Mini Theme 2217 | Owner's market blitz | Over

[Smoke and Mirrors]

marcis town
like
always town
dont bother pushing her ill treat that as a scumclaim

@SS

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

S & M
Something_Smart
Marcistar

Kyouku

[ssbm_Kyouko]

@mod can you confirm this night action resolution in thread since there seems to be some confusion?

A tracks B
B kills C
D jailkeeps C

What result does A receive?
-B didn't go anywhere
-No result

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Why tf would scum!us track a buddy?

This is explained in the post you quoted. You would Track Gamma to fake an inno on him. It didnt work as you'd planned because of the jailkeep.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Yes, you need to case me. We are in mlimlo. If you want this win you're going to have to work for it. Demonstrate that I make sense as a Gamma partner, and refute my case if you're town. If you don't, and S_S is scum, we lose. Deadline is no excuse today either because we can still no lim to get more day phases.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

@mod can you confirm this night action resolution in thread since there seems to be some confusion?

A tracks B
B kills C
D jailkeeps C

What result does A receive?
-B didn't go anywhere
-No result

If you tried to visit Marci, that would be our result but since she was jailkept by Mastina, my result on you was meaningless.

I pm’d him and that’s what he told me but anyone who understands how a jk would impact a tracker result could clearly figure that out but that’s what Gypyx told me: if you visited Marci, our result is useless.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Why tf would scum!us track a buddy?

This is explained in the post you quoted. You would Track Gamma to fake an inno on him. It didnt work as you'd planned because of the jailkeep.

Keep rewriting history.

We tracked you.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Jesus christ are you obtuse? Obviously Gamma isn't a Hider, this is an open setup. It is clear from context that I am saying he could be hiding behind town!you's pushes and reads to look less scummy as your scumreads get flipped as red. I'm saying he could be buddying you, pocketing you, etc.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

@mod can you confirm this night action resolution in thread since there seems to be some confusion?

A tracks B
B kills C
D jailkeeps C

What result does A receive?
-B didn't go anywhere
-No result

Oops I did the same thing I did in my pm, what I meant to present as options:

-B visits C
-No Result

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Yes, you need to case me. We are in mlimlo. If you want this win you're going to have to work for it. Demonstrate that I make sense as a Gamma partner, and refute my case if you're town. If you don't, and S_S is scum, we lose. Deadline is no excuse today either because we can still no lim to get more day phases.

Oh please give me a break. Scum S_S guilties his partner in what freaking universe?

I made my case.

Gamma hardpushed me to vote you for MO > Flea/CB
You tried to save obvscum!Kitty and miselim town!VFP instead
A few early posts from Imaginality accusing you of scumslipping.
You hardpushed the bus theory because you already KNEW it was true where as I clearly did not.

You were only onboard with saving SS and limming Cyrus because he said if you didn’t die you were scum. That’s why when you supposedly gave your MO to VFP and didn’t die, I thought VFP purposely didn’t kill you but when he flipped town, I obviously then knew it wasn’t the reason.

Then you lie and try to give Imaginality the impression that we have hitman, so his roleblock can’t clear us. Then right before the day ends, you actually tell the truth and admit you not only have it but have actually had it since day freaking 1!

What possible town motivation could you have to lie about this? NONE.

I KNOW it’s you and I will do my damndest to convince both SS and Marci that it’s you because you’re practically doing cartwheels now to try to make each of them sus the other.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Why tf would scum!us track a buddy?

This is explained in the post you quoted. You would Track Gamma to fake an inno on him. It didnt work as you'd planned because of the jailkeep.

Keep rewriting history.

We tracked you.

If you tracked me you saw I did not go anywhere. This is not an inno on me because 2 scum were alive, but combined with the fact I had hitman available from D1, it may as well be an inno. If I were scum I would have used it that night. The time to use it would be to get around the Jailkeeper. Doctors can only stop the kill by guessing the target. The JK can stop the kill by guessing the target, guessing the killer, or even accidentally stop it for the wrong reasons by trying to protect the killer.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Jesus christ are you obtuse? Obviously Gamma isn't a Hider, this is an open setup. It is clear from context that I am saying he could be hiding behind town!you's pushes and reads to look less scummy as your scumreads get flipped as red. I'm saying he could be buddying you, pocketing you, etc.

