Newbie 727: Game Over, Town Wins!

For Newbie Games, which have a set format and experienced moderators. Archived during the 2023 queue overhaul.
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Post Post #25 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:06 pm

Post by hasdgfas »

I'm planning on explaining my vote soon enough, I just would like Blitz to come in and answer my question first.

@Burb: Why does faulty rationale make someone suspicious? Is there a reason you're so jumpy about a vote so early?

Also:
Burb wrote:Let me make a pre-emptive defense: no, I am not a mafia protecting my matey.
You saying that it's not makes me more likely to think that it is. I didn't have any thoughts of you being mafia protecting your scumbuddy until you said that wasn't what you were doing. Why did you feel it necessary to defend against a non-existent accusation?
FoS: Burb
.
Burb wrote:However, votes based on poor rationale may lead to frustration and loss of respect on both sides, which makes the cooperation so necessary in the future that much harder. Of course a random vote will be needed, but first I'd like to hear both sides concerning your non random vote.
I hope there's no loss of respect. Frustration I can understand, but "loss of respect"? What do you mean by that?

Also, "makes the cooperation so necessary in the future that much harder". Could you explain this as well?

Like I said, I'm going to explain. I want Blitz to answer my question first. This is EXTREMELY important to my voting reasons.

Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #26 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:19 pm

Post by Burb »

You saying that it's not makes me more likely to think that it is. I didn't have any thoughts of you being mafia protecting your scumbuddy until you said that wasn't what you were doing. Why did you feel it necessary to defend against a non-existent accusation? FoS: Burb.
Because such an accusation is a logical consequence of my defense and I merely provided the next logical step. I despise inefficiency
@Burb: Why does faulty rationale make someone suspicious? Is there a reason you're so jumpy about a vote so early?
I find faulty rationale to be suspicious because only scum would need to resort to that in finding a reason to vote for someone else. Of course, being illogical may simply be a character trait of his, but i have no way of knowing that. Additionally, in lieu of all other possibilities, voting off the most illogical member is also simply the most logical step; he will be the biggest hindrance in the future.

It's not as if I think his reason was such a huge blunder he must be scum. It's just that I have absolutely nothing else to go on.
Also, "makes the cooperation so necessary in the future that much harder". Could you explain this as well?
well, I guess I'm just trying too hard in my first game and making myself too wordy. However, I think it's obvious that the townies will need to cooperate in order to root out the mafia... if you need further clarification, go ahead and ask.
Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?
I thought random D1 votes were a matter of course, especially among IC players such as yourself. voting NL gives us less information than a lynch; essentially it's a free NK for the mafia, which may result in a lost pro townie power role. Random kills may be unpleasant, but they provide greater information and even have a chance of killing the mafia, slight as it may be. Should we accidentally attempt to lynch a doc or cop, then they can claim, so it's not a totally terrible idea.
I hope there's no loss of respect. Frustration I can understand, but "loss of respect"? What do you mean by that?
Yes, that's me being too over enthusiastic again. Generally, I mean that people tend to form feelings of ill-will which encourages emotional, rather than logical, decisions. Obviously, this is detrimental in a game of mafia, where we root them out through logic of analysis.
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Post Post #27 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:33 pm

Post by hasdgfas »

Burb wrote:
You saying that it's not makes me more likely to think that it is. I didn't have any thoughts of you being mafia protecting your scumbuddy until you said that wasn't what you were doing. Why did you feel it necessary to defend against a non-existent accusation? FoS: Burb.
Because such an accusation is a logical consequence of my defense and I merely provided the next logical step. I despise inefficiency
But I didn't see it as you defending him at all. I saw it as you making a reasonable request of me to explain the reasons behind my vote. Why'd you think that would bring you under fire?
Burb wrote:
@Burb: Why does faulty rationale make someone suspicious? Is there a reason you're so jumpy about a vote so early?
I find faulty rationale to be suspicious because only scum would need to resort to that in finding a reason to vote for someone else. Of course, being illogical may simply be a character trait of his, but i have no way of knowing that. Additionally, in lieu of all other possibilities,
voting off the most illogical member is also simply the most logical step
; he will be the biggest hindrance in the future.

