Sushi Mafia! Game Over

[zwetschenwasser]

I doubt it.

[sirdanilot]

bah

[Setanta]

The last 2 days have gone way too fast. The person lynched gave up without any real attempt at defending themselves. Hard to get much from the bandwagon based off of that.

Never had a scum nightkill and no dead townies before. Yet there has continually been only one night kill. Dont really see how the scum could be doing the killing as they took out on of their own. Maybe 2 scum groups? Bunch of really lucky doctors or something?

Agreed with the first point, however both bandwagons were fairly justified though and when someone refuses to claim you generally assume scum.

There's been 1 kill every night always with the same death flavour too.
And yes the posibillity of 2 scum groups is quite high, see Talitha's flip for why I think this is likely.
I don't like the last line here, idk I don't think we should be discussing reasons for a lack of kills, but should just be grateful that there's been none.

Also Qanqan's first post is lulz. No sir wasn't a death miller Why would you think that?

[raider8169]

Agreed with the first point, however both bandwagons were fairly justified though and when someone refuses to claim you generally assume scum.

That is what I most dislike about them. They were quick lynches but justified ones, town or scum could have hide in the bandwagons and the information we can get out of normal bandwagons just are not there.

If it was not for the nightkill of a scum we would be in a bad position but we are down 2 scum and 6 town. I guess that is on par but it still doesnt sit right.

[Farkshinsoup]

Yesterday was 100% positively scum driven.

QFT.

We've got a lucky break with Sirdan turning up scum - let's take advantage of it. I should have time on the weekend to do a re-read. AGAIN, I want to look at voting patterns and now, interactions with Sirdan. Also, there is a whole other faction out there that hasn't shown up on the radar yet - It might be possible to discern a "block". My feeling is that at least some of them would be more likely to be voting than disappearing and flaking, so again, voting patterns people.

[Riceballtail]

I am in agreement that the last two days have gone way too fast, even for a speed game.

[Qanqan]

Also Qanqan's first post is lulz. No sir wasn't a death miller Why would you think that?

Because I'm nub

[shaft.ed]

bah

[08] Once your death scene has been posted, you’re dead. Stop typing. Not even a “Bah!” post, please. Save it for after the game is over. If you do not follow this rule, I will be ruthless to your side.

Be thankful Simenon didn't tell me what being ruthless means. But if it happens again, I'll take a guess.

[Minineko]

Did minimeko just ignore the entire MK case?

Yeah, I couldn't figure out what it was about. Which means I probably won't find it very compelling.

bah

Meow.

[Minineko]

Ummmm.... so apparently there are 3 more pages, during which stuff happens that make that post not exactly relevant.

Meow.

[Narsis]

In light of the nightkill, I've done a partial re-read(to make sure i remembered stuff right) and some thinking:

First, since the nightkill was not a townie, but scum, it means that there is not 1 but 2 scum groups. I would guess that we have a Precooked Mafia and a Knife mafia(or sk), because we had a Knife Cop.

Secondly, the kills are all knife related, so I think all the kills come from one mafia group, the Knife Mafia(or Knife SK). Add in that there has been only 1 nk per night, and maybe the second mafia cannot kill.

Thirdly, I'm also guessing that one scumgroup doesn't know each other's identity. I think that's what Pear Bear was getting at early on. At first I didn't think much of the question, it looked like a noob question, but it's not impossible that one mafia group does not know who each other are. I think Pear Bear was telegraphing something to the other mafia members. Also, when he said that the mafia was keeping him alive because it's useless, at first I thought it was just weird, but now in hindsight, he might have been once again trying to telegraph something. The scum is letting him live. What a strange thing to say, unless your buddies don't know who you are, and you have to send them a message during the day with everyone reading and watching.

I don't know which mafia group doesn't know each other. It's either the Precooked or the Knife Mafia. Since the Precooked Mafia seems to be unable to kill, which is a big disadvantage, this suggests that the other group might have a similar disadvantage, like maybe they don't know each other. I think Pear Bear is a member of the Mafia that doesn't know each other. Quite possibly the group that does the killings.

Vote: Pear Bear

The other possibility is the existence of an sk, but with those posts by Pear Bear...I find the likelyhood of a second mafia to be greater.

Also, this is one reason why voting pattern analysis isn't going to work too well. If one mafia group doesn't know their buddies, they'll be hard to catch. An sk is also difficult to catch via vote patterns.

[DrippingGoofball]

:goodposting: by Narsis

Looking at Pear Bear's posts in isolation, I get the following portrait.

Admits to lurking:

Just lurking over here as my random vote on MK seems to have been a bit more than just random...

