Open 870 | White Flag Mountainous | Postgame

[Una]

It's frustrating to get naked voted after repeatedly re explaining nitpicked "huh what you mean" responses to my posts

Instead of like, you disliking the original posts and finding them scummy.

Like fmpov I reexplained a point to two people I think are scum as an exercise in civic duty since they might not be scum

Then Ari naked vote

-_-

Mafia gaemplae

[giuseppina]

She's done nothing to make me townread her

And everyone else

has

done something to make you townread them? Because this doesn't make sense to me otherwise, but I also feel like this is not it.

why couldn’t it simply be that klick has more of an expectation for aristeia to do something towny than others? i kinda think i do

[Gamma Emerald]

i think my mental image of scum trying to climb the mountain versus town trying to climb the mountain is that town are kind of clueless and eager to sprint the entire way up while scum are smarter and understand it's going to be a very long climb.

Spoiler:

[Klick]

ok assuming we're both town

one of us is right and one of us is wrong

probability says you will be right but i have a feeling i am right

i dont actually care about winning so i am not going to effort and persuade you because i think i would enjoy you losing to scum shirou more

Is this in response to me?

[Aristeia]

ok assuming we're both town

one of us is right and one of us is wrong

probability says you will be right but i have a feeling i am right

i dont actually care about winning so i am not going to effort and persuade you because i think i would enjoy you losing to scum shirou more

Is this in response to me?

yes

[Gamma Emerald]

I ONCE AGAIN ATTEMPT TO LIVE PAST DAY 1

this would be funny to say as mafia and cakes is a funny person

VOTE: SirCakez
That did vibed a bit salty to me, I did skim that dance game that just ended

How does me being salty tie to my alignment at all lol

it doesn't, I was just reaction baiting you
I think you reacted okay
VOTE: Aubrey
I'll go here since I am skeptical of the expectation that I would be more solvy rn

[NorwegianboyEE]

Una are you saying that you no longer townread Shirou and did so mistakenly in your first pages? I have a hard time understanding what exactly your progression is and that’s not making me feel like i could be wrong.

[Aristeia]

It's frustrating to get naked voted after repeatedly re explaining nitpicked "huh what you mean" responses to my posts

Instead of like, you disliking the original posts and finding them scummy.

Like fmpov I reexplained a point to two people I think are scum as an exercise in civic duty since they might not be scum

Then Ari naked vote

-_-

Mafia gaemplae

sorry

[Aristeia]

She's done nothing to make me townread her

And everyone else

has

done something to make you townread them? Because this doesn't make sense to me otherwise, but I also feel like this is not it.

why couldn’t it simply be that klick has more of an expectation for aristeia to do something towny than others? i kinda think i do

you have too much faith in me <3

[Una]

Shirou is town

I don’t like this for example.
Very early, confident, and bold claim on Shirou’s allignment. Shirou being town here suggests to me it could be pocketing attempt. Scum like to identify strong town early and townread them so they get in good relations with potential trouble later on, even if the town player in question hasn’t looked town at all yet because it’s too early in the game to tell.
I think i can be so bold to say that i’m the best player at reading Shirou here and i did not trust them by post 38 which is when you posted this.

I don't think that's the best way to play scum so I don't play that way. If I'm playing scum I try to guess whether I would be townreading someone and emulate it.
Your last sentence contradicts itself, because if you think other players understand shirou less that you should have many opportunities to watch him snow people. You're a little bit scummy because the thought process is focused on being right rather than stepping in my shoes and scum sometimes focus on who is right.

what
I don't get what you're saying here
is it like, you think norwee should be able to tell if Shirou is pocketing people by seeing interactions between Shirou and others?

Snow doesn't mean pocket. And me, not others.
He doesn't have to know for sure, but he's asserting the contrary when he seems to rule out that I could be town mistakenly granting shirou town stature for insufficient posting

Did you or did you not townread them for insufficient posting?

If I definitively knew the answer to that mafia wouldn't be much of a game would it? I'm not playing "acknowledgement of uncertainty is disallowed" mafia

[Gamma Emerald]

Shirou is town

I don’t like this for example.
Very early, confident, and bold claim on Shirou’s allignment. Shirou being town here suggests to me it could be pocketing attempt. Scum like to identify strong town early and townread them so they get in good relations with potential trouble later on, even if the town player in question hasn’t looked town at all yet because it’s too early in the game to tell.
I think i can be so bold to say that i’m the best player at reading Shirou here and i did not trust them by post 38 which is when you posted this.

I don't think that's the best way to play scum so I don't play that way. If I'm playing scum I try to guess whether I would be townreading someone and emulate it.
Your last sentence contradicts itself, because if you think other players understand shirou less that you should have many opportunities to watch him snow people. You're a little bit scummy because the thought process is focused on being right rather than stepping in my shoes and scum sometimes focus on who is right.

I don’t get it what you’re saying in the end of your post.
I’m not focused on being right. In fact, i’ve come to my conclusion from trying to see the game from your perspective and whether that perspective is likely to be of town alignment. I’m saying that you are approaching the beginning of day 1 from a scum mindset rather than an town mindset.
Early townread on Shirou by you is questionable in both intent behind it and the logic made in approaching such an conclusion. The discrepency in your logic here can be explained by scum mindset of starting day 1 with survival in mind rather than genuinely trusting Shirou to be of town alignment due to genuinely reading the player to be so. Hence my suspicion.

town

[Lucian]

Why was this specifically not true for your giuseppina read at post 79, but it was specifically true at post 109? As implied by this post:

It was not "specifically true" or whatever. I started off the game thinking pina is weird and stilted, in a way I find scummy from her, especially post 24. I saw your readslist, I thought it was overall odd. I kept reading, I thought pina's posts weren't *that* bad and that I could understand if someone was townreading her. I don't know which posts specifically did it, it probably wasn't any specific post; I could go back and pick some posts but this feels like a waste of time and I am highly skeptical this is something that is like, actually thought to be AI by anyone.

