around a bit ago; and posts like 1289 ring more to me as the true feelings of like, just resignment/anger for this game bleeding through. Which I think is more reasonable to happen post-group-reveal.

[unwnd]

My joking is to ground myself in reality that this game doesn't need to be hellpit

If I sat here and just relented my frustrations, it wouldn't be good. It's also not productive

[Briar]

Also, @Infinity, a lot of this game doesn’t make sense to me if specifically Ana is scum, because of what I know of her scumgame. Yes I say that it could exist but the reads she has this game and her philosophy on scum narrow it down to like... a game that can’t exist with that sort of scumteam, and because she’s not outed I’m being a bit vague but I hope she understands.

Alternatively, she could still just be wrong, but when she’s town she usually is right more often and I can only remember a few times where she was wrong.