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Post #111 (isolation #0) » Fri May 11, 2018 6:16 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 47, Mathdino wrote:My favourite theme games have essentially been Normals with flavour wrapped on.
This makes me smile because I haven't really done much in the way of fancy flavor mechanics in any games yet, and it's nice to know someone enjoys those. I definitely intend to buck that trend sometime though.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
In post 61, northsidegal wrote:If people are taking too long for making their own changes to move forward, isn't that their problem and not the NRG's?
in my experiences with game review, all of my delays came because of the reviewers taking too long to come back and check the thread. they also are very nitpicky about things. All of my role PMs have been copied from previously approved role pms yet I get asked to make changes for some reason. My last game took around 5 weeks to be approved and it was nearly identical to a game I had previously ran on another account except I made minor changes. That time frame is completely unacceptable especially since there was a lack of approved games.
we need to replace the current reviewers and bring in new blood. Especially one reviewer who I won't name by name, she approves way to many unbalanced games imo
I agree that reviews stall frequently due to non-presence of reviewers, in all departments. I think we should make it an unspoken rule that reviewers should constantly check threads for reviews they are a part of (once a day minimum)
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
In post 137, Mathdino wrote:I use Activated Innocent Child for the kind that you activate, and just Innocent Child or D1 Innocent Child for the automatic ones.
D1 Innocent Child is not whitelisted... unfortunately. Only Night Specific modifiers are... not Day Specific.
But Yes Activated Innocent Child would be ok, too.
What do you think about Informed?
I think day modifiers are also included, right? I think I've seen novice dayvig
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
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Post #144 (isolation #3) » Sun May 20, 2018 6:16 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 143, callforjudgement wrote:Under current guidelines, we have Activated Innocent Child (triggers on request), and Innocent Child (triggers at the start of D1).
The main weirdness is that you can have an Innocent Child variant that becomes alignment-confirmed at the start of a Night, but not at the start of a Day other than D1.
(Also, Dayvig is not Normal, and IMO should not be Normal. It's a fine role for Themes, but IMO the day should be clearly separate from the night in a Normal.)
I've seen Day X (not 1) IC in some normals
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #147 (isolation #4) » Tue May 29, 2018 4:52 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
I like the stipulation about being the last one alive in a group, makes a town traffic analyst lose power if one mafia remains, I look forward to seeing it in action. Other roles/modifiers are nice but this one excites me
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
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Post #241 (isolation #10) » Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:24 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
You can just call a role that watches or voyeurs itself a “self-ability/self-targeting ability” role
Also I think Jailor is a weird role because of how in probably most utilizations it would have to pre-determine a target during the day phase, necessitating player mindfulness
Honestly it doesn’t feel like it fits the Normal scope
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #245 (isolation #11) » Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:34 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
Following Ircher’s response I think another issue with the role is how it creates only a temporary neighborhood, I think that kinda doesn’t fit what Normals aim for
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #266 (isolation #12) » Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:38 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
P sure Seraph Knight is fixed BG but whatever
Speaking of BG I recall once being told BG is a redirection of a kill onto the user, does that mean it shouldn’t be normal? FYI this is a joke but if we want to get serious about it I don’t mind.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
In post 291, Alisae wrote:Why is the role fun to play?
I don’t get it maybe I don’t see the fun in the role.
This is important btw
Its super important to make sure your game is going to be fun to play.
I get the design elements behind it and the depth it allows for, but if its not a fun role to play, who cares
I played it once and although I was barely in the game long myself it was still fun knowing the picture of the game and trying to utilize it.
Tbh I kinda wanna roll Traitor again some day just to try my hand at it for realsies
Plus there’s trying to indicate your identity to your team. Tbh I think making Traitor recruitable, on top of other things that maybe feel non normal, hurts the idea of scum having to be careful around the traitor
I liked what Boonskiies did in one of his games where iirc he made it so the traitors (cos multiball) had to target their team to get recruited. Obviously this wouldn’t work perfectly with how it is supposed to know their identities but like maybe give the traitor some ability that enable that, like Neighborizer (but prolly make it Novice or something?)
Also I remember that Large Normal you modded with Frogger where the mafia had a cop to find their traitor, I liked that
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
If NK'd the Bomb also takes out its attacker, which could be neat.
In post 304, Wake1 wrote:Maybe Paranoid Gun Owner instead to make it not just dangerous for Mafia? Another reactive one-time killing role could be neat.
I like this tbh
maybe a Bomb that has to be turned on to work properly rather than just being a passive role would be more balanced
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #409 (isolation #17) » Thu Dec 12, 2019 3:21 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 322, Amrun wrote:Idk I just feel like if you track X to nowhere in a normal you shouldn’t have to speculate “but what if they’re a ninja?”
That’s for themes.
Untrustworthy results is fine in Normals, other wise Gunsmith wouldn’t be normal
The reason Godfather got canned as I see it is it screwed with how the game was played too much
Ninja doesn’t really do that to the extent GF does. Worst I see is a Watcher seeing someone visit a Ninja’d kill and get a false guilty
And like your given scenario isn’t that significant because Ninja isn’t meant to counter Tracker, it’s meant to counter Watcher. So Tracker should not need to think that hard about it.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Instead of having the permitted roles and mechanics outline the principles and expectations of Normal, have the principles and expectations of Normal outline the permitted roles and mechanics.
There's BooneyToonz if you want a bottom-up Normal game.
I completely agree. We need to agree on what, fundamentally, IS the concept of a normal game, and then allow/disallow roles based on their adherence to that concept.
Axe ninja and Miller. They’re not needed and contradict the idea of Normal IMO.
Vanillizer, on the other hand, does not, IMO. At this point in time the “normal” designation seems arbitrary.
