Open 898: Don't Fall In The Volcano! | Game Over!

[Aureal]

1.14

Votecount 1.14

Klick (2/5)

-> NekoLover (427), KawaiiKame (428)

Claptastik (2/5)

-> Dannflor (538), Skygazer (552)

FakeGod (2/5)

-> Klick (388), Claptastik (485)

NekoLover (1/5)

-> Black (689)

Not Voting (2)

-> DragonEater70, FakeGod


With 9 gladiators in the arena, it takes 5 votes to remove someone from play.

The day deadline is in (expired on 2023-12-26 16:28:30).

Mod Notes: the combined mod ISO can be found here.

[Claptastik]

I don't think Neko is solving at all. I think he's just pushing where it is convenient to do so. If you don't believe me just look at his ISO

I agree that he's not doing much solving, but I think that's likely because he doesn't yet know how to solve. One person makes a case. That sounds good to Neko, and he agrees with it. Person cased makes a rebuttal. That sounds good to Neko, and he agrees with it. He's just going on feels, because he doesn't yet know how to look for motivations.

Or look at it this way. Neko's all over the place. I believe scum have daytalk. If he were scum, his partner would probably be coaching him to some extent, and his game wouldn't look so wild. The exception to this is if Titus/Kawaii is scum, since they weren't around at first to coach him.

So, logically I think Neko is town. Yeah, the thought that he's just playing deer in the headlights has crossed my mind. But I don't think that's the case.

[Claptastik]

I think klick is approaching this in a way that doesn’t optically make him look very good

Clap intentionally is

Rereading, and this post cracked me up. This site is like mafia bizarro world or something.

[Claptastik]

the fakegod/claptastik exchanges on this page feel like s/s distancing tbh

Are you saying they don't optically make us look very good?

[Klick]

I think klick is approaching this in a way that doesn’t optically make him look very good

Clap intentionally is

Rereading, and this post cracked me up. This site is like mafia bizarro world or something.

I don't understand why you find this odd

He's basically saying that he believes you're trying too hard to avoid getting scumread

[Claptastik]

I don't understand why you find this odd

Bad=good
Good=bad

[Klick]

It's about the level of effort and intention you're putting into it

Scum care about looking like town slightly more than town do

[Claptastik]

It's about the level of effort and intention you're putting into it

Scum care about looking like town slightly more than town do

Yes, I'm intentionally putting effort into scum hunting. And here, that's scummy. IOW this is bizarro world.

BTW, I'm not implying anything scummy about dann with this point. It's just an interesting (to me at least) observation by a relative outsider looking in. I sometimes get the feeling that the people here have been playing together for so long, and therefore wifoming each other for so long, that some conventional wisdom regarding mafia has been turned upside down.

[Black]

First thing she did when greeting our replacement was to punch him in the face affront him by asking him if he has read anything at all before he made his 1st post

For the record I asked him this not as an attack, but because I thought it felt unnatural for him to jump in and defend you so quick without reading any of the game. I wanted him to clarify if he had read at all. The way he worded his entrance made it seem like he hadn't

What is your read on Neko?

[Black]

I think klick is approaching this in a way that doesn’t optically make him look very good

Clap intentionally is

Rereading, and this post cracked me up. This site is like mafia bizarro world or something.

I don't understand why you find this odd

He's basically saying that he believes you're trying too hard to avoid getting scumread

What is your read on Neko?

Kinda want you to go into detail about it if you can

[Klick]

It's about the level of effort and intention you're putting into it

Scum care about looking like town slightly more than town do

Yes, I'm intentionally putting effort into scum hunting. And here, that's scummy. IOW this is bizarro world.

BTW, I'm not implying anything scummy about dann with this point. It's just an interesting (to me at least) observation by a relative outsider looking in. I sometimes get the feeling that the people here have been playing together for so long, and therefore wifoming each other for so long, that some conventional wisdom regarding mafia has been turned upside down.

I think I disagree with the overall point but I also don't necessarily agree with Dann's argument atm

[Klick]

I think klick is approaching this in a way that doesn’t optically make him look very good

Clap intentionally is

Rereading, and this post cracked me up. This site is like mafia bizarro world or something.

I don't understand why you find this odd

He's basically saying that he believes you're trying too hard to avoid getting scumread

What is your read on Neko?

Kinda want you to go into detail about it if you can

And I also want to go into detail on it and look closer

That's why I haven't done it yet, I need to be home and in the right headspace to stare at this for long enough to do that

[NekoLover]

I don't think Neko is solving at all. I think he's just pushing where it is convenient to do so. If you don't believe me just look at his ISO

I agree that he's not doing much solving, but I think that's likely because he doesn't yet know how to solve. One person makes a case. That sounds good to Neko, and he agrees with it. Person cased makes a rebuttal. That sounds good to Neko, and he agrees with it. He's just going on feels, because he doesn't yet know how to look for motivations.

