Micro 1066: Treestump Express [game over]

[Dannflor]

VOTE: innocentvillager

[Dannflor]

VOTE: innocent villager

[Dannflor]

Is Elements trying too hard for page 1?

why is this a question and not a vote

[Dannflor]

why are you not answering my question

I think a question is more useful than a vote right now, actually.

I didn't get that sense

she's posting a lot but I haven't gotten anxious posting vibes

just posting vibes

but by asking that question it seems like you do think that elements is trying too hard?

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Una

[Dannflor]

VOTE: innocentvillager

[Dannflor]

I'm scum with Una

[Dannflor]

[SHOCKING] You won't believe what happened next... *SCUM PRANK*

[Dannflor]

in all seriousness though

VOTE: Una

this is the slot that most feels like she's trying too hard

[Dannflor]

it was serious for the time

[Dannflor]

UNVOTE:

[Dannflor]

nona did you realize that was el-1

[Dannflor]

I didn't actually scum read you tbh

[Dannflor]

also it seems especially bad to end the day early in this setup

[Dannflor]

dann is town

why would you say this

[Dannflor]

@mod V/LA until Sunday night

[Dannflor]

I told you I'm scum with Una!!

no I just want you to explain because I haven't done anything this game

[Dannflor]

Moonview, can you describe why exactly you call Una greater than rand town?

Also what does "elements is fine" mean exactly

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Moonview

I think you rolled scum this game

[Dannflor]

Moonview, your posts do not seem like real thoughts to me. I feel like you’re forcing almost every single post you make. There’s like this anxious energy of needing to fit in and vibe with the thread that I’ve never seen from town!you, you are always at least a bit more casual and twirly as town. It reminds me a lot of that one scum game from Team Mafia actually, where it felt like you were always playing more to pocket than anything else

I realize some of this is you using Capital Letters but I don’t think that explains you forcing things this much

[Dannflor]

I think Junko's treatment of Dannflor looks genuine and she's probably town. Not really impressed with what I've seen from Dann so far though.

Like, for example, I don’t understand why the second half of this post exists

I had not done anything at this point in the game nor *tried* to do anything. Half of my posts were naked votes. Like, it would be revelatory if you were impressed. I don’t know why you felt a need to say this, it feels like it was out there because you felt like you needed to pad at your post or produce more sorty thoughts, not because you thought this was an important opinion to share with the world

I don’t see town!you thinking that and thinking that’s something you need to share unless you’re a little anxious about making sure you’re always sharing reads and looking townie

[Dannflor]

Haha, do you think I'm actually Ydrasse?

Regardless I'd like to see some examples of this anxious energy I apparently have.

Were you lying

[Dannflor]

154 also strikes me as a scum fluff post

The timing of it is really weird for town to come into the thread at that point and think that’s the most important thread to respond to

It’s also like, elements and Aida were having a goofy back and forth, and you kinda insert yourself into that dynamic. It feels like you saw two townies vibing and didn’t want to be left out of the ~vibes~

And I think spending energy there at that particular timing tends to be a lot more likely coming from scum wanting to fit into the thread

[Dannflor]

Junko called me town based off of a mechanical reason

Who had said they town read my posts

[Dannflor]

Blah I am somewhat less confident you are scum

Can you explain what made your elements read go from fine to top town

[Dannflor]

I'd say I have a fair amount of experience with mafia!

VOTE: innocentvillager

I have consulted my fortunes and IV is scum this game. It's in the stars. I'm a gemini, by the way.

Pedit: Putting guns to people's heads is fun! I guess in this game it would have to be, like, a special gun which turns people into trees. I don't know if science has progressed to that point yet.

Also, I'm a ydrasse alt.

I just get nervous posting vibes from this

I don’t know if knowing the ydrasse alt line was a joke or not makes it any less so or not

[Dannflor]

The timing of it is really weird for town to come into the thread at that point and think that’s the most important thread to respond to

I think this is a really weird way for town who is genuinely sorting my posts to phrase this. Like, it's super purposefully uncharitable and I do not think this is a genuine thought process at all.

I don’t think you really believe this

[Dannflor]

Elements/Moonview?
VOTE: moonview

Moonview/IV

I think Moonview reaching out to poke and prod IV but not me (until now) is how mafia would probably like to treat each other in this setup

I don’t believe Moonview ever intended to go after him over me

[Dannflor]

Junko called me town based off of a mechanical reason

Who had said they town read my posts

Again, I really struggle to believe you are not doing this on purpose.

