Wheel of Time Mafia: Rip in the Pattern (GAME OVER)

[Kison]

Casting a "one of three" net across people attacking him really helps support the case of Isacc being scum.

Nice. I like how your case against a confirmed SK is to make me seem scummy. Really shows that you're protown there.

What's the problem, here? Being a serial killer is inherently scummy.

Also, you "nailing 2 scum" isn't a free pass to

anything,

and the fact that you are trying to play it off as a reason to find you pro-town is a big red flag.

FoS MoS

for that one.

No, it's not a free pass to anything, but your implication that it shouldn't be taken into account when assessing his alignment is a fallacious argument.

2) I was not immune to the One Power....hmmm both of those were false...

I think the larger issue was your contradicting statements regarding your interaction with the moderator over the workings of the foxhead medallion, not the passive ability to fend off the One Power in itself.

MOTIVATOR IS NOT A SCUM ROLE.

Settle down there, Rasputin: IT HAS BEEN DONE.

MOTIVATOR IS NOT A SCUM ROLE

IT HAS BEEN DONE

[Isacc]

I think the larger issue was your contradicting statements regarding your interaction with the moderator over the workings of the foxhead medallion, not the passive ability to fend off the One Power in itself.

Then obviously you didn't read the arguments, because that didn't happen till a couple posts before I claimed. I was already heavily wagoned by that time. And, at least 3 people claimed my "one power immunity" was just a failed gambit and made up in order to protect against the roleblock accusation. You sir, need to read more carefully.

Settle down there, Rasputin: IT HAS BEEN DONE.

That's a particularly different role. Yes it is called a "motivator" but it is a very different role. The role we are discussing here is one that specifically grants the target the ability to choose two actions.

I don't think it's logical that this type of motivator would be a scum role.
I don't think it's logical that this type of motivator, if scum, would have targeted me.

The logic does not hold. Why is everyone clinging to it? Illogical behavior is so frustrating...

[Isacc]

Doublepost.

Kison, did you read the modnotes for the game that you linked? Your example even proves my logic.

Who did the motivator motivate every single day he was alive? SCUM.

Point made.

[Kison]

That's a particularly different role. Yes it is called a "motivator" but it is a very different role. The role we are discussing here is one that specifically grants the target the ability to choose two actions.

I don't think it's logical that this type of motivator would be a scum role.
I don't think it's logical that this type of motivator, if scum, would have targeted me.

The logic does not hold. Why is everyone clinging to it? Illogical behavior is so frustrating...

I agree with your #2(if you flip SK) but not necessarily with your #1; I wouldn't completely rule out the possibility as you are doing in a game as complex as this - but in the end I don't think it really matter unless you are lynched and not revealed as SK. If you're telling the truth I don't think you really should be concerned.

Kison, did you read the modnotes for the game that you linked? Your example even proves my logic.

Who did the motivator motivate every single day he was alive? SCUM.

Meh, again, I'm not really concerned as long as you flip SK. That was actually the only example of motivator as scum I found on the entire site. I mainly posted that to heckle you for your adamancy that it was not a scum role.

Then obviously you didn't read the arguments, because that didn't happen till a couple posts before I claimed. I was already heavily wagoned by that time. And, at least 3 people claimed my "one power immunity" was just a failed gambit and made up in order to protect against the roleblock accusation. You sir, need to read more carefully.

People thought it was a failed gambit because your claim was poorly executed: You claimed blacksmith and moments later claimed to have one power immunity on the side. That didn't add up, and in the end we got it right, even though it was a good attempt. I think it's pretty arrogant of you to shout about how wrong everyone was when you were caught for fairly valid reasons, but hey, whatever. I don't care that much.

[Albert B. Rampage]

We should lynch Isacc today and Kairyuu tomorrow.

[SpyreX]

I definitely agree with Issac. Kai is a decent probability but depending on night actions / Issacs flip we may disagree tomorrow.

So...now you're saying that you have some kind of role based info telling you you never would have become a SK, even if you hadn't been Gentled? Do you know something now you didn't know yesterday?

Yes. I can not go into details. But yes.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Oh yeah one more thing. Don't pay any attention to what Isacc says. Don't even address him. We don't care what he says, he's irrelevant to discussion now.

