Open 820: The Siege of Aurelia — Game Over!


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Post Post #825 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:01 pm

Post by catboi »

In post 822, implosion wrote:I'm also starting to think Dunn is the scum at keep. Or at least I feel like the game probably makes more sense that way.
Why do you think he took the last spot in the keep, then?
implosion wrote:I'm pretty sure the way this setup is designed, it is *never* possible to mathematically deduce information in one location based on the flip in another location. I think it's not possible to deduce anything mathematically at all, actually.
If only we could speak to its designer to get an answer to that...
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Post Post #826 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:03 pm

Post by PenguinPower »

Mmmm

15 seconds
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Post Post #827 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:04 pm

Post by implosion »

Yeah it can definitely be useful. You just can't get a guarantee like ssbm is trying to do.
catboi wrote:Why do you think he took the last spot in the keep, then?
Idk. Might have thought they'd be able to use the swap there but then weren't able to.
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Post Post #828 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:06 pm

Post by Something_Smart »

In post 825, catboi wrote:If only we could speak to its designer to get an answer to that...
Yeah, I think it's true. I can't think of any reason why it wouldn't be.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #829 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:08 pm

Post by PenguinPower »

Glad game designers are required to be 100% truthful in their responses to setup questions during a game they’re in.
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Post Post #830 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:09 pm

Post by Something_Smart »

I mean, you're welcome to check it. The only guaranteed thing after the swap is that 1 scum is at each location.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #831 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:10 pm

Post by PenguinPower »

That wasn’t a comment toward you - more toward the initial request since the same could have been done.
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Post Post #832 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:07 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

Scum team is T3, Something_Smart, and then one of skitter/implosion.

Luckily, it doesn't matter how hard scum shades me. I believe T3 is clearly scum in my group from their posts today, which is what I was waiting on.
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Post Post #833 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:12 pm

Post by Something_Smart »

What's stopping you from voting, then?
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #834 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:19 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

I don't think catboi is going to impulsively vote for t3 so I'm not in a rush
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Post Post #835 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:10 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

Actually, why am I letting you question me like that's relevant? I claimed I'd vote for Catboi, what do you have to gain from pushing on me?

You and Infinity
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Post Post #836 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:11 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

Who do you want voted in the keep?
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Post Post #837 (ISO) » Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:13 pm

Post by Something_Smart »

I'm not pushing on you, I'm literally just curious.

I'm willing to take your word that catboi is town, since you seem pretty confident about it.
It's always the same. When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die. You don't know whose children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they're always going to have to do from the very beginning... SIT DOWN AND TALK!
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Post Post #838 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:16 am

Post by T3 »

In post 832, Dunnstral wrote:Scum team is T3, Something_Smart, and then one of skitter/implosion.

Luckily, it doesn't matter how hard scum shades me. I believe T3 is clearly scum in my group from their posts today, which is what I was waiting on.
:|
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Post Post #839 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:31 am

Post by catboi »

In post 832, Dunnstral wrote:Scum team is T3, Something_Smart, and then one of skitter/implosion.

Luckily, it doesn't matter how hard scum shades me. I believe T3 is clearly scum in my group from their posts today, which is what I was waiting on.
In post 834, Dunnstral wrote:I don't think catboi is going to impulsively vote for t3 so I'm not in a rush
Funny enough,I was actually leaning on T3-scum, not necessarily because of his words but because of what the people at the gate were saying. I assume scum are at least somewhat playing to win here, and I was suspicious of the conclusion they were angling me toward.

I'll be starting my reread now to look at skitter/implo and unwnd/s_s.
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Post Post #840 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:10 am

Post by catboi »

Gut-feelies skim of SS says scum, but don't have a good way of reading him. Largely just feel he's stiff, hasn't had any moments that showed flashes of genuine feeling. But I recognize that it's not always easy to see him as town when he's town. I think if he's scum the read on skitter is likely a distancing one. I don't think he'd expect his reads to hold much sway and would aim for having the "correct" opinion on the gate to make himself look better after that flip.

