Open 875 - The Kindgom of Zeal: The Queens Chosen - GAME OVER

[Detective Penguin]

i could help though

[Detective Penguin]

think of the wagons we could build

[redFF]

Im really not understanding the LLD ranger tell situation...im gonna be honest

[Cephrir]

i don't either but i think ranger's response has been decently scummy

[Gimli]

why do you think the self vote is gross, if it isn't scummy? I get the idea of self voting being gross when that's tied to an emotional play or something that goes against wincon. but there on p2 it was a meaningless vote so I take issue with you pointing it out as if it's meaningful, and I want you to expand on why you think its gross and why it could potentially be scum indicative.

On reflection saying "not sure whether scummy" was technically true but I should have been clear I sort of do find it scummy. Not the self-vote itself, because people self-vote as town all the time (even though I think it's dumb), but the self-vote in combination with what came before and after.

Pretty sure role flips in setup but not night of acting if I remember correctly so will say I act N1. (I should double-check that but full disclosure; I actually forgot this was an open. Thanks to how flavored it was I thought it was a theme. xD)

VOTE: Ranger

I don't see LLD opening this way as scum but it's not worth the effort of debating my alignment with her.

This all seemed like an overreaction to being suspected. Making a claim and self-voting and saying "I don't see any point in arguing this" seems like something you might do as town if you are on the chopping block already but not in response to one person saying you are scum, so it comes off to me as someone trying to "react the way town would react" rather than just exhibiting their true reaction.

I agree it's an overreaction, but I feel like that fits the way ranger plays at a personality level and I think claiming n1 on p2 is more likely than not to be coming from town. I see ranger is getting some scumreads and I don't understand them nor do I think what you're noticing is more likely than not to be coming from scum.

from what I know of both ranger and LLD, if they start arguing with each other over their scumreads on one another, we'll see many very long posts. I think it's reasonable for ranger to try and avoid it, especially if she thinks lld is probably town and not a back and forth that'll help her solve.

[Cephrir]

think of the wagons we could build

we do seem to have a live one and yet, i'm seduced

VOTE: umlaut

[Gimli]

i don't either but i think ranger's response has been decently scummy

really, why is that?

[Cephrir]

i think she's focused pretty hard on the "confusing me with someone else" aspect and while i understand what she's getting at here, it's easier to hide behind this than to take another tack. furthermore, she accuses me of this when i haven't said anything that implied my vote has to do with who she is or isn't. i did make one post about the rightful order of things but that has never been why i was voting where im voting

also, if she wishes me to see her as someone else, then i think i get to hold her to a standard of explaining reads which i would not hold the person i'm confusing her with to, so i would like to see that

[Cephrir]

also, if she wishes me to see her as someone else

if i may rephrase this: "since i am confusing her with someone else,"

[Detective Penguin]

think of the wagons we could build

we do seem to have a live one and yet, i'm seduced

VOTE: umlaut

oooh - i do like this better than redff

VOTE: umlaut

[Detective Penguin]

i don't either but i think ranger's response has been decently scummy

really, why is that?

vote umlaut with us

[Gimli]

i think she's focused pretty hard on the "confusing me with someone else" aspect and while i understand what she's getting at here, it's easier to hide behind this than to take another tack. furthermore, she accuses me of this when i haven't said anything that implied my vote has to do with who she is or isn't. i did make one post about the rightful order of things but that has never been why i was voting where im voting

also, if she wishes me to see her as someone else, then i think i get to hold her to a standard of explaining reads which i would not hold the person i'm confusing her with to, so i would like to see that

I don't wanna get into the multiple people part of this other than to say it has to be NAI, right? and I don't think she's been heavy handed with it, surely ranger feels its important that we know she's not someone you talked with before.

what were you pushing ranger for originally? I see that you're not pushing her for having an overreaction to that 'i wont townread you just for putting things in the right order', when imo she wasn't reacting to a lean or a push, she was reacting to the familiarity in which you were approaching her.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

i know i should leave my vote where it is right now but there's something else i want to do with it right now. decisions

Look, I'm killing Ranger today.

You can BoP me later for it if I'm wrong, but I'm not wrong.

[Cephrir]

i know i should leave my vote where it is right now but there's something else i want to do with it right now. decisions

Look, I'm killing Ranger today.