Or look at it this way. Neko's all over the place. I believe scum have daytalk. If he were scum, his partner would probably be coaching him to some extent, and his game wouldn't look so wild. The exception to this is if Titus/Kawaii is scum, since they weren't around at first to coach him.

So, logically I think Neko is town. Yeah, the thought that he's just playing deer in the headlights has crossed my mind. But I don't think that's the case.

This is it; thank you, I felt stressed and i just stepped away from the game for the night; I'm so used to short form social deduction games that end in an hour that my brain is struggling to adapt to long form

[Claptastik]

Relax and watch what other people are doing. It takes a few games before it starts to make sense. And this game won't make any sense until you see some flips.

[Black]

You should explore the Skygazer gut townread more if you think you can @Black

Klick why did you ask this

I think it's pretty obvious from the way you asked this question that you have some sort of idea where the gut read came from

I don't think town!Klick asks this

[Black]

VOTE: Klick

Still down to go Neko if that gets any support but I think this is way more likely to flip scum than Clap or Fake

[Black]

Wait. I'm looking back now and I'm not as convinced that Klick is doing what I think he's doing with this question

I still think he's more likely to flip scum than the other two wagons but this particular point is a little weaker upon reread

I'm keeping my vote here for now. I have reasons that I'll disclose eventually

[KawaiiKame]

I think newscum is super likely to repeat opinions that have already been stated and I don't think newtown is as likely to have this problem. It's harder for newscum to come up with original thoughts...I would know because I played this exact way in my first scum game here

I feel Neko is confused town, unvoting you at E-1 shows original thinking. He did this without anyone else leading him, taking the initiative to do a town move. I fail to see the scum!Neko motivation behind saving you. Imo Neko does what makes sense to him in the moment, unvoting you at E-1 made since he wanted info, switching between siding with you vs. Clap/Dragon,

Yes but when all sides are making valid points and the mental limit has been reached im just gonna follow the crowd at this point because my brain is taxed and I don't think any more back and forth analysis will get me anywhere without results to better make my reads on. This is especially true given the social deduction games I did play before mostly revolve around ability usage, so my social skills isn't strong here

You either think Clap/Dragon are making valid points or I am. I don't see how you can agree with all of us at the same time

Your all making good counter arguments to each others arguments

Neko goes by what makes sense, he feels both sides make sense so he's conflicted between 2 opposing views. If nothing makes sense sheeping the majority pre-flip is in line with someone who is in deep confusion. Rn Dann/Klick makes sense to Neko but even that is a weak read. Neko questions his own thoughts a lot so it makes sense to sheep.

[KawaiiKame]

I'm keeping my vote here for now. I have reasons that I'll disclose eventually

I feel Klick is scum too

[DragonEater70]

Alright

Super catchup mode: ENGAGED

Estimated catchup time: 20-30 minutes.

Main objective: ability to answer Dann's question about my read of Clap.
Secondary objective: have a read on Sky and on Kawaii.

Starting catchup in 3... 2... 1!

[Claptastik]

Word on the street is that Clap is town... at least that's what I heard...

[Skygazer]

tired

[KawaiiKame]

Klick is insanely flippant this game, not only failing to unvote Black in e-1, but noticing she was and straight up not caring,

I was vaguely aware that Black was at E-1. I didn't care that much about it

This is sai, why would town notice and not care? Because it's funny? For the meme? Doesn't make sense to me at all.

Klick continues to not make sense, voting Black again in 260, citing he's happy with the "game running narrative", refusing to elaborate. Why is Klick happy with seeing Black as scum? What info is gained with this view? How does falling into this belief help solve?

Klick keeps going,

and I am going to make your life hard, intentionally

Like what the fuck is this? You don't want to sort me. You just want to be right about me so you can say "OoO I caught scum Black!!11!!"

I'M TOWN

If you're town I'm the wrong person to counter-push. I somewhat understand your concerns about my vote on you, but I feel that most of the votes on me have been just as lazy, and the difference is just that the vote is on you instead of me.

We're in similar spots if you're town. If that's the case then I think the scum are more likely to be in the quieter crowd.

Klick states, "most of the votes on me have been just as lazy, and the difference is just that the vote is on you instead of me"
Why is Klick voting Black without reason and saying the votes on Black are lazy?

It's like saying, "Ik the votes on you including mine are lazy but the votes on me including yours are lazy too"
This whole thing is a giant "No U" that Klick initiated by voting Black only to basically say, "We're the same"
If Klick is town then he makes a really good observation on their mutual positions and scum playstyle. But if Klick is town why is his playstyle so sai? Voting Black a 2nd time (to E-2) with 0 attempt to solve. Like why? Klick even admits he doesn't agree with any reasons to be voting Black,

Klick's townplay is generally very good and I'm legitimately shocked he agrees with some of the reasons being presented against me, so I think it's more likely he's just scum going along with the easy counterwagon

I agree with zero of the reasons but I don't think that means you're town

Klick redeems himself with this unvote,

I think Black is more likely to be town right now. I dont have a lock read yet but im confident i can get a very confident read there given enough time

I have an extremely good record of reading Black and if people can find me as town it would be cool if people trusted that

Dragon I believe it’s obvious he wants to catch scum!black and will do so by tunneling her regardless of her alignment so he can say he caught her

UNVOTE:
I'll take this. I'm not really 100% here atm but I'm willing to have a look at what you mean with Clap later

Klick realizing voting Black is a mistake and unvoting her is good play, it's either town Klick waking up or scum Klick seeing eliminating Black doesn't have enough support. Pretty nai but it does lessen Klick's scum behavior since this is town behavior.