I acknowledge it is possible for me to be biased here. I'm going to leave the thread for now and check back here later.

Okay

It’s possible I’m being confbiasy here and not realizing that

I’m trying to do this a different way instead of writing a huge wall because I always regret that

i don’t have much time until Sunday night but I’ll do my best to reset when I come back

Maybe I’ll read your posts differently knowing you’re not ydrasse

[Dannflor]

Y'know I've said yes as both alignments but I feel like Dannflor would struggle with scumclaim gaemplay. So I'm gonna say no. Which matches my role pm but is also what I'd probably say otherwise

oh no una was right i struggle with the alt claim gameplay too

[Dannflor]

Junko is wrong on the reasoning about Una town but I’m not sure why you think Junko would make that read on a scum buddy

[Dannflor]

Aisa do you have other thoughts about me other than that I’m weird

[Dannflor]

Also to say that I’m scum reading Moon for fluff posting isn’t really accurate

I think there’s a difference between town fluff posting and scum fluff posting and then there’s not alignment indicative fluff posting

The timing and tone of Moon’s has me leaning towards scum fluff posting

I don’t expect that particular point to be very convincing to anyone not named me but it is a feeling I currently have in my bones

[Dannflor]

Pavowski, who do you think is scum

[Dannflor]

Aisa you wrote 500 words about the quality of my case but none about my alignment

Why do you scum read me

[Dannflor]

Haha, do you think I'm actually Ydrasse?

Regardless I'd like to see some examples of this anxious energy I apparently have.

Were you lying

Omfw Dannflor

TRUST ISIS TAKES PLEASE

Aahhhphlglgk

:grimace emoji face:

[Dannflor]

I think the problem might have been the vaguely Ydrasse account name and like a lot of inertia

it's such a ydrasse account name!!

[Dannflor]

i think generally salty scum aren't as funny as salty town

401 is pretty funny

[Dannflor]

And 438 responding to Aisa's post with "are you scum" rather than anything substantial is just like, "yugg" in her words.

i don't know that this is scum indicative
i think scum even Isis scum have a compulsion to show that they have thoughts and that they are Real thoughts
"are you scum" only hints towards a thought process but is mostly posted to gauge a reaction probably

[Dannflor]

urge to clarify my case on moonview vs. want to drop it bc i really have no interest in pushing it anymore

who will win

[Dannflor]

iv talking about how they were very polarized when they played before is not inspiring confidence in me

[Dannflor]

I don't think it's impossible for Una to be scum here but I'm not really seeing it (I have to say this in order to not be banned for gamethrowing)

I feel like Pavowski's vote on your wagon was markedly worse tbh

especially given he's now town reading you but still has his vote on you?

[Dannflor]

VOTE: Aisa

honestly though if you're town I think it's more likely at least one scum treated your wagon as radioactive waste, maybe both if they don't know who wants to end game yet

but one scum is probably gonna be playing for the most *optics* they possibly can

that means defending "bad" town wagons, generally posting lots of walls, blah blah etc.

[Dannflor]

iv I feel like we're getting to the stage where intentionally not trying isn't really an excuse anymore

can you substantiate any of the vibes you're getting

[Dannflor]

ohhh something just clicked that made me town read Moonview a little more

lole

[Dannflor]

idk I think surface level the reaction was overdefensive

I think the specific fixation about being mad about Not Being Allowed to Make Jokes speaks to me as townier frustration than like "scum caught for the wrong reasons"

needing to leave the thread instead of just laying into me further for a perceived ridiculous case is also probably slightly +town

and the continued hunt for the worst vote on her wagon but with shifting targets is Good

[Dannflor]

I don't really want to pick 434 apart because I feel like I'd be activating a trap card, but this is almost exactly what I'd call information instead of analysis. Aisa doesn't comment at all on whether any parts of my push are more likely to come from scum or town, the analysis is focused on whether or not it "makes sense." It's focused on the pedantic quality of my case and that feels like the thing that is a lot easier for scum to focus on to generate content whereas town is going to be thinking about how that applies to my alignment?