You can BoP me later for it if I'm wrong, but I'm not wrong.

that's fine -- i don't even think you're wrong, but i do want to have this day take more than 6 pages

[Cephrir]

i think she's focused pretty hard on the "confusing me with someone else" aspect and while i understand what she's getting at here, it's easier to hide behind this than to take another tack. furthermore, she accuses me of this when i haven't said anything that implied my vote has to do with who she is or isn't. i did make one post about the rightful order of things but that has never been why i was voting where im voting

also, if she wishes me to see her as someone else, then i think i get to hold her to a standard of explaining reads which i would not hold the person i'm confusing her with to, so i would like to see that

I don't wanna get into the multiple people part of this other than to say it has to be NAI, right? and I don't think she's been heavy handed with it, surely ranger feels its important that we know she's not someone you talked with before.

what were you pushing ranger for originally? I see that you're not pushing her for having an overreaction to that 'i wont townread you just for putting things in the right order', when imo she wasn't reacting to a lean or a push, she was reacting to the familiarity in which you were approaching her.

i can be pretty reliably expected to vote anything LLD feels strongly about on page 1, and then i wasn't super thrilled by ranger's decision to decline any sort of discussion with her

[Gimli]

i can be pretty reliably expected to vote anything LLD feels strongly about on page 1, and then i wasn't super thrilled by ranger's decision to decline any sort of discussion with her

with her who, with lld?

[Cephrir]

yes

[Gimli]

but lld isn't saying anything ranger can defend herself from. its 'your scumtells', and ranger is saying pls don't read me on my tells im a different person. there's nothing to work with cause lld isnt engaging with ranger's posts, she's just identifying something ranger does when she is a wolf

[Gimli]

I'd be unwilling to engage with it as well if someone came to me and said 'oh youre doing your wolf thing' with no elaboration

[Cephrir]

she could at least try to ask or interact or case someone else or do something besides crumple up and concede

[Gimli]

I see. she said she's giving reads and I find her emotions genuine although I did townread ranger's emotions in 2019 game despite her being mafia. somehow this looks different and idt ranger strikes me as a resigned wolf.

[Detective Penguin]

she could at least try to ask or interact or case someone else or do something besides crumple up and concede

ceph not reading?

Can’t properly play for another few hours, but decided to sneak some posts in.

Will do precisely that in a few hours.

do better wagonbuddy.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

i know i should leave my vote where it is right now but there's something else i want to do with it right now. decisions

Look, I'm killing Ranger today.

You can BoP me later for it if I'm wrong, but I'm not wrong.

that's fine -- i don't even think you're wrong, but i do want to have this day take more than 6 pages

that's... probably fair. i mean for me i don't want it to slip away when someone starts making arguments like the ones on this page to try and spring Ranger from the trap they are in.

Ranger's goal here is to look as pathetic and dejected as possible while also trying to argue their way out based on meta plural contextuals that don't matter to simultaneously give a feeling of unfairness and engender rebellion against my push.

It's somewhat working.

Partially because I am being unfair. It's not fair I caught them Day 1. It's not fair our system sees right through theirs.

But that's how it is.

[Cephrir]

she could at least try to ask or interact or case someone else or do something besides crumple up and concede

ceph not reading?

Can’t properly play for another few hours, but decided to sneak some posts in.

Will do precisely that in a few hours.

do better wagonbuddy.

1) i was asked about my initial reason, which happened before those posts
2) i will believe this content is forthcoming when it happens and not before

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I see. she said she's giving reads and I find her emotions genuine although I did townread ranger's emotions in 2019 game despite her being mafia. somehow this looks different and idt ranger strikes me as a resigned wolf.

no, she's not resigned. That's the point.

this is the precise emotional result she's aiming to engender in you. You can tell it's planned because of the dissonance between Ranger's self vote and supposed give up mixed with Ranger's constant rebuttal of Ceph and I based on meta plural reasons, indictating she doesn't actually want or think she will die today. Infact, she's giving me vibes feeling confident she will live.

So let's take her at her word, yes? She wants to die, she's giving her reads, they'll be here tomorrow if she's dead and town.

But why would we let someone who votes themselves and wants to die, live?