TM 2023 | Masterchef MafiaScum (Game over)

[furtiveglance]

i really have no desire to talk to you

i hate you as a person

This isn't warranted

[furtiveglance]

Anyway more votes on Dessew?

[lilith2013]

V OTECOUNT 1.016
S HELF:
E LIMINATION V OTES
P LAYER N AME	C URRENT V OTES
Aristeia (2)	Korina, Doctor Drew
Aureal (1)	NorwegianboyEE
biancospino (0)	None
Dessew (2)	furtiveglance, biancospino
Doctor Drew (3)	McMenno, Aureal, Aristeia
furtiveglance (0)	None
Korina (0)	None
McMenno (1)	Dessew
NorwegianboyEE (0)	None
NOT VOTING: None
With 9 alive, it takes 5 votes to eliminate. Deadline: (expired on 2023-04-25 18:20:00)
Notes: pagetops: Aristeia 6 | Lilith 4 | Norwegianboy 3 | McMenno 1 | Aureal 1 | Dr Drew 1 | furtive 1

[Aureal]

VOTE: Aureal
Yeah they look really bad here. I think this could be a TvT fight they were trying to encourage.

Bruh, you have the same reaction to it in your previous posts, that it's weird and unnecessary, then go on to smear me for it? I think

you're

kinda slimy. This is the opposite of not dwelling on it, you're forcing me to react. And how would my remark encourage the situation? I fell it'd be the other way around.

[Aureal]

Anyway more votes on Dessew?

Hard as it is to believe, given the badness content of them, Dessew only has six posts. Are we really moving towards an elimination there at this point?

[furtiveglance]

Anyway more votes on Dessew?

Hard as it is to believe, given the badness content of them, Dessew only has six posts. Are we really moving towards an elimination there at this point?

I am, yeah

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: Aureal
Yeah they look really bad here. I think this could be a TvT fight they were trying to encourage.

Bruh, you have the same reaction to it in your previous posts, that it's weird and unnecessary, then go on to smear me for it? I think

you're

kinda slimy. This is the opposite of not dwelling on it, you're forcing me to react. And how would my remark encourage the situation? I fell it'd be the other way around.

I’m focusing on what i believe to be alignment indicative content from you specifically.
And yes, it makes me happy you feel forced to react. That’s exactly what i’m looking for. Please go into more detail on how my push on you makes you feel.

[Dessew]

I'm fine with eliminating Menno, furtive or Aureal at this point. My townreads are the same.

I've recently had a game where Drew replced in, he's a chill, active player. Let's see what he does.

By "at this point" do you literally mean you would want any of those people hammered right now, halfway though the deadline? You also seem to be mostly focusing low activity slots, and I hardly see anyone ever thinking that's a good idea for day one if they can help it.

I don't think anyone on this site uses that expression like that, but if you do, you should put it in your signature.

Secondly, one of my three top scumreads are low activity, Menno. The other two are you, Aureal, and furtive, who's been very active on the voting front.

In fact, it seems like he didn't really know what to do with his votes until someone suggested it'd be fine to eliminate him. Nervous mafia who tries to place a not conspicuous vote on a town enough wagon, but doesn't succeed, that's what it looks like to me.

The Ari vs Drew seems like ToT violence, unfortunately, but if not, the Ari slot is still likely town. For what it's worth, Drew was mafia in the game we played, and he was more agreeable there.

My "defence" of Drew when he replaced in was in reaction to Menno's push to eliminate the slot just as a new player was about to take over.

VOTE: furtive

[lilith2013]

Morning Tweet replaces Aristeia on Frog Friends.

[Morning Tweet]

[McMenno]

i really have no desire to talk to you

i hate you as a person

Yesh, I don't believe this is ever tilted scum. I don't see scum getting angry when pushed, regardless of the reasons, at most frustrated.

If Ari is scum this is deliberate AtE

not really scumreading the slot but like... come on. scum definitely gets angry when pushed

Secondly, one of my three top scumreads are low activity, Menno. The other two are you, Aureal, and furtive, who's been very active on the voting front

I have about a million times the activity of you so you can fuck off with that

also welcome morning tweet

[Morning Tweet]

starting from the top:

Biancospino pings lightly town on the first page.

Korina comes across as town to me but its more about the feel of their posts than the content. It’s not because Korina suggest hiding ingredients that i find towny, it’s more like im townleaning Korina’s immediate approach….? I think Korina might play different at the beginning at scum. It’s the tone of 53 and 55 i like. Pointing out that we shouldnt talk about our ingredients would be easy as either alignment, probably, because this is the first both alignmments are ever hearing about food kill mechanics.