[MrBuddyLee]

When Kai hangs, people better take a goooood look at the people pushing him. Unlike with Fabian, I think I'm right about this one (as logic leaves no other probable solution...)

At this point, I'm willing to accept Kaiyruu's explanation that he's a bad mafia player and overtrusted his real life friend who turned out to be a serial killer. If you turn out to be scum and not SK, though, Kira should absolutely be vigged and/or lynched tomorrow.

Illogical behavior is so frustrating...

Not really. It was totally illogical for you to claim SK at L-4, but I don't find that the least bit frustrating--I find it refreshing as a romp in a field of peonies.

You sir, need to read more carefully.

So do you, apparently. You were 0-for-3 on your scumcalls yesterday, and I suspect you're 0-for-3 again today with {MoS, armlx, MBL}.

MBL is being stupid, Kairyuu is overreacting by assuming everyone thinks he is cheating when it's only MBL goading him

for no real reason.

They both need to get real.

You should know better than this.

Oh yeah one more thing. Don't pay any attention to what Isacc says. Don't even address him. We don't care what he says, he's irrelevant to discussion now.

Actually, he's provided us with relevant info since he confessed. Regarding his nightkills, regarding the way locations work for killers, etc. Granted, he could be lying, but pumping him for info certainly doesn't hurt.

C'mon, OozingGoofball.

vote: Isacc

[Mr. Flay]

Albert, why did you ignore MoS' 984? He's not talking about Kairyuu, he's talking about Fabian and why you ignored the claim to detect Saidar.

I don't understand your query.

Rephrase what you want to know as if you were the one asking the question.

"Did you or did you not detect Saidar usage yesterday when Fabian claimed to have done so (either time)? If not, why didn't you take that as confirmation that Fabian was lying about his 'Lesser Detect Saidar' ability?"

Since a blacksmith isn't an Aes Sedai, either there's a Masonic Majority^TM out there, or that's awfully coincidental.

Can you elaborate on this a bit more? What do you mean by Masonic Majority?

Sorry, I just meant that we've already gotten two role claims by Aes Sedai who claim to have partners (not each other). Two of those are White, which may mean there's as many as 8 or more, each a Mason/Neighbor pair. Add in what I thought was a BlackSmith+Butler Mason pair (now obviously false), and it starts to look like there's a whole lot of Masons in the game.

Unvote, Vote: Isacc

- yes, it's theoretically possible we could use a claimed SK as a weapon, but I'm not counting on it. Also, THREE "dismemberment" kills last night makes me think we're dealing with a Gholam Mafia, not SK. The motivator claim accounts for two, but I'm guessing they get X kills/Y days or something, and killed

en masse

early because of KoC's roleclaim. Or they are lost siblings and have to find each other before they become a pair/triad/whatever. In any case, the nightkills don't match up to the roles thus far.

Isacc:

If you want to help the town, answer this: Was your role name "Conmeal Lud" given to you as a safe claim?

Why did you motivate Isaac last night, after he spent the entire day trying to prevent us from lynching one of the Forsaken?

Not that I disagree with the general gist of your concern (Kairyuu motivating Isacc instead of one of the Aes Sedai), but we didn't know Fabian was a Forsaken until Daybreak. He could have been anything at that point (probably not town, but you know what I mean).

[Moratorium]

Before someone tries to sneak this lynch through before our last replacement claims their location, let me just point out that with Flay's vote,

Isacc is now L-2.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Unvote

, until we get the last location claim.

With today's lynch out of the way, might as well move on to other business. I'm thinking Mr. Flay is our next scum.

ABR, if Mr. Flay is scum, chances are he can channel. Do you think he's more likely to be male or female?

[Mr. Flay]

Also, I'm pretty sure that's the first time I've ever been accused of being scum for knowing too much about the theme.

However, Issac being SK does lend a large amount of credence to a second Gholam running around based on kill flavor. I could, definitely, see that being Flay.

Well that means my hunch was right about the NKs, but it also means that there is likely a seond Gholam-SK that we need to look out for. There's another theory, but it's ugly and I'll explain it tomorrow after we get another datapoint.