Rereading unwnd, it is very, very hard for me to see him as scum here. This does not feel like his scumplay that I've experienced at all. I'm not sure how to put it into words precisely, I just feel his posts have been more purposeful and less aimed at appealing to others, the analysis in is also more clear-headed than anything he posted when we were a team, where I'd often read what he wrote and find it incredibly confusing as to what the purpose of it was even supposed to be.

I'll need to review the previous game to fact check myself on this, memory has a habit of distorting things. But that is where my mind is at right now. Their ISOs are short enough that it was an easy review. I still feel like I ought to be attempting more detailed analysis, this was a gloss and that often leads me down the wrong path. But these are the conclusions I got.
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Post Post #841 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:58 am

Post by catboi »

The distinction of unwnd isn't as pronounced as I thought, but I still feel his analysis in the other game was using a lot of words to sound complicated that ended up being not particularly meaningful. Also featured attempts to instill doubt in others that I don't really see here. His reaction to pressure was also vastly different, and I think that is the most valuable thing to look at when it comes to meta. Most people can't help but respond differently to accusations depending on their alignment. His ISO from the last game is massive and I'm still working through it, so I don't want to speak concusively but I actually feel okay here.
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Post Post #842 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:36 pm

Post by skitter30 »

In post 789, catboi wrote:to my posts in the last game of this, and he feels, on some level, like he is really trying to convince her he is town
I feel like this too
Honestly in my mind the game feels somewhat solved:
-implo at gate
- unwnd at wall
- vote t3 at keep
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #843 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:49 pm

Post by skitter30 »

In post 814, unwnd wrote:I am a very spiteful town player and will do things just to prove a point.

When T3/Kyouko both started to engage the thread as if I were scum for basically unilateral reasons it caused an uptick. T3 has no fucking idea how I play scum and certainly Kyouko doesn't.
I dont get how that proves anything, and i do not think of u as a spitefil town player either
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #844 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:50 pm

Post by PenguinPower »

Ugh - this has not been helpful so far.
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Post Post #845 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:54 pm

Post by skitter30 »

In post 822, implosion wrote:skitter hesitates going to the gate because of her playstyle. My read on her is she's not the kind of player who would do something "anti-town" like picking a location before everything is like, fully-everyone-100%-in-agreement-decided as either alignment. I think her as town wouldn't do that and her as scum has to imitate that.
This is true enuf, its nai for me
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #846 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:57 pm

Post by skitter30 »

In post 844, PenguinPower wrote:Ugh - this has not been helpful so far.
I dont really feel like i have much to add at this point, from my pov the game is close to solved: implo at gate and someone should vote t3 at keep

Idk who tje scum is at keep but i feel like it doesnt matter since t3 is town and voting him wins that location
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #847 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:57 pm

Post by skitter30 »

In post 832, Dunnstral wrote:Scum team is T3, Something_Smart, and then one of skitter/implosion.

Luckily, it doesn't matter how hard scum shades me. I believe T3 is clearly scum in my group from their posts today, which is what I was waiting on.
Plz elaborate on scum-t3
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #848 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:59 pm

Post by skitter30 »

The fact that both people at keep are scumreading t3 js troubling. @catboi why is t3 scum?
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'skitter is fucking terrifying' ~ town-bork about scum-me

'Skitter [was] terrifying to play against ngl' ~ scum-bork about town-me

'Going into lylo against scum!skit unprepared is like having someone force feed you dull razor blades. It's painful, and once it starts, you're pretty much dead' ~ NMSA

'Skitter you're a spirit animal's spirit animal' ~ slaxx
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Post Post #849 (ISO) » Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:30 pm

Post by Dunnstral »

In post 842, skitter30 wrote:
In post 789, catboi wrote:to my posts in the last game of this, and he feels, on some level, like he is really trying to convince her he is town
I feel like this too
Honestly in my mind the game feels somewhat solved:
-implo at gate
- unwnd at wall
- vote t3 at keep
Exact opposite of my reads so you're probably scum

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