Micro 1059: Micro & Normal Stuff | GAME OVER

[Xayah]

I know we probably won't vote the miller claim day 1 but I do think Ausuka's reaction to rolling miller seems a tad overblown here.

[Xayah]

I know we probably won't vote the miller claim day 1 but I do think Ausuka's reaction to rolling miller seems a tad overblown here.

It seems she's unhappy to have gotten the role, but do you think her reaction is AI, though?

I understand being "unhappy" to get miller (to some extent I don't think it's that big a deal and that could be playing into my mindset a little) but the 3 posts talking about it as if it's the worst role in the world seems like an overreaction and a half

[Xayah]

On Ausuka, I personally lean slightly town on the claim. I think it would draw too much unwanted attention for her to be willing to fake it.

I disagree. I've rarely seen millers ever get some sort of heat for the claim. It's just sort of nodded at and accepted, I think we should ignore the miller part and focus on the play

[Xayah]

I believe it's too early in the day to be talking about "yeeting" anybody

???

do you think the game has to be x posts long before we can talk about murder?

Ausuka being miller isn't the problem it's the way they reacted to it, but this overbearing tone might just be a them thing. I'm not really sure I get why you're asking so many questions without putting in much work yourself. Seems a bit tip-toey.

VOTE: Datisi

[Xayah]

What about my post do you think needs elaboration? I thought I explained myself fine. Meg is seeing what I'm seeing, I think that makes them more likely to be approaching the game with an uninformed mindset.

Considering the content you've posted so far I don't really think the stuff Meg has posted is so on the nose that it 100%=Comes from a villager. While I do think that way of townreading people is iffy, I esp think it depends on the type of content in question.

[Xayah]

Also, what I'm saying

did

happen you can legit read the first few posts in the game for yourself. I'm not backing down from the statements I've said either, I still think it's quite a wolfy opening but I don't feel like getting into a battle of words with someone who got huffy and upset over being called out in a game of mafia for their posting. It's a waste of my time so I moved onto something I found more pressing. Did the anger make me weaken the scumread? Yeah, because it starts to seem a bit personality based, but I think Datisi's angle on Ausuka isn't W/W and I think it felt like a TMI sort of angle. AKA: If there's a wolf in Ausuka and Datisi's prob prob Datisi atm.

I also don't think Meg/Other anime A name are W/W don't have much stock in their statements alone though besides "vibes"

[Xayah]

Phoenix's persistence is slightly towny, I think. As scum he would probably recognize that he isn't really getting townread for his approach and may change tactics. I do agree that he sounds a little stiff, but that may just be a personality or writing style trait.

Do you think such a change would happen when we're only 100 posts in? The game is quite short right now so quickly changing your styles seems...unneeded. I think Phoenix is

fine

(now do they deserve the amount of TR's they have that's another topic) but I disagree with this being a reason to TR them

[Xayah]

someone who got huffy and upset over being called out in a game of mafia for their posting.

This never happened either?

idk maybe i'm just salty about being pushed for something that didn't happen and her calling me overbearing for pointing it out

VOTE: Phoenix

Do you agree with Megs wolfread?

[Xayah]

Phoenix's persistence is slightly towny, I think. As scum he would probably recognize that he isn't really getting townread for his approach and may change tactics. I do agree that he sounds a little stiff, but that may just be a personality or writing style trait.

Do you think such a change would happen when we're only 100 posts in? The game is quite short right now so quickly changing your styles seems...unneeded. I think Phoenix is

fine

(now do they deserve the amount of TR's they have that's another topic) but I disagree with this being a reason to TR them

He's gotten more scumreads than townreads, no? I only see scamper having mentioned a townread. He got scum leanings from Meg, Ausuka, and Datisi, and was questioned by Don in a way that seemed to indicate suspicion.

And yes, I think that it feels like if he is scum then he is making the choice to double down on his approach. It's possible he's decided that he talked his way into where he is and he can talk his way out of it, but to me the barreling forward without regard for how he is perceived seems like it comes from someone who isn't self-conscious. It's easy and often tempting to step back and simply not post as much as scum. It's not a full playstyle change that I'm expecting.

Hm, alright I'm willing to go along with this read for now. I didn't really catch on how much Pho was becoming a common wolfread. But they're not really in my "I would vote today" tier anyway.

[Xayah]

VOTE: Meg

[Xayah]

I think it felt like a TMI sort of angle.

what's tmi about it

I'm unfamiliar with how much the playerlist is aware with each other, but the way you instantly jumped to their defense felt a tad strange to me. Even if you have a difference in opinion on the matter the way the situation was handled rubbed me the wrong way.

Phoenix's persistence is slightly towny, I think. As scum he would probably recognize that he isn't really getting townread for his approach and may change tactics. I do agree that he sounds a little stiff, but that may just be a personality or writing style trait.

persistence in doing what, exactly?

He's moving things forward but only along one path. If he were trying to look towny by having a lot of content, I'd expect him to be tackling different subjects and angles. His continued arguing what is basically the same point with Ausuka isn't really doing anything to make him look better on a surface level. To me it comes across as a tunneled townie.

This feels like, entirely based on self projection based meta on "I would expect X to do Y but because they're doing Z they're town." If you're always in this kind of mindset it doesn't help you catch mafia it helps people know how to play around you and I can't tell if this kind of thinking is good or not.

[Xayah]

Also, what I'm saying

did

happen you can legit read the first few posts in the game for yourself. I'm not backing down from the statements I've said either, I still think it's quite a wolfy opening but I don't feel like getting into a battle of words with someone who got

huffy and upset over being called out in a game of mafia for their posting

. It's a waste of my time so I moved onto something I found more pressing. Did the anger make me weaken the scumread? Yeah, because it starts to seem a bit personality based, but I think Datisi's angle on Ausuka isn't W/W and I think it felt like a TMI sort of angle. AKA: If there's a wolf in Ausuka and Datisi's prob prob Datisi atm.

