Newbie 2086 - Reaction GIFs | End!

[fferyllt]

Vote Count 2-2

catboi

(1): Greeting

Not Voting

(6): ɀefiend, catboi, Dunnstral, Cape90, V0ID, butterchurn

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to eliminate.

Deadline: January 10, Midnight US Eastern Time.

Countdown: (expired on 2022-01-09 21:00:00)

Mod Notes:

-

[butterchurn]

What do you think of:

catboi

,

Dunnstral

and

ɀefiend

, three players I mentioned earlier?

Not very firm reads on any of them.

- Slight townlean on dunn, as almost everything he's said has made sense to me and seems well-reasoned. Not enough posts to have a strong feeling, but nothing has made me suspicious as of yet.
- zefiend I feel like has just not really been on my radar for whatever reason. I've re-read him a couple times to try to get a read, and it just feels like we're on different wavelengths. My instinct is to find that suspicious, but the arguments against him don't convince me much. He's said a few things I agree with, and a few things that that just seem strange but not particularly AI.
- catboi I'm somewhat conflicted on. In general I would say slightly leaning town, but there's been a couple things that give me pause, and his reads don't align with mine at all.

[Cape90]

He then seems to completely forget his suspicion on notscience and switches to zefiend based on very little

right I "forgot" about it LMAO.

Nice assumption.

I have my reasons for suspecting zefiend is mafia, it mostly has to do with some of the grandiose wording that he was using in his posts, it didn't feel straightforward like your posts do.

[Cape90]

The potential candidates I see are: catboi, ɀefiend and Dunnstral.

I feel the same way with how I feel with cat being the weakest of these candidates.

VOTE: Dunnstral

This slot reads as really wolfy to me right now. Given they were more towny in their hydra game they played with me where they were mafia, I am comfortable voting this

[Cape90]

Cape's posts around notscience feel weird

also you certainly didn't think this earlier.

You sure you aren't mafia?

[Cape90]

But looks like someone knew this was happening beforehand.

Wouldn't even be the first time town has gamethrown by fakeclaiming mason

The outcome of tonight shows that scums definitely know how to rolehunt, which points my attention towards the remaining more experienced players. I haven't seen half the enthusiasm from

catboi

this game I've seen in the other games, plus his earlier actions made me concerned about their motives.

VOTE: catboi

I took 356 as a response to 355, and not as revealing inside knowledge. And 355 was prompted by NK15's two posts right before it.

I don't think this interpretation is correct at all

[Cape90]

I am not a mason.

This is my first game back on the site in a long time. What I learned from other games is that too many people throw their vote around willy nilly. I am taking a new approach in play style overall, to try to use my vote more effectively.

It is why I ask so many questions and "stall" before committing. My Greeting vote was intentionally left naked. It was meant as a wrench in the spoke of the NK15 wagon, to see how people react.

I was not expecting this gambit from NK15. I have no experience with this sort of thing, personally. But my gut tells me that NK15 is scum trying to pocket me as hoping that I town-read them, to form some sort of "town-bloc."

I think NK15 was happy to see my vote on Greeting, as hopefully derailing the current wagon. I choose to interpret the fake-claim as pre-emptive while at E-1. And I pretty much agree with everything Butter's said about the slot.

No problem voting here now. VOTE: NK 15

This feels a bit overexplain-y.

I disagree, I think that this is their posting style and that a lot of people have commented on it this game but that it is not really a telling piece of information

I also don't think of newbie (?) scum as being overexplain-y

I agree with the first part.

I disagree here with the second part

[Cape90]

Dunn, do you have other reads, other than Cape and myself?

VOTE: Dunnstral

This slot has not been doing much.
Only reads on me and cape, both extremely easy to fake.

Well I think that notsci and catboi are leaning town as that is who I have experience with.

I think that your play looks opportunistic.

edit:

UNVOTE:

cool, this looks like something I would 100% say as mafia

[butterchurn]

Cape's posts around notscience feel weird

also you certainly didn't think this earlier.

You sure you aren't mafia?

As I said in that post, that was my takeaway from a reread after knowing notscience's and NK15's alignments. Knowing that notscience is town, your posts stood out more. And I definitely thought some of your posts were strange earlier, especially the bit about your agreement with notscience on void, which is why I questioned you on them.

But looks like someone knew this was happening beforehand.

Wouldn't even be the first time town has gamethrown by fakeclaiming mason

The outcome of tonight shows that scums definitely know how to rolehunt, which points my attention towards the remaining more experienced players. I haven't seen half the enthusiasm from

catboi

this game I've seen in the other games, plus his earlier actions made me concerned about their motives.

VOTE: catboi

I took 356 as a response to 355, and not as revealing inside knowledge. And 355 was prompted by NK15's two posts right before it.

I don't think this interpretation is correct at all

That's very strange, as I can't understand how anyone could interpret it in any other way, and now both of you have. It seems incredibly obvious that he is responding to the post right before his, and would take some serious mental gymnastics to see it otherwise, since it is... a direct response to it. Like... what? Notscience says "if you fakeclaimed mason as town..." and then catboi says "wouldn't be the first time town has fakeclaimed mason". How can both of you possibly interpret that as anything other than a response? Bizarre.