It's not as if I think his reason was such a huge blunder he must be scum. It's just that I have absolutely nothing else to go on.
I don't like the bolded sentence there. Why the most illogical as opposed to the scummiest? Do you feel they're always the same?
Burb wrote:
Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?
I thought random D1 votes were a matter of course, especially among IC players such as yourself. voting NL gives us less information than a lynch; essentially it's a free NK for the mafia, which may result in a lost pro townie power role. Random kills may be unpleasant, but they provide greater information and even have a chance of killing the mafia, slight as it may be. Should we accidentally attempt to lynch a doc or cop, then they can claim, so it's not a totally terrible idea.
Remind me to return to this after Blitz answers my question.
Burb wrote:
I hope there's no loss of respect. Frustration I can understand, but "loss of respect"? What do you mean by that?
Yes, that's me being too over enthusiastic again. Generally, I mean that people tend to form feelings of ill-will which encourages emotional, rather than logical, decisions. Obviously, this is detrimental in a game of mafia, where we root them out through logic of analysis.
Oh, gotcha, the OMGUS feeling then.
Why do you feel that your vote was a logical decision as opposed to an emotional decision. If he had the same reasoning for voting for someone else, do you think you would have voted him?

Also, when you quote people, could you put their name in the quote box so people know who is being quoted? It makes it much easier to tell what and who you're responding to.
If you need to know how, it's
insertnamehere wrote: [/quote ] but without the spaces at the end.
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #28 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:36 pm

Post by ameyarahane »

- Have you had any previous Mafia experience? If so, was it here or on another site? In real life?

Yes, I have played a few games here, but that was a more than a year ago. I have played many mafia games in real life.

- Overall, do you believe that you are comfortable with, and understand the game of Mafia?

For most part, I understand mafia, save few roles. I'm not an expert in the game, but I am pretty much comfortable with it.

- Do you have a favorite role? If so, what is it? If not, why not?

My favourite role is the serial killer. It's great to murder people (hypothetically ofc.), while being independent, and not having an alliance with anyone.

- What, in your opinion, is a particularly egregious mistake that townies often make when they start playing?

Well, IMO townies believe their posts are not of much significance and hence end up posting content that draws more attention to themselves. Also, they lurk around for more time and then join the bandwagon easily. Result: Day 1, that townie is lynched!

vote:hasdgfas
for pretending to have a reason for his (apparently) non-random random vote. Also for using a deceptive avatar. You're no cow, not by far Mister!
├óÔé¼┼ôSometimes I lie awake at night, and ask, 'Where have I gone wrong?' Then a voice says to me, 'This is going to take more than one night.'├óÔé¼
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Post Post #29 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:45 pm

Post by Burb »

[quote=hasdgfas]
But I didn't see it as you defending him at all. I saw it as you making a reasonable request of me to explain the reasons behind my vote. Why'd you think that would bring you under fire? [/quote]

Because I also saw your accusation as not unreasonable, considering the d1 randomness, except for the part where you said it wasn't random. Should you have a valid and obvious reason that I missed, then it would appear that I would be deliberately redirecting suspicion. Perhaps my definition of defending and attacking are more sensitive than what the situation calls for; I certainly know that I suffer from a desire to overexplain myself, as evidenced by these ridiculously verbose posts. Still trying to fight it... but I figure too much is better than too little.

[quote=hasdgfas]
I don't like the bolded sentence there. Why the most illogical as opposed to the scummiest? Do you feel they're always the same? [/quote]

Perhaps I was unclear. When I said "in lieu of all other possibilities", I meant that in the absence of all other implications/evidence concerning players' scumminess. Naturally, this would not happen in a normal conversation once we've reached it's length (even subtle slips can hint at scumminess) but should all players somehow all appear equally innocent, than choose the illogical one. The townies rely on logic and analysis, while the mafia rely on misdirection.

Like I said before, I'm not trying to say OMG OMG BRONCO IS DEFINITELY SCUM MAN BET MY LIFE. Rather, since there's been little discussion between players, I would've random voted anyway. This act of otherwise little significance simply tipped the scales since everything else is so equal. It's not as if it puts him at L-1 anyway.

