Open 887: Coalition of Frogs (Game Over)

[Ausuka]

Merlyn,

Vanilla Townie

, eliminated on Day 4.

Bellaphant,

Vanilla Townie

, endgamed.

[Ausuka]

implosion,

Mafia Goon

, survived.

The

Mafia

has won open 887! Congrats to implosion and Save the Dragons! Honourable mention to Datisi who replaced out. Condolences to the town!

[Ausuka]

Dead PT

Mafia PT

[Aristeia]

congrats!

ty for modding Ausuka

[implosion]

gg

I’ll have more to say when I’m home. Fine with scum topic being released

[Datisi]

sorry again for repout. thanks for modding.

extremely well done, implo

[Ausuka]

Very impressive scumgame from implosion

I'm fine with the replace out, irl and mental health is more important than mafia game

[Doctor Drew]

I had Implo D1, that slimy sonuva B got away though.

Congrats though lol

[Merlyn]

I had Implo D1, that slimy sonuva B got away though.

Congrats though lol

I was thinking about this all D4 Drew, I could feel you in the dead thread.

gg scum!! Implo that was a damn clinic you put on there. Just amazing!

Much love to Bella, you are a delight and I look forward to playing together again. I'll try and take your advice and give my reads more freely in the future

Thanks Auskua for modding! SO. MANY. CUTE. FROG PICS.

[implosion]

so my main struggle this game was figuring out nightkills. And of course I regretted every nightkill basically as soon as the following day started, I regretted shooting Drew as soon as Hero said they would have been pushing him, I regretted shooting Ari as soon as Bella said she'd have been pushing her. The main motivation for the THS and Drew kills was that I knew I was too townie coming out of d1/d2 and I needed it to not be that auspicious that I was being left alive, so I wanted to keep some of the other townier people alive with me. It *sort of* worked? I shot THS specifically because he was townreading me at the time IIRC and I wanted to shoot someone townreading me in the moment to play for the long game. I also wanted to shoot on the StD wagon. I shot Drew because I thought he was townreading me at that moment but was liable to go back.

I also don't begrudge the replace out, irl is more important.

[Merlyn]

so my main struggle this game was figuring out nightkills. And of course I regretted every nightkill basically as soon as the following day started, I regretted shooting Drew as soon as Hero said they would have been pushing him, I regretted shooting Ari as soon as Bella said she'd have been pushing her. The main motivation for the THS and Drew kills was that I knew I was too townie coming out of d1/d2 and I needed it to not be that auspicious that I was being left alive, so I wanted to keep some of the other townier people alive with me. It *sort of* worked? I shot THS specifically because he was townreading me at the time IIRC and I wanted to shoot someone townreading me in the moment to play for the long game. I also wanted to shoot on the StD wagon. I shot Drew because I thought he was townreading me at that moment but was liable to go back.

I also don't begrudge the replace out, irl is more important.

Ah, the mystery of the THS killing revealed! Shooting Drew was very smart, I do think he wouldve gone back on you.

[Doctor Drew]

so my main struggle this game was figuring out nightkills. And of course I regretted every nightkill basically as soon as the following day started, I regretted shooting Drew as soon as Hero said they would have been pushing him, I regretted shooting Ari as soon as Bella said she'd have been pushing her. The main motivation for the THS and Drew kills was that I knew I was too townie coming out of d1/d2 and I needed it to not be that auspicious that I was being left alive, so I wanted to keep some of the other townier people alive with me. It *sort of* worked? I shot THS specifically because he was townreading me at the time IIRC and I wanted to shoot someone townreading me in the moment to play for the long game. I also wanted to shoot on the StD wagon. I shot Drew because I thought he was townreading me at that moment but was liable to go back.

I also don't begrudge the replace out, irl is more important.

I figured I was ripe for a mis lim on D2, so color me surprised when Ausuka said I was dead lol.

She did post what you said in the Mafia or about why you chose me, took me a bit but then I understood why you chose me.

I probably wouldn't have gone after you D2, but as the days went by probably would have realized it was you all this time.

Keyser Zoze.gif goes here

[RH9]

Congrats, implo!