He was obviously buddying me and I was wrong to not listen to CB on Alisae. I honestly thought Alisae would play a lot better as scum but I honestly can’t see why scum!Gamma would try so hard to push me to vote you for MO if you weren’t his buddy?

What other possible reason would he do that?

If you’re not his buddy, then he should have been fine with me voting for Flea or CB. He also didn’t say anything about it being deadline as a reason either, He hardpushed this and scum!Mastina did something very similar in a game but far less obviously. She tried to get us all to vote for her buddy Pink Ball. The difference was she was a lot more subtle but also, it actually mattered a lot less than in this game.

I also know we’re town.
I don’t believe SS would ever guilty a buddy. I have meta on him, remember?
I believe Distance inno’d Marci and that’s why he died. I also don’t see why Marci would kill Distance.

Mastina would never have scum!me as her #1 tr and has never townlocked me as scum. She said that this is “transparently town!Nancy”. I can dig up the post if need be. I just don’t see how it’s not you, because every single damn thing points to it.

And wrt to your nonsense track Gamma thing, why then didn’t we claim that? As Imaginality pointed out, why wrongly claim an inno on you? And had I not clarified with Gypyx that that inno was meaningless if you visited jk’d Marci, you might possibly have won this but the jk thing made me doubt that our result was valid, so damn good thing I verified it.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Why tf would scum!us track a buddy?

This is explained in the post you quoted. You would Track Gamma to fake an inno on him. It didnt work as you'd planned because of the jailkeep.

Keep rewriting history.

We tracked you.

If you tracked me you saw I did not go anywhere. This is not an inno on me because 2 scum were alive, but combined with the fact I had hitman available from D1, it may as well be an inno. If I were scum I would have used it that night. The time to use it would be to get around the Jailkeeper. Doctors can only stop the kill by guessing the target. The JK can stop the kill by guessing the target, guessing the killer, or even accidentally stop it for the wrong reasons by trying to protect the killer.

Sorry but this explanation is just wifom. I think you either didn’t know Mastina was jk - I sure as hell didn’t or if you did somehow realize it, because I’m pretty sure she never claimed it?

Or you didn’t know she’d jk Marci. I was actually surprised because I expected her to jk me but it obviously worked out, since it’s pretty obvious Marci was the target.

I think you or Gamma killed Distance because him calling Marci push a “scumclaim” makes sense if he got an actual inno on her. That’s why I don’t believe it’s Marci. I don’t believe scum!SS guilties a buddy. I think that is totally anti-wincon, especially since Gamma was being more strongly tr att than him.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Jesus christ are you obtuse? Obviously Gamma isn't a Hider, this is an open setup. It is clear from context that I am saying he could be hiding behind town!you's pushes and reads to look less scummy as your scumreads get flipped as red. I'm saying he could be buddying you, pocketing you, etc.

He was obviously buddying me and I was wrong to not listen to CB on Alisae. I honestly thought Alisae would play a lot better as scum but I honestly can’t see why scum!Gamma would try so hard to push me to vote you for MO if you weren’t his buddy?

What other possible reason would he do that?

If you’re not his buddy, then he should have been fine with me voting for Flea or CB. He also didn’t say anything about it being deadline as a reason either, He hardpushed this and scum!Mastina did something very similar in a game but far less obviously. She tried to get us all to vote for her buddy Pink Ball. The difference was she was a lot more subtle but also, it actually mattered a lot less than in this game.

I also know we’re town.
I don’t believe SS would ever guilty a buddy. I have meta on him, remember?
I believe Distance inno’d Marci and that’s why he died. I also don’t see why Marci would kill Distance.

Mastina would never have scum!me as her #1 tr and has never townlocked me as scum. She said that this is “transparently town!Nancy”. I can dig up the post if need be. I just don’t see how it’s not you, because every single damn thing points to it.