Also, I included the OMGUS in my own post because I wasn't quite sure how the term is used; from what I've seen, it seems to imply simply voting for someone after they vote for you. If it has some kind of emotionally attacking connotation, then ignore it.
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Post Post #30 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:47 pm

Post by Burb »

ahhhhhhhh freaking quote tags. forgot the quotation marks ahhhhhhhhhhhh

btw, is the mod allowed to edit posts for formatting stuff like that? If I'm not mistaken, edited posts will also show who they were edited by... and I think we can trust thok not to cheat :P.

amey brought up a good point: you're no cow! in fact, you're clearly sporting the male symbol on your profile while your cow avatar has udders! OBVIOUS CONTRADICTION SCUM OMG OMG!1~!!1!1one
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Post Post #31 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:48 pm

Post by hasdgfas »

ameyarahane wrote:
vote:hasdgfas
for pretending to have a reason for his (apparently) non-random random vote. Also for using a deceptive avatar. You're no cow, not by far Mister!
1) Please read the thread. I have said multiple times when I will be explaining my vote. I definitely have a reason for it, I need a question answered first, however.

2) Please read my signature. I am a cow. It has been proven through logic.


@Burb: You forgot the quotation marks around the names in the quotes ;)

OMGUS is usually used to indicate voting for someone who voted for you just because they voted for you.
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #32 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 6:18 pm

Post by BlitzBall »

(NOTE: I'm having computer technical difficulties, so I'm having to secretly post this from my school laptop. I will rarely (If ever), be able to do this, and these days I doubt I'll have enough time to get onto a library computer. I should be able to have a computer again by Wednesday at the latest, but if I take too long, feel free to replace me.)

Hasdgfas wrote:I will also vote: BlitzBall (this is not a random or arbitrary vote).

BlitzBall, I have a question for you. What do you think is the point of random voting?
Interesting. The point of random voting (IMO), is to generate conversation in a lighthearted way, and to provide potential reactions. (For instance, if somebody acts extremely strongly to a single vote, that could be scummy, and people could discuss the issue.) In some cases, especially with games among experienced players, it's more of simply a lighthearted way to begin the game, and more of a tradition. It's similar to my list, in that it can be used to created dialogue, but I feel that my questions also helped to provide some background information, that could be used for future analysis.

I was going to comment on the Burb-Hasdgfas exchange, but as of yet don't really see much to say that Hasdgfas hasn't mentioned already. I really didn't feel that Burb was defending me initially, as much as asking a rational question about Cow's vote. Therefore, the way that he automatically jumped to it being a defense is worrying to me.
ameyarahane wrote: vote:hasdgfas for pretending to have a reason for his (apparently) non-random random vote. Also for using a deceptive avatar. You're no cow, not by far Mister!
Really not liking this. Why exactly do you believe that Hascow had no reason for his vote, especially when he stated multiple times that he has a reason that he will reveal shortly?
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Post Post #33 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:25 pm

Post by hasdgfas »

BlitzBall wrote:Interesting. The point of random voting (IMO), is to generate conversation in a lighthearted way, and to provide potential reactions. (For instance, if somebody acts extremely strongly to a single vote, that could be scummy, and people could discuss the issue.) In some cases, especially with games among experienced players, it's more of simply a lighthearted way to begin the game, and more of a tradition.
It's similar to my list, in that it can be used to created dialogue, but I feel that my questions also helped to provide some background information, that could be used for future analysis.
This is what I'm focused on and the main reason for my vote.

Why did you feel it necessary to place a random vote, which is usually used as a way to figure out how to start real discussion, when you already had a way to start real discussion, that is, your questions?

