I see.
It's just that you said "signalling to scum" not "signalling to partners".
So I thought that you were implying that you read him as a Traitor who is trying to signal potential NKs.
In post 627, Roden wrote:Shiki I don't think they're gonna understand why Doctor needs to claim now until it's too late AKA tomorrow when it finally sets in what a flipless setup means
idk feel like my thoughts on mech / claims and such have done little other than create a mess even if i still think they make sense so i’m probably just going to focus on finding a mafia when i wake up and hope anyone who has any questions / doubts with regards to me takes me up on my offer to talk / be sorted in whatever way
That's probably the only thing we can do tbh. I think everything you've said WRT mech makes sense and is the most effective way to play this set up, I just don't think most people will understand that if they don't have experience with this set up/the game beforehand.
What are your reads looking like right now?
i don't really know how to weigh some of the things against eachother but will go slot by slot and compile thoughts
i think part of the difficulty is that some of the things are based on a very low volume of posts;
like my main thought with regards to marashu is that marashu felt like present in a towny way very early in the game but that wasn't really maintained and little else; don't know what to make of recent posts
I agree with this. I keep thinking "Marashu is dropping off a bit, that feels suspicious", but also every time I glace through their ISO I don't really see anything I dislike. Tonally I think they feel townie enough that I don't want ever want them voted out today.
doesn't always feels like scoliosis believes in push but like i said earlier could just be a playstyle thing
like it's very hard to tell the difference between
exaggerated because scoliosis feels that is best way to present thoughts to sort whoever is on receiving end
and
missing on trying to have the right amount of conviction
but because it's consistent willing to give benefit of doubt and say that it's playstyle
have thought a few times that scoliosis could be like, reapplying things from the thread to other situations - my saying scoliosis may have been doing something with the sole purpose of generating content -> scoliosis then saying that my explaining why i was asking about ranger's claim was me falsely saying i was trying to generate content for example - but it is like, do mafia really do that sort of thing very often? probably not
The vibe I've been getting is that Scoliosis is theory crafting mid-conversation and leaving out the connections between thought processes. I can kinda see how that would look like a lack of conviction, but I'm seeing it more him being very "in the moment" when talking to people and not really taking other people's perspectives into account. IMO he's either Crew or Bug, because I don't think Gnosia or AC fake short-sightedness like that especially this early into the game. He'd be my pick for an Engineer check, but I wouldn't want to vote him out.
want to check if you were in radio buzz when i talked to galron about like my views on people facilitating communication at some length
but even if so probably unfair of me to not view as +town as i usually do even if you were aware
(you were but eh)
think the thoughts on autere's complaining / enchant's helpfulness felt somewhat towny
I didn't realize you were in that game actually. I think I know which alt was yours now, but yeah I didn't make any connection between that game and this one until just now.
the feeling that elmo is timetraveling is greatly lessened by elmo being aware and apologizing for jumping around the thread,
still don't really follow elmo's fakegod read,
I was confused for a moment what you meant by time traveling; I forgot that they were stuck on the first nine pages for like three days and then went on VLA. Their ISO makes me think they're almost completely disengaged from the game, mainly only popping in to defend themself.
The Fakegod read and the Ranger read in 330 vibe like TMI to me.
Spoiler:
In post 655, shiki wrote:freedom's questions with regards to abilities still seem odd to me but recent posts have felt okay even if possibly prompted by scoliosis's 'real thoughts' post
want to note scoliosis's dismissiveness towards freedom when compared to other interactions
Tbh I was going to make almost the exact same criticism towards Freedom that Scoliosis made (too many questions and not enough reading or gameplay), I think it's just genuine irritation.
Spoiler:
In post 657, shiki wrote:junkochan has felt very town to me and thus my inclination to ask her thoughts on things i was having trouble weighing,
dunno if i can put a lot of words to this but i am often looking for like
a pillar or whatever and junkochan was my most confident town
Agreed, I feel like Junko and I both keep reaching the same conclusions.
