Open 885: Backup6 [Game Over]

[meowmeow]

I thought you and Black probably not scum partners at that time

but in my head the possibilities throughout my push on Black were that you were S/S or T/S and wrong on your read

uh this is strange though

earlier you said your view was along the lines of; "black is scummy. i don't know that she's scum, she might be town, but i think she is above random likelihood to be scum right now. i also know that if black is scum, she is extremely slippery. therefore, i need to exaggerate my push so people will actually listen to me." correct me if anything here is wrong.

like, i don't see how your pov here really fits with that? how can you

not even have thought of black town as a possibility

in that time period? were you not, like, thinking of "what happens if the person i'm tunneling flips town" which you should have thought of as a fairly likely occurrence?


pedit: ok that does make sense, why was he then your top townread by 129? i think you could argue from the black case he's anti associative with black but i don't see how this takes him all the way to top town from his scummy beginnings i guess.

[Dannflor]

i was tunneled on black and thought t3 was pretty much never scum with black

[Dannflor]

earlier you said your view was along the lines of; "black is scummy. i don't know that she's scum, she might be town, but i think she is above random likelihood to be scum right now. i also know that if black is scum, she is extremely slippery. therefore, i need to exaggerate my push so people will actually listen to me." correct me if anything here is wrong.

like, i don't see how your pov here really fits with that? how can you not even have thought of black town as a possibility in that time period? were you not, like, thinking of "what happens if the person i'm tunneling flips town" which you should have thought of as a fairly likely occurrence?

i was assuming i was right and fitting everything into a world where i was right

[Dannflor]

look i never said i was exactly playing this game well

[Dannflor]

if t3 flips red i think that spews Generic town 32

probably spews black town


maybe ccgeek? 121


i don't think the amount of shading t3 does towards aureal in 340 really comes from partners

that leaves [iavh, ccs, dunnstral] as possible partners

I think I would still pick dunnstral out of those 3 probably but idk

i think if t3 is scum here they probably want to be in a bussing position

[Aureal]

Yeah I'm not following that progression either. You voted T3

after

he argued against Black. Then decided that even though he'd pinged you with a scummy townclear of Generic, his argument against Black was just so great it made him town? It feels to me more like you saw that he was actually getting traction with that argument and decided to jump on it and maybe end the day quickly with a big push. I think that makes you two pretty unlikely to be scum together, at the least.

[Dannflor]

my suspicion of black started more with how she reacted to CCGeek's vote on her

[Dannflor]

there's not really a universe where i am that boneheaded as scum

it's town boneheadedness

[Dannflor]

Before I want to yeet anyone I would like to say this is not biased against anyone

Just remember to claim intent to hammer before actually hammering to allow for claims.

weird fucking post to make btw

[Dannflor]

pretty sure that comes from mafia who wants to claim a pr before he dies not an actual pr

[T3]

Before I want to yeet anyone I would like to say this is not biased against anyone

Just remember to claim intent to hammer before actually hammering to allow for claims.

weird fucking post to make btw

I thought IAVH might forget to declare intent, I think you can excuse me for that.

[Black]

Aureal what is your read on T3? iirc you didn't have a read on him last I checked

Why is Dann your #1 fade choice here?

[Black]

To me it feels like T3 is only "better" because he's trying to come across as townie, which isn't really better at all

can you elaborate here? i think you're probably town based on other posts and usually have good reads but like... i am really not seeing your pov on t3 and dann right now

I was trying to say that T3 feels better recently than he did a few days ago, but that might be because the pressure on him has increased and he's putting on his best townie act. I think T3 is more likely to flip scum than Dann here. Did I make this stance confusing or something?

[meowmeow]

To me it feels like T3 is only "better" because he's trying to come across as townie, which isn't really better at all

can you elaborate here? i think you're probably town based on other posts and usually have good reads but like... i am really not seeing your pov on t3 and dann right now

I was trying to say that T3 feels better recently than he did a few days ago, but that might be because the pressure on him has increased and he's putting on his best townie act. I think T3 is more likely to flip scum than Dann here. Did I make this stance confusing or something?

t3's posting just doesn't come off that way to me and i want to know if i missed something i guess

[Aureal]

pretty sure that comes from mafia who wants to claim a pr before he dies not an actual pr

Yeah I don't see any reason to think 'Mafia' over 'actual pr' or 'person concerned that the other wagon could still be a pr'

Aureal what is your read on T3? iirc you didn't have a read on him last I checked

Why is Dann your #1 fade choice here?