I voted for you because it seems to me like you random voted to fit in better because it's "the thing to do", or, as you say, "tradition" even though your questions were a much better start to any game than random voting could be.
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #34 (ISO) » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:03 pm

Post by Thok »

Official Vote Count


broncofaninmd (2): (Ropis, Burb)

LACivilian (1): (Sotty7)
Spinach (1): (BlitzBall)
BlitzBall (1): (hasdgfas)
Burb (1): (broncofaninmd)
hasdgfas (1): (ameyarahane)

Ropis (0):
ameyarahane (0):
Sotty7 (0):

Not Voting (2): (LACivilian, Spinach)

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.
Burb wrote:btw, is the mod allowed to edit posts for formatting stuff like that? If I'm not mistaken, edited posts will also show who they were edited by... and I think we can trust thok not to cheat :P.
I can edit quote tags, but in general there's little need to do so except for aesthetic reasons. Plus me not doing so will give you incentive to learn to use the quote tags correctly.
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Post Post #35 (ISO) » Tue Jan 13, 2009 5:54 am

Post by Sotty7 »

Burb post 23 wrote:Why would I try to force the game to start later, if I were mafia? It makes no sense for me to invent a reason that merely delays the start. If, perhaps, I were delaying the voting process and lurking under the pretense of "busy with schoolwork, soz soz" etc, then that would make sense. At least in that scenario, a possible advantage for me would be to gain information while giving nothing away. However, like I said already, delaying the /confirm process offers no conceivable advantage no matter what my role.

OMGUS
vote bronco


Sorry bronco, but your faulty rationale makes you suspicious. Should you be trying to random vote, then be honest about it: LAL, after all. ATM it seems that you're looking for a reason, any at all, to accuse someone. A townie would've tried to think this through before randomly accuse someone... which you haven't.
You realize that you give reasonably good reasoning for voting bronco here so that really doesn't make your vote OMGUS? You can't have it both ways.
Burb post 29 wrote:Also, I included the OMGUS in my own post because I wasn't quite sure how the term is used; from what I've seen, it seems to imply simply voting for someone after they vote for you. If it has some kind of emotionally attacking connotation, then ignore it.
Ah. An OMGUS vote is classed as you are voting someone basically for just voting you. As I said above, you seemed to actually have reasons why you found bronco the best place for you vote. In my mind that takes the OMGUS completely out of it.

http://www.mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php ... 1_You_Suck

Also Burb you didn't answer this question:
hasdgfas wrote:Oh, gotcha, the OMGUS feeling then.
Why do you feel that your vote was a logical decision as opposed to an emotional decision. If he had the same reasoning for voting for someone else, do you think you would have voted him?
Which I would very much like the answer to.

I understand the logic of your vote now Has. Now that Blitz has answered in the way you anticipated how do you think this makes him any more likely to scum trying to fit in, compared to town trying to fit in?

Also:
hasdgfas post 27 wrote:
Burb wrote:
Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?
I thought random D1 votes were a matter of course, especially among IC players such as yourself. voting NL gives us less information than a lynch; essentially it's a free NK for the mafia, which may result in a lost pro townie power role. Random kills may be unpleasant, but they provide greater information and even have a chance of killing the mafia, slight as it may be. Should we accidentally attempt to lynch a doc or cop, then they can claim, so it's not a totally terrible idea.
Remind me to return to this after Blitz answers my question.
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Post Post #36 (ISO) » Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:12 am

Post by hasdgfas »

hasdgfas wrote:
Burb wrote:
Another question Burb, why did you say "Of course a random vote will be needed"? What did you mean by that?
I thought random D1 votes were a matter of course, especially among IC players such as yourself. voting NL gives us less information than a lynch; essentially it's a free NK for the mafia, which may result in a lost pro townie power role. Random kills may be unpleasant, but they provide greater information and even have a chance of killing the mafia, slight as it may be. Should we accidentally attempt to lynch a doc or cop, then they can claim, so it's not a totally terrible idea.
Remind me to return to this after Blitz answers my question.
Ah yes, this. Ok, here goes.

Random votes are one way of starting us off to get more information. However, not everyone random votes in games. Many players use other ways of getting "real" discussion started or use things they see in other people's random votes to start discussion.

However, no lynches should be "random", as you appear to say some are. If there is a quick lynch, that's not random, because someone had a reason to have the lynch like that. Every lynch has some reasoning behind it, and we start to see that once we get out of the "random stage". It's usually better to start "real" discussion quickly so time isn't wasted on the "random stage", which, by the way, I don't think is truly "random". I could do a whole rant on why it's not truly "random" but I don't think you want to read it right now.