Bianco still pings lightly town engaging to Norwe

Norwe’s attempt to read into Korina seems real

89 by Norwe - I get that angle but i dont think Korina makes the mech sound more elaborate than it is by intention

Page 5, Korina says the Dessew wagon built up too quickly. I guess. Ari and Korina voted then Norwe/furtive both voted for added pressure. That is a bit quick

@Furtive, what is so outdated about the meta Norwe is mentioning? They just said you have a lot of drive as town that hasn’t come yet. Or do you not have an overabundance of *drive* and *direction*. Basically my point is, why is your response that the meta is dated, rather than that you do have drive the game just hasn’t started yet, which I think would probably be more fair. Like how is you putting effort in dated?

That being said furtive having the one townread and that response to McMenno pings slightly town to me

I’m not sure what McMenno’s game here is. What are you trying to get at?

Aureal - 131. Do not feel pressured to be an active presence in the other Team Mafia games. At least not yet. First and foremost be a force in your own game, IMO. After you’re established you can start playing a secondary role in other games

Regarding McMenno/furtive. McMenno you can’t seriously be telling furtive “Shouldn’t you be able to read me as town here since we were scum in another game”. You can’t be that obvious as scum. Makes no sense

143 by Korina - “I don’t think Dessew reaches E-1 without scum interference”: Uhm, no. There are 7 town 2 scum and two of those votes came at around the same time since furtive or whoever immediately unvoted. This feels arbitrary and wrong

Norwe’s got me convinced he’s town for the day with the comment about bianco possibly white knighting McMenno if mcmenno’s town

Ari describes McMenno’s play as townie entitlement the same as Norwe, Maybe.

I agree with Ari that Korina coming from a place of “Dessew wagon must have a scum on it” WE DONT EVEN KNOW DESSEW’S ALIGNMENT. It’s a terrible starting point to see 4 votes and go “must have a mafia in there”. Unless I guess, you overtly townread Dessew but Korina hasnt mentioned that

I generally agree with what Ari is saying about Korina although I don’t know if Korina would make an argument from essentially probability as town

169 by Korina - You think that furtive deliberately put Dessew on E-1 just to immediately put him back to E-2? But why are you finding this inherently sus?

170 Korina You should not be firmly standing by that there is one scum in a pool of 4 players voting for 1 particular player that was chosen randomly in RVS

Datisi has informed me that he believes Korina to be town

VOTE: Dessew

So I think the important mech thing is that we should just avoid talking about recipes in general. Like, at no point ever should

anyone

claim their recipe, or what ingredients they have. Simply because there's no NK for scum. The only kills happen if you have all your ingredients at the end of the night, or elim during the day, and kills are replaced by redistribution where the ingredients are able to be moved to/from players, so all we'd do by posting what we have and what our recipe is, is just telling the scum

how

to kill you.

Well I think that's just common sense.

I looked up my recipe and the ingredients needed to kill me are present in the game, which makes me think that Lilith just went through a bunch of foods and went "How do you make these" and took the ingredients in the list, and that's how to kill me. I think that's going to be true for everyone too - I don't think we're going to have someone have a recipe and need an ingredient that makes

zero

sense to make that food IRL as a part of the kill.

Uh... was anyone actually considering the idea that the needed ingredients would

not

be present in the game? i.e. that someone would be immune to nightkills?

Or that the recipes wouldn't make sense (make pepperoni pizza with shrimp and water?) but that would probably just be a reason to stare at lilith and not ever let her cook for you rather than gameplay-effecting...

VOTE: Korina

VOTE: Dessew

VOTE: Dessew

Building a wagon
Slaying a dragon

It an RVS wagon you can’t make a conclusion like 1 scum in here especially before Dessew is even known. I sound like a broken record

@Bianco
They’ve not said it was a joke so why would i believe it was?
And it’s hilarious how you seem to claim that it’s scum indicative for me to react negatively to shading. As if that’s not something i take up to 11 in literally every single one of my towngames in history.

Here's a hot take, if someone claims they've solved the game by page 5 with a one-liner, no reasonable person would believe it's serious unless there were some explicit indications of it or if they were on eggshells

No that’s BS. I’ve solved a newbie game in page 5 by calling out both scum. You can flush this take down the toilet.