I also don't think Meg/Other anime A name are W/W don't have much stock in their statements alone though besides "vibes"

i greatly disagree with both your earlier characterizion of ausuka and this one - she made 2 very short posts that didn't say much at all and you called it "overblown", now you accuse her of being "huffy and upset" because she (rightly imo) pushed back against you for saying that, but again the scale of the response is really not at all what you're describing here...

it just feels incredibly misrep-y

It isn't something that can even be called a misrep because what I'm saying is a subjective point not an objective point. You don't have to agree with what I'm saying for me to still believe it to be true. Focusing on my use of adjectives to describe the situation is not important what so ever. What's important is if you think I am misreping this player on purpose or not to suit an argument. Trying to just point out stuff like this feels like useless shading instead of trying to help the thread.

I'd wagon Xayah. The misreps I go back and forth on, it seems like something that will easily get called out. But 101 and 107 felt weird to me. There's a very strange level of hedge in the way she expresses her read in those posts and it feels awkward.

VOTE: Xayah

What's wrong with hedge?

scamper is precious

Can you give me any sort of readslist or a real read on anyone that isn't 3 posts calling them uwu cute

This post is important

I would probably be switching my vote to Don here but I think they're at E-2 already and it seems a little twisted to put them at E-1 for suggesting that we put someone else at E-1. It does feel like they're kind of all over the place and I struggle to see a consistent town mindset. That makes me think they could be intentionally trying to look like the town they describe as "playing however they want". The issue is that I don't understand the motivations behind anything they're doing, so it just feels random for the sake of chaos.

Here is an attempt to soft buddy me. Coral knows i am under fire, and by saying they wont vote for me theres an attempt here. Of course by saying they're still suspicious of me there is no concrete stance taken here. What they are doing is to signal to me "everyone suspects you, but i can be open minded". And as scum, they know i'm town, and would want to leave a positive impression on me without going too hard on buddying.

I don't know if I agree with this being the exact line of logic that Coral is trying to do if wolf I believe that you do. I think Corals play has been very projective based and had very little natural solving in it but the fact most of the thread seems to agree gives me slight pause.

[Xayah]

I feel fine enough about most people in the thread that they've given me enough to work with minus Meg and Ari so I will continue voting them until further notice

[Xayah]

I have nothing to really ask at the moment but I understand what you're saying. If I asked random questions it would just be for the sake of it.

[Xayah]

VOTE: Ari

Good morning. My day started with me having a bloody nose cause I thought I had more bed to roll over into. Galron entrance is fine one might even call it "good" I no longer want to vote Meg at the moment they are moved out of Day 1 vote range.

That leaves Ari/Scamper

[Xayah]

That leaves Ari/Scamper

does this mean you townread everyone else, or...?

No, it just means everyone else isn't in my D1 pool. This PL is pretty hard to get into due to the levels of obvious familiarity that seems to make things easy for others that aren't so much with me

[Xayah]

I understand the Coral votes but I don't think I'm gonna support it today given I find the amount of content they give easy to dive into compared to other people. [Yes this is me setting up a D2 Coral push fear me]

[Xayah]

she's playing by the philosophy of "post things to avoid death"

Hey, not true I'm used to play 1 irl day phase so this 9 player stuff means I can just kick back and take my time and not have to worry about anything. It's quite a nice change of pace. Although, I do miss the instant results of finding out if I'm correct read wise. My only real strong TR atm is the replacement and Done

[Xayah]

I took that as you grouping my posting as doing that and was pouting carry on. Although, if you think I'm doing it based on post count it isn't. It's just based on who I think would be a good day 1 vote and who wouldn't. If everyone escapes that list we go to the classic information D1 vote

[Xayah]

oh I don't think it's about post count for you at all.

you seem to be going on word count but you haven't actually sorted based on the walls posted and I'm waiting to see if you actually do anything.

That's not true at all, I think you just don't like the fact my vote is on you given the lack of meaningful content you've posted in my eyes.

[Xayah]

I can easily point to things I think look villagery in a lot of players or at least the effort put into the stuff they're doing. I cannot make that claim about you or scammper. I could go into details on why I think the Datisi townreads seem way too easily given but maybe that's threadspewing him townie or people have meta I'm unaware of but on a base level I think Datisi's posting have very basic level solving with fluff inside it to add onto the posts given.
pedit: It has been proven that you don't care already so maybe as you say "do something" instead of just saying you don't care.

[Xayah]

Datisi's posting have very basic level solving with fluff inside it to add onto the posts given.

is this supposed to be scummy? or like do you think it is

and i'm not sure i get how i'd be getting threadspewed townie there

I don't think reasons people are townreading are reasons that I think I would TR you for, and I can't tell if it's just simple disagreement or that people know you and are using meta reasons

[Xayah]

I can easily point to things I think look villagery in a lot of players or at least the effort put into the stuff they're doing. I cannot make that claim about you or scammper.

I don't think effort correlates to alignment unless there's established meta that makes the read better than rand.

I think your line runs more along the vein of "she's not efforted as much as everyone else so she doesn't deserve to survive today

yet

" which is unlikely to be compelling to anyone. I think you need to push harder to actually get things to happen.

That isn't what I'm basing my reads on at all but I guess that falls on me for needing to give a better explanation. Effort doesn't=AI nor is it the reason I took people off the D1 list. It simple falls under "I see reason to take XYZ off. I don't see reason to take ABC off." As for the push harder part? Yeah, I already know that if I want to get the results I want I need to put more reasons on the table but I'm not the kind of person to really build a case until I'm confident in the read. Until then I consider myself a reactive player.