Do you have higher expectations of Ari? (Also @pina, I did not assume so because I don't recall Klick and Ari playing together.) Or has everyone else done something that you would consider something that scum wouldn't do?

Why am I scum?

[Lucian]

I'll go here since I am skeptical of the expectation that I would be more solvy rn

Is that really the only thing you're voting them on?

[Lucian]

Actually, I wanna say that's townie for Gamma because she's surely aware how scummy that sounds and wouldn't actually type that and press Submit if she were scum.

Right?

[Aristeia]

do you have high expectations of me?

[Gamma Emerald]

pace himself, conserve energy for later, figure out who is mislimmable

I feel like Shirou is drawing a lot of unnecessary attention to himself for achieving those goals

do you feel like he is not accomplishing his goals at the present?

hmmm

[Aubrey]

@Gamma, Early early game you seemed to sheep and just talk without producing much original content. Mafia tend to do that some. That’s why I was curious as to why you announced you’d be taking a step back.

I don’t remember much of your play style, so that shouldn’t be figured into my words.

[Lucian]

do you have high expectations of me?

Can't say that I don't. :3

[Gamma Emerald]

ok assuming we're both town

one of us is right and one of us is wrong

probability says you will be right but i have a feeling i am right

i dont actually care about winning so i am not going to effort and persuade you because i think i would enjoy you losing to scum shirou more

this is one of the posts of all time

[Aristeia]

do you have high expectations of me?

Can't say that I don't. :3

uWu

[Aubrey]

You and I both know Toto has no wagon forming and nobody is at risk right now. So vote. We can’t stay undecided forever and you can change. Otherwise it just reads as cautious idle mafia. Though Ari seems to be backing you by stating this as your standard. A bit not so great standard though me thinks.

Votes are not nearly as important as people like to believe they are

Neither is all this meta kawaii junk, but alas.

okay so you think shirou may be doing so as mafia, yes? the goal for scum!shirou i assume would be to make the game harder to read and to alienate some players?

and the rest of those involved in either the meta discussions or the ‘kawaii’ as you say are enabling shirou to do so? or do you think it is more likely a concentrated mafia effort? or?

My response is the same that I answered earlier regarding Shirou. If I was on my computer I’d link it.

Meta has little to no grounds or basis in my eyes. The only meta comment Ive taken stock in was when whoever said you typically stall on votes. Other than that, it’s been in one ear and out the other across the board.

As for kawaii, I’m just ready to off all anime girls at this point.

sorry i do not think i asked this well

your earlier posts re:shirou is why i ask in the first place,

i am trying to ask if from the interactions shirou is having, both about meta and ‘kawaii’ etc, does it seem more likely to be towns enabling shirou to muddy the game to you? or a more concentrated effort of shirou+ others to do so, or?

maybe i am still not asking well

Ah, I think I know where you’re going with this. No I’m not thinking this is a team effort or plan.

[Una]

Actually, I wanna say that's townie for Gamma because she's surely aware how scummy that sounds and wouldn't actually type that and press Submit if she were scum.

Right?

I don't think she's definite scum but I would read it at face value instead of level1 WIFOM.

[Shirou]

Spoiler: actual useless post (aka my attempt at being a "boomer" by talking about site history)

Meta has little to no grounds or basis in my eyes. The only meta comment Ive taken stock in was when whoever said you typically stall on votes. Other than that, it’s been in one ear and out the other across the board.

Isn't it curious how after Ellie "happened" the site mostly moved on from this argument (the "is meta trash or not")? I'm not "truly" an old player for a 20 years old site so I haven't read too many "truly old" games but I feel this is an opinion/take on meta that used to be way more common before 2017/2018 or so happened

But there's like, still lost sheep in the limbo we're all in known as

"figuring out mafia"

, they haven't seen some glimpses of light relatively recently showed.

I for one am in this camp as well, but in a reformist way. I think meta can tell us some things, and if you dive deep and methodically into it, sinking truly a lot of time, money, effort or all those combined, you may be able to create individual frameworks on how to read the individuals rather than trying to freestyle between using "general statistical tells" and your "experience" with the player be it watching or playing together with them (basically meta). However I don't think it's how it's "intended" to be, or even realistically can be played by most people, and in my experience I would say the "I know X meta a lot trust me on this read here" argument has failed me at Live 4K resolution more than 50% of the games.

Getting some truly reliable tells can be harder than what we often believe imo...

I would say, "good meta is king, no meta is okay and bad meta is trash"

This was my "current state of play in mafiascum dot com" TED Talk for tonight thank you

[Lucian]

Actually, I wanna say that's townie for Gamma because she's surely aware how scummy that sounds and wouldn't actually type that and press Submit if she were scum.

Right?

I don't think she's definite scum but I would read it at face value instead of level1 WIFOM.

Last time I decided to make a read like that on level1 WIFOM rather than face value, I got slapped with a red flip and an egg on my face. But I'm still a sucker for WIFOM I guess.

[Aristeia]

i think limming una and lucian will end the game

im probly wrong