also calling 275 wishy washy is just Saying Words at this point

the "case" culminates in a vote on me in 443

idk the whole progression just looks like it's designed to pocket Moonview

keep in mind she doesn't actually state she thinks Moon is towny anywhere here

just that she's not "super scummy"

[Dannflor]

I don't really hate the hedginess so much as it feels like Aisa saw Moonview getting run up and wanted a stumped Moonview to still like her without actually strongly impeding her elimination

[Dannflor]

{IV, pav, una}

why not elements

I don't really get the town reads on that slot

[Dannflor]

you do probably have a salient point in that I am probably once again giving into my masochistic need to make these micros harder than they need to be

[Dannflor]

I can't make up my mind about what Dann not hammering Una means, so I'm just going to ignore that. I don't agree with Dann's push on Moon (I think the push is weird, not you, Dann! You seem nice :3). I don't know Dann very well, but it sounds like multiple people here think they are a competent scum player who could fake what they have done so far, in which case townreading them seems like a mistake?

this bugged me too and it's possible I'm reading it too harshly because it's about me

but the specific phrasing of "I can't make up my mind about what Dann not hammering Una means" feels very pointedly like a player that wants to avoid town reads collating around a slot

not that she should be town reading me off of that exactly, but the explicit and deliberate dismissal of it entirely feels weird to me

[Dannflor]

again elements kinda fits the spot of mafia positioning around your wagon

except I don't think she's really strained as hard to look towny as aisa has

[Dannflor]

elements do you have a read on me / my push on moon

you called moon town but you didn't really comment on what that meant for me

[Dannflor]

fun

[Dannflor]

my 3p record is Bad

[Dannflor]

I will say my initial most basest instinct here is Junko

pedit:

okay

VOTE: Junkochan

[Dannflor]

please be Good una

[Dannflor]

yayish

[Dannflor]

I don't know is casing Junko helpful

[Dannflor]

I can also self meta ))))

[Dannflor]

I was on elements ass this entire Game una vote Dann

if i was scum i imagine i would be very focused on distancing this setup

[Dannflor]

298 is a really weak push when the context of the thread was following my push on moonview

[Dannflor]

i guess I'm casing anyway

[Dannflor]

I was on elements ass this entire Game una vote Dann

if i was scum i imagine i would be very focused on distancing this setup

You never voted elements

that's like exactly my point

[Dannflor]

lol

I think you are good at scum is I think what I was trying to convey there

[Dannflor]

disappointed in the lack of scum treestump memes

[Dannflor]

una I'm scared

[Dannflor]

I'm town

sorry Aisa

[Dannflor]

i hate you

[Dannflor]

that was to una and also it was a joke

[Dannflor]

@mod v/la until sunday for holiday

I'll pop in when I can to answer questions

if you are actually going to vote me I would like some warning please but yknow

[Dannflor]

I voted you because I wanted to see if I could get a real wagon going

[Dannflor]

my read accuracy is not good

I just post like someone who has good read accuracy

sorry

[Dannflor]

it wasn't about reading you una

[Dannflor]

i don't know I have some shame in my play in the fact that I wound up in this situation at all and that I didn't push scum

but I still maintain my push on Moonview was Good and it helped me get to an accurate read

maybe I could've gotten there with Aisa but maybe not

probably I should've played this game a lot less aggressive than I did given the setup

I didn't really tune my play at all

[Dannflor]

that describes me as a person pretty well

[Dannflor]

I think I'll shut up now I don't think I'm helping

[Dannflor]

I'm a firm believer in the "it's always possible to get to an accurate read on someone" cult

[Dannflor]

yeah okay

I mean I think if I'm scum in this setup I play for optics. I don't think I hard push two different townies. Maybe one at most. Probably I push my scum buddy at some point. Probably I try to attract less attention and then turn it up in 3p, if I'm the one angling for it.

I think Junko has definitely played it for optics. elements' push on Junko just isn't real. the timing of it given what was going in thread is especially bad. Junko never campaigned for elements. it's pretty much exactly how I'd expect scum to be playing this setup and it is exactly what I was looking for all game and I just missed it

[Dannflor]

I think maybe if I use just my brain I don't believe that but in my heart of hearts I believe it

[Dannflor]

my gut instinct looking at this F3 was Junko just because I think from an outside perspective

you and I both look similar level of suspicious

neither of us were town read in the same way Junko was

if scum is in your position I don't know why they don't make the third some else who had a similar level of suspicion in game like moonview or someone else

like this looked like an F3 designed for Junko

[Dannflor]

it is hard to know what to post that is actually convincing and not just conf-bias

[Dannflor]

Junko presenting like they hard pushed elements all day is so disingenuous

shocking VOTE: Elements

Also will start catching up now! Ask questions if you have any!