[Xayah]

I don't think it's hard for anyone to look like a conventional villager as mafia considering it's a basic skill and I will play this game under the assumption everyone knows what they're doing to some degree. Plus I don't know any of you so I don't think I could even answer that statement without it being a shot in the dark.

[Xayah]

I am known for my above avg read rate so for now I will just have to trust that my style of sorting players works. It has been a minute since I've been on this site so only time will tell.

[Xayah]

I am known for my above avg read rate so for now I will just have to trust that my style of sorting players works. It has been a minute since I've been on this site so only time will tell.

I hope you don't take this the wrong way;

You have three completed games on this site where you are on the limwagon on d1; the hit rate is [1/3] (33%)

I have ten completed games on this site where I am on the limwagon on d1; the hit rate is [7/10] (70%)*

I can tell you right now that your read on me is incorrect but I'm excited to see where you go from here.


*

many of these are just me shamelessly sheeping Datisi because he's so good

This isn't my main account my main account is in my sig. Plus, I've been playing off site for a year where I have a 60% town WR and something in the 70s% wolf WR. So yeah, you could say I'm a bit confident in the way I read people but if a townread of mine put a stop to one of my pushes I'd hear it out and prob look elsewhere but obviously rn I have no reason to do so.

Please show where I called you a wolf? Just because I'm putting pressure on you doesn't mean I think you're a wolf rn.

[Xayah]

Honestly the most villagery scamper has done for me is the subtle annoyance in their posting but ik that's NAI. I'll wait for Done's case or what it is before swapping my vote off

[Xayah]

I shall probably need help with some stuff as in a bit of clarification on if some reads are based on familiarity or based on things in this thread (if that makes sense) it's my biggest disconnect with this game rn

[Xayah]

I am known for my above avg read rate so for now I will just have to trust that my style of sorting players works. It has been a minute since I've been on this site so only time will tell.

I hope you don't take this the wrong way;

You have three completed games on this site where you are on the limwagon on d1; the hit rate is [1/3] (33%)

I have ten completed games on this site where I am on the limwagon on d1; the hit rate is [7/10] (70%)*

I can tell you right now that your read on me is incorrect but I'm excited to see where you go from here.


*

many of these are just me shamelessly sheeping Datisi because he's so good

This isn't my main account my main account is in my sig. Plus, I've been playing off site for a year where I have a 60% town WR and something in the 70s% wolf WR. So yeah, you could say I'm a bit confident in the way I read people but if a townread of mine put a stop to one of my pushes I'd hear it out and prob look elsewhere but obviously rn I have no reason to do so.

Please show where I called you a wolf? Just because I'm putting pressure on you doesn't mean I think you're a wolf rn.

My criticism of your approach relates to its effectiveness and accuracy - your response is that by meta you are quite effective.

I contrasted the accuracy rates of our approaches to the game as evidenced by success rates on D1 wagons we are on.

I am aware that you probably don't have a good read on me at this point in the game.

A sample size of three isn't really that big to begin with and that requires that I am using the same idea years ago in those games in these now. Both, are not really the case. I think this should really only become a concern if my reads are insanely wrong come D2 or you think I'm a wolf using this to advance the game state, I think only time will tell though!

Do you believe Meg's read on you comes from a place in good faith? Because from an outside pov it strikes me as quite odd.

[Xayah]

I'm a bit of an overbearing control freak

at times

all the time and it rubs people the wrong way and I am trying to exercise restraint to take things a bit easier so that I don't get blacklisted by everyone on the site.

so I'm trying to not express every thought that passes through my head.

If there's something you'd like to talk about in terms of reads etc - I am happy to talk with you about anything.

You're perfectly fine to me! I'm told my tone can come across really cold/aloof at times when that's not my intent so I'm trying to use more relaxed typing or add more expression to it so I don't insult someone by mistake. If you want any more clarity on my reads or thoughts on a player do lmk.

[Xayah]

will be here tonight working on a birthday party for the local daycare atm

[Xayah]

VOTE: Datisi

[Xayah]

Done/Ari
Meg
Galron/Scramper/Coral
Datisi/Aus

Exactly 1 in the bottom row

[Xayah]

If I was to order the murkey pool in order of likelihood to be a wolf it'd prob go scamper>Coral>Galron

[Xayah]

Xayah can you elaborate on your townreads?

Done:- I think a lot of Done's stuff this game is stuff that can easily faked, so I had to pause when thinking of where I thought they were, but the thing that really makes them a strong town for me is how they've approached slots and this game. If Done is a wolf they've put so much pressure in town's favor for no reason with just how they've acted alone. It's just more likely they're a wolf.

Ari: I thought Ari was a townie during our interaction but the blowup kinda just put them into lock town because it's very hard to fake that level of emotion as a wolf because you would know you're in the wrong and it just screams upset townie. It's clear Ari is trying to solve slots and sort players and when people didn't agree with her logic she poked and got a little upset about it. Would be very shocked if wolf.

Meg: I think Meg is a slot I could be wrong on placing this far up, but compared to the other slots I've just had a good feeling about them ever since they started posting more the angles they've taken seem to come from a place like a townie trying to figure things out not someone with all the answers, there's a level of stubbornness that wolves don't have that Meg reached.

