Newbie 727: Game Over, Town Wins!

[Sotty7]

/confirm

[Sotty7]

Vote: LACivilian

Why not?

Interesting list of questions, a good way to start some discussion I think.

- Have you had any previous Mafia experience? If so, was it here or on another site? In real life?

Been a member off an on here for a few years. Just recently back here again after another site I go to started mafia games. After playing them I got the bug back. Never played in real life.

- Overall, do you believe that you are comfortable with, and understand the game of Mafia?

I would say so. There is always new things to learn of course, I would never claim that I am an expert, but I have a healthy understanding.

- Do you have a favorite role? If so, what is it? If not, why not?

This is hard, mainly because I think it really depends on the players I play with rather than the role I have that determines my enjoyment level. If I had to pick though I would probably say Serial killer. The whole me against the world feeling is always fun.

- What, in your opinion, is a particularly egregious mistake that townies often make when they start playing?

Lurking is a good one. I would say tunnel vision is also pretty bad. The idea that a lot of new people have that because a player votes them or finds them suspicious that they

must

be scum. For a first time player being the center of attention can be overwhelming and can often lead to the old survival instinct kicking in which can make them look worse regardless of alignment.

[Sotty7]

Why would I try to force the game to start later, if I were mafia? It makes no sense for me to invent a reason that merely delays the start. If, perhaps, I were delaying the voting process and lurking under the pretense of "busy with schoolwork, soz soz" etc, then that would make sense. At least in that scenario, a possible advantage for me would be to gain information while giving nothing away. However, like I said already, delaying the /confirm process offers no conceivable advantage no matter what my role.

OMGUS

vote bronco

Sorry bronco, but your faulty rationale makes you suspicious. Should you be trying to random vote, then be honest about it: LAL, after all. ATM it seems that you're looking for a reason, any at all, to accuse someone. A townie would've tried to think this through before randomly accuse someone... which you haven't.

You realize that you give reasonably good reasoning for voting bronco here so that really doesn't make your vote OMGUS? You can't have it both ways.

Also, I included the OMGUS in my own post because I wasn't quite sure how the term is used; from what I've seen, it seems to imply simply voting for someone after they vote for you. If it has some kind of emotionally attacking connotation, then ignore it.

Ah. An OMGUS vote is classed as you are voting someone basically for just voting you. As I said above, you seemed to actually have reasons why you found bronco the best place for you vote. In my mind that takes the OMGUS completely out of it.

http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... 1_You_Suck

Also Burb you didn't answer this question:

Oh, gotcha, the OMGUS feeling then.
Why do you feel that your vote was a logical decision as opposed to an emotional decision. If he had the same reasoning for voting for someone else, do you think you would have voted him?

Which I would very much like the answer to.

I understand the logic of your vote now Has. Now that Blitz has answered in the way you anticipated how do you think this makes him any more likely to scum trying to fit in, compared to town trying to fit in?

Also:

Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?

I thought random D1 votes were a matter of course, especially among IC players such as yourself. voting NL gives us less information than a lynch; essentially it's a free NK for the mafia, which may result in a lost pro townie power role. Random kills may be unpleasant, but they provide greater information and even have a chance of killing the mafia, slight as it may be. Should we accidentally attempt to lynch a doc or cop, then they can claim, so it's not a totally terrible idea.

Remind me to return to this after Blitz answers my question.

[Sotty7]

Sotty, why do you expect me to have made my decision after one post?
My thoughts change after each post by the person I'm going after. I'll continue going after him, asking him questions and the like, until I'm satisfied. It's what I do when I scumhunt.

Fair enough. This is just what I do hence the question. Guess I was just wondering if you had any other insight that you weren't sharing with us all.

[Sotty7]

If the point of random voting is that it begins discussion, does that include the conversation that begins when people start discussing the purpose, point, and advantages/disadvantages of random voting?

Blitz pretty much hit it on the head I think. Random voting can really help kick start the game when we start talking about specifics related to that game. In a newbie game like this it is more likely that a little time is spent on

why

we random vote, which can be more general and not necessarily that helpful when it comes to scum hunting.

What do you think of the discussion that has occurred about random voting in this thread so far LA? Do you think Has has a point when it comes to Blitz and his questions?

[Sotty7]

I don't see much wrong with Blitz asking other players about the exchange between himself and has. It's been the biggest talking point so far so it's understandable that he would use that to draw in the other players.

[Sotty7]

unfos blitzy

well that provoked some interesting responses. Wasn't really looking for anything else. Nothing else to go on w/o the othres posting, but maybe I'll post more after school.

This post feels off to me. Major back pedaling in the face of three players disagreeing with you (Has, Blitz and myself) An attempt to pass of what felt like a serious post to me, as one that was just out looking for reactions. Does this mean you don't stand by what you posted in #46?

FOS: Burb

This would be a vote, but putting someone at lynch -1 isn't a good play on only the 3rd page of the game.

here's a question, Spinach. How does it help anyone if, after the "random stage" is over(don't get me started on my opinion of how useless the "random stage" is, btw), everyone decides to just unvote because we're out of that portion of the game

It helps people to unvote their random votes after the random votes stage because then you don't end up with confused people like me wondering why said person has a vote on them, and if there may be more to it. Right now, I don't know if BlitzBall thinks I'm scum, and any person would like to know if someone thinks they're scum, as they would like to shake that off and clean their slate.