I went through the game again and didn't see anything that really pinged me. He seems to occupy a pretty solidly reasonable position. Could he be scum, sure. I don't have any reason to particularly suspect him at this point so I'm fine worrying about that later.

[meowmeow]

look i never said i was exactly playing this game well

this isn't about skill! i don't think you're a bad player at all even if you're town this game

i'm thinking of 365 where you explained your post like this;

just in general i think it's kind of purposeful that he's creating these stretchy reasons to push black, and reads are never actually this strong this early in any case - this is page 5. the most likely reason for 124 that comes to my mind is - i might have already brought this up, but people townread cases and long posts. by just focusing on quantity in his push it's pretty easy for dannflor to get townread and seen as a 'solvey player' - this is the kind of read scum does make a lot but town also does it a lot

for whatever it is worth I did project a lot more confidence into my case on black than I maybe *should* have

but the reason for that was not to get town read but to eliminate black

because I thought I had a read that was significantly >rand to flip scum, but I thought if I didn't push it with extreme confidence it was never going to happen because Black seems like a great scum player who could charisma her way out of an elimination if any leeway was given

I realize these answers don't like make me seem any more townie but that's why the push came out the way it did

i don't really see what the timeline of townflor is here? like, to me, this means you're simultaneously exaggerating a read that isn't that strong because you think if you don't and black is scum she will win easily, but also you just think black is almost definitely scum this game and seeing everything through that lens. and i don't understand how they coexist or how one turns into the other

[Dannflor]

Yeah I don't see any reason to think 'Mafia' over 'actual pr' or 'person concerned that the other wagon could still be a pr'

it's too telegraphed

[Dannflor]

I went through the game again and didn't see anything that really pinged me. He seems to occupy a pretty solidly reasonable position. Could he be scum, sure. I don't have any reason to particularly suspect him at this point so I'm fine worrying about that later.

tbh these are the types of reads that flip scum most often

[Dannflor]

i don't really see what the timeline of townflor is here? like, to me, this means you're simultaneously exaggerating a read that isn't that strong because you think if you don't and black is scum she will win easily, but also you just think black is almost definitely scum this game and seeing everything through that lens. and i don't understand how they coexist or how one turns into the other

I don't really think I can explain this satisfactorily but I will try

for starters my read was pretty strong! like I don't decide I want to kill someone on page 5 if my read is not strong. I had flickers of doubt here and there but for the most part I thought I had a really good read and built my worldview of the game around it.

now, normally even if I get a good read on page 5 I'm a little more diplomatic and try to give my scum read some space to prove they are town

I did not feel it was wise to give Black that same space I usually give people, so when I say I exaggerated my read, I mean that I pushed a lot harder than I normally would because I wanted to make sure that Black would die

like, I thought my read was significantly strong

it was because I thought my read was significantly strong that I went so hard on Black and did my best to not give any slivers of doubt or any room to move

[camelCasedSnivy]

Before I want to yeet anyone I would like to say this is not biased against anyone

Just remember to claim intent to hammer before actually hammering to allow for claims.

weird fucking post to make btw

its either a scum post or T3 just thinks iamveryhappy will forget

[Dannflor]

I've been super tryharding in terms of trying to improve my read accuracy lately, I think it's one of the weakest parts of my play generally so I'm trying to play a ton of games, look objectively at which reads are working and which aren't, and improve from there. I aspire to get to the same read accuracy of peak nsg or radiantcowbells

part of that journey for me is believing that my reads can get there, and if they aren't there, beat myself up after the game until they get there

my plan for "what if Black flipped town?", I didn't have an in game plan

I was just playing as if she was going to flip scum

my plan for if Black flipped town was to beat myself up after the game over it and look at what went wrong in my read

[Dannflor]

VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3

[meowmeow]

VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3VOTE: T3

was this prompted by something specifically or did u just feel like doing it

[T3]

I went through the game again and didn't see anything that really pinged me. He seems to occupy a pretty solidly reasonable position. Could he be scum, sure. I don't have any reason to particularly suspect him at this point so I'm fine worrying about that later.

tbh these are the types of reads that flip scum most often

What about, like, actual scumreads? This logic is so weird that I almost wonder if Dannflor is tunnled town.

[Dannflor]

just felt like it

I'm feeling more and more confident about T3 flipping scum the longer I look at this game