I like all 3 here

[Xayah]

ayo I’m rlly here because Xayah’s sig mentions she is MariaR and I remember her kinda fondly
Prolly gonna read up in a couple hours, gonna be watching a movie

KINDA???????? Listen you little-

GAMMA <33333333

[Xayah]

The Meg vs Scamper stuff really gives me nothing, the more Meg goes at it with people the less they seem partnered with people but making that kind of assumption is dangerous. I don't know if I get the whole "this is a TvT" fight from that though. Datisi's most townie posts are when they're not sober (funny enough)

I still feel good about voting in either of the two at the moment. Taking Auska's early game aside, when I look and compare posts between their slot and any other of my teamreads I don't get the same sense of a slot trying to sort and figure out the game. The most honest they felt was in their confusion around me. Something a wolf

can

be honest about vs well...the rest

[Xayah]

Spicy claim, this is me saying go along with the hammer so if it's wrong I can wagon Ausuka tomorrow ez

[Xayah]

I suppose Galron going from my top TR on sub in to "I'm okay with eliming them" should give me pause but it doesn't so I'll just let it happen.

[Xayah]

Spicy claim, this is me saying go along with the hammer so if it's wrong I can wagon Ausuka tomorrow ez

why ausuka scum of galron town?

I still will be very surprised if one of Ausuka and Datisi aren't a wolf.
If the fact town PR's are like rolecop miller vs 1 scum role that can be played off with a rolecop and a goon that's hella townsided so I doubt it from a setup pov that both of those are real.

[Xayah]

Sorry had no internet access for like the last few days while I went hiking. I'll be rereading Ph0 iso but gut suspects are in Meg/Coral

[Xayah]

I think the main issues I have with Meg/Coral are poral opposites in playstyle but still fit the objective of a wolf. Meg's main pushes were...well not in Ph0/gals direction and the main focus seemed to be Ari and just being a loud voice in the thread to distract from their partner.

I'm not interested in sending the rep today. Both wagons going currently are pretty good and I'd compromise to a galron lim if time comes to it.

The other posts about the scum slot? Nothing in regards to Ph0 and saying "I forget Galron exists" next is just a vote on the slot near NoD it's honestly such blatantly scum partner interaction that it makes me pause because I'd like to assume a partner would at least try to have better interactions then this but on a textbook case? Yeah we get left with this.

Corals early defense of Ph0 when they were under pressure and I had to ask them about it still rubs me the wrong way. Of course, you can be wrong and simply townread a villager but I just disagreed with the method Coral did it. I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

They had Galron in "I would kinda let them go"/shade tier and on paper it's a better look then Meg. So for now, I'm okay with placing my vote down.

VOTE: Meg

[Xayah]

scamper feels good and GE is just a villager if I'm missing a blindspot it's on Datisi but I don't ever see a world where I'm alive with Datisi long enough to make that choice so I'm not gonna worry about that right now.

[Xayah]

I think the main issues I have with Meg/Coral are poral opposites in playstyle but still fit the objective of a wolf. Meg's main pushes were...well not in Ph0/gals direction and the main focus seemed to be Ari and just being a loud voice in the thread to distract from their partner.

I'm not interested in sending the rep today. Both wagons going currently are pretty good and I'd compromise to a galron lim if time comes to it.

The other posts about the scum slot? Nothing in regards to Ph0 and saying "I forget Galron exists" next is just a vote on the slot near NoD it's honestly such blatantly scum partner interaction that it makes me pause because I'd like to assume a partner would at least try to have better interactions then this but on a textbook case? Yeah we get left with this.

Corals early defense of Ph0 when they were under pressure and I had to ask them about it still rubs me the wrong way. Of course, you can be wrong and simply townread a villager but I just disagreed with the method Coral did it. I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

They had Galron in "I would kinda let them go"/shade tier and on paper it's a better look then Meg. So for now, I'm okay with placing my vote down.

VOTE: Meg

Interested in why you think Coral's play is scum indicative

I think her play around the wolfslot and defense of it feels different then a lot of the other players as in. Like there's an in-deph defense of Ph0 that she hangs onto but when Gal replaces in it just goes to "meh" like the downgrade is wolfy and you don't wanna hold onto that so much.

There is no mention of Coral in Gal's iso and Ph0 questions why Coral is in a wolfy list then puts her as the second strongest wolfread after me it's odd. I don't get that odd feeling in regards to other slots.

[Xayah]

I don't see much reason to defend myself given Gamma is using meta that is over a year old and Ausuka is just biased. Of course, I'd like to imagine I wouldn't get caught so easily given how easy it is to wolf on this site and how to come across as a villager to people but ya never know. As long as the Elims are me Meg Coral game ends so shrug.jpg

(Well I need to read Dat more but give me a bit on that)

[Xayah]

I think the main issues I have with Meg/Coral are poral opposites in playstyle but still fit the objective of a wolf. Meg's main pushes were...well not in Ph0/gals direction and the main focus seemed to be Ari and just being a loud voice in the thread to distract from their partner.

I'm not interested in sending the rep today. Both wagons going currently are pretty good and I'd compromise to a galron lim if time comes to it.

The other posts about the scum slot? Nothing in regards to Ph0 and saying "I forget Galron exists" next is just a vote on the slot near NoD it's honestly such blatantly scum partner interaction that it makes me pause because I'd like to assume a partner would at least try to have better interactions then this but on a textbook case? Yeah we get left with this.

Corals early defense of Ph0 when they were under pressure and I had to ask them about it still rubs me the wrong way. Of course, you can be wrong and simply townread a villager but I just disagreed with the method Coral did it. I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

They had Galron in "I would kinda let them go"/shade tier and on paper it's a better look then Meg. So for now, I'm okay with placing my vote down.