I’m more agreeing with Bianco here.

yes, I'm here now. who's scum? is it VOTE: norwee?

No, are you reading?

found the scumteam, pack it up

This is probably a 15% on the serious-o-meter. I think it was reasonably clear the post had hints of serious but could not have been something town!McMenno is sure of in any capacity

I’m pretty sure Norwe is wrong town the way he’s reacting to Ari. Ari’s takes were Korina are fire and you’re wrong but that’s okay

I think Norwe trying to teamsolve Ari with bianco seeeems townie. he’s probably town

Fun fact. Ari’s only mention of Bianco at all so far is the opening "hi Bianco"

is this supposed to be some kind of gotcha at page 8 in a micro where nothing has really happened?

It comes across to me like a “I called it” kind of post which is more townie. Like something you can say “Ha i got the scumteam on page [#]”

I like how everyone ignored my Bianco read. Ferls good.

why is me ignoring your unconvincing case an issue if p much everyone did?

Yeah this pretty much sums up Norwe’s bianco/Ari thing. Connections where there aren’t any but it reminds me of town

198 by furtive - You scumread every slot except Norwe/Aureal?

203 - Dessew: “Kuribo knows Aureal is mafia” This sounds like it will be important

207 - I assumed that Aureal and Kurbio knew each other. This pop in is really cold though. Weird that Aureal hasnt found anything to comment on

208 - No, McMenno, no one does your posting quite like you

210 by furtive - LOL

Korina sounds like they might be genuinely convinced by their furtive reasoning that I do not agree with

Kori says they’re ready to end D1 on Ari/furtive, wtf?

Kori is convinced Ari is scum? Why? Furtive already gone over.

Kori’s thought process, like everything to do with the Dessew wagon reasoning makes no sense to me. But they might believe it. I’m not really sure.

Kori does act like they’ve never played a game where an E-1 happened immediately. For example, it happens all the time in newbie games. If you have you will know that the entire wagon can be town with ease especially when, you dont know Dessew’s alignment

242 - It’s not a statistical wonder lol. Korina is so sure of this

244 - I think you can use wagonomics just not like this

Skipping the bit where Ari starts to get tilted at Kori’s reasoning, but fair enough

274 - All of Aureal’s pop ins seem to involve her replying to other ppl about their read of her. Does Aureal have her own version of the game in her mind, though?
275 - Literally this, though. I agree with you there.

284 - This is one of The Moments of All Time

Still leaning a bit on bianoc town

Btw furtive, you didn't answer my question.

Is

there a difference between shady and sus?

Shady is more annoying but not necessarily sus I guess

So you weren't actually scumreading everyone except Norwe and I. Your list is kind of misleading then!

So, wanna talk about your vote? Did Gimli make you do it? :lol:

I’m not sure that is misleading?

the audacity of replacing out of the smallest game only to then try to replace into the event again

not to mention that is shady as hell

VOTE: Doctor Drew

Nah, it's just Kawaii. Wanna hear about the time they got 40 pages into a game without even understanding a basic game mechanic? Or the time they outed their mason team in a newbie game (a known setup) to avoid having the cop that couldn't possibly exist counterclaim them? Or the time- well I should stop there.

My point was, hi Drew! Nice to see you even though it probably means I'm doomed!

Your comment about Kawaii is probably a little townie since that’s a distraction you could be using but you instead correctly point out that Kawaii’s rep out has nothing to do with alignment

Lol I like Aureals interaction with Drew it seemed fairly careless. As in, not nervous.

315 by Dessew - I think McMenno attacking Kawaii/Drew could be scum (if Kawaii/Drew isnt scum of course). Aureal is generally a little underwhelming but has been getting better for me. The only cases for furtive I’ve seen involve the E-1 vote

319 - Furtive calls that post by Dessew scum content, I dont know maybe its possible
320 by furtive - Isn’t it a little early to do pre-flip associatives, what causes you to do this for Dessew here? @ furtive

322 by Aureal -
I get the reasoning behind voting Kori for pointing out the mech which would be obvious to some. But I don’t find it suspicious because mech is not nearly as obvious to some ppl as it is to others (I’m mech illiterate). I don’t think this was a bad vote back in 62.

That being said your characterization of Norwe’s reasoning (“Why is voting for someone you find scummy a bad vote?”) feels like an over-simplification. You should be thinking, “Why does Norwe think this vote was bad?”. You of course don’t have to agree that it was bad you just have to think abt why it could be.

top of page 14, Aureal. Aureal is maybe trying to expand the elimination pool from herself to include Dessew or furtive. But furtive doesn’t have any votes so maybe I’m mischaracterizing this. It looks like Aureal might be targeting players that other players are targeting intentionally.