[Hero at Heart]

i have a few things to say.

first of all, wow implo you were fucking good, you looked so towny right up until the end, even when i voted you on day 3 i had serious doubts because fucking hell you were towny. i'm impressed. you definitely deserved to win.

second of all, merlyn, i just didn't get your thought process at all in regards to voting me. you knew you were town. it's /beneficial/ for you as town not to be voted by someone else, regardless of if they are town or scum. why do you think me not wanting to vote you because i am that confident you are not scum is a scum characteristic / anti-town thing to do? if both of us survived to elo then the game would basically play out like an elo with a confirmed townie meaning 50% ev instead of 33% ev, which is amazing. but i guess i wasn't clear about saying i won't vote you because i am sure you are town, lol.

third of all ari, sorry for my shitty pushes on you, but i got really tilted from all your shitty pushes on me and at some point i just felt like i had enough of it and started playing really suboptimally. so sorry again.

fourth of all, i think i realize what mistake i've done that led me to be elimmed - i basically got too complacent about being being townread and stopped doing the one thing i'm very good at - looking extremely townie as town. and part of this includes that maybe i should have not shown my indecisiveness as much to you guys but pretended i was more confident on implo being scum.

oh and btw, i started composing this huge scum case on implo toward the end of day 3 but for some really stupid reason i let the fact that he didn't hammer me confuse me and i didn't post it, even though it was in line with how he played scum not to actually hammer immediately. oh well, next time i will just post such things.

[Merlyn]

econd of all, merlyn, i just didn't get your thought process at all in regards to voting me. you knew you were town. it's /beneficial/ for you as town not to be voted by someone else, regardless of if they are town or scum. why do you think me not wanting to vote you because i am that confident you are not scum is a scum characteristic / anti-town thing to do? if both of us survived to elo then the game would basically play out like an elo with a confirmed townie meaning 50% ev instead of 33% ev, which is amazing. but i guess i wasn't clear about saying i won't vote you because i am sure you are town, lol.

It's more that I didn't really believe you wouldn't flip flop on that vote, Hero. Tbh I can still see a final 3 scenario where Implo gets you to change your mind and vote me. I also have to say that I don't know that I would have figured out Implo was scum here if Bella wasn't in the final 3.

[Hero at Heart]

nope, i would always go implo in a final 3 of you/me/implo. the fact that he was alive is simply too incriminating.

[Merlyn]

from the mafia PT:

This one will be kind of a painstaking decision.

An operative consideration is "what would Bellaphant do as scum here"? The main dynamics: I've given townreads on ari and merlyn, probably stronger on ari. Merlyn had before said she was feeling me or bella, but then wound up voting Hero while also saying it could be Ari (lol). Ari is... a wildcard. I think if I kill Merlyn it feels like anyone's guess who Ari votes for in elo and also anyone's guess who Bella votes for. If I kill Ari then I think Merlyn will on average wind up feeling like she's suspicious of me but will end up voting Bella most of the time *unless* she thinks Bella would have shot her or me over Ari. Which she could think, because I've implied suspicion of Bella. The upside of this is that me and Bella both being alive tomorrow can easily be framed as scum leaving us both alive so I mislim her, whoever I kill.

There is also the option of just killing Bella. I feel like that pegs me a bit though since I'm suspicious of her.

I think the "default" kill here is Merlyn because she's been somewhat universally townread, Ari was suspected by the now-dead Hero at Heart, etc. The thing is that the 3p dynamics are pretty complex. My plan for most of the day was to shoot Ari but things have changed to the point where it feels very hard to pick.

If bella is scum here, she keeps me alive because she thinks she can get the third person to vote me, in principle. Honestly my gut says so strongly to shoot Ari because I feel like I have no idea how to manipulate the way she thinks about the game right now. The feeling I get is that a Merlyn kill sends vibes of "the game is going how scum wanted it to go" and an Ari kill sends vibes of "uh-oh, something weird is going on". And maybe in those vibes it's hard to get Merlyn to vote Bella with me but not hard to get Bella to vote Merlyn with me.

Kill: Aristeia

liable to change idfk

I'm really glad you articulated your thoughts here, it's genuinely fascinating to go back and see how your thought process led to the right decision for you here

[Merlyn]

nope, i would always go implo in a final 3 of you/me/implo. the fact that he was alive is simply too incriminating.

lol, is this not you in the dead thread thinking I'm the scum after all?