[Greeting]

I’m trying to make sense of this game by associations, because honestly nothing else seems to be working. The colors don't mean a thing, they're just to make this more readable since I like to bold players' names.

Please correct me if I misinterpreted your stances.

Spoiler: Summary of suspicions

Cape90:

Townreads -

Greeting

(?)

Suspicions -

Dunnstral

,

ɀefiend

,

catboi

Greeting:

Townreads -

butterchurn

,

Cape90

Suspicions -

catboi

,

ɀefiend

,

Dunnstral

V0ID:

Townreads -

butterchurn

Suspicions -

Greeting

(?),

Dunnstral

(?)

butterchurn:

Townreads -

Dunnstral

,

ɀefiend

(?),

catboi

Suspicions -

Cape90

,

Greeting

ɀefiend:

Townreads -

butterchurn

(?)

Suspicions -

catboi

,

Cape90

,

Greeting

Dunnstral:

Townreads -

catboi

Suspicions -

Cape90

,

V0ID

catboi:

Townreads -

Greeting

,

Cape90

,

butterchurn

Suspicions -

Dunnstral

,

ɀefiend

,

V0ID

And here are my conclusions from this:

It seems that the majority of players townread

butterchurn

(4), and personally I also am in that majority, so I'm leaving that slot be.

It also seems that a different majority of players scumread me and

Cape90

(4), and since I'm not scum and I don't really think

Cape90

is either, I am willing to think that either of these two majorities has some scum on it. There's also another player who seem to be scumread by a majority (4) and that is

Dunnstral

. The second most suspected player is

catboi

(3), and I am amongst these players.

Cape90

indicated that

catboi

is the weakest of his scum reads (403). With my vote being admittedly more of a press, which doesn't seem to resonate with others, it seems that the better course of action would be to leave this for now.

My feeling of

ɀefiend

is that it's just them against everyone. If they're scum then this is a very effective tactic which makes it very hard to see any possible associations. That being said, I don't oppose them being voted out today.

But I think that I can get on this slot. What kept me from voting

Dunnstral

before was their interactions with

notscience

who flipped town. But overall, their actions in the game are NAI at the very best, and their predecessor,

GeorgeBailey

was behaving oddly for a very active and established player. Personally, I could see the scum team being

Dunnstral

/

V0ID

who are evidently distancing from one another by scumreading, but not acting upon it.

It's not very much, but I think it's a decent shot.

VOTE: Dunnstral

[Greeting]

I think I know how the scums found out that

notscience

was a PR. And it is a direct consequence of

Not Known 15

's actions.

Notscience

was

the only player

who did not withdraw their vote on

Not Known 15

after their claim in 320, presumably knowing for sure that the claim was fake due to their role. I did notice this before on Day 1, but then didn't pay very much attention to it. Now it makes perfect sense.

And I don't think a complete newbie would be clever enough to spot and correctly interpret such a detail, hence why at the moment I'm convinced that there is someone experienced who is leading the scum team.

Dunnstral

and

notscience

knew each other before this game so this slot also makes sense here.

[butterchurn]

That is... such a scum way of looking at things. I'm actually baffled, because I can't imagine scum-you being so bold as to post something like that, unless you're just completely lacking in self-awareness, but also can't imagine that perspective coming from town. I've never seen you do this kind of analysis in previous games. You understand how looking at things from a perspective of sorting out what everyone else's suspicions are in order to determine where you have room to be suspicious is exactly what scum would be doing today, right? What made you decide to look at things in this way, when to my knowledge, you haven't before in any of your previous 4 games, as town? And if I'm wrong on that, please point me to an example.

Am I seeing things? catboi, dunn, zefiend, y'all have experience, am I just totally off base here? Current mood: confused

[Greeting]

@

butterchurn

That’s

your

interpretation of what I’m doing, so from my perspective your question has a thesis in it which is false. Might I add that this is has already happened in our last exchange. I already said what I’m doing and why I’m doing it and if you keep on interpreting this in a scum way then it’s on you and there’s nothing for me to discuss here.

[Greeting]

The point about me packing self-awareness is, sorry to say this, utterly ridiculous. I am town, I don’t need to worry about acting town, because everything I do is from a town point of view and is aimed at achieving my winning goal. Moreover, in order to do this, I must cooperate with others, because I do not posess a superpower to eliminate any single player on my own.

[butterchurn]

Putting together a list of who currently has townreads or suspicions on whom in order to determine what directions are viable for you to push is exactly what I would expect mafia to be doing right now. I have no idea why town would organize their thoughts in that manner. If nobody else agrees with me, maybe I'm just seeing things and I'll drop it, but to my eyes it is an extremely scum-perspective thing to do. The comment about lacking self-awareness obviously only applies if you are scum, because to me this looks so clearly scum-perspective that I can't believe scum-you would just put it out in the open like that. That's why I'm waiting for others to weigh in, because I kinda feel like I'm going crazy here.

