Open 869 | Fight for the Winter Court [Game Over!]

[skitter30]

I dont understand how this is strong enuf reasoning to base the rest of the game around

I suppose another side of it would be that I don't have any conflicting opinions that are strong enough to want to try to overrule what seems to be the preference of someone forming a group that doesn't involve me.

The context is that this is a 'want' that led you to forming a me/you/tempest pairing

So like ig i'm kinda confused why the catboi/faker/ffery pairing made by someone elese is strong enuf to base the rest of the game on (including where you yourself go)

Like this explanation doesnt fully square with me with describing that pairing as a condition for how you arrived at your own pairing ...

[Isis]

There's not much I want to say right now that wouldn't be better to hold off until day 2.

I'll entertain questions, though.

LOOK AT THIS SHIT

[Chara]

Isis <3

[Isis]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

I'm so lost, aren't suspicious people compatible with being deciders

[Faker]

Reviewing your ISO again it looks like you wanted feedback on a specific interaction of Coral/skitter's, not just the individuals.

I didn't find their stuff around page 8 very iffy, especially given that it seemed to have started from a back and forth with skitter/absinthe

about

Coral. 220 is pretty direct for a S/S interaction.

[Faker]

LMAO ISIS

[Tempest]

I'm here. Who and what do you want to talk about?

Are there any of my reads you disagree with? Besides the one on you of course?

Is Isis, skitter, me still your scumteam thought?

Are you scumreading Faker for raising an eyebrow at your entrance and very early play?

I have misgivings about speaking my strongest townreads out loud right now.

No, I'm not scum reading Faker. That was a low-key floating thought I was spitting into the wind.

I guess what I'm really interested in is the same thing I asked faker. Do you have any thoughts on the skitter/coral interaction around page 5?

Other than that, I'm not really reassessing anything tonight. I'm going to catch up with the thread right now and then go to bed. I'll think about reads tomorrow.

[Isis]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

It's the nature of the Keep to me. Just like any other group of three, if Demona, Tammy and I had gone to the keep, then two of us know that we are individually town regardless of which of the other two are scum. And I feel like it comes down to me in that instance because I either am townreading Tammy into the stratosphere or I'm having a nervous breakdown over which of them is town. And if Tammy is town, then given her reads right now, she'd make the wrong choice in that threesome. I feel like it would fall on me one way or another. Tammy and I both waffle a LOT. But I'm pretty sure I'm more decisive than she is in the early game. In fortress, it's ALL early game from my perspective. But maybe I'm totally wrong about how it would play out. And when I was thinking that a Demona/Tammy/me Keep it looked to me like it would be easier than it does now. I really didn't expect her to straight up scumread me at this point. I'm not blaming her for the read. I'm fighting off some major tilt and I'm well aware it's bleeding into my play, but I'm still going to keep it light in this game.

That's was convoluted to write because of the layers of hypotheticals and my own re-thoughts based on Tammy's posts today.

At the moment I can't imagine being the player who is voted in the Keep. So my agency comes down to getting my reads right. Otherwise I'm putting the weight of the minigame on the other town player.

When town, Tammy really shines out as town IMO. We usually have a few bobbles and misinterpretations, but those bobbles almost always have resolved, usually the next time we interact.

I expected (and kinda still expect) us to eventually connect pretty well in this game if she's town. Despite Tammy's assertion that she's never in my top town reads, that's hasn't really been the case in our last few games. WH13, Diffusion, Tenet, all three of those games my read of her settled well before hers did of me (and in Diffusion she never expressed a townread of my hydra. Her hydra partner did). In all three of those games she was high tier town to me (in Tenet even before her hydra were mod confirmed town I was townreading them). We meet as hydras a lot and my partners' thoughts play into my reads of her, but often I'm the first to get there. The Smokefilled game probably deserves mention too, but the dethy had a huge impact on my reads. She was my second-highest townread in the dethy, starting very early on.

I'm so confused, if you are really good at getting correct townreads on Tammy don't you want to go to keep and vote for her? But you don't want to go to keep? Or was that gate?

[Faker]

I basically had it filed under "To do with Chara/Coral" and when I saw page 5 was Chara/Coral thought that was it, I actually had to hunt for skitter/Coral

[absinthe]

Someday you're going to figure out how to read me.

Ffery do you think i should be townreading you at this point?

At this point you're one of a thousand points of light.

You pretty much default scumread me in our two recent games and you were right about one of them. Should you be course correcting? I feel like you should be because you're a skilled player and part of that is reading playstyles that clash. My expectations may be too high. I scumread read you pretty emphatically in Tenet, and really only talked myself out of that read momentarily here and there until it was too late to do anything about.

Most likely some of the scumreads on me are fake. IIRC there are only a couple of players who haven't taken a stance on me. I don't feel like you've really justified your read but day 1 in this setup probably goes better with some cards held to the vest. I shouldn't have talked so much about my reads on day one of the first Fortress game.

[Chara]

i want to take Isis with me to the Wall but i do not want to lock in a whole location and fuck with whatever else is going on. but i am not smart enough to figure out what groupings should go where!

[skitter30]

I was just rereading that post and trying to decide what i felt abt it

Pedit the ffery post isis quoted

[skitter30]

Sorry @ffery remind me which game you were scum in with me?
A few games are starting to run together in my mind >.>

[Chara]

I shouldn't have talked so much about my reads on day one of the first Fortress game.

how were your reads used against you in the first Fortress game? is that why you found yourself shifted by scum?