And wrt to your nonsense track Gamma thing, why then didn’t we claim that? As Imaginality pointed out, why wrongly claim an inno on you? And had I not clarified with Gypyx that that inno was meaningless if you visited jk’d Marci, you might possibly have won this but the jk thing made me doubt that our result was valid, so damn good thing I verified it.

If he was obviously buddying you then why didn't you track him? You expressed suspicion that you were being buddies and you addressed the possibility of S_S, CB, and maybe Mastina buddying you, but you never mentioned the possibility he was buddying you. If it is now obvious, and you were suspicious at the time, why did you not address it, and why did you not use your tracker in a manner consistent with your read on the gamestate?

Gamma didnt push you hard to vote me for MO. He made a short and simple post: "why NOT?" And you immediately acquiesced. I guess somehow you already were strongly TRing him for no reason before the Kitty wagon flipped, as the presence on the Kitty wagon seems to be your excuse for TRing him in this game. Convenient that you can do that and avoid analyzing his play.

You were both working together to buddy me. It is clear when reading his reasoning for voting me MO that he is appealing to my emotions. This is just a continuation of his plan to get you two into the town block by campaigning publicly for a town MO and eliminating scum D1.


You know you're town? I think not. Consider the following:
Maybe you do know S_S wouldn't bus. Probably he didnt bus as it seems likely you are the last scum. If you're town though, you're wrong, and he did bus, because I also know I'm town, and Marci seems to have been innoed.

Distance died so that town would think my bus theory was wrong. It wasn't wrong though.

Go ahead and dig up the mastina post for the class - mastina admitted she was having a hard time getting into this game and it was one of her worst town games in a while, and that her scumdar is static, etc. I am not going to put stock in her read on you over my own. You'll have to prove that to me on your own.

You didnt claim to track Gamma because there was no kill. If a kill happened, as you pointed out the day before, a tracker result on anyone EXCEPT VFP is a hard inno, because VFP publicly won Ninja.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Why tf would scum!us track a buddy?

This is explained in the post you quoted. You would Track Gamma to fake an inno on him. It didnt work as you'd planned because of the jailkeep.

Keep rewriting history.

We tracked you.

If you tracked me you saw I did not go anywhere. This is not an inno on me because 2 scum were alive, but combined with the fact I had hitman available from D1, it may as well be an inno. If I were scum I would have used it that night. The time to use it would be to get around the Jailkeeper. Doctors can only stop the kill by guessing the target. The JK can stop the kill by guessing the target, guessing the killer, or even accidentally stop it for the wrong reasons by trying to protect the killer.

Sorry but this explanation is just wifom.

I think you either didn’t know Mastina was jk - I sure as hell didn’t

or if you did somehow realize it, because I’m pretty sure she never claimed it?

Or you didn’t know she’d jk Marci. I was actually surprised

because I expected her to jk me

but it obviously worked out, since it’s pretty obvious Marci was the target.

I think you or Gamma killed Distance because him calling Marci push a “scumclaim” makes sense if he got an actual inno on her. That’s why I don’t believe it’s Marci. I don’t believe scum!SS guilties a buddy. I think that is totally anti-wincon, especially since Gamma was being more strongly tr att than him.

It's not WIFOM. the hard truth of it is that JK is twice as likely to stop a kill as doctor if it targets randomly, meaning hitman should be used against JK. Theres no wifom whatsoever in that argument.

Which is it? You didnt know Marci was JK or you expected her to JK you? Why would you expect to be jailed if it was obvious you won tracker? If you expected to be jailed so you as the tracker would be guarded from a kill, why didnt you holster for the night so you could pretend to have wasted your shot and had a good chance at using your ability the next night?
Answer is, you knew town won JK and expected to get jailed, so you had Gamma do the kill.