Why would you be confused? The reason for the vote is right there in the thread, all you have to do is look back, or ask the player in question. Personally I see votes a tools that the town can use to get information during the day. Some players like to use their vote to simulate pressure to push players into either answering questions that they want answered, or simply to push said player out of their comfort zone to get a reaction and hopefully some kind of read on them.

The random voting stage would be completely pointless if everyone just decided to suddenly unvote after a set amount of time. No fruitful discussion would be started because no one would feel any kind of pressure because they know that soon everyone will just unvote. Then we would all be back at square one looking for a way to push the game forward.

How useful is it to say "unvote because we're out of the random stage" and then not put your vote anywhere else?

I don't understand this. Which person are you talking about putting their vote anywhere else? Me, or the person that voted during the random votes stage?

Correct me if I'm wrong Has, but I believe he is talking in general terms. So how useful do you think it would be in scum hunting terms if you simply unvoted your "random" vote and then didn't actively attempt to put your vote somewhere else?

[Sotty7]

This would be a vote, but putting someone at lynch -1 isn't a good play on only the 3rd page of the game.

I have to disagree with this, but it doesn't really matter right now.

What part do you disagree with? The possible vote, or the comment about putting Burb at lynch -1 so early?

[Sotty7]

Fair enough. I'm not comfortable to push it so quickly so early and when there are still questions Burb can answer.

Play style differences I would suppose.

[Sotty7]

just a quick question: at what lenght of time do deadlines start getting pushed on us? Is it a x number of pages kinda thing, set amount of rl time, or a combination of both?

Depending on the mod, but deadlines tend to come when there is a significant lull in discussion in order to keep the game moving. In games outside of newbies some mods like to give each day a time limit, like say three weeks for example.

On the subject of post 65, it just felt off to me. Just how quickly you seem to be to put down your own play. You even seem to talk about your lynch like it is a certainty. Calling yourself a newb and even agreeing with your attackers:

I understand why you'd vote for me, though. I played very noobishly in being overly aggressive early on. Even if the tells really are tells, however unlikely it may be, attacking a person immediately is a bad idea. Should they be innocent, you made a big deal out of nothing and confused the town. Should they be guilty, it's too small to convict them on anything and you're either warning them to be more discreet or making them look innocent by making yourself look so guilty. Instead, one should sit back as much as possible to let any suspicious incidents accrue, at least that's how I see it. Any opinions, ICs? I hope to actually contribute to the next game I'm in, whenever that may be.

For the record I see nothing wrong with going on the attack right away as long as you know when it's the right time to intensify or recall the attack. In fact a lot of information can be gathered from any kind of attack inculding how other players react to what you do.

I still find your back pedaling very telling at this point in time. I'm not buying the whole thing that it was a test to see what would happen. Especially with how quickly you just gave up on it.

[Sotty7]

Reasons why I am not particularly upset
1) I understand, if not necessarily agree with the attacks on me.
2) I've learned a bit on what not to do, therefore this game is not a waste.
3)I'll be able to join other games, having completed my first noobie one. It's not as if I'm trying to get lynched on purpose; if I wanted that, I'd lurk a whole lot more. I'd rather live through this game and participate. But well, it's nice to know that I'll be able to join more games than one if I die.

The game isn't over. Heck the day is only really just getting started, there is no reason to just give up because people are climbing all over you. It's the nature of the game. Don't just stop playing suddenly because you happen to be close to a lynch, you are by no means the certain lynch for the day. At this point I am unsure what to make of your brazen giving up, you are right it does tend to happen more to townies than scum. That doesn't mean you are definitely town though. If you are telling the truth and just simply made a mistake then just get back on the horse and get back to scum hunting.

Looking forward to your lynch doesn't help you, and it

certainly

doesn't help the town if you truly are a townie.

Seems like a last-ditch attempt to save your back. Things getting kind of desperate here it seems.

Burb seems to be anything but desperate. If fact he seems eerily at peace with his wagon.

I am waiting for some more posts to be able to decide if I should vote him. I am waiting for others in the game to post and know what they feel too. LACivilian and bronco have voted Burb but havent been around much lately to help things here. Sotty has also not posted much.

Why does it matter what others think? If you find him scummy and have no problems putting him at lynch -1 then what is anyone else gonna say that would change your mind?

It is quite obvious Night-1 I won't be targeted because to half the town I already appear scummy, and most possibly I will be lynched Day-2, but I don't want to speculate. I just hope, that if Burb is lynched, he turns out to be pro-town!

Why are you speculating about night already? From what I see we don't appear to be close to a lynch at all. I'm guessing the quip about Burb flipping pro town was a joke, but still not good. Also why do you think if Burb does flip town (IF he is lynched) that would make you look better in the eyes of the town?

Unvote, Vote: ameyarahane

You seem to be doing almost what you accused Burb of doing. Talking about night kills and that you are assuming you will be lynched come day 2. Kinda sounds like giving up to me.

[Sotty7]

I already mentioned why I felt so in the sentence prior to that. And anyway its either Burb or me on Day-1

Not very well. Because people find both you and Burb suspicious they are thinking you are the scum team? Don't get me wrong, I wish mafia was that easy, but it very often isn't. Can you explain how you jumped to this conclusion?

Also why do you think it's either you or Burb on day one?

Welcome to the game Triple D!