I think we all kinda played bad the last couple days, should have been a slam dunk for us, ah well.

i can agree with this

let's see if merlyn somehow turns it around though

kind of think mer is the last mafia but wouldn't be surprised if i'm being a clown

huh, maybe you right

in which case i will fucking laugh at the fact that i was sring her day 1 due to a mostly innocuous interaction with doctor drew that i decided randomly /must/ be svt and then never shared it because i thought it was a silly read.

[implosion]

for some really stupid reason i let the fact that he didn't hammer me confuse me and i didn't post it, even though it was in line with how he played scum not to actually hammer immediately.

Yeah I was definitely grateful for this. I am fundamentally a coward who is afraid to commit to anything in the game (really as both alignments). I definitely can remember like one time in a scum game that I tried to take what looked like a free cheap hammer, but iirc it backfired pretty hard.

One more interesting thing - there was something in my ISO that I was sort of afraid was going to be a smoking gun particularly when Bella asked about setup mechanics near the end, which is my admittedly weak attempts to replace Datisi with someone else in the coalition. As I (truthfully) said, it's beneficial for scum (quite beneficial) to have only one scum on coalition, and I thought if I was the only scum on coalition I'd be able to parlay that into a lot of mislims much more easily than with both me and Datisi, especially since we could just kill of coalition every night and not arouse any suspicion on me. It is something that I could have posted as town but of everything I did this game that was by far the most agenda'd thing.

[implosion]

I'm really glad you articulated your thoughts here, it's genuinely fascinating to go back and see how your thought process led to the right decision for you here

I definitely forgot that I said it'd be easier to get bella to vote you than you to vote bella lol. I think a tactic you could have taken in this last day (i have no idea if it would have worked but it's an interesting alternative world!) is to really try to push me to vote for Bella since I was vocally leaning that way, like for you to ask for the hammer explicitly. I considered at one point explicitly saying I wanted the hammer. Either you get me to vote Bella (in which case you get the hammer) or I'm reluctant to do so, in which case you can quite possibly score town points when you vote for me. Really I think voting for me was also a very sensible choice but it's an alternate way things could have gone that makes me curious, like it would have been quite challenging to respond to that pressure effectively for me.

[Hero at Heart]

nope, i would always go implo in a final 3 of you/me/implo. the fact that he was alive is simply too incriminating.

lol, is this not you in the dead thread thinking I'm the scum after all?

I think we all kinda played bad the last couple days, should have been a slam dunk for us, ah well.

i can agree with this

let's see if merlyn somehow turns it around though

kind of think mer is the last mafia but wouldn't be surprised if i'm being a clown

huh, maybe you right

in which case i will fucking laugh at the fact that i was sring her day 1 due to a mostly innocuous interaction with doctor drew that i decided randomly /must/ be svt and then never shared it because i thought it was a silly read.

it's me saying "uh maybe" but in a "i don't really think it's true" way of maybe.

[Hero at Heart]

as in i didn't think it was the case but i said if it were the case, i would fucking laugh.

[Hero at Heart]

Yeah I was definitely grateful for this. I am fundamentally a coward who is afraid to commit to anything in the game (really as both alignments). I definitely can remember like one time in a scum game that I tried to take what looked like a free cheap hammer, but iirc it backfired pretty hard.

One more interesting thing - there was something in my ISO that I was sort of afraid was going to be a smoking gun particularly when Bella asked about setup mechanics near the end, which is my admittedly weak attempts to replace Datisi with someone else in the coalition. As I (truthfully) said, it's beneficial for scum (quite beneficial) to have only one scum on coalition, and I thought if I was the only scum on coalition I'd be able to parlay that into a lot of mislims much more easily than with both me and Datisi, especially since we could just kill of coalition every night and not arouse any suspicion on me. It is something that I could have posted as town but of everything I did this game that was by far the most agenda'd thing.

i didn't notice that specifically but i did notice your reluctance to have datisi in the coal, but i actually thought that was townie for most of the game (in the end i did think it was possibly partnered, but again, i changed my mind on you for that lack of hammer).

[Bellaphant]

Sorry all, I massively over thought this. I was so tempted to slap the hammer down after merlyn voted, and then I tied myself in a knot. I think aot of the issue is, implo 100% spent the first half of the game posting takes that I totally agreed with: I think the only other person who's done that and fooled me so well is lukewarm.

I need to stop thinking everyone will think like me!

[TheHoldSteady]

It's okay Bellphant. You were in an unenviable position. It happens to the best of us.