More admissions of lurking, and worrying about what people think rather than finding scum:

I was hesitant to post because my random vote for MK seemed to have been a decent pick in the first place, and I was assessing what everyone else was thinking to determine if I wanted to keep my vote on MK or not.

Strange thing to say:

I understand that

I'm looking realllllly scummy right now

.[...]

Strange thing to say:

Ive made a newb mistake that could potentially end up killing me, and hurting the town.

Strange thing to say:

I was also extremely surprised that I wasnt on Plums list of suspects

as he was the only person to vote me yesterday and now

I look 1000x scummier than then

.

Strange thing to say:

And finally, I don't fully comprehend the hasty flameaxe voting...

THE BIG ONE:

Does scum know the identity of other scum in this game?

More weirdness:

Hypothetical question for a pro-town mafia vet:

If someone (town or scum) were to do something really obvious and scummy, and another player takes the bait, believes the lie and thinks the person who did the scummy thing is obviously pro-town (or so they say) should that player be looked at as suspicious? or just stupid?

This may or may not pertain to this specific game.

Weird:

...my mindset during that entire day was to keep informed and follow the majority because most of you know much better than me what youre doing.

Unusual, though perhaps understandable for a newb:
Well if a townie was rolefishing to determine if someone had a pro-town role then that townie would be able to defend and cooperate with that player, right?
That was my thought process.

Plum was attacking Pear Bear, and several players declared that they felt Plum was town. Plum was killed Night 3.

Plum, [...] I think you're very likely town.

This will be very interesting later on if OGML flips scum. I already suspect plum for a few fallable reasons, one of them being that whenever someone votes against me, and I am town, they automatically jump into my line of sight as potential scum, because theyre voting to lynch town. Also, in nearly every mafia game Ive played, those players who you think are "likely town" and do the best job at looking the part of a townie, end up being scum. And Plum is doing a great job at looking pro-town.

vote OGML

for the time being.

ANOTHER BIG ONE:

If there were two scum groups, how likely would it be that they know eachothers identities?
I would think that if they were aware of each other it would defeat the purpose of seperating them.

THIS ONE LEFT ME SPEECHLESS, BUT NOW I'M THINKING HE WAS BOASTING HIS SCUM CREDENTIALS TO HIS UNKNOWN BUDDIES:

If we lynch another town, would we still have a chance of winning?
Because I'm fairly certain

scum is intentionally keeping me around

because I'm
A) Not helpful to the town.
B) A scapegoat to draw attention to when one of them is getting lynched.

Through the course of this game Ive suspected Flameaxe, Talitha and Plum, all turned out to be town. And I wasnt convinced Santos was scum, and I ended up being wrong.

After this exercise, I have to reconsider my earlier opinion of Pear Bear. There are several posts in there where he seems to be telegraphing something to his (possibly unknown) scumbuddies in broad daylight. Twice he brought up mafiates not knowing each other before we had a chance to even be able to guess at such things, and he keeps bringing up how scummy he is. At first it just seemed strange, but now I believe that he was saying this to avoid being nightkilled by his buddies.

vote: Pear Bear

[Slicey]

That's kind of rewording my case on PB. >_>

I'm gonna look back at Pear Bear's posts again (mostly his response to my case) and see if I think it is worth a vote.

[zwetschenwasser]

In light of the nightkill, I've done a partial re-read(to make sure i remembered stuff right) and some thinking:

First, since the nightkill was not a townie, but scum, it means that there is not 1 but 2 scum groups. I would guess that we have a Precooked Mafia and a Knife mafia(or sk), because we had a Knife Cop.

Secondly, the kills are all knife related, so I think all the kills come from one mafia group, the Knife Mafia(or Knife SK). Add in that there has been only 1 nk per night, and maybe the second mafia cannot kill.

Thirdly, I'm also guessing that one scumgroup doesn't know each other's identity. I think that's what Pear Bear was getting at early on. At first I didn't think much of the question, it looked like a noob question, but it's not impossible that one mafia group does not know who each other are. I think Pear Bear was telegraphing something to the other mafia members. Also, when he said that the mafia was keeping him alive because it's useless, at first I thought it was just weird, but now in hindsight, he might have been once again trying to telegraph something. The scum is letting him live. What a strange thing to say, unless your buddies don't know who you are, and you have to send them a message during the day with everyone reading and watching.

I don't know which mafia group doesn't know each other. It's either the Precooked or the Knife Mafia. Since the Precooked Mafia seems to be unable to kill, which is a big disadvantage, this suggests that the other group might have a similar disadvantage, like maybe they don't know each other. I think Pear Bear is a member of the Mafia that doesn't know each other. Quite possibly the group that does the killings.

Vote: Pear Bear

The other possibility is the existence of an sk, but with those posts by Pear Bear...I find the likelyhood of a second mafia to be greater.