VOTE: Meg

Interested in why you think Coral's play is scum indicative

I think her play around the wolfslot and defense of it feels different then a lot of the other players as in. Like there's an in-deph defense of Ph0 that she hangs onto but when Gal replaces in it just goes to "meh" like the downgrade is wolfy and you don't wanna hold onto that so much.

There is no mention of Coral in Gal's iso and Ph0 questions why Coral is in a wolfy list then puts her as the second strongest wolfread after me it's odd. I don't get that odd feeling in regards to other slots.

I feel like that downgrade would be more town indicative since it correlates to a drop in the amount of content rather than ot being from a partnership itself.

If I had a townread with the amount of confidence Coral was showing I wouldn't drop someone to villager to "shades half the game being ok with going over" just because of a replace in but that's just me.

[Xayah]

Of course, I'd like to imagine I wouldn't get caught so easily given how easy it is to wolf on this site and how to come across as a villager to people but ya never know.

I hope you are in fact scum because it would make this line very funny!

*Old lady voice* Back in my day I was one of the best scum players on this site ya see. Ya whiper snappers

[Xayah]

If I had a townread with the amount of confidence Coral was showing I wouldn't drop someone to villager to "shades half the game being ok with going over" just because of a replace in but that's just me.

Can you point out where I showed this level of confidence?

Your entire interaction with me on Ph0 shows that level of confidence, you even doubled down when I asked about it.

[Xayah]

Who is it if it isn't me Meg?

[Xayah]

I will bet the game on GE town and you will never touch that slot if I die.

[Xayah]

@xayah is there a reason you keep avoiding my questions about your d1 reads?

mmmmmm I don't have much to say about them? I feel like I explained why I had you both at the bottom pretty clearly. What more do you want to know?

[Xayah]

The amount of cherrypicknig and incorrect assumptions is so funny.

Let me pick the kid to sleep

[Xayah]

Fwiw I don't think Coral saying Phoenix looked 'slightly towny' in the early game really indicates confidence.

You can say whatever you want, but the actions speak for themselves. Just because someone says they're slightly towny it's still enough to express the fact that they're in your town pile and aren't going to vote them for the time being. It would raise a view eyebrows if you openly just defended your mafia goon so early esp if Coral was in the mindset that Ph0 was getting wolfread so early on that would make anyone have pause and on a reread look bad. All you need to do is put someone as a slight villager and there ya go.

[Xayah]

Phoenix's persistence is slightly towny, I think.

This was where I originally stated the read. Extreme confidence, here!

In 104 I respond to your questioning of it and clarify my reasoning. I don't think any of my language here portrays confidence. I examine both sides and state that I lean towards one of those sides.

In 125, similarly, I respond to scamper's questioning of it, and I explain again. Here my language is a bit less hedgey, I suppose, but it's still on the same original point.

In 144, I talk to scamper about how I wasn't that confident in the read but it was fun exploring it together

I don't think that in any of those I express much confidence in the read. Your approach to the questioning is also much scummier than scamper's, by the way, because he was examining my reasoning to try to sort me individually. You were focused on Phoenix and making sure that you clarified that you weren't willing to vote the slot, without explaining way, but that other people's reasoning behind their townreads were

bad

. You weren't really trying to sort me in the moment, you ended by saying "hm, I can go along with this for now". You were pretty clearly saving me for later.

Doubling down on a read is enough confidence you need. You don't need to openly say "I am confidence in X" to display it in the way you play and show yourself around a player (and you did.) Also nothing you've said in your last bulk explains why such actions are wolfy. No, I wasn't trying to sort you I was trying to find your logic on another player. You can say someone did XYZ but without explaining why that's wolfy it's just throwing shade with no logic to back up any of your statements.

Explaining logic isn't hard, making up reasons isn't hard. For a new player? Maybe. Actions speak louder than words. Just because someone doesn't go into full detail on every little thing doesn't make them a wolf and I'd like to think you know that.

[Xayah]

why were you townreading galron on entrance
why did you drop him later

link me where you explained me/ausuka?

The entrance felt very lackluster and not really in a way I would expect a replacement to try and get townreads on a slot that was already underfire. But, it soon turned into "that's how they play" so there's no reason to townread that hence the drop into meh.

Also, what I'm saying

did

happen you can legit read the first few posts in the game for yourself. I'm not backing down from the statements I've said either, I still think it's quite a wolfy opening but I don't feel like getting into a battle of words with someone who got huffy and upset over being called out in a game of mafia for their posting. It's a waste of my time so I moved onto something I found more pressing. Did the anger make me weaken the scumread? Yeah, because it starts to seem a bit personality based, but I think Datisi's angle on Ausuka isn't W/W and I think it felt like a TMI sort of angle. AKA: If there's a wolf in Ausuka and Datisi's prob prob Datisi atm.

I also don't think Meg/Other anime A name are W/W don't have much stock in their statements alone though besides "vibes"

This was the start of the reason I was wolfreading both of your slots. But, then as the game went on and it turned into "oh they're friends and oh this is Ausuka's personality" it made me pause. But, after pausing if I looked at it from just a base level you guys didn't look like partners and while I was kinda hardtownreading Ausuka for a lot of the thread (and mainly thinking you were a wolf) in the world Ausuka wasn't a wolf it was hard for me to come to a world where you were a villager.

[Xayah]

Coral all throughout the game has been very analytical, nuanced, and her thoughts feel really grounded within the game. It's evident that they are trying to solve the game beyond just a surface level to try and appear townie.

I'm remembering why this site made such townsided setups

[Xayah]

I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

I think that this is quite silly especially given that the familiarity

was

explained. The only thing that wasn't explained originally was the context of Ausuka being a Miller in a game that was ongoing at the start of this one.

