large normal 243: lindOVER

[Skygazer]

CKD wrung their hands so much doing all this performative bs about how they really didn't want to vote for her, but if things came to it he would, etc. etc. It's really hard to interpret how that could come from a townie -- they was desperately trying to cover their ass after what they knew was going to be a town flip.

have you ever heard of a compromise vote

It's not that it was a compromise vote. It was that CKD just repeadetly kept saying that they were Very Unhappy about the Andante wagon. It's not like they made serious attempts to push another wagon either -- they just slipped onto it at the end and spent a lot of the late day talking about how scummy the wagon was. The simpliest explanation for their pattern of behavior is that they're scum who knew Andante was going to flip town and wanted to line up mislims on the Andante wagon without themselves looking scummy for jumping on it.

i think if scum is trying to get cred for hyping up their town read on an imminent miselim then they don't burn that cred by voting for them anyways lol

and i think that the andante elim was looking inevitable so i dont see the point in scum-ckd voting there if they're trying to get town-cred for being off the mis-elim. wouldn't they just continue not voting there and let someone else do the dirty work of hammering?

[Skygazer]

bub i know you called me VI (and i'm not arguing that i'm not an idiot) but i know you know i can sometimes have good reads after that lovers game

i think you should drop ckd for now or at least spend time exploring other avenues

[Skygazer]

if that furtive thought on it being ckd/bub scum theater im going to be really kicking myself

[Skygazer]

if that furtive thought on it being ckd/bub scum theater im going to be really kicking myself

*being ckd/bub scum theater is true

[sheepsaysmeep]

this game is too difficult I shouldve stuck with fort nite

[furtiveglance]

this game is too difficult I shouldve stuck with fort nite

I haven't had a victory royale in a fat minute

[Skygazer]

i miss fortnite but i got tired of being demolished by 8 year olds

[MalcolmTucker]

Man you're just immediate super defensiveness towards any kind of pressure is so goddamn scummy.

scum love to lean on "being defensive is scummy" as part of a case, because they usually dont have anything. Someone says something they cant answer..."oh you are super defensive". lame just lame.

1.) explain the theory of why a scum would be more defensive than a townie. It is easy to just say it, but explain it.
2.) what is your definition of "defensive". I saw someone say something that is either not true or hypocritical I call it out.

See, it's asking these random, toothless and distracting questions is exactly the sort of thing that makes me read you as scum. They accomplish, far, far less than they appear to. Everything you've asked I can answer, but my answers are honestly irrelevant.

Being overly defensive is super scummy because the scum's motivation is much more strongly tied to their ability to survive. Townie motivation is to scumhunt and not be overly bothered by people on their wagon.

The knee-jerk reaction to immediately attack and discredit ones attacker even if they aren't scummy is patently scum-motivated behavior. That's what you're doing -- the only reason you've ever thought of me as scummy at all is the fact that I've caught you. Your actions aren't defensible from a town POV so you're attacking your attacker.

You're presuming all town approach the game in what you perceive to be a calm-headed, logical and rational way. In almost every game I've played I have seen town players become overly defensive to the point where it's frustrating because they don't like being suspected, knowing they're town, and don't cope well with pressure either way. It's remarkably common...we saw it with Andante last turn!

I'd argue it's only really useful if it's indicative of a player approaching the game in a different way to how they normally do from a meta POV. But some players are just naturally defensive, and if anything scum want to appear more reasonable because it can help earn them town points sometimes.

[MalcolmTucker]

CKD wrung their hands so much doing all this performative bs about how they really didn't want to vote for her, but if things came to it he would, etc. etc. It's really hard to interpret how that could come from a townie -- they was desperately trying to cover their ass after what they knew was going to be a town flip.

That combined with consistent scummy play throughout the game that has bizarrely gone over-looked.

Their soft-PR claim was literally the single scummiest possible reaction to getting wagoned and everyone just let it go for some reason? Also, at no point in this game have they seriously pushed anybody who wasn't attacking him. All of their "scumhunting" is performative and basically only in the service of relieving pressure on himself. Like they just started dumping wallpost after wallpost casing me which only came about after I came out firing against them today. If they were actually trying to catch scum you'd expect something like that more regularly on other suspects. I guarantee you CKD wouldn't be pushing me at all if I wasn't pushing them.

This is just patently untrue given CKD was the leading wagon early in D1 until they claimed. Like...the slot was perceived as being so scummy that they had to claim to avoid being limmed.

I sort of feel you're taking a general tone of scumminess to CKD's play and using it to fit your wider case without actually thinking about whether CKD is likely to be scum on the basis of the actual gameplay we've seen so far...i.e., eliminations, votes, claims and so on.

As I mentioned above plenty of players consistently look scummy, I can be noncommittal and tend to end up on the scum radars of a lot of players at some point in most games, some players just have playstyles which make them look scummy. That alone does not make them scum, because the job of good scum is to look like town.

I also don't think it's true CKD hasn't pushed anyone not suspecting them, like they're focused on you at the moment, but a look through their ISO shows votes and suspicions going elsewhere previously.

I just don't like this case at all. It feels like a classic scum approach...instead of actually assessing who's probably scum on the basis of what's happened so far you're just trying to look for someone whose tone strikes you as scummy because it's easier to make a case that doesn't need to be true or genuine.