Also, this is one reason why voting pattern analysis isn't going to work too well. If one mafia group doesn't know their buddies, they'll be hard to catch. An sk is also difficult to catch via vote patterns.

I think you're misinterpreting the kills. My guess about the knife cop is that we have pro-town power roles that use knives, such as a chef (an inventor variant).

[DrippingGoofball]

I think you're misinterpreting the kills. My guess about the knife cop is that we have pro-town power roles that use knives, such as a chef (an inventor variant).

Why have the kills targeted the townies players?

Why a Knife COP, if the Knife Killer(s) is(are) townie(s)?

I don't subscribe to your theory that the kills are from the town, and I find your suggestion of such, suspect.

[Azhrei]

What PB's defense comes down to, is purely that he is a newbie. Normally, I would be inclined to play with newbies (outside of newbie games) no differently than with experienced players. This is better for the newbies and can also exploit their weaknesses. This helps the play of the game AND the play of the newbie in his next games.

However, in this case I cannot play with PB like this, for two reasons. Firstly, I know for a fact that he is completely new to this kind of mafia. I used to play with him on a different site and we played a game that did have the mafia concept of uninformed majority, informed minority, but that's mostly it. It's not anything like the kind of mafia played here, so I am very inclined to believe he is in fact a newbie to scumhunting. It would've been better for him to join a newbie game first to learn how to scumhunt without any guidelines other than what the players are saying in-thread.
The second reason is that it's better to ask him questions rather than just lynch him because he isn't scumhunting. Asking him questions about things will bring up more information about his alignment. For an example, see how DGB is dealing with this.


I am

not

defending him because he is a newbie, but I am saying that you should change your interrogation technique to make the results more accurate.
-------------------------------------------------
That said, I find Flameaxe popping in with no content whatsoever absurdly anti-town and scummy too, meaning that I am keeping my vote on him.

More flameaxe votes gogogo

Found it! I remembered sirdan saying something about how PB was newby and defending him not so subtly. The above post is it. Here, sirdan defends PB's newb defense quite vocally, but then says he's not defending him. In light of his alignment, I would be inclined to think that sirdan was indeed protecting him.

That, coupled with all of the rest of the info on PB, makes me feel very much that PB could indeed be scum. Now, normally I'd vote right now, but after the previous two days [I didn't even get to post yesterday D:] I'm going to wait for PB to attmept to defend himself.

[ortolan]

The PB wagon certainly seems reasonably justified.

I do find both DGB and Narsis' setup speculation a bit of a stretch though:

"hey, if there's only one night-kill, and maybe two mafia, they must both have a severe disadvantage each- the first is the lack of night-kill, the second is not knowing who one another are!"

It's certainly possible, but I don't really see how you've drawn this as a

likely

conclusion from the facts of the game so far

I also believe hp[leaves] hasn't posted in two weeks so I'd really, really like to hear from him about the latest events

[DrippingGoofball]

It's certainly possible, but I don't really see how you've drawn this as a

likely

conclusion from the facts of the game so far

Multiple allusions to it, by pear Bear, perhaps?

[ortolan]

I suppose so. The other thing that doesn't make sense is how can a mafia group that can't kill even win?

[Minineko]

:goodposting: by Narsis

Looks more like :weirdposting: and :baselessspeculationposting: to me, but I do like his conclusion.

I'm a bit worried that DGB is sort of barning Narsis' specrapulation, but her concerns seem valid. Polar Bear has just been weird all game.

Azhrei: Nice catch. I am impressed.

Meow.

[raider8169]

I suppose so. The other thing that doesn't make sense is how can a mafia group that can't kill even win?

I doubt that is the case, mafia will have a way. We have to assume the game is balanced so they have to have some sort of means.

[ortolan]

I suppose so. The other thing that doesn't make sense is how can a mafia group that can't kill even win?

I doubt that is the case, mafia will have a way. We have to assume the game is balanced so they have to have some sort of means.

I agree. I'm saying I have a problem with the conclusion that a mafia faction has no way of killing because it makes no sense.

[Seraphim]

Vote: Pear Bear

There's too much evidence against him to be ignored or brushed off as simple newbiness. Azhrei brings up the best point: that sirdanilot defended PB. Sirdan is scum. That, the scumminess coming off of him like a nuclear bomb's radiation, I refuse to sit back and watch us lynch another townie.

[DrippingGoofball]

I suppose so. The other thing that doesn't make sense is how can a mafia group that can't kill even win?

Good question. But that does seem to be what is happening, until such time as we see a kill from Precooked Sushi, maybe Salmonella poisoning, haha.

[hp [leaves]]

I also believe hp[leaves] hasn't posted in two weeks so I'd really, really like to hear from him about the latest events

too much village idiots =/