Open 902: Frienemies Blitz | Postgame

[Black]

Ranger how strong is your scumread on me and outside of associations with Dannflor/gob what is it based off of

[Dannflor]

just because you operate on a certain level with how you develop your reads does not mean that is how i operate

[Dannflor]

you are actively making this game so frustrating and horrible for me to feel like playing and that is actively helping scum

consider that you do not have the toolset to successfully eliminate me *even* if i were scum here and you are doing more damage to the game by interacting with me this way as town than you would be doing good to the gamestate by interacting with my in this way if i were scum

if you don't get my reads you can ask me about them and we can talk about them but the way you are treating me is just not good

[Dannflor]

and I would not- in fact - be this frustrated as scum because it would actually be pretty helpful for me optically to be able to shrug off your push and look towny

[Black]

Ranger is playing completely different than the game I played with her. I don't really think that means she's scum for a variety of reasons but that's the thought that came to my mind skimming some posts on the last page

Is anyone super familiar with Ranger? How often is she this dug in and engaged

[Black]

Also why is T-Bone scummy tl;dr. I feel like he has been mostly jokes but he's mostly flown under my radar so far

[Dannflor]

Is anyone super familiar with Ranger? How often is she this dug in and engaged

she's town. it's very common for Ranger ime

[Black]

Is anyone super familiar with Ranger? How often is she this dug in and engaged

she's town. it's very common for Ranger ime

Are you familiar with her scumgame at all?

[Dannflor]

oh god i just suddenly had this thought about ausuka

[Dannflor]

Okay, calmed down and this might actually be nothing.

But I had a pang of fear looking at Ausuka's reads list because she puts Ranger as a top town read (which I think is correct and I think Ausuka would struggle to attribute any other read to Ranger so nothing stranger there), but otherwise disagrees with Ranger's most fervent feelings (dann!scum, black!scum, tbone!town, etc.)

The main thing about Ausuka that has me uneasy is the fact that she isn't really involved in the game? I might be able to attribute that to it being a blitz game and Ausuka being unable to adjust. At the same time I'm worried Ausuka is hiding behind not being able to get into a blitz game to justify why she feels so spectatory.

I guess why this all has me worried is because while I strongly believe Ranger is town, I think her reads are pretty much flipped upside down and I think she is a very useful tool for scum to be either supporting or at the very least not getting in the way of. And I am left to kind of wonder whether Ausuka fits the role of someone letting Ranger do her dirty work.

this thought also kinda came about because I have felt substantially less good about light ganski's latest posting and starting tinfoiling a light gnaski/drew team and thought Ausuka made some sense as a third to that tinfoil

[Dannflor]

that's probably me getting hyper paranoid

I do kind of want to kill drew though

[T-Bone]

lmao this wagon.

[T-Bone]

The main thing about Ausuka that has me uneasy is the fact that she isn't really involved in the game? I might be able to attribute that to it being a blitz game and Ausuka being unable to adjust. At the same time I'm worried Ausuka is hiding behind not being able to get into a blitz game to justify why she feels so spectatory.

Welcome to Ausuka is scum.

[light_ganski]

Yh I gave t-bone's ISO another skim earlier bcos I'd been thinking he hadn't been that active and when I realised he'd made over 40 posts I wondered why he was under my radar. But I don't see it

[light_ganski]

Hmm, confused. Why did gob think Naerys was a top wagon?

This is still a legit question and central to why I'm still feeling not good things about gob, even though I didn't mind his answers to me earlier. Naerys never had more than three votes

[T-Bone]

Yh I gave t-bone's ISO another skim earlier bcos I'd been thinking he hadn't been that active and when I realised he'd made over 40 posts I wondered why he was under my radar. But I don't see it

I'm just constantly beyond the 12 hour prod range.

[Dannflor]

I think there has been enough passive support for naerys wagon that i have also assumed and still assume naerys is a top viable wagon candidate

i don't know why you think "thinking someone is a top wagon but they aren't" is scum indicative anyway

[light_ganski]

My falloff in the light_ganski read likely takes the most explanation. I don't think light is scum with Black; I don't think light is scum with Dann; light's more recent content has rubbed me wrong and triggered my "player deepwolfing" reflexes, because it looked like the takes of scum setting themselves up rather than town working things through. However, if light were scum light would still need partners and I don't see who light's setting up for an endgame. I'm willing to chalk this up to paranoia for now, but pends investigation when I can.

I've vibed with T-Bone's content indicating he's town here. His approach feels his normal town approach. He's not a lock for town because he deliberately mirrors this as scum, yet I feel he's not showing signs of deliberate forethought behind his actions.

davesaz has demonstrated what I believe is a solving mindset. He's put in more than the bare minimum to avoid elimination, which I feel indicates town.

Cook is guilty of the exact things Drew has been accused of and not enough people are talking about it. Cook has done nothing and has lurked into being ignored by players. If any of my scumreads are wrong, Cook is my top choice because I know Cook is better than this as town even on a bad day.