Using "oh, well of course they're just friends, if only someone had

told

me that, then I would have never suspected them" is extremely weak here and at best indicates that little to no thought was put into the original read, because even if you were only reading this thread, it would take very little effort to figure out that they were friends.

You're saying this like it was the base for my read for the entire game (it wasn't) it was for the

start

of the TMI read and evolved into something else after reading context clues.

[Xayah]

scamper feels good

As long as the Elims are me Meg Coral game ends so shrug.jpg

(Well I need to read Dat more but give me a bit on that)

If I was to order the murkey pool in order of likelihood to be a wolf it'd prob go scamper>Coral>Galron

You should also probably explain why you're willing to bet the game on a "scamper feels good" given that your most recent read there had them above only Datisi/Ausuka.

Other way around.

[Xayah]

I don't really understand what you're trying to say. Of course I wouldn't necessarily expect Coral to hard townread their scumbuddy but the argument you were making was based on the premise that Coral had a high degree of confidence in this read and therefore it's strange that she changed it over time. Based on what she actually posted I think this interpretation is wrong. Given that I'm not Coral I'm not sure why you're speaking as if I have an ulterior motive in defending her here, unless you think there are three mafia in the game.

Yes, but the thing people are getting stuck on is they're taking:

Coral said it was slightly towny so that's not high confidence
vs
Corals actions in the game that display such high confidence that makes the read change odd.

[Xayah]

scamper feels good

As long as the Elims are me Meg Coral game ends so shrug.jpg

(Well I need to read Dat more but give me a bit on that)

If I was to order the murkey pool in order of likelihood to be a wolf it'd prob go scamper>Coral>Galron

You should also probably explain why you're willing to bet the game on a "scamper feels good" given that your most recent read there had them above only Datisi/Ausuka.

Other way around.

the alligator eats the bigger cookie

I make alligator shoes. But yeah, other way around.

[Xayah]

I don't really understand what you're trying to say. Of course I wouldn't necessarily expect Coral to hard townread their scumbuddy but the argument you were making was based on the premise that Coral had a high degree of confidence in this read and therefore it's strange that she changed it over time. Based on what she actually posted I think this interpretation is wrong. Given that I'm not Coral I'm not sure why you're speaking as if I have an ulterior motive in defending her here, unless you think there are three mafia in the game.

Yes, but the thing people are getting stuck on is they're taking:

Coral said it was slightly towny so that's not high confidence
vs
Corals actions in the game that display such high confidence that makes the read change odd.

Give examples

Already did.

[Xayah]

Alright, now that we're done with that I'ma go iso Datisi just so I'm fine with the 3 person elim train.

[Xayah]

Datisi do you bus often?

[Xayah]

I don't really understand what you're trying to say. Of course I wouldn't necessarily expect Coral to hard townread their scumbuddy but the argument you were making was based on the premise that Coral had a high degree of confidence in this read and therefore it's strange that she changed it over time. Based on what she actually posted I think this interpretation is wrong. Given that I'm not Coral I'm not sure why you're speaking as if I have an ulterior motive in defending her here, unless you think there are three mafia in the game.

Yes, but the thing people are getting stuck on is they're taking:

Coral said it was slightly towny so that's not high confidence
vs
Corals actions in the game that display such high confidence that makes the read change odd.

Give examples

Already did.

I mean those haven't been particularly convincing.

See I don't really need to hard convince people because Coral wolf doesn't win the game rn and me going over looks even worse for her. Now if I thought Coral was some lock town villager that I needed to convince I'd try harder

[Xayah]

I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

I think that this is quite silly especially given that the familiarity

was

explained. The only thing that wasn't explained originally was the context of Ausuka being a Miller in a game that was ongoing at the start of this one.

Using "oh, well of course they're just friends, if only someone had

told

me that, then I would have never suspected them" is extremely weak here and at best indicates that little to no thought was put into the original read, because even if you were only reading this thread, it would take very little effort to figure out that they were friends.

You're saying this like it was the base for my read for the entire game (it wasn't) it was for the

start

of the TMI read and evolved into something else after reading context clues.

No, this doesn't track. If you initially felt it was TMI and that later evolved into a more nuanced take that included the knowledge of them being friends (nuance which you never showed at the time and are only now claiming it existed all along), and that read still persisted all the way to 846, then

why are you only now saying that you mistook familiarity for TMI

and that you now realizing this caused you to drop your read of there being one wolf in the pair?

Once again third time for the people in the back:

The read on one wolf being in them never changed just the reasoning for it did.

[Xayah]

That's awfully convenient.

Not my fault my reads were correct on my null pool (B

[Xayah]

Datisi do you bus often?

depends if i think it's worth it or not. you'll find examples of me both hard defending and bussing partners if you look.

why?

I'm trying to track your consistency on the Ph0 Galron read and it looks good if you don't bus often but if you're an omegabusser I have to look at other areas because you look the best off the flip.

[Xayah]

See rn I get I'm going over and I do not care about the fact I am going over. I am just trying to block Meg and Coral from going after other people because they need to do that to win the game.

[Xayah]

Obviously, that logic does not work if Dat is a wolf (I'd still bet game on GE and scamp villa and you will respect that when you exe me)

[Xayah]

I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

I think that this is quite silly especially given that the familiarity

was

explained. The only thing that wasn't explained originally was the context of Ausuka being a Miller in a game that was ongoing at the start of this one.

Using "oh, well of course they're just friends, if only someone had

told

me that, then I would have never suspected them" is extremely weak here and at best indicates that little to no thought was put into the original read, because even if you were only reading this thread, it would take very little effort to figure out that they were friends.

You're saying this like it was the base for my read for the entire game (it wasn't) it was for the

start

of the TMI read and evolved into something else after reading context clues.