Personally, I would also axe multitasking! But that’s more debatable.
P-edit: Yes, it would be powerful. That’s a question of balance, not which roles are normal. Currently, ungated cops are not usually used, and that trend would continue.
Tbh what grounds do you consider vanillaizer normal by
Like I wouldn’t want to be able to lose my role in a Normal, that just doesn’t seem fun at all
That seems like solid reason for it to not be normal
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Loyalblocker isn't the same thing as Loyal Roleblocker for example.
Here's how I'd define the variant roles:
Loyalblocker - Make a player unable to target players that they don't share an alignment with for the night (effectively making them Loyal for the night, or roleblocking them if they target outside their alignment)
1-shot Ascetic - Immune to non-kill actions the first night they are targeted by a non-kill action.
Strongman as a modifier - A modifier making you ignore roleblocking, protection, rolestopping, and immunities. Does not allow targeting commuting commuters.
Superstar - IC without the innocent part i.e. it doesn't confirm alignment. A variant of this might be publically revealing your role as if you were public role copped.
Follower-Cop - A weakened role cop that gets results in the term of a Follower. (probably a bad name tbh since it sounds like a hybrid role)
pedit: yeah confusing roles like Town 1-shot Weak Loyal Combined Neighborizer Friendly Neighbor isn't really normal and the normalcy part of the reviews should weed that out imo.
I prefer the idea of inherent multitasking being something the mod puts in the ruleset imo
I think Multitasking should go the way of Encryptor where you can have unannounced multitasking through the modifier or have announced multitasking. I especially want this because Multitasking X can be a soft/hard guilty to a Role Cop.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #434 (isolation #21) » Tue Dec 31, 2019 6:43 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 426, gobbledygook wrote:I will hard veto and lobby against any game especially normals to include Vanillalizer as a role. That role is so incredibly unfun to play against as town.
MAFIA vanillaizer sure. Town vanillaizer can be interesting (though I still firmly believe it to be not-normal).
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
A vanillaizer is a long standing role that everyone is familiar with.
These new variants change how we think about the game and would have people needing to look them up, so they’re not normal. Totally viable roles though.
Wasn't Gunsmith like that when it was introduced?
And "long standing" + "familiar" doesn't make it fair at all.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #551 (isolation #28) » Wed Oct 07, 2020 12:48 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
Except it changes how you investigate to cops temporarily. Firstly, that doesn’t seem useful ever, and secondly, it kinda bends the role changing rules.
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
It can be a weaker... Neapolitan-ish thing if you have something that's obviously going to be a town role, or will be after some of the setup is revealed. Doesn't confirm all the VTs, just one PR (maybe something you have a few of)
It can function like a Scum Rolecop/Neap/Vanilla Cop/whatever where you want to give scum the ability to target a particular part of the town. Like Scum PT Cop hunting Masons, but for other things. Those roles have some use when you want to give scum just a some specific counterplay. e.g. Doctor-Finder
Finally, it can be used as a way to hint about the nature of the setup without giving an Informed role.
maybe give scum a doctor finder in a setup with a doc+cop combo
it's provides a counter to follow the cop without being a full rolecop
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #625 (isolation #37) » Fri Jun 04, 2021 4:48 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
Would Superstar announce the full role, or just the Superstar portion?
Besides that question, I have no qualms with TL’s ideas that aren’t already addressed by the normal guidelines
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
In post 671, TemporalLich wrote:Combined Cop would technically be correct but also is wrong - You're meant to put at least two things in a Combined container but it's not like you're going to crash the game if Combined has 1 or 0 things in it.
well, a Mafia combined cop would be forced to have the same target for a Factional Kill and Cop action right?
This would be interesting with a Bulletproof Traitor actually
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #712 (isolation #44) » Wed Jul 07, 2021 4:56 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 703, TemporalLich wrote:I'll argue that a red herring is not a moderator lie: there's nothing about a Cop Enabler that informs you that Cops exist in the setup.
Enablers/Backups/[role]-Finders without their associated role existing in the setup is a red herring - it is designed to lead to a false conclusion (that the associated role exists) but there's nothing that actually states the conclusion is true.
It gets even more unusual when you consider the Backup/same Backup interaction - I assume one of the Backups dying in that scenario activates the other, otherwise there's no point to having two Backups unless the non-Backup version of the role exists. (note: this gets really weird with two Backup Bulletproof roles - I'd have to resolve in that case simultaneously NKing both will result in both dying as neither have time to back up)
I have seen a double backup scenario, the function was that both triggered at the same time
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
Post
Post #858 (isolation #58) » Sat Sep 18, 2021 6:14 pm
Postby Gamma Emerald »
I’ve had a game in the works for like a year that kinda has hit every snag in the books but I intend to run it as a Booneytoonz entry once I get it in shape
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”
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Post #874 (isolation #59) » Sun Sep 19, 2021 5:47 am
Postby Gamma Emerald »
In post 867, Wake1 wrote:How about a sub-section in the Normal forum for "Almost Normal" games, where variations and concepts could be tested to see how they work? That way it could be an easier way to facilitate evolution of Normal games.
In post 868, Gypyx wrote:sounds like putting the graylist into place but with extra steps lol
personally i'd be fine with it, although maybe splitting up the normal queue isn't the best idea, a rotation could be better?
Maybe what you do is you have a group of trusted mods on file that can run Almost Normal games, iirc the newbie queue has a list of moderators who are basically trusted to handle those games well. And what you do is just sorta run an Almost Normal setup periodically, maybe like once every 3 months
Also I have some ideas I’ve been kicking around but they’re kinda being reserved for one setup in particular I’ve been working on for about a year off and on
<Embrace The Void>
“A flipped coin doesn't always land heads or tails. Sometimes it may never land at all...”