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[Dannflor]

to deny us a potential elimination and also make chances of hitting scum 1/4 instead of 1/3 in lylo?

like that's just straight up -EV

[Dannflor]

anyway I still think this is fire

I think fire is playing in the only way he can as scum and I think realistically there would've been some more desperation and genuine paranoia to his solving yesterday if he were town

[DeasVail]

I also still think it’s fire

[Thestatusquo]

Is there anything to talk about here really?

[Thestatusquo]

I agree that Titus shooting is bad.

[fireisredsir]

sorry i really just thought it was frog

i still don't really have any good idea which person im wrongly townreading. none of them feel very believable to me so im lost

if you want to give me some time to think it over before my death i can try but idk, even if i come up with something i wouldn't really recommend sheeping my reads over scamper's and datisi's

i wish i could say that i was excited to solve this and figure out the truth but im really not

i still will at least try tho

[Thestatusquo]

No reason to not give time.

Also I agreed with you on frog very strongly at the end, so I don't really blame you for that.

[Dannflor]

Fire can you name a time you’ve been this uh defeatist

[Dannflor]

even if i come up with something i wouldn't really recommend sheeping my reads over scamper's and datisi's

cause like im struggling to see this as something someone with a green role pm says

[fireisredsir]

i think ive very often trusted others' reads over mine, especially after being repeatedly wrong. and ive also at times been p accepting of my fate

[Ausuka]

hi um am still in the countryside

I still think it's probably fire but should look into others as well

I agree Titus not shooting would be good

[Dannflor]

i think ive very often trusted others' reads over mine, especially after being repeatedly wrong. and ive also at times been p accepting of my fate

I just think it's weird to be like, "hey these guys who think I'm scum are probably right" as town

[fireisredsir]

neither had much of any reason for me being scum they just couldn't rule me out of the poe which i think is fair

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE:

ok i want you to have some time

[T3]

VC 6.2
Not voting (7): Ausuka, Titus, fireisredsir, GuiltyLion, Thestatusquo, DeasVail, Dannflor
Day 6 will end in (expired on 2022-10-28 14:59:00)

[Dannflor]

my VCA conclusions lead me to believe that no one is scum with another person here

[Dannflor]

VOTE: fire

ok that was some time

[fireisredsir]

fair

[fireisredsir]

i think i feel least good about my reasons for townreading DV. i sort of preflip cleared him earlier due to his pushes on GL and frog, but they can't be scum together, so

i do still feel like a lot of the stuff with GL is kinda sus, but a big part of it also was how he handled HEM vs obscure, and that just reads as a lot more uninformed knowing that both were actually scum rather than just obscure. he'd probably be my second choice tho

ausuka i actually have had some creeping doubts about a few various points gut feeling like tmi due to a seemingly unsupported confidence but her reads are probably just a lot better than mine lol. if she's scum she has gotten way better than her previous scum game in terms of sounding believable which idk if i would really expect after not playing scum for 2 years

shea i just don't think is scum. i don't really want to get into it. ik he's next in the poe but i don't think my reasons will convince anyone not to flip him anyway so whatever

dann feels pure like all game to me now. just feels like he's constantly trying to find scum. very well played if scum

i kinda doubt it's titus bc wtf is an even night serial killer

[fireisredsir]

People I am considering as scum currently:

Juice, HEM, Aristeia, Firebringer, Gamma, GuiltyLion, Skitter, VP Baltar

But I don't feel strongly enough about any of them right in this moment to make a proper (or even a fake) push.

like dv the strongest reasons for him being town imo are things like this where he puts the whole scumteam in his scumreads

which. yes that makes me doubt. but one of you is scum and i think that these kind of things are a lot easier for scum to get miscleared on than, like, playing around wagons in an uninformed way or being unaware of what will help scum wincon

[fireisredsir]

and like of that list he pushes GL

and maybe he's right idk

[fireisredsir]

[Ausuka, scamper, xofelf, ydrasse]
[HEM, Aristeia, fireisred, obscure, relly]
[Datisi, Dannflor, Firebringer]
[Nero Cain, VP Baltar, GuiltyLion, Frogsterking]
[Gamma, Marci, Conman]

and when it turns into a readlist later it looks a lot more neatly spread out

[fireisredsir]

VOTE: Gamma Emerald

For me the deciding factor is multiple instances where Gamma has posted in such a way that is displaying outrage/disbelief in response to a certain/person event that is actually benign to the point where I struggle to believe that she can feel so passionate about it.

798

2111 through 2114

And more recently the ??? at marci

gamma does that, like, all the time though

I don't have the luxury of having played multiple recent games with gamma, but from games I am aware it matches my impression of scum-gamma more than town-gamma. If there are equivalent examples of gamma-town doing it I would be willing to reevaluate.

PEdit: thanks for the link, but it is not quite an example of what I mean

VP I also had the thought of a lot of GL’s posts being busy work, but I don’t think it’ll take off Day 1 (also I probably need more time on that read)

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ConmanMick

I think CMM is more likely scum than Gamma at this point.

this sequence is kinda scummy. votes gamma over something that is very characteristic of gamma as either alignment, waits for someone to let him know that it's NAI, and then pushes a town wagon instead

[fireisredsir]

deasvail

- around the competing wagons of hem/deas, obscure was having a really really awkward read on hem (lol, 4096), and instead tried to help push deasvail (4109) (s)
- prior to the vc in 4314, which had s/s gamma/hem wagons, he voted gamma. scum is less likely to vote the lesser scum wagon in this scenario (same as dann) (s)
- the vc in 5145 is townie for deasvail (s)
- obscure was cosistently pushing deasvail throughout the whole game, and that is probably not s/s (s)
- csf's vote on deas in 5455 and the vc in 5457 - csf knew that both her and tweetie are on borrowed time this game and would flip eventually. so csf was probably trying to push a cw to tweetie to at least get one town flip there (and she was pushing deas) (s)
- on page 33, gamma and hem are having a shitfight, that we now know is s/s - in that light, don't think deas is scum because gamma kept ignoring his vote/scumread on her (d)
- page 51 is the first time that deas interacts with scum about the read on me (reminder deas was townreadign me early, hem gamma vpb were either scumreadign me or seeing me in a negative light) (d; scamper told me this is stupid because deas was rather inactive and didn't have opportunity to react, i told him to fuck off) (we didn't actually have that conversation i would never tell him to fuck off)
- 2304 probably not a bus vote by deas (d)

ok let's look at these

like not trying to minimize these too much but basically all of them are just, scum would PROBABLY be pushing town wagons at these various points, and so deas is town bc he was either being pushed or he was willing to vote scum. and i think scum could have easily had longer term goals in mind here. clearly there were points where there were 2 leading scum wagons, and scum were on both, and they were ok with that. so idk why it's not believable that they would do it with deas too

if obscure legit was struggling with the game i don't think it's unlikely that his partners would be like "hey you can just push me, come on it'll be great!". id probably do that

the only point that isn't along those lines is the one about gamma ignoring deas' vote on her. which yea, that's true, gamma is treating deas differently than she's treating another scum partner. but i don't think it's reasonable to expect scum to treat all of their partners in the same way? gamma clearly had more of a rapport with hem and maybe just felt more comfortable theatreing there

[fireisredsir]

csf voting deas when MT was for sure going down is probably more +scum for deas than it is +town, i don't think csf ever would have expected to get a miselim off there, she probably is already on antispew