No Lynch does give us less information and gives the scum a free kill.

Sotty wrote:I understand the logic of your vote now Has. Now that Blitz has answered in the way you anticipated how do you think this makes him any more likely to scum trying to fit in, compared to town trying to fit in?
Sotty, why do you expect me to have made my decision after one post?
My thoughts change after each post by the person I'm going after. I'll continue going after him, asking him questions and the like, until I'm satisfied. It's what I do when I scumhunt.
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #37 (ISO) » Tue Jan 13, 2009 6:22 am

Post by Sotty7 »

hasdgfas wrote:Sotty, why do you expect me to have made my decision after one post?
My thoughts change after each post by the person I'm going after. I'll continue going after him, asking him questions and the like, until I'm satisfied. It's what I do when I scumhunt.
Fair enough. This is just what I do hence the question. Guess I was just wondering if you had any other insight that you weren't sharing with us all.
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Post Post #38 (ISO) » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:58 am

Post by Burb »

Sotty wrote:Also Burb you didn't answer this question:
hasdgfas wrote:Oh, gotcha, the OMGUS feeling then.
Why do you feel that your vote was a logical decision as opposed to an emotional decision. If he had the same reasoning for voting for someone else, do you think you would have voted him?
Which I would very much like the answer to.
Hmm? Not sure why this is so important... obviously my answer'd be no, since I already stated that only this motivation made him slightly more suspicious than the herd (had not realized hasd's point about blitzy's random vote, but I'll see how bronco responds before unvoting). Had two or more people had similar ideas, it'd be more difficult to tell, especially if you consider copycats and so on. In that case, I more likely would've kept watching, perhaps pointing a FOS at someone.
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Post Post #39 (ISO) » Tue Jan 13, 2009 3:49 pm

Post by LACivilian »

If the point of random voting is that it begins discussion, does that include the conversation that begins when people start discussing the purpose, point, and advantages/disadvantages of random voting?
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Post Post #40 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 4:55 am

Post by BlitzBall »

hasdgfas wrote:
BlitzBall wrote:Interesting. The point of random voting (IMO), is to generate conversation in a lighthearted way, and to provide potential reactions. (For instance, if somebody acts extremely strongly to a single vote, that could be scummy, and people could discuss the issue.) In some cases, especially with games among experienced players, it's more of simply a lighthearted way to begin the game, and more of a tradition.
It's similar to my list, in that it can be used to created dialogue, but I feel that my questions also helped to provide some background information, that could be used for future analysis.
This is what I'm focused on and the main reason for my vote.

Why did you feel it necessary to place a random vote, which is usually used as a way to figure out how to start real discussion, when you already had a way to start real discussion, that is, your questions?

I voted for you because it seems to me like you random voted to fit in better because it's "the thing to do", or, as you say, "tradition" even though your questions were a much better start to any game than random voting could be.
Hrm. The first issue is- that it wasn't particularly neccesary to place a random vote- it was more because I wanted to. That was the way games were started at my old site, and so that sort of thing was imprinted in my mind, basicially. When you start the game, you random vote. I didn't feel that it would be much harm to the town, in that it was a single vote, and if much pressure came to spinach, and he was pushed to a point where he was close to being lynched, I would simply unvote, if I didn't find him scummy enough to warrant that. I didn't see a huge disadvantage to random voting, and not any advantageto not, as I could miss out on possible reactions that would be valuable later on, so I made the random vote.

Also, "the thing to do" does not equate to "tradition". And neither does "blending in". Tradition is something you do, when you've done it so many times that it's basicially second-nature to you to do so. Something being the "thing to do" sounds more like a newbie attempting to do something just because everybody else is doing is, which is obviously not the case with me. As for "blending in", that doesn't seem to equate either, since I could not be sure if I would draw attention for my lack of random vote or not, no? I was the first person to place one, I believe.