If that were the case on Distance, he would not be killed. A Cop inno can be faked by scum on a real townie. If I were scum and picked up that Distance innoed Marci, I would kill Marci, not distance. Distance wouldn't have money left if he bought cop, he also cant be the doc if he won cop (unless you assume that somehow cop and doc were won for 250 ea by the same player on D1 when everyone's wallets are full and cop is the strongest town PR in the setup), so it's statistically more likely he will be protected by the doc.

Again, Distance died because I was pushing him as a busser. Scum would not want the Kitty wagon to be investigated because Gamma was on it.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Spoiler: My push on Gamma culminating in Imaginality voting Gamma

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Mafia players will receive 800Ð.

^


Kyouko just making lies up about me

OK so I think the mastina scum deliberately no-killing theory doesn't hold up. A bit too risky and I don't think mastina needed to take the risk.

So mastina town.
Ssbm I think is likely town because daykill has been pushed back and now is unavailable to scum, and buying hitman openly D1 needed him for future auctions.
Ssbm not being killed suggests to me scum may have been coin/PR hunting and know ssbm isn't a threat on either front.

If ssbm is town his push towards VFP D1 wasn't scum trying to deflect from Kitty. So VFP scum is more possible.

I think it was easy for marci if scum to town read me to get creds for a town flip, but I don't think it's as likely as marci town.

S&M everyone seems sure is town because of Kitty wagon.

VFP, Something_Smart, Gamma.
I can see how VFP scum would want me around as a future mis elim.

I think if VFP is scum it proves his D2 wagon was town as I think scum bussing D2 is too risky for them, auction wise. Conversely VFP town helps narrow down who's scum. (Per ssbm's count, the E-1 wagon on VFP day 2 had cyrus, distance, S&M, mastina, marcistar)

I think there's at most one scum among {VFP, S&M, mastina, marcistar}. Which leaves at least one among {ssbm, Something_Smart, Gamma}

So VFP isn't scum I think Something_Smart and Gamma are. And if VFP is scum I think one or the other of them is.

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and

they

can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Isn't the bolded referring to your hypothetical scumbuddy, not you?

I just realized there are worlds where scum!S&M can buy both ADs, thirdscum can be just about anyone and they can still afford 200 for tracker, then S&M can announce the tracker result and appear to be town that bought 1-shot AD and Tracker. I dont think this happened, but it could have. So I realize voting based on bids doesnt really make sense. Any scum could be mixing and matching claims to make things appear differently to town trying to solve by numbers.

this is an outright lie


1-shot Auction Detective 300
2-shot Auction Detective 450
Tracker is 200

total is 950

scum start with 800 so its impossible for me to buy both ADs and Tracker

VOTE: Kyouko

Reread the quoted post, and relax lmao

Oh I see from pronoun usage it is unclear upon reread. By "they" I mean the third scum. I also dont think that is what happened
What I'm saying is that, even with the info we have, it isn't enough to catch any scum by looking at auction prices directly, as they are able to mix and match their purchases if needed to make the numbers line up.

What I'm saying is we need to look at dayplay and see Gamma has been sidelining the whole game. He's not offering anything original, I dont think he's scumhunting so much as he's just following the flow of others' pushes, and it's pretty easy to see it by just reading his ISO.

I also think that Distancr and Marci as kills point towards a player like Gamma and the only other sideliney player like that is S_S. I think S_S makes sense as a partner to Gamma as well - the game just really points that way.

Gamma also shares some of your reads (Imaginality / VFP theory), so you might consider that he's hiding behind you

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

In this case on Gamma directed at S&M, I even point out to them explicitly that Gamma could be hiding behind them. S&M continues posting until deadline but never addresses this point. The next morning, S_S announces a guilty on Gamma. S&M pretty immediately votes Gamma without questioning if it's a fake in LimLo, slipping that she knows Gamma's alignment.

I think it's odd that one of their highest TRs guilties another of their highest TRs (probably top 2 TRs of S&M's left alive at that point in the game) and there is no pause to question which one they were wrong about.

Gamma wasn’t a hider, he flipped goon. Because I trusted S_S, which is why I fought so hard to save him.

Do I seriously need to requote the scummy reactions Gamma had to the guilty. which I pointed out? Or are you also going to pretend that never happened?