[absinthe]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

It's the nature of the Keep to me. Just like any other group of three, if Demona, Tammy and I had gone to the keep, then two of us know that we are individually town regardless of which of the other two are scum. And I feel like it comes down to me in that instance because I either am townreading Tammy into the stratosphere or I'm having a nervous breakdown over which of them is town. And if Tammy is town, then given her reads right now, she'd make the wrong choice in that threesome. I feel like it would fall on me one way or another. Tammy and I both waffle a LOT. But I'm pretty sure I'm more decisive than she is in the early game. In fortress, it's ALL early game from my perspective. But maybe I'm totally wrong about how it would play out. And when I was thinking that a Demona/Tammy/me Keep it looked to me like it would be easier than it does now. I really didn't expect her to straight up scumread me at this point. I'm not blaming her for the read. I'm fighting off some major tilt and I'm well aware it's bleeding into my play, but I'm still going to keep it light in this game.

That's was convoluted to write because of the layers of hypotheticals and my own re-thoughts based on Tammy's posts today.

At the moment I can't imagine being the player who is voted in the Keep. So my agency comes down to getting my reads right. Otherwise I'm putting the weight of the minigame on the other town player.

When town, Tammy really shines out as town IMO. We usually have a few bobbles and misinterpretations, but those bobbles almost always have resolved, usually the next time we interact.

I expected (and kinda still expect) us to eventually connect pretty well in this game if she's town. Despite Tammy's assertion that she's never in my top town reads, that's hasn't really been the case in our last few games. WH13, Diffusion, Tenet, all three of those games my read of her settled well before hers did of me (and in Diffusion she never expressed a townread of my hydra. Her hydra partner did). In all three of those games she was high tier town to me (in Tenet even before her hydra were mod confirmed town I was townreading them). We meet as hydras a lot and my partners' thoughts play into my reads of her, but often I'm the first to get there. The Smokefilled game probably deserves mention too, but the dethy had a huge impact on my reads. She was my second-highest townread in the dethy, starting very early on.

I'm so confused, if you are really good at getting correct townreads on Tammy don't you want to go to keep and vote for her? But you don't want to go to keep? Or was that gate?

That's EXACTLY what I wanted to do.

[Faker]

I guess staring at 220 I think it's plausibly scum-skitter in a vacuum but I just view this all as pretty standard/run of the mill for basically any alignment pairing.

I'm just not seeing what you're seeing sadly.

[Isis]

68 is irrelevant because it's about meta, 171 is my impression from demona of "this looks pretty town" rather than "i think i can read demona".

and 410 is my chara's folly trauma.

Demona does look pretty town it's also the townread in the game I feel I can pull out of the 1000 jigsaw and put down as a corner piece.

I feel waffly about others.

With coral I just wanna eat the waffle anyway since it's just track record doubt

Oh this morning I tried to use the waffle iron but I misread the markings about how much batter to and overflowed it and I didn't know how to fix it so I just left without eating anything

[absinthe]

Sorry @ffery remind me which game you were scum in with me?
A few games are starting to run together in my mind >.>

That absurd normal game. 2181.

[Isis]

the folly was mine. do you get it.

I GET IT

<3

[demona]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

I'm so lost, aren't suspicious people compatible with being deciders

i think coral/tempest were saying

‘why wouldn’t tempest simply be the decider by voting tempest’s townread, demona’

and the answer to that from a town!absinthe perspective would simply be that tempest was not town and therefore would not actually decide that, at which point i would think absinthe would realize tempest was not town and tada!

but from a town!tempest perspective it makes sense for tempest to simply vote for me and win the keep

[Faker]

Ah yes, the game we all threw in the towel on the NRG

[Chara]

68 is irrelevant because it's about meta, 171 is my impression from demona of "this looks pretty town" rather than "i think i can read demona".

and 410 is my chara's folly trauma.

Demona does look pretty town it's also the townread in the game I feel I can pull out of the 1000 jigsaw and put down as a corner piece.

I feel waffly about others.

With coral I just wanna eat the waffle anyway since it's just track record doubt

Oh this morning I tried to use the waffle iron but I misread the markings about how much batter to and overflowed it and I didn't know how to fix it so I just left without eating anything

at least you tried to use the waffle iron! i find it an intimidating device. next time you can learn from your mistake because you tried today!

i don't know what to do about a good... 50% of this game. common sense is telling me to ISO Tempest and really dig into that but i do not want to, i want to write instead.

[skitter30]

Sorry @ffery remind me which game you were scum in with me?
A few games are starting to run together in my mind >.>

That absurd normal game. 2181.

Ooooooo that one
That was a great game for me lol
(@prism i think that was our firsf game together! And there were many bickerings abt my absurd gamestate conclusions that were *entirely* right!)
But tbh i'm not reading you based on meta, like at all. Idk how to metaread you and i'm not taking any past games into acct

[Faker]

I'm actually very lost so I'm going to take this as a sign I should go to bed and let other people's magic work.

Everyone fine with me locking the Keep? @skitter I can't remember if you actually objected to that too or just want Wall over Gate

[Chara]

I basically had it filed under "To do with Chara/Coral" and when I saw page 5 was Chara/Coral thought that was it, I actually had to hunt for skitter/Coral

what is your approach to reading me anyways, Prism? in this game in particular. i know you didn't come out with anything you felt strongly about one way or the other, but i'm wondering about your methodology, if anything.

pedit: answer this in the morning then, i support sleep.