Newbie 2118 | Terrieresque! - Day 4

[Kowahbunga]

I think if either Jason or Delta flip scum, then the other is town. I don't think their interactions with each other is scum v scum.

Town v Town - possible
Town v Scum - possible
Scum v Scum - possible but I think highly unlikely

Just to show how you've now attempted to create a story out of thin air against me TWICE on page 10.

[Deltabreedy]

How is that any different.

So if you see the wagon on me to your preferred conclusion, when I flip town in that scenario - what do you do next?

[JasonWazza]

I just need to say it again that this narrative was created by Delta.

I feel like this needs to just be put as a signature to all of Delta's posts at this point to be honest.

[Deltabreedy]

Like literally how is that different

So if one of us flips scum, the other is town
But if one of us flips town, the other is town

Would you seriously not let me flipping town impact your read on Jason at all? Because that's just inconsistent. You're trying to paint your methodology as being better but it lacks logical consistency

[MafiaSSK]

@bewolkt - In the group of Jason, Delta, Mafia, Kowah, if you have to pick the scummiest one, who would that be and why?

If I had to vote one of them out right now it would be Mafia. I don't think scum would play the way Jason or Delta are playing and they seem genuinely convinced about their ideas and I don't feel Kowah's opinions are alignment indicative at this point, even if I could see a world where they are using this to excuse themselves and not contribute. But right now it feels honest to me that this is what they think (but I feel it won't help town)

so me just by process of elimination, somehow?

In a way, but honestly I haven't seen anything in your posts that gives me positive town vibes, which I feel it's concerning given how much you post

Can I ask you how do you feel about or what's the motivation behind your vote right now? What do you think Kowah is trying to do here?

mostly just kinda pass on by without suspicion. do the bare minimum

[MafiaSSK]

*snip*

I think if either Jason or Delta flip scum, then the other is town.

*snip*

If they're playing from gut and they want to react off of objective information, why is Kowahbunga planting the seeds for a chain lim in D2?

In fact, why is the assumption being pushed that the limpool today is solely Jason & I?

is it really being pushed? at most this is a false dichotomy, but it's not like this is a major theme of the game

[Kowahbunga]

How is that any different.

So if you see the wagon on me to your preferred conclusion, when I flip town in that scenario - what do you do next?

That's A LOT different than what you're saying. Because you're trying to create a scenario where I think just because one of you is town the other is scum. I NEVER SAID THAT. My specific statement was that I DO NOT THINK YOU'RE BOTH SCUM. If I have openly stated that I find it to be EXTREMELY UNLIKELY that you're both scum, how is that setting up two lims? AT LEAST ONE OF YOU IS TOWN. BOTH OF OF YOU COULD BE TOWN. There is nothing currently going on in the game that makes me think you're both scum.

[Deltabreedy]

A third of the players seem to think it, which is inconsistent with the vibes of the game and the facts of where the votes are.

Ninja'd: Answer the question

[Deltabreedy]

Because at the moment you're operating from a position of certainty that I'm scum, in order for what you're saying to be consistent with your actions.

Why don't you just admit that you're Mafia and that you're sheeping EgoTown?

[Deltabreedy]

Again, if I flip scum (I won't), you'll think Jason is town.

If I flip town, you'll think Jason is town.

Is that correct?

[JasonWazza]

Again, if I flip scum (I won't), you'll think Jason is town.

If I flip town, you'll think Jason is town.

Is that correct?

Doesn't this literally go counter to your theory of chain liming?

[Deltabreedy]

Well it's a question so once they answer I'll get back to you

[Deltabreedy]

If it is correct then I was wrong.

[Deltabreedy]

I get the sense though that I could say that one plus one is two and you'd jump down my throat so I don't think it matters to be honest.

Still waiting on those reads from Mewtaph. Sod it can I also get T3's and SeeEmpty's, for clarity?

[Kowahbunga]

Because at the moment you're operating from a position of certainty that I'm scum, in order for what you're saying to be consistent with your actions.

Why don't you just admit that you're Mafia and that you're sheeping EgoTown?

Bro, you gotta take a step back and quit putting words in my mouth.

AGAIN, ME OPERATING FROM A POSITION OF CERTAINY THAT DELTA IS SCUM IS A NARRATIVE THAT HE HAS CREATED.

I've literally been saying that you can be town from the very beginning of this argument. I don't know how else I can say it anymore.

If Jason is scum. Delta is town.

If Delta is scum. Jason is town.

You both,

HEY

DELTABREEDY

PLEASE PAY EXTRA ATTENTION TO THIS PART PLEASE LIKE READ IT VERY CAREFULLY BECAUSE YOU REALLY NEED TO READ IT

, could be town.

If Jason flips town before I know Delta's alignment, then I am not sure what Delta's alignment is.

If Delta flips town before I know Jason's alignment, then I am not sure what Jason's alignment is.

IF DELTA AGAIN PAINTS A NEW PICTURE OF WHAT I'M SAYING AFTER THIS THEN IT IS TIME TO END D1 WITH THEIR ELIMINATION.