Jesus christ are you obtuse? Obviously Gamma isn't a Hider, this is an open setup. It is clear from context that I am saying he could be hiding behind town!you's pushes and reads to look less scummy as your scumreads get flipped as red. I'm saying he could be buddying you, pocketing you, etc.

He was obviously buddying me and I was wrong to not listen to CB on Alisae. I honestly thought Alisae would play a lot better as scum but I honestly can’t see why scum!Gamma would try so hard to push me to vote you for MO if you weren’t his buddy?

What other possible reason would he do that?

If you’re not his buddy, then he should have been fine with me voting for Flea or CB. He also didn’t say anything about it being deadline as a reason either, He hardpushed this and scum!Mastina did something very similar in a game but far less obviously. She tried to get us all to vote for her buddy Pink Ball. The difference was she was a lot more subtle but also, it actually mattered a lot less than in this game.

I also know we’re town.
I don’t believe SS would ever guilty a buddy. I have meta on him, remember?
I believe Distance inno’d Marci and that’s why he died. I also don’t see why Marci would kill Distance.

Mastina would never have scum!me as her #1 tr and has never townlocked me as scum. She said that this is “transparently town!Nancy”. I can dig up the post if need be. I just don’t see how it’s not you, because every single damn thing points to it.

And wrt to your nonsense track Gamma thing, why then didn’t we claim that? As Imaginality pointed out, why wrongly claim an inno on you? And had I not clarified with Gypyx that that inno was meaningless if you visited jk’d Marci, you might possibly have won this but the jk thing made me doubt that our result was valid, so damn good thing I verified it.

If he was obviously buddying you then why didn't you track him? You expressed suspicion that you were being buddies and you addressed the possibility of S_S, CB, and maybe Mastina buddying you, but you never mentioned the possibility he was buddying you. If it is now obvious, and you were suspicious at the time, why did you not address it, and why did you not use your tracker in a manner consistent with your read on the gamestate?

Gamma didnt push you hard to vote me for MO. He made a short and simple post: "why NOT?" And you immediately acquiesced. I guess somehow you already were strongly TRing him for no reason before the Kitty wagon flipped, as the presence on the Kitty wagon seems to be your excuse for TRing him in this game. Convenient that you can do that and avoid analyzing his play.

You were both working together to buddy me. It is clear when reading his reasoning for voting me MO that he is appealing to my emotions. This is just a continuation of his plan to get you two into the town block by campaigning publicly for a town MO and eliminating scum D1.


You know you're town? I think not. Consider the following:
Maybe you do know S_S wouldn't bus. Probably he didnt bus as it seems likely you are the last scum. If you're town though, you're wrong, and he did bus, because I also know I'm town, and Marci seems to have been innoed.

Distance died so that town would think my bus theory was wrong. It wasn't wrong though.

Go ahead and dig up the mastina post for the class - mastina admitted she was having a hard time getting into this game and it was one of her worst town games in a while, and that her scumdar is static, etc. I am not going to put stock in her read on you over my own. You'll have to prove that to me on your own.

You didnt claim to track Gamma because there was no kill. If a kill happened, as you pointed out the day before, a tracker result on anyone EXCEPT VFP is a hard inno, because VFP publicly won Ninja.

I had no idea that it was Gamma who was buddying me. I was extremely surprised that I was wrong on him. I wrongly tr him, so why tf would I have tracked him?

I was however suspicious of you and thought I had a real inno on you until Gypyx clarified that unfortunately was not the case.

C’mon, you obviously deduced that he likely had the cop. Why am I bothering arguing with obvscum? You’re obviously just going to keep twisting everything I said.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Aiming for Marci is just a nullshot (someone fence-sitting regarding VFP, Mastina, you, and I) on someone who has at least some money left because they won GD for 225 and killing her also prevents her from digging Distance and clearing herself by seeing he won cop.