If you're town, your most helpful response would be to point me to a time in another game where you sorted things out in a similar way, or if it is the first time, explain more about why you decided to do so in this instance.

[V0ID]

I understand what butterchurn is saying, it does seem like a scum thing to put that list together in that fashion. Not to say town should not have their thoughts organized but I get what butterchurn is getting at in the post above. But then again, if greeting did have a notepad file open with that as scum and was keeping track of people in that way for his scum motives would he really have posted it for all of us? Once again, I see what butterchurn is saying and I am not ruling out that perspective. But,I could easily see that just as simply information gathered he is presenting to us to help both us and himself as town. I guess it is kinda strange though.

[Greeting]

If you're town, your most helpful response would be to point me to a time in another game where you sorted things out in a similar way, or if it is the first time, explain more about why you decided to do so in this instance.

Sorry to disappoint you, but I feel like me discussing your projections further is a waste of my time and an unnecessary source of frustration for me. If you think that I’m scum then just vote me and I’ll try to work with others.

[butterchurn]

...okay, then.

VOTE: Greeting

[Dunnstral]

Greeting/Cape town, butter weaker town, scum in void/dunn/zefiend. I still think void's day 1 was incredibly scummy but if scum he undoubtedly has a more savvy partner

I don't agree with most of these reads

Explain?

I don't agree with Greeting/Cape in the townreads (that doesn't mean I think it is both of them though), or that Zefiend is scum, or that I am scum

I fel like scum often go to lengths to overjustify a vote they know is wrong, is what I'm getting at.

Look at their iso though, a lot of their posts are about that long and have the same feel. That's why I am saying it is t heir posting style.

[Dunnstral]

Hey Dunn, how well do you remember xeno 2 day two?

Refreshing my memory, there were two things that stuck in my mind from day 2, both from mafia

Do you remember what gave Cabd the push to claim his “guilty” that day?

I figured it out, not sure I agree with the implication

Well it’s one of two options.

I’ll see what zefiend has to say.

@

Dunnstral

what was this conversation all about in the context of

Not Mafia 15

's elimination and who is xeno?

Xenoblade 2 mafia was a different game.

notscience was trying to signal something to me, but when I read over the game I saw that Cabd's explanation for the guilty (which notsci references in post 330) was essentially that cabd faked that there was an investigative result on another player to mask somebody else who was a cop. So I thought notsci was saying that NK15 was masking another power role, which I said was was unlikely.

In actuality, it was something about their role and nk15 fake claiming, I'm sure

[Dunnstral]

Obviously I can say that the argument about myself being "performative" is false, but I don't buy it as a description of

Cape90

either.

As for my reads, at this moment I think

butterchurn

and

Cape90

are town and can be trusted. The rest is all varying degrees of mixed feelings.

I am still pretty sure that there is an experienced MafiaScum player leading the scum team.

The potential candidates I see are:

catboi

,

ɀefiend

and

Dunnstral

.

I got a feeling that there is at least one scum hiding amongst them.

Butterchurn

is classified as a newbie, but obviously has previous mafia experience. I don't include them in my suspicions as their tone is independent and investigative, the only thing seeming to worry me is their lack of conviction. I don't think there was anything scummy about the

NK 15

wagon at all - the reasons to vote that player were all pretty reasonable and their fake claim was the cherry on top. I was reassured by

butterchurn

's vote on

Not Known 15

Day 1, they later withdrew it in understandable circumstances (and so have I), but

NK 15

was ultimately eliminated without them.

Cape90

had nothing to do with

Not Known 15

's elim altogether, but has shown strength of conviction in his pursuits into other slots and I like it.

You keep pushing that scum has to be experienced to have made that kill. In my opinion, I would put cape90 in that category because they have experience on another site, as well as yourself since you pointed it out right at the start of the day. That ends up being most everyone anyway.

[Dunnstral]

The potential candidates I see are: catboi, ɀefiend and Dunnstral.

I feel the same way with how I feel with cat being the weakest of these candidates.

VOTE: Dunnstral

This slot reads as really wolfy to me right now.

Given they were more towny in their hydra game they played with me where they were mafia, I am comfortable voting this

Is the bolded not an argument against me being mafia?

[Dunnstral]

But looks like someone knew this was happening beforehand.

Wouldn't even be the first time town has gamethrown by fakeclaiming mason

The outcome of tonight shows that scums definitely know how to rolehunt, which points my attention towards the remaining more experienced players. I haven't seen half the enthusiasm from

catboi

this game I've seen in the other games, plus his earlier actions made me concerned about their motives.

VOTE: catboi

I took 356 as a response to 355, and not as revealing inside knowledge. And 355 was prompted by NK15's two posts right before it.

I don't think this interpretation is correct at all

What is your interpretation?

[catboi]

You keep pushing that scum has to be experienced to have made that kill. In my opinion, I would put cape90 in that category because they have experience on another site, as well as yourself since you pointed it out right at the start of the day. That ends up being most everyone anyway.

This is probably a fair enough point that theorizing on those grounds is mostly useless.

[fferyllt]

allez