[JasonWazza]

You realize he's still going to literally misinterpret this somehow right?

[Merlyn]

Because at the moment you're operating from a position of certainty that I'm scum, in order for what you're saying to be consistent with your actions.

Why don't you just admit that you're Mafia and that you're sheeping EgoTown?

He absolutely did not say that. He said this:

I think if either Jason or Delta flip scum, then the other is town. I don't think their interactions with each other is scum v scum.

Town v Town - possible
Town v Scum - possible
Scum v Scum - possible but I think highly unlikely

and he was responding to this:

What information would we gain if Delta flips town/scum?

By your definition, would you say we would be also getting the same amount of information if we flip you instead?

It's an answer to a hypothetical question SE was asking

You really are pushing a narrative here. SE, Kowah, and Jason most certainly did not suddenly start talking about 'we have to lim Jason or Delta'.

[Deltabreedy]

*Snip*
I was apologizing for the fact you got a red role pm this game. I can tell it's eating you up inside.

This and the fact that you're voting for me indicate that you have a certain conviction for me being scum. With that being the case, why are you trying to be so loud in saying 'woaaah, he could be town though!'

You're saying I -could- be town, yeah cool - if you're town then there's a 75% chance numerically that I'm town straight up. That's not contributing to gamestate or owt, it's just the facts of how the game works so it's a lot of words that say functionally nothing - because you are voting for me and advocating for an elimination.

That's not a narrative, it's just an objective recalling of events. Trying to depict it as a narrative is disingenuous, and I think this is scum more using AtE than anything tangible to force their point across. I think Kowah is dangerous.

Ninja'd and the first thing I see is Jason being a dick as per. Whatever - see you all tomorrow

[Deltabreedy]

Like Kowah literally says it's a 'fact' that I got a red role pm, but now y'all are letting him get away with saying I 'could' be town?

And I'm the one creating a narrative. Okay

[JasonWazza]

Will say this, anyone who thinks Delta isn't the lim for the day, look at the fact that we just had to waste 1-2 pages on literally trying to argue semantics with him, because he refuses to read the actual things being said.

If you don't believe me, this is what i said.

just because someone's vote

isn't

somewhere doesn't mean they won't be willing to lim them.

This is what i apparently said

'Just because someone's vote is somewhere, doesn't mean they want to lim that person'

And again, i tried to get him to read what i actually said, the post i am quoting, is literally after i told him to actually read what i said, he refused and continued with his bs.

I never said this narrative that he has made up.
Kowah never said the narrative he has made up.

We consistently have to argue with strawmen while dealing with Delta which is an utter waste of time.

Like hell, we literally have to argue with him about NAI stuff constantly, because everything he doesn't like has to be scum.

[Deltabreedy]

I didn't know pages were a limited resource, we should all go back to 12 hours ago when no-one was talking and only post votes from now on...

Thing is, if you want to argue semantics that's your choice. Realistically I think everyones time would be better spent connecting the logicial inconsistencies in what Kowah says but cool feel free to just disregard everything. All I want is a game of mafia where rather than having to be defensive on literally every single point, I can devote energy to looking for Kowah's partner. Currently that's not the case, I have just constantly point out lies and semantics from Jason and again, I'll maintain that they way they've spoken to people absolutely sucks. Kowah is in my mind absolute scum, I've made my case, I'm coming back in 24 hours unless I see something that needs to be responded to in the moment.

Like with what you said Jason, yeah, I misread what you said and then I corrected the base from which I was arguing from accordingly.

The last line is a straight-up lie, that's why Jason is Ego!Town arguing from a base of just wanting to be right instead of actually hunting scum - if this is scumhunting then man, you've had an absolute nightmar, and I can most assuredly say that if you are in fact town - you're in absolutely no position to try and lecture others and say they're 'bad' town with this behaviour and deathtunnelling.

[JasonWazza]

Like with what you said Jason, yeah, I misread what you said and then I corrected the base from which I was arguing from accordingly.

Except your straight up lying, you didn't re-read what i said like i told you, and then posted this

For the record, I think Jason is town with a confbias problem over scum with a deathtunnel gambit, but arguing from semantics and insulting the town is just dragging us down to be honest

This isn't you correcting the base, you just refused to actually read what i said and continue on with your day, which you have done this whole thread.

[Deltabreedy]

Tunnel goes brr

[Deltabreedy]

Come at me with fiction, I'll respond with the level of respect the accusation deserves.

[Merlyn]

Like Kowah literally says it's a 'fact' that I got a red role pm, but now y'all are letting him get away with saying I 'could' be town?

And I'm the one creating a narrative. Okay

Yes, you are- the thing you are creating as a narrative was that kowah was chaining lims. I explained, using direct quotes, why that wasn't the case, and you've somehow twisted that into saying the player voting for you is trying to be wishy washy with their opinions. There is so much dancing and dodiging here, delta, and it doesn't read like a town response to me.

UNVOTE: Mewtaph
VOTE: Deltabreedy