Klick then goes onto lead the charge against FakeGod accusing him of having fake thoughts,

I acknowledge that FakeGod had some content in their ISO that looked like solving on the surface
My point was rather that the content itself felt forced, felt like it was driven by what FakeGod wanted to push into the thread rather than what FakeGod thought. It felt like the purpose of their posting was to look a certain way, as opposed to just solving. And that bothered me.

I'm seeing a shift in thought/approach once the 2nd Black vote fell, hopefully Klick is close to a solve he hoped to have in the beginning,

I feel like I'm close to having enough information to try to infer some sort of solve but I'm not quite there yet.

This is what I want most from Klick now. In alignment he's a slight scum lean to me with getting Black to E-2 in the 2nd vote then unvoting her and changing play.

[DragonEater70]

I think Black is more likely to be town right now. I dont have a lock read yet but im confident i can get a very confident read there given enough time

I have an extremely good record of reading Black and if people can find me as town it would be cool if people trusted that

I approve of Dann taking a hard stance. This is what Day 1 is all about, people. I'm willing to give a pass to Black on Dann's word.

I agree that Clap's taking more of a methodical, logical approach compared to Klick who is taking an organic, wishy-washy, softer approach. I think that's more of a stylistic difference and I don't think that necessarily points to Clap being scum.

This kinda has a LAMISTY performative tone to it, but it's possible it's just a relic of how MafiaScum was played in 2010.

Nah, that's not good enough. I want you to respond to my rebuttal of your case so I can tell if you're town pushing me for bad reasons or scum pushing me for bad reasons

I thought your rebuttal was weak. I think responding to weak scum arguments plays into the hands of scum. I'm fine letting everyone decide based on what's out there.

I agree which is why I also didn't really reply to most of Black's rebuttal back when I was scumreading her. I think this is probably town of Clap to think though.

Yeah Klick is my strongest TR, and with how Clap has been towning it up recently, they are a close second (Neko/Sky were previously tied for second place and are now tied for third place)

Agreed, you, klick and neko look pretty solidly town.

Why do you think Klick is town?

I explained that in 245 247 and 255. You're not reading for content, i.e. not really trying to sort people, or you would know this.

Nah I just overlooked them. Thanks for providing an answer tho

What do you think of the reasoning on klick in those posts? Do you think I'm scum with klick?

Probably not. I think it's more likely that there's one scum within you

What do you think of my reasoning on klick?

The repetition of the question is slightly +town

245 is ok. I disagree with 247 - I think it's much easier to stay calm and collected when being wagoned as scum as opposed to town.

Tangent but it's interesting how Black and I have an opposite take on this - I don't care about votes on me as town, but I do get stressed when I am wagoned as scum.

I'm watching you two play 5D chess while i'm playing checkers in this game

I don't think so. Black is either floundering scum or bad, over-defensive town. Without dannflor backing her she'd be in trouble.

As for dannflor, he appears to be the most annoying type of player there is - the old guard who thinks he's so damn good he doesn't need to explain himself. And sometimes those people are that good, but there's no way for newer people like you or me to know that.

Annoyingly, he really is that good. I have nominated him for best town player of the year award, so I may be a biiiit biased, but yeah he's good.

What if this game is actually just really easy

Kinda wonder what Klick had in mind when he wrote that

I think this argument is +town for both of you

Agreed

Honestly I don't know who to suspect at this point, but my feelings right now
Dragon Probably town, wants to eliminate black regardless of alignment
Dann feels scummy just because of how limited information he's sharing

Neutral: Clap, Sky, Klick, Fakegod, Black

I don't really know at this point, I'm just not trusting my gut because I am lost in this 5D chess game

These two posts feel like what newbscum might write to avoid engaging with game.

I think this argument is +town for both of you

I disagree, but if it is tvt, scum are just coasting, so it has to end for a while.

Yeah run along now

You really are making this game miserable. Hope you're proud of yourself.

This is probably a town post btw. It could be scum faking these emotions but I kinda doubt it

Why can't it be scum having a genuine emotion?

[NekoLover]

Since I got a headache trying to edit the quotes to only include my phrases, I'll just @Dragon; If I have no clue who to hunt or any suspicions, what do you expect me to say? Genuinely asking because it's hard to contribute when you genuinely have no reads on anyone