[QUOTE="LACivilian]If the point of random voting is that it begins discussion, does that include the conversation that begins when people start discussing the purpose, point, and advantages/disadvantages of random voting?[/QUOTE]

Hrm. It depends. Often times if you're discussing random voting in general, then it dwindles down to simply a debate of how to play Mafia, in which case, you're less likely to find valuable content and analysis for later on. Now, if the discussion is voting on a specific person, as this discussion seems do, that's much more conductive to analysis and scumhunting.
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Post Post #41 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 12:10 pm

Post by Burb »

Thok wrote:Your town of 9 was living peacefully, at least until the mafia arrived. Lynch them before they shoot you at night.
Waitaminute, if we were nine
before
the mafia came, then how can there
still
only be nine with two of them being goons? Did the mafia secretly brainwash two of our neighbors without us noticing?

also, lack of discussion makes me sad... especially since I'm limited to only one atm. T_T
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Post Post #42 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 12:28 pm

Post by Sotty7 »

LACivilian wrote:If the point of random voting is that it begins discussion, does that include the conversation that begins when people start discussing the purpose, point, and advantages/disadvantages of random voting?
Blitz pretty much hit it on the head I think. Random voting can really help kick start the game when we start talking about specifics related to that game. In a newbie game like this it is more likely that a little time is spent on
why
we random vote, which can be more general and not necessarily that helpful when it comes to scum hunting.

What do you think of the discussion that has occurred about random voting in this thread so far LA? Do you think Has has a point when it comes to Blitz and his questions?
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Post Post #43 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 1:16 pm

Post by Spinach »

Can someone tell me who the IC's are? I don't see anything on the first post. ;_;

Unless I'm missing something. >_>
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Post Post #44 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:07 pm

Post by Thok »

Spinach wrote:Can someone tell me who the IC's are? I don't see anything on the first post. ;_;
The first post has been editted to fix this.
I replaced into Chess Mafia for 6 months, and all I got was a win and this lousy sig.
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Post Post #45 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 7:32 pm

Post by BlitzBall »

Sotty7 wrote:
What do you think of the discussion that has occurred about random voting in this thread so far LA? Do you think Has has a point when it comes to Blitz and his questions?
Will be interested in LA's response. And, speaking of gathering information-
Ropis wrote:
hasdgfas wrote:(this is not a random or arbitrary vote)
A non-random vote in the 3rd game post? Please feel free to wait until after Blitz has responded, but if you've picked something up already I'm certainly interested in hearing it.
This was Ropis' last post in the game.

- Do you feel that Hascow's reasoning for the vote was adequate?

- How do you feel about the dialogue between the two of us thus far?

- Do you have any comments about the rest of the game?
ameyarahane wrote:
vote:hasdgfas
for pretending to have a reason for his (apparently) non-random random vote. Also for using a deceptive avatar. You're no cow, not by far Mister!
This Amey's first, and last as of yet, post in the game.

- Do you feel that Hascow's reasoning for the vote was adequate?

- How do you feel about the dialogue between the two of us thus far?

- Do you have any comments about the rest of the game?
broncofaninmd wrote:
Vote Burb
I dont like that school excuse, it makes me feel eerie
This was bronco's last post in the game.

- What exactly do you mean by your vote on Burb? It doesn't seem like a particularly random vote. Is there reasoning behind it?

- How do you feel about Hascow and I's discussion? Do you have any comments on it?

Although Spinach just posted, he also hasn't said much about the game as of yet so

- Do you have any comments about the game thus far Spinach?

Although it's only been a couple days since the game started, I feel that it's best to keep an eye on the players who haven't said much as of yet, as we don't want anybody trying to weave under the radar.
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Post Post #46 (ISO) » Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:16 pm

Post by Burb »

FoS Blitzy


I find it interesting that Blitz is concerned primarily with what people think of the attack on him. He even asks bronco, who has had no involvement at all with that exchange. Since there is no involvement, there is no pressure, and therefore little chance of a slipup that would inform us of a tell.