This is all townie thought process imho. The paranoia reads town tm and I take what you mean RE davesaz even though I'd still put him in my null pile.

I think cook would be a cop out elimination but I'd go there if there's no will behind gob

[T-Bone]

I think T-bone is probably still the scummiest player in the game. I hope this was clear from what I said earlier but - I think his thought process in the early interaction with python doesn't make sense. I don't really believe he asks "Why is python so rattled?" as a neutral question, or that such a thing is natural to do. When I asked about it, he said that it could get responses anyway, which is like true to an extent, but 1) you're going to get more responses if you don't make it look like a rhetorical question and 2) I just don't see the thought process that leads to T-bone not thinking python is scummy and asking that. His play feels overly cautious and unnatural to me. This hasn't changed over time; his posts in general don't really feel interested in finding other people's alignments.

I'll be honest, this is the fakest thing to ever fake. Is there a less charged synonym for bad faith? Because Ausuka was like that for this interaction she is referencing. She asked me to explain both my python read and why I asked a certain question, and I answered earnestly. She never responds to that, but later puts on a naked vote after I have a fun PT slip with Dann over Python's hero solve. Ausuka doesn't actually seem interested in my thoughts which is why she uses vague terms like unnatural to describe how she feels about me. Ausuka is interested in a mislim for sure.

Take a look. I believe I grabbed the relevant quotes but if I missed something let me know.

It was a question to the rest of you. Whether you think they were or not. Indirectly I think Dann answered and I had a related conversation with Light about it. Like, I think it was clear what I was doing when I offered a hero solve for 5 payments of 99.99. It's worth contrasting why Python was so hostile to the idea. I don't like to argue with people about their own behavior, that's not productive. I like to ask the rest of the players about people's behavior.

I mean, it very much does not come across as a neutral question. "Why is Python so rattled, is a question I will pose to the audience." is almost like, the definition of a leading question actually. If Python is rattled, that obviously implies they are scum I think. Saying they are hostile to the idea is also something that, if true, I don't understand the town motivation you think is there. Personally, I just see it as a simple response that they don't want your hero solve because it was completely wrong last time, but if you think they're hostile to it or rattled, why not push it? i don't understand your approach here.

I'm either going to get a response of people agreeing with me or pushing back on me so I don't think the wording of the question or being neutral matters all that much in this instance. If someone thinks strongly that Python isn't rattled they might quote me and call me out on it.

I'm not sure if you're questioning my town motivation or Python's so I'll answer for me. Because this is how I play, I want people to react to things I say. One of the ways I do that is point something out and ask if anyone else is seeing it? You can ask the meta folk if that sort of thing appeals to you.

As to why I'm not pushing it you're not reading the thread since I had several posts of discussion about this very thing with Dann and Light. No, I didn't use the word rattle again, but I think I demonstrated how I was choosing to advance that thought process. Question the town motivation of that if you wish. If you're questioning why I didn't vote it's because I didn't feel like it.

VOTE: T-bone

i'm reading the thread!

Sorry, this is all Ausuka can manage to say? If you think she's trying to sort me, go look at all this again. Because the next time we hear from Ausuka about this read is to start my flash wagon lol which is the post I quote at the start of this. There's nothing between the naked vote in 300 and her great explanation of this read 537 to justify this new wagon. If the way I treated Python was so unnatural, shouldn't I be pushed on that? Asked to explain my contradictions or whatever?

[light_ganski]

Yh I gave t-bone's ISO another skim earlier bcos I'd been thinking he hadn't been that active and when I realised he'd made over 40 posts I wondered why he was under my radar. But I don't see it

I'm just constantly beyond the 12 hour prod range.

I get you dw. I mean I didn't see it as you as maf

[T-Bone]

The main thing about Ausuka that has me uneasy is the fact that she isn't really involved in the game? I might be able to attribute that to it being a blitz game and Ausuka being unable to adjust. At the same time I'm worried Ausuka is hiding behind not being able to get into a blitz game to justify why she feels so spectatory.

Welcome to Ausuka is scum.

To expand upon this I had to go get the receipts in my post above. Looking through Ausuka's ISO it really is just that one time she asked me to elaborate on my Python stance huh?

[light_ganski]

I think there has been enough passive support for naerys wagon that i have also assumed and still assume naerys is a top viable wagon candidate

i don't know why you think "thinking someone is a top wagon but they aren't" is scum indicative anyway

I don't think its necessarily scum indicative

But I think his mindset in 502 conflicts with his townread of naerys

And I don't know if its sincere

[Dannflor]

But I think his mindset in 502 conflicts with his townread of naerys

I don't think it does at all and this seems like you are hung up over a surface level inconsistency

[light_ganski]

I'll take it under consideration

[Dannflor]

tbone do you have thoughts on anyone not named Ausuka