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[angela]

also it is hard for me to not feel like you are doing this in this way to prove a point and because i am struggling to understand it

and it does not feel like you are using this to sort me in anyway

[angela]

also it is hard for me to not feel like you are doing this in this way to prove a point and because i am struggling to understand it

and it does not feel like you are using this to sort me in anyway

as you could simply ask me the questions regarding if you were trying to sort me or to understand

[angela]

also it is hard for me to not feel like you are doing this in this way to prove a point and because i am struggling to understand it

and it does not feel like you are using this to sort me in anyway

as you could simply ask me the questions regarding if you were trying to sort me or to understand

instead of like, disprove me or you're mafia and also scorpious is a town!

like that's not actually how anything works but i am trying nonetheless

[angela]

1. Is the claim real? If it was not, they would not have claimed it as a serious claim therefore it has to be real even if they were scum.

like at the time they claimed i thought it was likely they were either

a mafia!mailman

or

a town!mailman

you can look back and see me saying so

but now with additional information this seems not as likely to me as lying

[JacksonVirgo]

Ill list a few conclusions that have combined to result in my conclusion.

1. Is the claim real? If it was not, they would not have claimed it as a serious claim therefore it has to be real even if they were scum.

2. Since I concluded it was real, where is the message? If they were scum it would specifically require them blocked by a Town role, as the suspicion surrounding the ability has been in the air for so long and nobody clarified their personal influence in blocking it in addition to it being stupid to block them, it is likely not the case this happened. If they are Town there are many reasons, one of which I doubt, scum role that blocked the action maliciously or ascetic. The latter being the one I do not believe to be the case, the former is my conclusion.

3. Why were they not killed if they claim PR? This is the only conclusion that I am less than confident with as it relies on the content of day 1 and the path scum chooses. If scorp was an easy wagon going into N1, it’s an easy continual wagon in D2 if they block their action. This paired with I earlier points makes me conclude that scum wouldn’t claim it if they were not along with their action still failed without influence from a town role. Therefore this being a scum agenda is a very strong possibility

All of these conclusions are hard for me to imagine occurring outside of my conclusions , trust me I tried thinking all the ways.

What points do yoh disagree with then conclusions for and why

1. they have a history of 'out there' claims as many have discussed, also could potentially be informed et cetera, though that wouldn't even be necessary though it would make it weirdly coincidental there was another message role

2. well they could have also not sent it, as has also been discussed, if actually a mafia!mailman, but as i said already that option doesn't seem so likely to me

1. Them just claiming bullshit things would only really work if they have claimed almost instantly confirmable roles as scum in the past. I have only seen BP Cop as an example and thus does not counter the chances for me personally, it is actually one of the reasons I am a bit concerned along with the addition of a FN. But as it stands it does not counter my conclusions well enough for me to change my stance.

2. They would have claimed this was the case as Town, and likely as scum as well. Especially when it would instantly incriminate them by lying, where if they fake claimed tracker, which wouldn’t they would have to fakr their check even if they failed to submit their action. It is also unlikely for scum to miss an action than a Town as there are buddies which can submit for them.

[Enchant]

If Friendly Neibor real, then Mafia!Mailman could exist to imitate this message.

But it's really crazy theory.

[JacksonVirgo]

also it is hard for me to not feel like you are doing this in this way to prove a point and because i am struggling to understand it

and it does not feel like you are using this to sort me in anyway

Im not trying to prove a point outsidr of try and convince others that they are town.

[angela]

If Friendly Neibor real, then Mafia!Mailman could exist to imitate this message.

But it's really crazy theory.

i thought maybe this was happening with the friendly neighbour message lol

as i was unable to determine whether the message would look any different

and it caused a whole thing

[JacksonVirgo]

also it is hard for me to not feel like you are doing this in this way to prove a point and because i am struggling to understand it

and it does not feel like you are using this to sort me in anyway

as you could simply ask me the questions regarding if you were trying to sort me or to understand

I am attempting to look aside from me thinking you are scum to attempt to get on the same page

[Enchant]

If Friendly Neibor real, then Mafia!Mailman could exist to imitate this message.