I might be wrong, but it certainly appears Blitz only wants to know whether he is coming off as too suspicious, and why. Consider this: if two people are both accusing each other, then the townie can only gain by casting further suspicion on the mafia. Even if he dies, if it makes the mafia look more suspicious, then it was beneficial. On the other hand, if he were scum, then the only reason to accuse is to throw OFF suspicion, and if a particular exchange starts going more badly for you, then you'll want to break it off, or amend your arguments as according to criticism, etc. Therefore, Blitz' probing for public opinion seems fishy to me.

OTOH, blitz has already shown he likes to throw out a bunch of questions for people, just because. Considering I don't know him at all and this is a newb game, he might have actually implicated himself accidentally. Then again, he might have foreseen this reaction. Hmm.
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Post Post #47 (ISO) » Thu Jan 15, 2009 2:56 am

Post by Sotty7 »

I don't see much wrong with Blitz asking other players about the exchange between himself and has. It's been the biggest talking point so far so it's understandable that he would use that to draw in the other players.
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Post Post #48 (ISO) » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:29 am

Post by hasdgfas »

unvote

Blitz has answered my questions sufficiently.


@Burb: Why is it such a bad thing to be asking people about our discussion so far? It's not like they're leading questions or anything trying to make me look more suspicious for no reason or questions trying to paint himself in a good light. Actually, questioning people can be one of the best things you can do, even if you're in the middle of an argument with someone. It just depends on the questions. I like these questions so far.
jdodge1019: hasjghsalghsakljghs is from vermont
jdodge1019: vermont is made of liberal freaks and cows
jdodge1019: he's not a liberal
jdodge1019: thus he is a cow
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Post Post #49 (ISO) » Thu Jan 15, 2009 5:02 am

Post by BlitzBall »

Burb wrote:
FoS Blitzy


I find it interesting that Blitz is concerned primarily with what people think of the attack on him. He even asks bronco, who has had no involvement at all with that exchange. Since there is no involvement, there is no pressure, and therefore little chance of a slipup that would inform us of a tell.
There will not neccesarily be much pressure to directly, you are correct there. However at least two of the players wanted Has to explain exactly why his vote wasn't random, which lead to the whole discussion. As for why I asked bronco, the fact is that the discussion between has and I practically amounts to what's gone on thus far, since this is just page 2. However, opinions themselves can be useful, as they can force people to take a stand on issues. (IE- who they think is scummy, and why), and the way that scum answer these questions can be useful later on in the game. If the Mafia are among those players who haven't been a part of the discussion, a stance could be useful, even at this early stage.
Burb wrote:I might be wrong, but it certainly appears Blitz only wants to know whether he is coming off as too suspicious, and why. Consider this: if two people are both accusing each other, then the townie can only gain by casting further suspicion on the mafia.
Not really, considering that right now, I don't really believe has to be Mafia. Therefore, I feel that it would be useful to try and obtain a little more information from the people not posting, and seeing what they think about the whole exchange. Although it might not be useful immediately, in a couple days this information could be quite valuable in analysis.
Burb wrote:Even if he dies, if it makes the mafia look more suspicious, then it was beneficial. On the other hand, if he were scum, then the only reason to accuse is to throw OFF suspicion, and if a particular exchange starts going more badly for you, then you'll want to break it off, or amend your arguments as according to criticism, etc.
Again though, I don't believe Has to be scum at the moment, so it's rather worrying that you automatically seem to assume that I'd think he was. As for me throwing off suspicion, it's not like I'm trying to put suspicion on any of the lurkers, or even put suspicion on Has, I'm just wondering if they have any opinions about the exchange between us, since many of them hadn't contributed for a couple days.
Burb wrote:Therefore, Blitz' probing for public opinion seems fishy to me.
It's not as if I'm asking for information for future discussions with anyone, and since this discourse seems to be finished, I fail to see what's scummy on hearing people's take on it, especially if those people hadn't commented on anything in a while.
Burb wrote:OTOH, blitz has already shown he likes to throw out a bunch of questions for people, just because.
I disagree. I believe that my opening questions started dialogue, and helped set up some meta information for later on. (IE- somebody who had played Mafia before would be less likely to be able to successfully play the newbie card then somebody who hadn't.)

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