Open 810 | Aliensitter Needed! | Mafia wins

[GrandpaMo]

mine

[Not_Mafia]

You're talking like he's using horoscopes to make his read

[GrandpaMo]

You're talking like he's using horoscopes to make his read

that isnt the point nm of what im tryna say.

this is exactly why i scumread bingle --

and this is also where bingle misunderstands me and thinks I am scumreading them based on their inactivity?

look bingle becomes disengaged >>> then questions me regard it and asks me bout HIS META >>> then defends you based on YOUR META.

now it is just resulting in this weird pseudo shit where bingle thinks i am scumreading them based on his meta of low activity level?

but its also how he evolved throughout this specific game and how he NEEDS to townread you because if he scumreads you then guess what?? everything bout the no lim makes no sense.

just think bout it >>> BINGLE SET THIS WHOLE THING UP. Bingle WANTED a no lim on day 3 to come to this exact moment hence why there was so much oppoistion to it. it was to setup his 100% fortified townread on NM and tried to start the townread on mena during day 4 where MENA felt like they were being pocketed. then it leads to day 5, with the person who he townreads is now scumreading them >>> and NM + (ydrasse) can be easily pocketed by Bingle. Im not TO sure bout ydrasse . like I still really really want to hear where bingle stands as well as ydrasse because i dont think ydrasse really gave clear definitions on how it could play out.

but if this is right >>> this would lead possible scum to always be with bingle + and someone who bingle possibly scumreads.

[GrandpaMo]

holy fuck that took the 2 brain cells left i had in this game

[GrandpaMo]

now bingle i am very very open to townreading you and changing my reads!! and i am willing to hear wwhat you have to say --- and this is really where im looking at on how well you take this opposition against you and how it could possibly result in a tvt sitatuion. i am willing to use our full time and discourage any fast lims here. i really really want to solve the game and i could just be blindly tunneling because it could have been setup by mena to be like that -- that is why im willing to change my reads and i encourage everyone to really always change there reads everytime because it would result in a active state and if we want to win as town that is the most optimal thing to garner is push ppl and see if they have scum reactions / result. i still believe that WE can win as town -- i always hate giving up as town and thats why i questioned A50 concession. even tho we have may lost most hope, there is always still the last hope to be gained and i believe in town we can get scum out this day.

[Not_Mafia]

holy fuck that took the 2 brain cells left i had in this game

tl;dr

[Not_Mafia]

holy fuck that took the 2 brain cells left i had in this game

tl;dr

[GrandpaMo]

holy fuck that took the 2 brain cells left i had in this game

tl;dr

bingle wanted a no lim on day 3 to set the townreads on you + mena

[GrandpaMo]

also its not even that long, just read ffs im not bout have my cocntext ruined thru tldrs .. its very very important to read always into details especially consideirng its mylo

[Not_Mafia]

also its not even that long, just read ffs im not bout have my cocntext ruined thru tldrs .. its very very important to read always into details especially consideirng its mylo

I can't be bothered

[Menalque]

Am I missing anything on why it can’t be Bingle + mo? I started rereading and I’m now realising I may have been ruling that possibility out without justification

[Menalque]

Lukewarm, do you have any non-pokemon related thoughts on any players yet?

Yeah. I am actually suspicious of Bingle making the suggestion for the psych to automatically out a guilty result. Because imo, that seems more likely to out the sitter then to out mafia.

I think that they know that too, because they were in the Open Setup review of the game that the mod linked to in the first post, and there they talked about the Psych having "a fake inno and a fake guilty on a questionable reliability investigative."

So from my PoV, Bingle came out with some anti-town advice, and then said for no one to question them

Let me give you a quick rundown on how Bingle do.

Bingle will argue the optimal strategy for town as he sees it, regardless of his alignment. Bingle is good at mechanics speak. Bingle is very good at mechanics speak. Bingle is widely regarded as among the best at mechanics on site. Bingle has said, specifically, that there are a bunch of things that are mechanically optimal, and that we should not discuss mechanics speak further for the rest of the day.

Either, Bingle is telling the truth that this is a protown maneuver or Bingle is crippling his ability to lean into mechanics speak, setting himself up to be questioned thoroughly on not D1 (historically the day when Bingle wants to be questioned in order to establish himself), and taking a harsh departure from what is a tried and true strategy Bingle has used as both town and scum for literally years to a pretty good result in a lobby that is at least half full of people who know Bingle pretty well.

