BTXVI: Boons Ahoy! Spectator Thread

[Boonskiies]

Sometimes it doesn't fit with the puzzle is all.

Mutations are generally lower, like Neighbor not being part of the role name is the classic one. same with traitor.

In theory, I should have just chosen not to answer the questions until post game or something. Where as a Variant is like the Kraken.

[Enchant]

Then just add "As mutation Neighbor can not be listed as part of role name mutation" and it's perfectly okay, no?

I mean you mentioned that "Ah yes there's mutation which can make one thing unstoppable FOR ANYTHING INCLUDING ASCETIC so yep it's possible" it's not fucking tame, not by my opinion atleast.


Maybe i am just mad, but why i need to even play guessing games when mod provided role list which i can't believe for some reason.

[Boonskiies]

I like the WIFOM of it. With these setups, I like to get players to know that yes, there could be some wackadoodle reason, however, go after play in addition to some mech.

I also think the choice that was made to make the claim was rather strong and a big risk.

I don't want pure mech to be able to solve one of the games.

It's a bit cartoonish, but I do feel this game is actually a good indicator of where things are landing with BooneyToonz.

[Enchant]

Well of course. It's your game. Run like you want.

[Boonskiies]

it's definitely noted, though. Player enjoyment is always necessary.

[Ranger]

Spoiler on one of the scum, one town, below.

Spoiler:

Doctor Drew, scum, doctored Frogs. Klick, Interdimensional Traveler, delayed Drew's doc shot til the next night. If scum decide to kill Frogs on Night 4, then Doctor Drew is going to legitimately protect Frogs on Night 4. :lol:

By my count, that's actually spoiler on two town.

Spoiler: Reason

Scum wouldn't kill Frogs if Frogs were scum;
Scum wouldn't kill Frogs if they knew Drew's protection on Frogs was delayed.

[Boonskiies]

Spoiler on one of the scum, one town, below.

Spoiler:

Doctor Drew, scum, doctored Frogs. Klick, Interdimensional Traveler, delayed Drew's doc shot til the next night. If scum decide to kill Frogs on Night 4, then Doctor Drew is going to legitimately protect Frogs on Night 4.

By my count, that's actually spoiler on two town.

Spoiler: Reason

Scum wouldn't kill Frogs if Frogs were scum;
Scum wouldn't kill Frogs if they knew Drew's protection on Frogs was delayed.

yeah, we are effectively spoiled spectators now.

[Ranger]

well now im spoilered on the team

Same.

Spoiler: what this means

There's still a decent chance my prediction comes mostly true,

if

Peregrine isn't voted in 5p. STD's still likely going down, despite the doubt of his scumness. Norwee or Malakittens are still likely nightkills. In lylo, all Drew/Peregrine need to win is for town to vote town, and Norwee/Mala's survivor are prime candidates. Should that be the townie voted, I got it right.

If they don't kill one of Norwee/Mala then I got it wrong; if they get paranoid and vote each other, then I got it wrong; if they vote Peregrine, then I got it wrong; if they vote Drew, then I got it wrong.

I give 5p odds as 35% Peregrine, 25% Norwee/Mala survivor, 25% Klick/Frogs turning on each other, with the remainder accounting for both Norwee/Mala alive, a different kill, and/or Drew as the elim, collectively 15%.

[Ranger]

it's definitely noted, though. Player enjoyment is always necessary.

For my part, I had fun.

[TemporalLich]

Generally I'd run a BooneyToonz as a Normal Game but with some abNormal roles and the ability to add a themey (but not meta-warping, most ContraBoon'd roles ) role as a Variant

There is a "BooneyToonz Extravaganza" concept for a reason, and that is where it can truly be ran as a Theme game and where you can have flavor matters roles and mechanics (Flavor Cop being an obvious flavor matters role)

also, Unstoppable is a RoleBook modifier and really shouldn't be used as a mutation

[TemporalLich]

every ContraBoon'd role is either bastard or meta-warping, with the exception of Vanillaizer which I really think could warrant a discussion of that role being Normal

even then, I'd consider a Fixed Roleblocker a good Variant role for a BooneyToonz game

[TemporalLich]

also, I'd consider using the incomplete reveal mutation of Superstar without explicitly saying something like "other parts of this role may not have been revealed" bastard as it is lying by omission, otherwise it is meta-warping like Janitor

[Boonskiies]

Well, the Extravaganza I did years back everyone had secret voting, and I had 4 people chosen to choose when to end the day, and majority vote ended, and in between night phases were extra Bonus Rounds of a whole separate game where there were prizes that added onto people's roles.

But yeah, BooneyToonz did start in the Normal Queue, but I was a little bit too whacky admittedly for a Normal Game, I just liked the Variant mechanic.