But it's really crazy theory.

i thought maybe this was happening with the friendly neighbour message lol

as i was unable to determine whether the message would look any different

and it caused a whole thing

Ask mod privately.

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Is the claim real? If it was not, they would not have claimed it as a serious claim therefore it has to be real even if they were scum.

like at the time they claimed i thought it was likely they were either

a mafia!mailman

or

a town!mailman

you can look back and see me saying so

but now with additional information this seems not as likely to me as lying

Why would they lie? And why is it more likely

[JacksonVirgo]

If Friendly Neibor real, then Mafia!Mailman could exist to imitate this message.

But it's really crazy theory.

i thought maybe this was happening with the friendly neighbour message lol

as i was unable to determine whether the message would look any different

and it caused a whole thing

It would have them mod confirmed as town for the FN and just a messagr for the other. Mailman to fakr FN for town is not why its a role.

[Enchant]

There's third variant.


No roleblocker.
Scorpio is maf!mailman and simple... Did nothing.

Like, why not.

[JacksonVirgo]

There's third variant.


No roleblocker.
Scorpio is maf!mailman and simple... Did nothing.

Like, why not.

Already explained this

[angela]

1. Them just claiming bullshit things would only really work if they have claimed almost instantly confirmable roles as scum in the past. I have only seen BP Cop as an example and thus does not counter the chances for me personally, it is actually one of the reasons I am a bit concerned along with the addition of a FN. But as it stands it does not counter my conclusions well enough for me to change my stance.

2. They would have claimed this was the case as Town, and likely as scum as well. Especially when it would instantly incriminate them by lying, where if they fake claimed tracker, which wouldn’t they would have to fakr their check even if they failed to submit their action. It is also unlikely for scum to miss an action than a Town as there are buddies which can submit for them.

1. it's not really confirmable in anyway, if you claim it, you can claim a message and then if the person didn't get it then conclusion from sender's point of view is roleblocked or ascetic, which mafia could fake plan on faking easily, et cetera, and even if there is a message it means nothing for alignment, like i still disagree with you saying mailman would be a bad claim for a mafia to make, as i explained earlier, as it seems like an okay to good mafia claim to me,

2. it would have been an intentional no send if it was not sent i think, as part of potential frame of me i've already talked about due to pooky talking about mafia ascetic stuff

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Why would they not do an action whrn their life literally would depend on it
2. Scum missing an action but still killing is extremely unlikely

[angela]

1. Why would they not do an action whrn their life literally would depend on it
2. Scum missing an action but still killing is extremely unlikely

because the message doesn't actually confirm anything alignment wise but claiming you sent a message can potentially be used to mafia's advantage

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Them just claiming bullshit things would only really work if they have claimed almost instantly confirmable roles as scum in the past. I have only seen BP Cop as an example and thus does not counter the chances for me personally, it is actually one of the reasons I am a bit concerned along with the addition of a FN. But as it stands it does not counter my conclusions well enough for me to change my stance.

2. They would have claimed this was the case as Town, and likely as scum as well. Especially when it would instantly incriminate them by lying, where if they fake claimed tracker, which wouldn’t they would have to fakr their check even if they failed to submit their action. It is also unlikely for scum to miss an action than a Town as there are buddies which can submit for them.

1. it's not really confirmable in anyway, if you claim it, you can claim a message and then if the person didn't get it then conclusion from sender's point of view is roleblocked or ascetic, which mafia could fake plan on faking easily, et cetera, and even if there is a message it means nothing for alignment, like i still disagree with you saying mailman would be a bad claim for a mafia to make, as i explained earlier, as it seems like an okay to good mafia claim to me,

2. it would have been an intentional no send if it was not sent i think, as part of potential frame of me i've already talked about due to pooky talking about mafia ascetic stuff

1. Why is mailman a good claim for a mafia setup with no mailman? Its one of the worst possible claims.
2. A mailman frame will never happen, because it wouldn’t be a frame. Ascetic isn’t incriminating, and scum that got mailmanned as ascetic would claim as much. It’s not a play that will happen by anyone with a brain. If they planned to frame they would have not claimed mailman or even just retracted it as a joke on the basis that they bullshit claims a lot.