Heck, maybe you even thought that Marci won the JK because she had 275 left

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Btw RE: the track:
Since scum, presumably, attempted to outbid me on the jailkeeper, but failed, they would know a town player got the jailkeeper.
If the jailkeeper was used to protect, they would assume that it was on Smoke & Mirrors, the more universal townread and loudest voice, which again is why a watch there is convenient.

If the jailkeeper was used offensively rather than defensively, though? Who would the scum think would be blocked? VFP, the person with the ninja and a universal scumread, or the other scum?

OBVIOUSLY, with the scum not having control of the jailkeeper, they would know that IF the jailkeeper were used offensively, that the jailkeeper would be roleblocking VFP, necessitating the non-ninja to perform the nightkill.

Which means that in all probability, the clear on SSBM is in fact a clear. While it's obviously possible scum, knowing that they didn't get the jailkeeper, chose to holster out of fear of the jailkeeper, them deliberately no-killing guarantees the jailkeeper agency; if the jailkeeper was used offensively on VFP, VFP's a guaranteed elimination; if the jailkeeper was used defensively on town, then the town player is cleared from the jailkeeper; this, regardless of an attempt to kill or not.

In other words: scum

could

have holstered, but they had more reason to take a shot than to not. Meaning that the clear while not absolute, I still trust as being reasonably likely to be correct.

So at this point:

Smoke and Mirrors = marcistar = ssbm >> imaginality >>> Gamma Emerald

>

Something_Smart >>>>>>>> VFP to me.

Not the specific quote I was looking for but it’ll do. This is also why SS is town. Gamma was more tr than he was, so it makes absolutely no sense for him to have guiltied Gamma.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Again, if I knew he had the cop, I would not have killed him. That's a stupid move, and I'm not stupid. If I'm scum there I just shoot Marci. Why would I want to greenflip him N2 when all of D2 I was pushing a theory that scum was bussing on the Kitty wagon. I would kill a cop with no shots, no money, and no guilty? Get real

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Who am I reading wrong then?

Well townread-wise (you can substitute my name for yours, here), I'm currently at:

Smoke and Mirrors > marcistar > imaginality ~= Something_Smart > ssbm >>> Cupcake Butterfly (as of VFP voting them at end of day) > Gamma Emerald (as of

someone

needing to be scum and Gamma's vote on scum D1 being the most likely to be a bus) >>>>>>>> VFP.

Hot take: Smoke and Mirrors vs ssbm is tvt.

Doesn't seem like an especially hot take to me, but why?

Well Smoke and Mirrors is clearly town here because this is transparently Nancy's towngame through and through. It's painfully obviously Nancy's town meta, with every marker which that entails, beyond her ability to fake it as scum. Even were she having the scum performance of her life, I meant it when I said that the fact that the slot was voting scum on D1 and contains Pooky means that the slot is 100% guaranteed locktown. It IS literally a nearly 20-year-old tell for Pooky that is borderline trust tell. Pooky's relative absence from the game be damned, he's not letting a tell that old randomly be broken. He's not flaked from the hydra altogether, per Nancy and also per common sense. (If Pooky

were

100% completely and entirely out of the game I would expect Nancy to replace in solo or replace her hydra with a different hydra to get a different partner.)

ssbm is also someone there's a lot of reasons for me to think is town, but beyond those, ssbm vs Smoke+Mirrors just has literally every single classical marker of a TvT fight. It screams, bleeds, TvT to its very core at every stage.

He's town is why. He was the alternative to Kitty.

Why can't the two top wagons be S/S?

My thoughts exactly. There's nothing in how the game has played out which says that VFP was a scumdriven counterwagon to the towndriven wagon on scum. And for that matter, nothing but paranoia about VFP's L-1 wagon on D2 having scum there, when multiple members of the VFP wagon on D2 are town with a high degree of certainty. cyrus? Flipped town. Distance? Flipped town. Smoke and Mirrors? 100% conftown to me. me? Also conftown to me. marcistar? Highly highly likely to be town. The L-1 wagon on VFP was in fact in high probablity? All town.

The only possible scum there is marcistar who Distance, the nightkill, hard-vouched as being town, a read I am inclined to sheep.