Nowadays, I don't think my games are too difficult for someone who has a solid baseline on mechanics, even though it can get wacky, but the game's I like to run just aren't simple enough to run in the Normal Queue, even though it could if I made sure to tweak it a bit.

Plus, I mainly run Large Themes because I like to incorporate Flavor, even if not so much the actual lore I'm writing, which has been lower effort style this game. It did its job. Sometimes I just don't have the creative energy to write for a modded game but still wanted to mod.

Like, one of my previous games I started using the Inverted modifier, which let you and anyone else target onto people who were commuted, which is Wacky, but overall, kinda simple.

And I think that's my sweet spot.

End of the day, I just like the story that the game brings with these roles.

Like the Privateer being a combination of the Disabler and Buccaneer was super fun to see.


The few BooneyToonz games that were modded by others did feel drastically different.

I will have to watch out for getting hard Mod Meta'd, though. Ranger as the only pure Vanilla definitely would have essentially been an IC. Liked the Universal Backup claim, though, even if it didn't pan out in the long run.

[Boonskiies]

I kind of liked the Superstar without the Modifiers. I kind of get that, though.

I need to establish the Mutation side of things more, though. That's clear to me after this game. I have been doing Mutations for a while, like sometimes Bunyip is VT/Not VT, sometimes it's Vanilla/Not Vanilla. Setup wise, these things became necessary for the puzzle to work how I wanted them to.

I also typically like to use Vanillas and Neighbors, so that's why I treated Neighbors the way I do.

[Boonskiies]

I think a lot of confusion with certain things stems from the familiarity with Normal Games, and how they've worked for a while, so things like Neighbor outside of the role is just weird because it's not really seen, when it's really just different.

I actually really liked Superstar for Role only, not Modifiers. I know you made it, and liked it for both, but I definitely specifically didn't want modifiers on this go around.

Had I let the modifier go through, Emp Flip would have been essentially an IC, imo.

[TemporalLich]

I see BooneyToonz as a version of Normal Games but with wacky roles and the Variant role basically being a "create a new role" slot.

The spirit of Normal Games still exists, and the meta should still be a Normal meta but with wacky roles existing.

I would deem meta-warping elements such as random resolution, known holes in information, arbitrary results interference, and significantly affecting the core mechanic of majority/plurality eliminations something I wouldn't consider BooneyToonz.

Flavor matters apparently has a specific checklist option known as "Does flavor have an effect?", so it actually could fit into BooneyToonz maybe.

also, the flipside to the Neighbor mutation would be a Neighborizer mutation that actually changes player's roles (e.g. alternate neighborizing a Town Doctor would change their role to Town Neighbor Doctor), but that kinda starts to become a Vanillaizer variant which would ContraBoon that mutation.

pedit: yeah... I was seeing BooneyToonz as a Normal Game with wacky roles instead of a Theme Game. I'm still not sure if alternate Superstar (the one that reveals role only) counts as a known hole in information and therefore would be ContraBoon'd if I were reviewing the setup actually... but Superstar potentially having an incomplete reveal is a side effect of me discovering it's actually a

modifier

and not a

role

.

I still would say not having the two distinguishable counts as lying by omission (a bastard mechanic, which is super mega ContraBoon'd)

[TemporalLich]

also, any reasons other than terminology that the role that is now known as Exploder was removed from the RoleBook?

idk but if I had to guess Exploder could be seen as meta-warping

[Boonskiies]

also, any reasons other than terminology that the role that is now known as Exploder was removed from the RoleBook?

idk but if I had to guess Exploder could be seen as meta-warping

I didn't like it enough to want it all the time available in the Role Book, and it had its time in the Boon Bank.

It's still able to be a variant, but I don't think it's a fun role, imo, except for some situations in Face to Face Mafia specifically.

Basically just a get out of jail free card for a scum who's already going down.

[Boonskiies]

There was a scum slip in the game thread. Let's see if it gets caught.

[TemporalLich]

I didn't like it enough to want it all the time available in the Role Book, and it had its time in the Boon Bank.

It's still able to be a variant, but I don't think it's a fun role, imo, except for some situations in Face to Face Mafia specifically.

Basically just a get out of jail free card for a scum who's already going down.

fair enough

[Emperor flippyNips]

How was that a scum slip? If you’re referring to what I think you are

[Boonskiies]

They covered it up, but yeah.

[Theta Alpine]

as to the slip not sure that counts as a slip

Spoiler:

cause honestly that is a mistake i could see town making especially with a role as complicated as what drew claimed
so not sure that counts as a slip but we will see what happens

[Theta Alpine]

and then the game just kind of stalls out
not sure if that is good or bad for me

[Ranger]

Stalls always favor scum.