Feel free to scumread me for it (I in fact enjoy scumreads, they are delicious) but we are done talking mech for D1.

I am actually a little confused how the psychologist role helps us in this set up.

If he can get a "can kill" result on the baby sitter, but gets a "not able to kill" result on the cowardly mafia + any mafia that has already committed a kill, then on day 1 wouldn't a "can kill" result be a 50/50 chance at being the babysitter or mafia. And then starting on Day 2, they will basically be getting "is babysitter" and "is not babysitter" results, right?

That makes me question this advice given by Bingle

Optimal play is for baby to target Allen and Allen to aim for scrum.

We all pseudoclaim a psych inno D2 and maybe later day phases on the basis of how kills pan out.

psych claims immediately if has guilty

I do have to comment on this though:

@Luke:

REGARDLESS OF HIS ALIGNMENT

; you should always treat Bingle's mech talk as gospel. It is accurate and indeed best play for Town. End of discussion.

Note: The above is not limited to this game. It does apply here but is a general rule of the thumb.

I am actually a little confused how the psychologist role helps us in this set up.

If he can get a "can kill" result on the baby sitter, but gets a "not able to kill" result on the cowardly mafia + any mafia that has already committed a kill, then on day 1 wouldn't a "can kill" result be a 50/50 chance at being the babysitter or mafia. And then starting on Day 2, they will basically be getting "is babysitter" and "is not babysitter" results, right?

That makes me question this advice given by Bingle

Optimal play is for baby to target Allen and Allen to aim for scrum.

We all pseudoclaim a psych inno D2 and maybe later day phases on the basis of how kills pan out.

psych claims immediately if has guilty

I do have to comment on this though:

@Luke:

REGARDLESS OF HIS ALIGNMENT

; you should always treat Bingle's mech talk as gospel. It is accurate and indeed best play for Town. End of discussion.

Note: The above is not limited to this game. It does apply here but is a general rule of the thumb.

I have never played a game with Bingle, so I guess I will take your work for it for now. His advice doesn't really come into play until day 2 anyways, so we can talk about it then.

Responding to post 196 without a quote because I hate the way you formatted that. How am I supposed to respond when your entire post is hidden inside of an older quote?

Yeah, it feels like you are not actually reading my posts, and are instead trying to make it fit to this idea you already have in your head. Almost50 had almost no influence on me dropping my scumread on Bingle.

This is why I dropped it:

what is a tried and true strategy Bingle has used as both town and scum for literally years to a pretty good result in a lobby that is at least half full of people who know Bingle pretty well.

Bingle claimed that he has done the same thing in every game he has played for years. I cannot imagine that this is a lie, because it is something that could easily be disproven by anyone willing to look back over his game history or by anyone who has played games with him in the past. I decided to move bingle back to a null read at this point, because I believed him here that it was NAI.

Almost50 chiming in was just an extra little nudge that re-accessing the situation as NAI was the right move.

Why are you lying? You keep saying "Almost50 had almost no influence on me dropping my scumread on Bingle" but you literally reply to that quote and agree with them, what am I suppose to think? (in post 148) That they didn't have influence on you? Of course I will make that claim. Just look at how you acknowledged it; it clearly seemed you were influenced by A50 here.

I quoted the other two quotes to see the chronological order of which these events followed. Bingle said somehting, A50 did too and you come out and reply to A50 acknowledging what Bingle said; idk it seems an influence to me.

Also what does the quote thing have to do with anything? Are you tyring to find petty reasons to seem like "oh scum would do this" you could literally just reply to me and quote under a different color. I needed to reply to everything you had so I can justify my reads and my reasoning. We may disagree or agree, oh well, as long as you understand what I am trying to say and I feel like you aren't right now.

Looking back I feel like this doesn’t look good for mo, and I remember at the time thinking that one of lukewarm/mo was town and the other was scum

[Menalque]

Maybe I should stop worrying about the NKA, but I really feel bingle should be dead by now? Like, if he and A50 are mutually TRing each other I find it a very odd decision to choose to take bingle further into the game instead of A50 (no offence, A50, but you being kinda “out there” sometimes makes you more available for a mislim than I think bingle generally is)

[Menalque]

Actually, I’m gonna change my vote to this.
He calls me out when I call out T3’s entrance as not that great and comparing it with Dann.
Then when T3 votes then he throws T3 in his SR’s.