I realize that others don't have the advantage of conftowning me so that objectively I could be scum on the VFP wagon--but from my point of view the wagon is as close to confirmed all-town as it can be without being confirmed as all town.

[Smoke and Mirrors]

Hot take: Smoke and Mirrors vs ssbm is tvt.

Doesn't seem like an especially hot take to me, but why?

Well Smoke and Mirrors is clearly town here because this is transparently Nancy's towngame through and through. It's painfully obviously Nancy's town meta, with every marker which that entails, beyond her ability to fake it as scum

. Even were she having the scum performance of her life, I meant it when I said that the fact that the slot was voting scum on D1 and contains Pooky means that the slot is 100% guaranteed locktown. It IS literally a nearly 20-year-old tell for Pooky that is borderline trust tell. Pooky's relative absence from the game be damned, he's not letting a tell that old randomly be broken. He's not flaked from the hydra altogether, per Nancy and also per common sense. (If Pooky

were

100% completely and entirely out of the game I would expect Nancy to replace in solo or replace her hydra with a different hydra to get a different partner.)

ssbm is also someone there's a lot of reasons for me to think is town, but beyond those, ssbm vs Smoke+Mirrors just has literally every single classical marker of a TvT fight. It screams, bleeds, TvT to its very core at every stage.

He's town is why. He was the alternative to Kitty.

Why can't the two top wagons be S/S?

My thoughts exactly. There's nothing in how the game has played out which says that VFP was a scumdriven counterwagon to the towndriven wagon on scum. And for that matter, nothing but paranoia about VFP's L-1 wagon on D2 having scum there, when multiple members of the VFP wagon on D2 are town with a high degree of certainty. cyrus? Flipped town. Distance? Flipped town. Smoke and Mirrors? 100% conftown to me. me? Also conftown to me. marcistar? Highly highly likely to be town. The L-1 wagon on VFP was in fact in high probablity? All town.

The only possible scum there is marcistar who Distance, the nightkill, hard-vouched as being town, a read I am inclined to sheep.

I realize that others don't have the advantage of conftowning me so that objectively I could be scum on the VFP wagon--but from my point of view the wagon is as close to confirmed all-town as it can be without being confirmed as all town.

[marcistar]

1. Did Imaginality provide any quotes or generalized reasoning for a partnership between me and Gamma? I'd like to address any that are resonating with you as he's no longer around to discuss with

nah theres no quotes in there

2. Can you go into what doesn't seem town about my D5 or any other parts of the game? Again I'd like to address concerns

d5 just seemed like u were trying to push whatevers easiest to convince people on mainly. it seemed like u were keeping ur options open, and not trying to limit those options down at all to find scum. thats what i dont like, and thats what convinced me on u.

3. Can you provide context to this? I'm not sure what it's referring to.

we were talking about if gamma would be scum
i said "he would vote alot quicker if he was town" something like that
he said that someone used that argument against him when the butterfly elim thing was going down
i mentioned how it was u who did that against him.

ttention his slot deserves. Nobody else was keeping their options open enough to see he was scum. I've already posted some quotes but can post more in a dedicated post if you need, to showcase my pushing on Gamma and others' "passive" townreading of him.

he didnt mention ur push on gamma at all tho..?

7. Why did you think I would try to get him miseliminated? I briefly flip-flopped end of D3 I think when CB was eliminated, I remember voting him so he would have to vote CB to self-preserve, and I SRed him on D1 some, but aside from those times, as I recall I thought he was actually trying to solve. I think he Cupcake and I have been the most active about solving in this game.

at that point my thoughts were "brrrng i was wrong somewhere, i dont think kittys partner would lead an elim against them tho" so it went down to process of elimination which made u = scum, so if scum wanted a miselim on imaginality (like he thought it was gonna be)... ur who i think is scum, so u would try to miselim him

[Smoke and Mirrors]

If you don't die your being voted off next. Scum tend to kill if they think they will get mo next.

That’s why I said 1 scum between VFP and Kyouku.