(But I’m not sure of that)

330 by bianco - I disagree with you. I want flips. Flips are knowledge and knowledge makes the game a much easier solve. Some slots I’d be okay with flipping include the late Kawaii (at the time. I havent read Drew’s posts yet) and McMenno. This is because I dont think I can read these two slots without flipping them.

Even if I were placed in a hyperbolic time chamber with McMenno for eternity I dont think I’d be able to ascertain their alignment without something additional to go off of. And Kawaii was gone.

Your vote is based on the premise that flipping slots (“at this point”) is not something town would want to do, but that’s not true. At this point in my read, I would flip those two. The other six I think I can read off of the flips and the posts. Also just an example. I probably will change on Kawaii at least.


361 by Aureal - @Aureal you have not one townread? Townreads are so easy to make, though


Drew/Ari, skip. Aureals pop ins I will miss sadly.


418 by Norwe says Aureal might have been encouraging the TvT fight – I guess I have to read them then

like are you trying to get Dessew eliminated? is your scumread there real this time? I don't really understand your motivations this game.

Are you gonna answer this one, Drew? It does seem like you're being pretty cagey about your reads - we can't tell if you even have them, let alone what they are!

Like, I kinda want to townread Ari for making good points about Drew. But I'm also terrified of her attitude mismatch between this game and the micro we played before. I might need to try digging into her meta, see if she gets upset easily as scum. Like I have time to do that. x_x

Yes it does seem like Aureal is avoiding giving out a townread like the damn plague. It’s making it difficult to believe when she’s constantly suspecting every other player

422 by Norwe - Yes, exactly that.

VOTE: Aureal
Yeah they look really bad here. I think this could be a TvT fight they were trying to encourage.

Bruh, you have the same reaction to it in your previous posts, that it's weird and unnecessary, then go on to smear me for it? I think

you're

kinda slimy. This is the opposite of not dwelling on it, you're forcing me to react. And how would my remark encourage the situation? I fell it'd be the other way around.

Is there anyone in this game you don’t find slimy?

[Morning Tweet]

Here's where im at, the explanations are sparse but i've generally got everyone where I feel they belong

probably town

NorwegianboyEE (Perfectly Balanced)

slight town

McMenno (We Don’t Mafia) - I said in my post I couldnt read McMenno even with infinite time but actually I buy into entitled townie theory, when you’re town you can say things like 133 and generally have a “Can’t you tell I’m town” mindset.

very slight town

furtiveglance (Shadow Syndicate) - Whenever anyone goes under any pressure they start attacking furtive this happens too often for me not to believe scum hasn't done it at least once. This is very stretchy reasoning I know but am still curious if anyone else thinks this. A very tentative gamestate level read, i think furtive could probably still be scum it just seems less likely to me

Korina (Studies Show) - Korina has a thought process to their posts, i think they've been wrong (see: Ari/furtive scumreads) but I don't think it's quite what I expect as scum behaviour. I think more likely Korina believes what they're saying -- for example, Korina actually thinks a wagon going to E-1 early is a statistical anomaly. This fallacious assumption could make you think that furtive or Ari have to flip, sure. What I'm saying is im buying what Korina's selling here so far

biancospino (Pork Eaters) - I get townpings from some posts but their votes (furtive, norwe, and i dont like your reasoning for voting Desew) i do not agree with

null

Dessew (Ghosts of NKs) - I dont have a lot of opinion
Doctor Drew [KawaiiKame] (Whimsical Activities) - Waiting for more

i suspect a little

Aureal (Good in Plaid) - I've outlined why I find you a bit suspicious. My question to you is this: Why do you have no townreads, and why do your scumreads seem to change to whoever is suspecting you / being suspected? You don't have a consistent "This is who I think is scum" -- my evidence for this is that you've suspected most every slot and it usually feels reactionary

The first question is something you said yourself that I'm curious to know more about. The second is a bit of a loaded question on my part, you dont have to answer that.

[Morning Tweet]

VOTE: Aureal

[Morning Tweet]

I'm a bit behind with my reading, but kuribo knows for a fact that Aureal is mafia.

I forgot about this post. Would be before Aureal had any votes. A little weird of an approach for partners.

I'm fine with eliminating Menno, furtive or Aureal at this point. My townreads are the same.