No, this doesn't track. If you initially felt it was TMI and that later evolved into a more nuanced take that included the knowledge of them being friends (nuance which you never showed at the time and are only now claiming it existed all along), and that read still persisted all the way to 846, then

why are you only now saying that you mistook familiarity for TMI

and that you now realizing this caused you to drop your read of there being one wolf in the pair?

Once again third time for the people in the back:

The read on one wolf being in them never changed just the reasoning for it did.

That addresses literally nothing in my post. That point was part of my post, even.

Reread your post then

[Xayah]

I am fine being the exe and would rather not waste time on people trying to figure that out and just send me over and instead tell me why Dat or Scamp could be a wolf and I'll think it over

(Srsly will die on GE town and you can flame me post game if that's wrong)

[Xayah]

Obviously, that logic does not work if Dat is a wolf (I'd still bet game on GE and scamp villa and you will respect that when you exe me)

If you cared about convincing people to respect that then you would give... like, any reasoning whatsoever for why you're so confident on scamper being town.

You'll respect it when you see my green role pm when I flip. If I have to towncase scamper villa later I will

[Xayah]

Obviously, that logic does not work if Dat is a wolf (I'd still bet game on GE and scamp villa and you will respect that when you exe me)

If you cared about convincing people to respect that then you would give... like, any reasoning whatsoever for why you're so confident on scamper being town.

You'll respect it when you see my green role pm when I flip. If I have to towncase scamper villa later I will

Or you could also tell me why you think scamp could be a wolf that'd be nice since you want to give reasoning so badly.

[Xayah]

Datisi do you bus often?

depends if i think it's worth it or not. you'll find examples of me both hard defending and bussing partners if you look.

why?

I'm trying to track your consistency on the Ph0 Galron read and it looks good if you don't bus often but if you're an omegabusser I have to look at other areas because you look the best off the flip.

i really don't *like* doing busses but i have done a few very successful ones. not sure what i'd have done this game as scum, fwiw.

Assuming I'm a villager do you think I'm on the wrong track and

should

be glancing at scamp?

[Xayah]

Obviously, that logic does not work if Dat is a wolf (I'd still bet game on GE and scamp villa and you will respect that when you exe me)

If you cared about convincing people to respect that then you would give... like, any reasoning whatsoever for why you're so confident on scamper being town.

You'll respect it when you see my green role pm when I flip. If I have to towncase scamper villa later I will

Or you could also tell me why you think scamp could be a wolf that'd be nice since you want to give reasoning so badly.

If by some miracle you flip town, I have no reason to give any weight to your scamper read. I have my own reasons for my scamper read and care much more about those. If you provide reasoning that convinces me I should care about your read, that could change, and it could also at least slightly chip away at the massive pile of things that you seem to be clearly making up on the fly.

Well at least I know I don't need to answer you anymore ty for making that clear ta ta

[Xayah]

i've already given a few reasons why i think scamper is most likely town, so no?

So you agree with my worldview perfect okay I can die knowing someone here will do my work for me (B

[Xayah]

See, I take into account everyone's reasoning because with one wolf alive teamwork makes the dreamwork. You, on the other hand are not trying to sort me or listen whatsoever. It's just saying "that's convenient" and trying to dogpile anything you can on my slot. If you won't hear out or at least show me why you think someone else is XYZ then there's no point in holding a useless conversation with you I'll spend the rest of my time doing more productive things.

[Xayah]

From my perspective, it looks like you're openly just having fun messing around as caught scum, because I don't think anything you're saying here makes sense from a town mindset.

I've given many different things that I have issues with and would like to hear your response on in order to sort you, and you have either dodged, ignored, or misrepresented them. None of them have you answered in a substantial way.

If any neutral observer disagrees with that and thinks that I'm being the unreasonable one in this back and forth, I'm happy to reassess.

See I don't see any question I have dogged or ignored, if I have please requote them so I can answer. Maybe you disagree with what I've said but in my mind, I've answered it because I'm fine with answering any question asked my way. Just because you do not like the answer doesn't mean I've ignored it?

[Xayah]

I also would like to take into account your reasoning on scamper. That's why I asked for your reasoning. You refused to provide it.

This I can say did happen yeah I haven't given my scamper TR reasoning but right now I don't see that as important to conversation if you really want me to just go into detail on that read I can but rn it doesn't seem like it should be the focus given I want the vote to always be in our 3 slots (3 being me you meg)

[Xayah]

I can openly say words are hard and convincing people or getting my point fully across is the hardest thing for me as a villager (my reads are normally pretty good though sob) so if you're not getting something I can try to reword it but it does get a tad dishearting when the basic answer feels pointed

[Xayah]

I think the main issues I have with Meg/Coral are poral opposites in playstyle but still fit the objective of a wolf. Meg's main pushes were...well not in Ph0/gals direction and the main focus seemed to be Ari and just being a loud voice in the thread to distract from their partner.

I'm not interested in sending the rep today. Both wagons going currently are pretty good and I'd compromise to a galron lim if time comes to it.

The other posts about the scum slot? Nothing in regards to Ph0 and saying "I forget Galron exists" next is just a vote on the slot near NoD it's honestly such blatantly scum partner interaction that it makes me pause because I'd like to assume a partner would at least try to have better interactions then this but on a textbook case? Yeah we get left with this.

Corals early defense of Ph0 when they were under pressure and I had to ask them about it still rubs me the wrong way. Of course, you can be wrong and simply townread a villager but I just disagreed with the method Coral did it. I mean I thought Dati/Aus had to have one but I mistook it with familiarly over TMI (woo how fun ty for explaining that to me could've avoided this mess)

They had Galron in "I would kinda let them go"/shade tier and on paper it's a better look then Meg. So for now, I'm okay with placing my vote down.