@Junko I don't you've explained why Elements is scum?

I mean, my initial vote was meant to poke, and now that I got an answer I don't like it.

like this was the extent of her push on elements

a few posts later she is asking if they should El-1 moonview

[Dannflor]

and she drops the read completely in 394

I feel like it's kinda textbook planned bus

[Dannflor]

I was town reading you both too!!

[Dannflor]

I think if I'm scum with elements in this game I always let you have the moonview/elements solve

I'm pushing moonview anyway why do I care if I get some extra distancing in

also I don't know why what I said would be so convincing to Junko in any universe

[Dannflor]

I think if I'm scum with elements in this game I always let you have the moonview/elements solve

I'm pushing moonview anyway why do I care if I get some extra distancing in

also I don't know why what I said would be so convincing to Junko in any universe

This is bullshit

This is bullshit

[Dannflor]

if i was scum I'd be making memes for elements to post i rest my case

[Dannflor]

maybe I'd tell her to sneak in a cute cat picture

[Dannflor]

If i was scum I get elements to hammer Una on page 6

[Dannflor]

what

[Dannflor]

one time i self voted to not wind up in 3p

[Dannflor]

gut says kill dann I don’t see why junko willingly enters this f3

???

why wouldn't junko want this f3

[Dannflor]

Una I hope you do not read Junko's gamethrowiness as town

it is exactly because she is scum that she can be so careless about who she votes

also like if town!Junko really did hate elimnlo and didn't want to deal with this she just

Wouldn't Post

[Dannflor]

If the team were elements/Dannflor, I'm probably the one looking to end game right? Like if you go off post volume and just like the fact that I'm an annoying tryhard if one of us were angling for F3 it would probably be me out of the two of us. Thus, if I'm scum, I'm going to be playing for that from the start of the game.

1) I wouldn't try to persuade Junko that elements shouldn't be in her solve. That accomplishes nothing in terms of "saving" elements because elements was never in any danger and only makes me look worse come the end of the game.

2) I wouldn't never *not* vote my scum partner in a game where people are specifically going to be looking at my associations with flipped scum.

3) I had the chance to not post and let elements have a chance to hammer Una on page 6 of the game. This is probably the single most +EV move for scum in this setup and I didn't take it.

4a) In a game

where every single dead townie gets tree stumped for F3

why on earth would I hard push not one but two townies? Especially in not super charitable ways? I did not make either Aisa or Moonview like me or be inclined to town read me and while it may be nice to say that treestumps will have no influence in F3 I don't think that's true in practice.

4b) I did not play this game to make friends. I've been on a kick recently of really trying to improve my read accuracy(lol) and kinda eschewing the more traditional aspects of my playstyle and this game is super emblematic of that shift. I think one of the strengths of my scum game is that I'm decent at pocketing people and being *likable* and that is not something that I went for this game.

In conclusion, I am town

[Dannflor]

Why does Junko choose this F3 fypov?

I think una and I fill similar spaces of suspicion when it comes to pushing flipped slots and we are both likely to be looked at unfavorably by treestumped peoples

neither of us have like any direct interaction with elements whereas Junko has a very clear and telegraphed bus

Junko was generally more town read, we both town read Junko

it just seems like Junko's perfect F3

and I think it's kinda predictable that Una and I paranoia on each other

[Dannflor]

am i missing something that makes una not confirmed town here

she is confirmed town junko is just scum

[Dannflor]

VOTE: una

wish you wouldn't game throw

[Dannflor]

I mean Una made it pretty clear she was leaning towards voting me

I'm sorry if my posts were getting frustrating to read but I kinda had to play hard to win this

There was no reason to play against your win condition

doesn't really feel like this was earned

[Dannflor]

the lole gave it away

[Dannflor]

fun

[Dannflor]

datisi says lole too tbf

[Dannflor]

Elements mvp

thanks for modding datisi