[MalcolmTucker]

CKD's claim looked pretty townie to me...like it was messy and not the best way to necessarily go about it, but the reluctance to give more info feels as if it would need to be a pretty bold gambit to come from scum, because I feel as if scum typically want to seem confident and assured when they make a false claim. A partial claim that's also a lie is a big risk for scum, because if they get caught out for it and it comes down to a 1v1 they're almost certainly not going to be believed. Whereas confident scum can sometimes bluff their way through.

[Bub Bidderskins]

@Malcom

I think it's possible that I'm tunnelling the point of pushing myself to confirmation bias, but I still feel like CKD's behavior is consistently scummy in ways that go beyond what you've mentioned.

I'm not presuming that townies are always "calm-headed and rational," if anything CKD has been more or less calm-headed and has tried to exhude a presence of rationality. It's about the motivation behind their actions. I don't read any of their pushes as that significant -- their "pushes" are actually fairly toothless...except on people directly pushing them. They never seriously pushed people but slipped on to wagons when it was convenient.

Again, it's possible I'm just too deep in the tank at this point, but I just don't see how any of CKD's behavior is anything other than super scummy. IMHO every reaction they've had to any kind of pressure has only been scummier and scummier. Literally everyone else in the game is like half as likely to be scum as CKD IMHO.

[Bub Bidderskins]

This is just patently untrue given CKD was the leading wagon early in D1 until they claimed. Like...the slot was perceived as being so scummy that they had to claim to avoid being limmed.

This is a mis-representation of the game state. I believe the CKD wagon was the first serious wagon of the entire game, but I don't think it got all that close to an elimination, like maybe E-4? I read the claim as panicked and premature.

[curiouskarmadog]

This is just patently untrue given CKD was the leading wagon early in D1 until they claimed. Like...the slot was perceived as being so scummy that they had to claim to avoid being limmed.

This is a mis-representation of the game state. I believe the CKD wagon was the first serious wagon of the entire game, but I don't think it got all that close to an elimination, like maybe E-4? I read the claim as panicked and premature.

wow what a stretch here. another example how you dont have a case, but you NEEEEED something.

you want to put out there I panicked at E-4? really?!? laughable. I WAS LEAVING FOR SEVERAL DAYS. I wanted to get it out there. there is no way you believe this.

[curiouskarmadog]

@Malcom

I think it's possible that I'm tunnelling the point of pushing myself to confirmation bias, but I still feel like CKD's behavior is consistently scummy in ways that go beyond what you've mentioned.

I'm not presuming that townies are always "calm-headed and rational," if anything CKD has been more or less calm-headed and has tried to exhude a presence of rationality.

It's about the motivation behind their actions. I don't read any of their pushes as that significant -- their "pushes" are actually fairly toothless...except on people directly pushing them. They never seriously pushed people but slipped on to wagons when it was convenient.

Again, it's possible I'm just too deep in the tank at this point, but I just don't see how any of CKD's behavior is anything other than super scummy.

IMHO every reaction they've had to any kind of pressure has only been scummier and scummier.

Literally everyone else in the game is like half as likely to be scum as CKD IMHO.

there is no way you believe the bolded. there is just no way.

[Save The Dragons]

Bub and ckd

What are your thoughts on other slots in the game

[curiouskarmadog]

I don't think pushing the person pushing you is intrinsically scummy if you think they're scum,

but it seems like CKD only does "scumhunting" when it has the benefit of getting someone off their back

.

That's what being "defensive" in a scummy way looks like -- there's no legitimate scumhunting, only defense.

another post, that is just a complete lie. You cant read my ISO and really believe that. This is just more fluff. I encourage EVERYONE to read my in ISO. Just because you say a thing, doesnt make it true.

there is no way I moving my vote today. He is not misguided at this point. He is trying to fluff up his "case" with nonsense.

[curiouskarmadog]

Bub and ckd

What are your thoughts on other slots in the game

like who? I think I have commented on just about everyone today. Where I am leaning...my thoughts. I am pretty transparent.

[curiouskarmadog]

now I just mad. Forgot how maddening this game could be. backing off for 24 hours.

[Save The Dragons]

Apologies if I missed it

[NJAC]

@

Everyone

:

Can you please order (again if you already did) these six players from the scummiest to the least scummy?

{Enchant, Venmar, GIF, Malcolm, Sheep, Sky}

general issue with this listing....it ignores Hu and Bub, which are high on my list atm.

Malcom/Venmar...Enchant...Sky/Sheep...GIF?

I would really have to go back and deep dive all 6, so this is just an off the cuff thought.

My question to you. Other than getting a time stamp of what people's thoughts were, is this actually helpful? for me, I am guessing and lack the time to reread all my notes. like as Im typing this, I want to change it.

Malcom/Venmar...Enchant...Sky.....Sheep...GIF?

Like I just remembered the whole Sky incident where she was either trying to trap scum or fish for PRs....but the sheep slot has done jack shit this game....which is scummier? man I dont know.

I think it's helpful. Thanks for answering.

[Enchant]

I don't know what CKD claimed

[sheepsaysmeep]

is there any site function to like bookmark specific posts or not really

[sheepsaysmeep]

I actually despise this

[sheepsaysmeep]

ur all too deep logical thinkers in a way thats too unreadable

im used to just gut and vibes it's much nicer

[sheepsaysmeep]

im kinda turning on Malcolm he got more wolfy