VOTE: Meg

you just gonna brush past my concerns?

I do not care about your concerns about my slot because as I've said I'm fine going over. And given your meta is incorrect on me. I would like if you do not use it as a crutch to try and read Coral the same way. People are people and play different games it's not like we're robots.

[Xayah]

i don't really understand posts like 1068, 1074, 1084, 1085, 1091, 1103 then

they seem like they're intended to just be frustrating

like, I'm sorry but i just don't believe that the genuine town response to "why did you have this player in this spot in your read list?" is "obviously I wrote the readlist backwards, so actually my reads were correct all along"

So tldr you just don't know my personality or understand how to read me. Welcome to the club! I see my rep is still the same as ever.

[Xayah]

From my perspective, it looks like you're openly just having fun messing around as caught scum, because I don't think anything you're saying here makes sense from a town mindset.

thats not really the impression i get at all, and i dont think shed mess around as scum

Coral all throughout the game has been very analytical, nuanced, and her thoughts feel really grounded within the game. It's evident that they are trying to solve the game beyond just a surface level to try and appear townie.

i think shes going to post analytically regardless of alignment...

I mean probably but it seems like a towny thought for meg to have? idk

I can't tell if you think Meg is just like, a bad player and can only come up with these thoughts as a villager or what but everything Meg has said is very bare bones and is easily taking a backseat. They don't seem interested in trying to figure out the wolf rn it's just "Xayah is most scummy player let's move on next" Even there who to die next list is awful.

[Xayah]

i still don't understand where the bolded comes from. like, the way i'm reading this is "dats/ausuka are sus for their interactions with one another > oh nvm they're friends this is nai > ??? > if ausuka is town, then dats very likely isn't" and i don't understand what the ??? in your thought process here is

With the way the thread was playing out. I found your early and mid D1 wolfy and obviously I made it no secret that I found Ausuka a bit questionable.

But, as the thread went on I figured if it's just Ausuka's personality I should try to read the thread as a whole and given I had Ari slot/Done/Meg as villagers at the time and the game did not feel LOLEASY at the time, I thought the most likely answer was in you or Ausuka. Even if Galron was just a...meh wolf the game didn't feel like a lock so I looked at it based on that degree. Obviously, I was incorrect. (Unless you're a wolf then called it but sob)

[Xayah]

I mean, I wouldn't expect town Meg to be super analytical?

Nevertheless I don't really have any interest in letting Meg live to endgame, so

What about Coral

[Xayah]

I mean she has a push pool of meg coral datisi

I don't really buy the argument that because she's unlikely to win with her current tactic she wouldn't choose it, because she's really unlikely to win with any tactic

Hahahahaha you haven't seen me as a wolf before

[Xayah]

See the only way this strat would work for me as a wolf would be is if I was in a game with all my friends who would know I don't do this as a wolf and then for some reason decide to let me go. (But even then I doubt my friends let me live to any endgame because they're scared. How dare they)

This at most, would buy me...a day? If I'm the wolf here I need to do something to reverse the pecking order not just sink myself in the PoE like this and say let me be run over. Now, the next thing you're gonna say is something like "SEE THIS IS WHAT YOU'RE GOING FOR" lol no. This is just a heads up for post game when I'm in the GY

[Xayah]

Given I am going over it is correct to assume I am flipped town right now and sus out other players because otherwise most of the dayphase is a waste of time.

[Xayah]

Ah yes, 4 year ago meta you sure got me B)

[Xayah]

I don't really care if you do or not. It isn't like I'm trying to get out of the exe

[Xayah]

VT

[Xayah]

I don't have much out to really talk about that comes to mind unless there's serious doubts on scamper or GE I need to address

I would relook scamp at f3 but I'm srs when I say GE is lock town never taking that back

[Xayah]

Well, I personally doubt Meg has some big claim that would make them obv town given a goon as flipped and I think mafia prob have a rolecop or something.

But what I consider a balanced setup is not what MS prob views a good setup. I think the only way a massclaim would be good is if we have another PR that isn't Meg like they're sorting cause that's almost cc based.

So tldr: I don't think it solves much

[Xayah]

Gamma and me's history was if I didn't have Gamma read correctly I was on a noose and while Gamma can't read me nearly as well and Gamma's meta has changed, combine how I'm reading Gamma rn and with how I was reading Ari? Yeah I'm good with lock towning that slot.

As for Datisi and scamper...I still don't really think Datisi had a good day 1, but right now I've kinda put myself in a spot where most if not all of the thread has played more with Datisi that if they're a wolf I expect them to catch him and I'm prob just wrong for having the feelings I did.

Scamper had a really good look when it came to voting Galron and it certainly didn't seem partnerish. If you're asking me who I would tie the noose around if it was f3 and I had hammer rn I'd vote Scamper purely because they've taken a bigger backseat on this phase. I don't think Datisi looks better on my flip even if they have soft defended me.

[Xayah]

I think Coral looked decent in our conversation together and to be honest I would have to do some serious rereading if it wasn't Meg. I wasn't as confident in my lock 3 as I was before but if you have reasons on why you think scamp is a wolf I'd like to look them over together before you vote me but ye I'd bet the game on GE villa and if they're a wolf you can laugh and make fun of me post game.

[Xayah]

I wish Ph0 was in this game more because Coral looked like the obv partner while reading but then lol sub out big sad.
pedit: uh oh...got it sorry mod-kun

[Xayah]

*Clicks tongue*

Hammer away unless you've got question

[Xayah]

G_G

[Xayah]

If it isn't meg-oh it's L-1 kek w