Flay would be my first hunch since he was the only one to bring up the word Gholam in the thread (I've never heard of the things).

Huh? Why am I a likely Gholam? I'm not even going to bother quoting Isacc's bandwagoning on this stupid idea. This is a trivial hypothesis to disprove - someone just needs to target me with a direct weave and get a result.

Kairyuu's unvoting of Isacc after speedlynch danger was gone is noted.

Oozing, claim your sleeping location from last night ASAP.

[Mr. Flay]

EBWOP:

You killed two power roles last night, and you keep trying to convince people I am scum after I nailed 2 scum. Neither of those actions are protown.

Okay, Isacc finally made some sense again. Why do you assume hasfgdas was a power role?

You seem to be making an awful lot of assumptions there. IF I'm scum, why would I be a channeler? Why do you think I'm the next best lynch, anyway? I haven't seen anything like a case from you, just bald statements.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I didn't assume hasdgfas had a power role. It should be pretty obvious that I typed that part of my post before it was revealed that Isacc didn't kill SK.

You'd be a channeler because most of the scum in the books could channel. It's possible you're not, but I don't think the discussion is invalid just because the possibility exists. It's also *possible* you are protown, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss you being scum, either.

As far as why I think you're scum, I've been voting/FoSing you since day 1. I dropped my vote off you to go after Fabian, remember? Your "jester" actions seem completely scum-motivated, your actions regarding Fabian lead me to believe you're a possible scumbuddy of his (passive defense, early attack on a premise that is easily dropped, etc), and calling out SK as an Aes Sedai doesn't sit well with me (including the subsequent backtracking when you got called on it).

[Albert B. Rampage]

Don't vote for Isacc anymore until we get a location claim.

Albert, why did you ignore MoS' 984? He's not talking about Kairyuu, he's talking about Fabian and why you ignored the claim to detect Saidar.

I don't understand your query.

Rephrase what you want to know as if you were the one asking the question.

"Did you or did you not detect Saidar usage yesterday when Fabian claimed to have done so (either time)? If not, why didn't you take that as confirmation that Fabian was lying about his 'Lesser Detect Saidar' ability?"

I

did

bring it up. Reading times ahead for you Mr.Flay.

@MoS

Dunno. Scum is scum.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Oozing? Why not just call him zwet?

[Mastermind of Sin]

@MoS

Dunno. Scum is scum.

Well, the difference being that since we are already lynching scum today, whatever channelers we have left should gentle/still Flay tonight, we just have to decide what he is first.

[Albert B. Rampage]

If Flay does an IP check on OozingGolfBall then I will consider him pro-town.

[Benmage]

@MoS

Dunno. Scum is scum.

Well, the difference being that since we are already lynching scum today, whatever channelers we have left should gentle/still Flay tonight, we just have to decide what he is first.

Look at the mini AS abilities. They have some pretty powerful stuff. To force them to gentle/still is questionable...first of all they have to decide which action to take gentle or still...Secondly ABR said it requires 3 to gentle and both ABR and SK mentioned they were in pairs, so it'll have to be agreed upon on the forum somehow to gentle since it requires three.

[Benmage]

Also you have to convince all that flay is what you believe him to be, and so far I've only seen you considering this option.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Benmage, unvote so the scum don't quicklynch.

[MrBuddyLee]

At this point it's not even remotely quicklynch. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[SpyreX]

I am against gentling flay tonight. Lynch him or be done - unless you think he's cookoopuffs like I was the gentle is a waste of more useful PR's. If you think he's scum, lynch him.

Not to mention my tinfoil hat theorm about how terribad it would be to suggest something like that if there was a scum watcher. Even I yesterday said that gentling me was a bad idea.

ON A RELATED NOTE:

@ABR, did your partner get a "gentling successful" message? I mean, I know it worked but did they?

[Albert B. Rampage]

At this point it's not even remotely quicklynch. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Why end the day? We already know what the lynch scene will reveal. This isn't War in Heaven mafia, we're not under pressure to kill quickly. The more evidence we have, the better. Also, its fun to watch Isacc squirm

[Albert B. Rampage]

@ABR, did your partner get a "gentling successful" message? I mean, I know it worked but did they?

I doubt it.