In post 656, shiki wrote:'claim and counterclaim are both town if one of them dies during the night' is a pretty funny take
though i also thought there was a decent chance both were town and maybe even more so now
In post 659, shiki wrote:enchant obviously excited by the format here and thus the preplanned counterclaim and such,
post following reveal of not the engineer about preventing counterclaims seemed good and logical
though rescinding of claim coming shortly after fakegod use of ability and me asking about a second shot makes me a little uneasy
as if traitor and fakegod truthful enchant could still get found out potentially
but also traitor still a miss and i don't currently think traitor more likely than town anyway
and rescinding could very simply have been because didn't want the guardian angel to not know who to save based on later enchant comments, which would be some of the benefit of a mafia counterclaim anyway which enchant worked to prevent, so!
since not known 15 had already claimed et cetera
A part of me really wants to town read Enchant for the fake CC and the thought process behind it. I think as long as he can get confirmed by NK15 that he isn't Gnosia or Bug, then even if he is Traitor I think he ultimately town sided and shouldn't be voted out.
Spoiler:
In post 661, shiki wrote:still have that tingly feeling with regards to autere talking about tracking fos votes and then someone using an ability that made day 1 an actual vote
In post 474, Autere wrote:I'm not asking you all to be brain surgeons but I really am fucking perplexed that the front of discussion has been what it is. The start of this game was NK15 claiming engineer in the most hackneyed way by intentionally misspelling his apparent ability, which he then (unprompted) claims Engineer of all fucking things. This causes Enchant to CC, and my initial thought is that 'ok, so Enchant is likely real because he didn't want to out like a sensible person' but ho ho ho I thought it was supposed to be December but you could've fooled me that it was April with how much fucking jokes have been played. Excuse me for being skeptical about FakeGod's ability when we've already seen what's happened prior. So what else is going on? Meandering discussion that amounts to nothing but setup analysis and flavor wank that is
tonally daft and boring
it's like I'm being educated about Gnosia and if I wanted to do that I would've played the fucking game. Please for the love of god can we get some nuance in here. The thread is bone-dry with surface level takes it makes me want to participate with a coma than this shitshow.
and i don't really like
understand why this post exists? / feels like,
like isn't the solution simply to interact with posts that aren't 'educating you about gnosia' and to interact with those who are about other things,
i guess i feel like,
like,
like there was not a dearth of posts outside of this umbrella autere could have easily posted about instead
same as with the vote counting thing like instead of doing so stated that it should be done, instead of doing so with regards to content not about source material stated that others should provide it,
and i don't know if being so seemingly upset with that tracks
In post 468, Autere wrote:Call me nostradamus but I predict NK15 will retract as well. I'm not very happy about this but I'm biting my tongue for the sanctity of the thread
though i thought this numerous times
and i don't really have any basis from which to judge if being so upset about something like this instead of doing something about it is actually alignment indicative
so guess i would like others' thoughts on this
I have complicated thoughts here. Originally I had a knee jerk reaction when they told me to shut up about flavor and I thought it was scummy, but I bit my tongue because I was worried that maybe I was being annoying. Complaining about flavor and mech talk again later on is kind of consistent, but I noticed it too that they weren't really doing much to change what was bothering them about the game. 268 bothers me in hindsight because it's just more of them complaining without doing anything about it, like they shade me for not giving out more reads on more players, but they don't vote me or confront me on it. Additionally they just kinda dipped out of the game over the last few days, but it feels like an unconvincing rage quit.
468 seems like the same assumption Narrow has been making, idk why multiple people are expecting a double Engineer fake claim. I think Autere having no reaction to most of the player list believing the claim is very off, if nothing else.