VOTE: Lukewarm

Eh

Sure

VOTE: lukewarm

I’d also like to note that I don’t think this is something I’d do as scum, and is probably one of the best points against anyone thinking I was partnered with drap.

When I’m scum, I’m generally not going to very conspicuously sheep my buddy — I like to do my best to make sure that we don’t look too aligned, especially in the early game. Feel free to check my latest two scumgames where in p-mylo I consistently took stances against the skitter-lili hydra to try to avoid us looking aligned (later on we were super aligned, but out of circumstance, not desire) and also I’m fairly sure I did the same thing in the game where I was scum with vanders (I just checked, here’s the iso for me and my buddy — there was no daytalk so I couldn’t tell him to stop, but notice that while he consistently follows my votes, I consistently change away to make sure we don’t look like we’re pushing too much for the same things viewtopic.php?t=86045&f=83&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go )

As such, if I *was* going to make an exception and sheep my buddy for WIFOM purposes (and I generally don’t play for WIFOM unless I think I’m already losing, which... why would I feel that way at this point?) I doubt I’d do it in such a casual way? This is where it maybe gets a bit too self-meta-y, but I would probably wanna play off a sheep vote on one of my buddies as the result of some “progression” from interacting with them. Not just lazy plop it down with “eh sure”

[Menalque]

I mean, I also think it’s fairly obvious that I’m just town at this point anyway, but I mention in case there are doubts

[Menalque]

Why are you lying?

Okay, I am done interacting with you over this one comment tbh.

I'll say it lay it out one last time before I start hard ignoring this topic: Bingle's claim that he has done it in every game game for years was enough for me to decide that it was NAI. Before I got caught up on the thread,

I also read Almost50's post, which further confirmed it should be NAI.

Bingle made a statement, and that statement would be a dumb lie to tell. I mean if it was a lie, it could have be easily disproven by anyone willing to read his backlog (or by any of the people who have obviously played with him before) and therefore I decided to believe it.

Why should I not have believed his claim that he does that every game? If you are trying to say that it is indicative of me being scum, then you need to explain why town!Luke would not have reacted the exact same way.

Believe me or don't believe me, but I don't know what else there is to say on the matter.

I just saw this ngl. You literally contradicted what you said in the highlighted bold. You said in the earlier post that Almost50 had absoletly NO influence on your confirmation. And guess what you claim literally that it further confirmed it should be NAI. Do you see how why I suspect you could just be spewing lies out of your ass? I was never looking at Bingle's statement being a lie... like I said it's not what happened it is how you interacted with Bingle that was more sus. You keep going by the fact of the content being made. I thought the content was fine; I am not really assessing that. A scum mindset would have the same right now; you are going based of what you said and what bingle said and not looking at the bigger pciture. So literally everything after the bolded is irrelavent info. And I really see that as a way for you as scum to just cover your tracks. Honestly, you saying you don't want to interact with me is also anti town. I think my vote is gonna stay this for now.

VOTE: Lukewarm

Think this also looks bad now that lukewarm has flipped, was a lot harder to judge what was going on in the interaction at the time, but knowing that lukewarm was approaching things in good faith makes this argument look far reachier and too hyperbolic

[Menalque]

Also, contextually, it seems important that at that point in time, lukewarm’s main read and push is on scum

It doesn’t seem mad to me that mo might try the chainsaw defence in response, especially as drap still isn’t under that much pressure at this point. Scumteam probably still saw drap as salvageable and part of trying to do that might have involved undermining lukewarm’s credibility

[Menalque]

Like he had time to respond before and after that readslist.
He also hasn’t explained much of his reads (or at least not that I’m aware of)
Like his highest TR according to the sheet is Gypyx...

I wouldn't say that they are in order, more like just two groups atm.

But I have explained why I scumlean you, and I did not think your response was enough for me to change it. This is why I said that I scumleaned you:

when I iso'ed him there was a bunch of little things that pinged me, and no posts that made me townlean him, so I am happy with that vote for now.

It was a 2 part reason. "a bunch of little things," and no posts that made me

town lean you

. Yes, you tried to address the little things, and I took your response into consideration, but I still have

not seen any townie posts

from you, so my read on you stayed the same.

I am townleaning gypyx because of his response to the me/bingle interaction. He is the one who made me realize that I had misunderstood bingle, when I feel like scum could have just stayed quiet and let the misunderstanding sit.