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Why would they not do an action whrn their life literally would depend on it
2. Scum missing an action but still killing is extremely unlikely

because the message doesn't actually confirm anything alignment wise but claiming you sent a message can potentially be used to mafia's advantage

Mafia surviving is much more beneficial that getting them eliminated. Especially early game, they wouldn’t have made such a swingy play for many many reaons which I can’t help but srr you completely overlooking whether that be from bias/tunnel or a scum agenda

[angela]

There's third variant.


No roleblocker.
Scorpio is maf!mailman and simple... Did nothing.

Like, why not.

by the votes right now you are likely one of the deciding votes

though nero cain was earlier voting scorpious

and then unvoted

and has recently been critical of geraintm's posting

so

(though nero cain vote/unvote also maybe hm w/ regards to +partner

but idk)

which is why i was wondering if you were around earlier to see like, how you were feeling about scorpious and such

[angela]

1. Why would they not do an action whrn their life literally would depend on it
2. Scum missing an action but still killing is extremely unlikely

because the message doesn't actually confirm anything alignment wise but claiming you sent a message can potentially be used to mafia's advantage

Mafia surviving is much more beneficial that getting them eliminated. Especially early game, they wouldn’t have made such a swingy play for many many reaons which I can’t help but srr you completely overlooking whether that be from bias/tunnel or a scum agenda

yes and the mailman claim is alive and you are fighting for them to remain alive partly based on claim and such, that is in fact surviving and nothing that mafia wouldn't potentially suspect might occur when thinking about it,

the only wrench for mafias would be the friendly neighbour

like if you look at beginning of day before i make friendly neighbour public i am being pressured by scorpious pretty heavily while scorpious saying sent me message and such, which i did not get

[JacksonVirgo]

1. Why would they not do an action whrn their life literally would depend on it
2. Scum missing an action but still killing is extremely unlikely

because the message doesn't actually confirm anything alignment wise but claiming you sent a message can potentially be used to mafia's advantage

Mafia surviving is much more beneficial that getting them eliminated. Especially early game, they wouldn’t have made such a swingy play for many many reaons which I can’t help but srr you completely overlooking whether that be from bias/tunnel or a scum agenda

yes and the mailman claim is alive and you are fighting for them to remain alive partly based on claim and such, that is in fact surviving and nothing that mafia wouldn't potentially suspect might occur when thinking about it,

the only wrench for mafias would be the friendly neighbour

like if you look at beginning of day before i make friendly neighbour public i am being pressured by scorpious pretty heavily while scorpious saying sent me message and such, which i did not get

Scum wouldn’t risk not acting or faking a claim for the chance someone would catch very specific mechanical reasonings and back them up accordingly. If so, they played trash

[JacksonVirgo]

Like worse than trash

[angela]

1. Why is mailman a good claim for a mafia setup with no mailman? Its one of the worst possible claims.
2. A mailman frame will never happen, because it wouldn’t be a frame. Ascetic isn’t incriminating, and scum that got mailmanned as ascetic would claim as much. It’s not a play that will happen by anyone with a brain. If they planned to frame they would have not claimed mailman or even just retracted it as a joke on the basis that they bullshit claims a lot.

1. it isn't a bad claim, it can buy time, it isn't immediately suspect, and because it was claimed always have 'roleblocked' as a fallback,

2. the claim had already occurred before the frame plan would have come into play as i've said multiple times, it would have been simply using the already existing claim to do so, not claiming in order to do so

[angela]

Scum wouldn’t risk not acting or faking a claim for the chance someone would catch very specific mechanical reasonings and back them up accordingly. If so, they played trash

pooky already laid out the mechanical reasonings after the claim day one, so it would be very much expected that everyone would be aware of them and might back them up