In post 158, narrow parking wrote:if i were engineer i wouldn't claim here. i doubt we'll reach end of phase without one of them walking back their claim. if one of them dies during the night w/o that happening we know they're both town cuz scum doesn't want to get rid of that kind of wifom.
ill wait for the dramatic reveal to decide if i want one of them froze
how did you decide
that you want enchant froze?
mmmmmmmmm
yeah this mostly right you say someone is going to walk it back both are quite possibly town et cetera
but then when enchant walks it back you vote and are now saying you're unlikely to vote elsewhere
so how did you get from a to b i guess i am asking
like was it a ploy to get a mafia to rescind their claim
and if so why do you think a mafia would do so at the time that enchant did?
and if not, i guess what is the reasoning otherwise,
i was never really at point a. my thinking then was it could be tvt given both making it to eod, which didn't happen. so now im seeing it as an info play, one that seems very scum motivated. enchant
- cc'd a cop
- went on an AtE rant
- started randomly voting heads
- fished for other potential cop claims
- did no scum hunting outside of this
i don't see the town mindset for this other than "muh info", and it doesn't even seem like they got anything out of it? Like if the whole goal is to get reads from reactions, where are the reads ? Where is the case, the pressure, it doesn't exist! ridiculous
In post 677, Freedom wrote:In that, I feel like his opposition to Coroner claiming feels like he wants to scum to have less NK choices.
How would Coroner claiming mean scum have less NK choices?
Similar reasons to Elmo but mainly so the scum doesn't get to choose between NKing the Engineer and Doctor.
Especially since both can't be protected by the GA.
In post 692, FakeGod wrote:Enchant also argued pretty hard for other power roles to NOT claim, even though Coroner claiming after cop was CC'd was the right move.
This is because he knew that he fakeclaimed and will be retracting it, which would leave Coroner vulnerable to nightkills if claimed.
About what, specifically? About my stance on coroner? Sure. I think that, if coroner claims and there are no cc's then it means that scum won't be able to cc it later. Let's say nobody cc's the claim. Town has 2 confirmed members, with 2 more hidden as masons. From my point of view that means of the 10 remaining players, half are evil, town will be able to trust results, and scum will be forced into VT claims because claims after D1 shouldn't be trusted (in case the real PR was killed in the night).
If there is a cc, that locks at least one anti-town, maybe more. In this scenario scum likely won't kill the coroner - killing one confirms the dead one was not scum and was not bug, so it's either real coroner or AC follower (1 for 1 with the traitor may not be optimal so I can see some arguments on that point, but it's also not a terrible exchange). If there are 3 or 4 claimed doctors, it becomes more complicated to resolve or trust the results of any one coroner, but also gives us targets for the engineer. In the CC variation there's also a possibility where an unclaimed mason is voted out (which I don't think is a bad thing so long as the other mason isn't NK'd) and a fake coroner says that they were scum, only to have the living mason reveal. But that's more of a dream scenario and one that I don't think will happen.
Having said the above, I can understand the coroner being hesitant to claim, but I find it very, very interesting that no scum (AC Follower, Bug, or Gnosia) have tried to fake claim coroner to force a counter-claim. My guess is they (groupscum specifically for this point) aren't coordinated and didn't prepare for counter-claims and at least some of them are not familiar enough with source to have seen how the extra claims adds doubt and makes it tough for town to solve. Either that, or they decided ahead of time to lay low and hide among the VTs, but I think that is pretty unlikely.
----
I forget if I said this before but right now I have NK15, shiki, Roden, Enchant as town.
People who can sort Elmo from what's been posted deserve a medal. I'm not really getting anything from this slot.
@Ranger, I've been meaning to ask. I know your frequent read lists is something you say you do for yourself, but is it something you're just doing this game or have you done it before?
It's been days and I'm still not quite sure I understand NK15's character ability (or more specifically what benefit it is supposed to provide). That said, I'm looking at Freedom's ability claim. I haven't seen any randomness anywhere else in the game beyond role distribution, so consider me skeptical. I'm not really seeing anything from Freedom that seems scummy, though, beyond that unprompted claim.
In post 677, Freedom wrote:In that, I feel like his opposition to Coroner claiming feels like he wants to scum to have less NK choices.
How would Coroner claiming mean scum have less NK choices?
Similar reasons to Elmo but mainly so the scum doesn't get to choose between NKing the Engineer and Doctor.
Especially since both can't be protected by the GA.
I keep forgetting that most of you don't understand the set up