I've recently had a game where Drew replced in, he's a chill, active player. Let's see what he does.

I don't think there is anything wrong with saying "I'm fine with eliminating (players). That's a normal thing to say

I'm fine with eliminating Menno, furtive or Aureal at this point. My townreads are the same.

I've recently had a game where Drew replced in, he's a chill, active player. Let's see what he does.

By "at this point" do you literally mean you would want any of those people hammered right now, halfway though the deadline? You also seem to be mostly focusing low activity slots, and I hardly see anyone ever thinking that's a good idea for day one if they can help it.

I don't think anyone on this site uses that expression like that, but if you do, you should put it in your signature.

Secondly, one of my three top scumreads are low activity, Menno. The other two are you, Aureal, and furtive, who's been very active on the voting front.

In fact, it seems like he didn't really know what to do with his votes until someone suggested it'd be fine to eliminate him. Nervous mafia who tries to place a not conspicuous vote on a town enough wagon, but doesn't succeed, that's what it looks like to me.

The Ari vs Drew seems like ToT violence, unfortunately, but if not, the Ari slot is still likely town. For what it's worth, Drew was mafia in the game we played, and he was more agreeable there.

My "defence" of Drew when he replaced in was in reaction to Menno's push to eliminate the slot just as a new player was about to take over.

VOTE: furtive

I think Dessew's play is pretty safe in that they're not really rocking the boat with any of these scumreads. Plus calling Ari/Drew TvT is safest

So they could be scum in that they're safe. But I dont really object to anything thats been said plus I agree with the "defence" of Drew (as in, what Kawaii did wasnt AI, let's watch Drew and make a conclusion from there).

[Morning Tweet]

Drew do you have a reads list or thoughts or sumthing?

Starting to form a bit, hoping for a bit more activity.

Dessew's post basically welcoming me was weird and felt unnecessary, pinged me a bit scummy. Ironically Furt thinks they are scum though, and Furt seems more engaged here then I have really seen him, and he has always been town with me, so that pings me as well.

McMenno is probably town, despite the aggression(or even because of it) towards my slot.

Will need to skim through the thread to tighten reads on the rest though.

Oh, but Aureal is totally scum for real.

How much of this is still accurate? Mostly just wondering where you're at now particularly with Aureal McMenno and Dessew.

I am also having a gut scum read on Bianco, I don't know if I wanna push it further, but just want it out there ftr.

I also don't like how they are so obsessed with the VC, yes someone was put at E-1 in RVS, but that shit happens sometimes.

I mean I am at E-3 as well, that isn't close to be elim'ed, but you didn't point that out.

Was bianco obsessed with the early E-1? I mostly associated that with Korina. I felt like that was a distraction whenever it was given more weight than "RVS wagon".

[NorwegianboyEE]

Holy mother of text. Hello MT.

[Morning Tweet]

Hi Norwe!

[Doctor Drew]

Morning Tweet replaces Aristeia on Frog Friends.

This is a fair trade.

I will offer my apologies to everyone here for what transpired last night, but I am still confused how it got to where it was.

Anywho, will be back a little bit later.

[furtiveglance]

@Furtive, what is so outdated about the meta Norwe is mentioning? They just said you have a lot of drive as town that hasn’t come yet. Or do you not have an overabundance of *drive* and *direction*. Basically my point is, why is your response that the meta is dated, rather than that you do have drive the game just hasn’t started yet, which I think would probably be more fair. Like how is you putting effort in dated?

I've lost some of the drive I used to have recently, that was the point I was making.

[furtiveglance]

320 by furtive - Isn’t it a little early to do pre-flip associatives, what causes you to do this for Dessew here? @ furtive

I wanted to sweeten the deal to get more voters on Dessew, with the promise of information

[Korina]

UNVOTE:

I don’t know who I’m voting for but I’m reconsidering my stance on the Ari/MT slot

[Korina]

On gut instinct alone I don’t think scum!mt posts a wall like that, but that’s coming from literally seeing MT play in the game I modded, where MT was a mentor. Radically different roles than what we’d see in TM, but I think that’d be consistent between cult and normal groupscum

[Korina]

Not to mention teammates thinking MT/Ari is town and I’m slowly losing my conviction on it when rest of team are saying town

[furtiveglance]

Not to mention teammates thinking MT/Ari is town and I’m slowly losing my conviction on it when rest of team are saying town

Cmon let it gooo

Just let it beee