Think your a little confused on your read there buddy.
You scum lean me if I recall not Town lean me, unless you just randomly 180’d you mis put “Town” instead of “Scum” which kinda makes me believe you aren’t entirely genuine about your read towards me.
You don’t believe me to have done anything Townie then keep watching me and I’m sure I’ll reveal my alignment eventually. If we both survive for tomorrow and you have the exact same read on me and nothing has changed, Boi I may have to bring up my 3rd Pokémon Move on you.

Um, If you read my posts I’m pretty sure I clarified my reasons and it shouldn’t have been that hard to catch on to what it was.
I don’t think helping with misunderstandings is AI? Considering A50 pointed out something I didn’t see and while it wasn’t entirely a misunderstanding it’s something I missed. It doesn’t really mean anything in the long run but I did miss it. I’m also pretty sure it was You (or maybe Gypyx) who called me out on it being bad.
I don’t know, if your only reason to TR Gypyx is “helped with misunderstandings” I hope you have more to add to that read of yours down the line.

This post furthers my feeling that scum didn’t have a plan of bussing drap at this point. I think if so he’d be more aggro with lukewarm instead of concerned with trying to get him to change his read on him, which is what this feels like. “I’m pretty sure if you read my posts” — yes, it’s an attack, but it’s also an appeal, I think? Like he thinks lukewarm’s reasons are bad but also doesn’t want to commit to TRing lukewarm in case he can’t change his mind

Also, nobody else who must be on the scumteam is gunning for drap atp. That should be happening if they’d already decided to bus

[Menalque]

Which is like EXTRA extra concerning when you consider that dann normally radiates town when town

this is so incorrect if you've ever played in any game with me that's not called team mafia and you have actually

like

this is the type of thing people who don't know me very well say because there's a meme reputation of being a deep wolf or whatever blah blah blah

but we literally had a game together VERY RECENTLY where I was like scummy as hell

granted I was hard defending you early on so maybe that colored your perception? but you definitely didn't hard town read me that game iirc

Never responded to this (sorry) but the reason I expect you to be hard town to me is bc of that game with hiraku/dram/A50 (the one with maf/werewolves) where you were quickly and strongly town to me

I feel like I have a good track record on reading you as town in the games we’ve had together and you’ve generally been town. Maybe I would read you as town if scum too, and obviously this game is an exception, but this was why you not seeming immediately town to me concerned me at the time

[Bingle]

I mean, I also think it’s fairly obvious that I’m just town at this point anyway, but I mention in case there are doubts

Eh. You're not locktown, but you are "I've already lost if this is not town" if that makes sense.

[Menalque]

Who would I be scum with at this point?

[Menalque]

Bingle, why have you been posting much more in other games than here? I would expect you, if town, to be quite interested in seeing if you can solve the puzzle instead of being avoidant

[Menalque]

Ydrasse dipping the fuck out is Not A Great Look for that slot

[Not_Mafia]

Is Menalque all that town? He basically sauntered in day 3 and pushed our PR

[Menalque]

VOTE: T3

Every post above me is town.

VOTE: VFP

The quoted post is literally a scum claim.

NGL.
I didn’t notice that till you pointed it out.

on the other hand, ew @ this

VOTE: professor

still not a fan of Pooky ftr

This is what I’m “ew” on?
I could probably give you like 3 others posts I’ve made that is more “ew” then that one.
Like can you explain?
Feels like your just trying to reach for a reason to vote me.

just the way you apparently take this seriously without doing the appropriate actions in that case (a vote)

but hey, what do you think is scummier than that and for what reasons now that you're on the topic?

I said I didn’t notice it to be consider that way. If you read my ISO you will know I GT’ed VFP.
Unless your referring to the after when you placed your vote, well if you go look at the thread I’m already voting you.
For your last part, if you read my ISO you can find allot better stuff to case me on.
I’m saying I feel like you just grab a random post of mine to vote me on.

GT'd? wdym?

and welp, i'm not seeing the stuff to case you on if that wasn't obvious, so that's why i'm interested on what you think it is, it would really be appreciated if you did that really

GT = Gut Town
Which you would know if you read my posts.

Hold Up.
Your “not seeing the stuff to case me on if that wasn’t obvious”.
So it’s an OMGUS vote that was placed on me then?
Um I’m not sure I understand the last part.
You want

me

to give

you

a reason why your vote on

me

is valid?
Huh?
I’m pretty sure I’m not understanding you here can you elaborate please.

Is this whole interaction really bussing?