Mini Normal 2294: Monkey Business (Endgame)

[Ausuka]

Ligma nutzzzzzzz haha gottem

You're lucky i'm not a minor anymore

[Klick]

Why do you actually think Comus is scum Mena

[Gimli]

klick whenever you can explain your progression from locktowning mena to thinking he is scum id appreciate it

i'm out for the day imma literally go watch john wick with the lady

but im here before end of gameday for sure

[Klick]

I am doing evening with the kids and then tonight I intend to devote a good amount of time to this game

[Klick]

Tl;dr I thought I had a good read of Mena solving that looked like a really sensible town progression, but after the Elsa town flip I felt like I was wrong somewhere and decided what Mena had posted thus far felt like it could plausibly be faked. But now I'm in a rather murky unsure state about him

[Klick]

At the moment I'm spending bits of spare time this evening looking at past games of geraintm and Ausuka and trying to develop patterns of behaviour because getting better reads on some of the players I know less well feels like the most reliable way of getting a more accurate solve in this game

[Klick]

Right now I'm reading this game for those following along at home

viewtopic.php?t=89682

[Klick]

So far my vague impression is that gera is a lot scummier in that game than in this one and in particular is a lot more self-focussed in the late game

But I want more confident conclusions than thay

[geraintm]

Right now I'm reading this game for those following along at home

viewtopic.php?t=89682

Did I win that one?

[geraintm]

I have hardly any memory kf that game, but looking at the night actions it is one of thr games where I was let go for way too long and in subsequent games I begged to be checked early because I think I am hard to read, but that didn't go Down well with people so I stopped that too

[geraintm]

So far my vague impression is that gera is a lot scummier in that game than in this one and in particular is a lot more self-focussed in the late game

But I want more confident conclusions than thay

I think I am very obvious as scum

[Klick]

What are the main differences that you notice yourself between your town and scum play?

[Klick]

Like if you were to legitimately analyse the way you think and post when you're town vs when you're scum, what would the takeaways be?

[geraintm]

I am really panicky as scum, if you ever read my scum threads I feel I veer wildly from up to down. I think my votes are really bad as scum too, much worse than town which just come from me being a bad player.

As town, I occasionally just get awesome reads on some players, usually from conflict

[Klick]

Is there anything intrinsically different about how you approach a town game vs a scum game? I've got a decent idea of what you think when you're scum now, but what are your general goals when posting as town?

[geraintm]

Just be as useful as I can be to town, make the best reads I can with what info I have. Know my weaknesses and don't overstep them. I mostly know what are bad.ideas and say, rather than having good ones

[Klick]

So far my vague impression is that gera is a lot scummier in that game than in this one and in particular is a lot more self-focussed in the late game

But I want more confident conclusions than thay

I think I am very obvious as scum

I find it to be a red flag that you also said exactly this in the game I linked

You say that you feel like you're obvious when you're scum. Do you think that means there are obvious differences between your posting when you're scum and your posting when you're town?

That's what I'm trying to get at here. Help me see what you see. If you're obvious scum when you're scum, help show that you're not doing the things you always do when you're scum. Don't worry so much about how what you're saying

sounds

- just give me an honest contrast between what you're doing here and what you do that's so obvious in your scum games.

[Menalque]

I really want to hammer for that

Tbf it’s how I always wanted to go

Ligma nutzzzzzzz haha gottem

You're lucky i'm not a minor anymore

I nearly didn’t then remembered you were in uni and figured I was in the clear

[Menalque]

I am legit almost sad that klick didn’t hammer me there because I’ve never won post of the year before but I think that sequence of events would’ve been a shoe in

[Menalque]

Why do you actually think Comus is scum Mena

The very, very cliff notes — the way he changed off from me being locktown with ausuka to me being scum when gimli started pushing me felt really forced and I don’t believe it for an instant, I also don’t believe his PR claim and think his positing of a world of (mena, sky, enchant) as the team is completely ridiculous because in that case setup balance has basically been taken out behind the wood shed, shot in the back of the head, and buried in a shallow grave

[Comus]

[Menalque]

How do we feel about me adding a Cato-the-Elder-style “Comus necandae est” to the end of all my posts?

Comus necandae est!

[Klick]

Why do you actually think Comus is scum Mena

The very, very cliff notes — the way he changed off from me being locktown with ausuka to me being scum when gimli started pushing me felt really forced and I don’t believe it for an instant, I also don’t believe his PR claim and think his positing of a world of (mena, sky, enchant) as the team is completely ridiculous because in that case setup balance has basically been taken out behind the wood shed, shot in the back of the head, and buried in a shallow grave

So he had a forced change of read on you (fwiw he did the exact same thing to me a couple of times this game day), he is potentially fakeclaiming (I agree that the claim is most likely completely unreliable), and he has a full solve that's bad mechanics-wise (he has also been doing this full-solve thing basically all game)

I get that all of those behaviours are not very pro-town but I also fail to see how it follows that it means he has a red Role PM

[implosion]

Vote Count 3.8

Menalque (4): geraintm, Comus, KawaiiKame, Enchant
KawaiiKame (3): Ausuka, Menalque, Gimli
Enchant (1): Skygazer

Not Voting (1): Klick

With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to eliminate.

Deadline is April 4 at 3:00 PM PST, in (expired on 2023-04-04 18:00:00).

[Menalque]

Why do you actually think Comus is scum Mena

The very, very cliff notes — the way he changed off from me being locktown with ausuka to me being scum when gimli started pushing me felt really forced and I don’t believe it for an instant, I also don’t believe his PR claim and think his positing of a world of (mena, sky, enchant) as the team is completely ridiculous because in that case setup balance has basically been taken out behind the wood shed, shot in the back of the head, and buried in a shallow grave

So he had a forced change of read on you (fwiw he did the exact same thing to me a couple of times this game day), he is potentially fakeclaiming (I agree that the claim is most likely completely unreliable), and he has a full solve that's bad mechanics-wise (he has also been doing this full-solve thing basically all game)

I get that all of those behaviours are not very pro-town but I also fail to see how it follows that it means he has a red Role PM

Uh actually the fake claiming thing is irrelevant it’s the other two things, but the second especially in the context of the first

I think having a big shift in reads doesn’t mean scum, but when it’s (1) forced (bad sign, as I don’t think town often have to force it they just realise it and change) and (2) providing justifications that make little/no sense (e.g. I’m on a team with sky and enchant) then actually yes, those things do tend to mean a red role pm

And in the broader context I still think that kawaii is, on balance, more likely to be scum than town and here I have the additional info that comus’ change in direction was towards pushing town and away from limming what is probable scum

So taking the forced nature of the shift alongside the objectives of said shift, yes, I think it all adds up to making comus very likely scum

Outside of that, just the way he has interacted with me since then (including cheekily admitting that I’d caught him) all feels like interacting with scum but I can see how that’s entirely subjective and unlikely to convince anyone not already locktowning me and who trusts my reads (which in this game is no one but I mention it as it feeds into why comus is the slot I’m most confident on atp)