Wheel of Time Mafia: Rip in the Pattern (GAME OVER)

[Albert B. Rampage]

Also, reveal what your results have been so far.

[Benmage]

I like the idea of testing on Spryex to see if he was really gentled. As far as outing who he used n1/twilight1...sure i don't see it being bad as scum already know who aren't scum, and this can help confirm/enlighten the rest of us.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Flay use your ability on Spyrex to see if he told the truth about him being gentled.

This.

[Seraphim]

Flay, just claim dude. Gotta give the people what they want.

This is strange wording. You seem to be daytalking scum with him. Please note that lie detection abilities CAN BE FAKED, as in Mind Screw Mafia III (ask Seraphim).

Absolutely. This is so true. There are other abilities than can be used in place of a lie detector to create the fallacy of a lie detector.

[SpyreX]

I'm totally down:

I was gentled last night.

[SpyreX]

(mind you that this, of course, isn't the absolute best use of it because if Flay IS scum he, of course, is going to say I am telling the truth but hay)

[MacavityLock]

I'm not sure if this is best use either. Once again, we get into the issue that we need to have either Flay or SpyreX dead to figure out whether or not the lie-detecting worked. I think if we really want to do this, we need to think of something that can be confirmed or refuted by a 3rd party. However, this could have the potential issue of outing some other power role. Either way, we shouldn't be cavalier about this test.

However, if we do go through with this, I don't want it screwing up on a technicality. SpyreX, you need to amend your statement to "I was gentled over Twilight 1." I'm not sure whether or not that counts as "last night" at this point.

[SpyreX]

Fair enough:

I was gentled over the Twilight 1.

And, yes, really this isn't going to help because scum should be REAL good at faking lie detector. Nor, really, is it going to be useful because if its one target per day short of us all going "I am town" EVERY day and Flay hitting the right person (i.e. playing cop) are the scum going to overtly lie.

But, I'll play along.

[Mr. Flay]

Flay use your ability on Spyrex to see if he told the truth about him being gentled.

That's what I tried to do yesterday actually. The global block thwarted me.

Moratorium: My D1 target is still alive, yes, so I'll declare them before I die if I still get lynched, but not before without good reason (like a bandwagon).

Others: I can work with an entire post not just a single declarative statement, so I'd prefer if it combined truth and lies. The difficulty being that it can't be someone who is an Aes Sedai, for that reason... so either it's someone we already know not to be one, or who doesn't mind being outed. And I'd *really* prefer that the statements be about the game, not what they had for lunch, since I only get this once a day. Sleeping locations, especially from last night when everything apparently got blocked, seems a weak use.

[Faraday]

(mind you that this, of course, isn't the absolute best use of it because if Flay IS scum he, of course, is going to say I am telling the truth but hay)

This.

He's just going to say you were gentled, and even if you weren't

you're

not going to contradict him, I believe you were btw but this is kinda testing Flay...so idk

[SpyreX]

Flay, I can understand not giving out details on your ability but if you are telling the truth depending on how this works we MAY be able to make it really, really useful:

So, couple questions before I make up a bunch of statements to check the validity since I think I am a good pig for it.

1.) Do you get a "X has lied" or "This statement by X is a lie."

2.) Further, and this is tricky: does it have to be, like the aes sedai, where if they believe it it is true OR is it a binary (this is a lie / this isn't a lie) regardless of whether or not they believe it.

[Albert B. Rampage]

Unvote, vote: Flay

Flay's claim is kinda bleh. Go ahead and lynch him.

[MrBuddyLee]

Flay's confidence leads me to believe he has this ability, and now it should be debated whether or not scum would be given lie detection. My guess is no.

unvote

[Faraday]

Flay's confidence leads me to believe he has this ability, and now it should be debated whether or not scum would be given lie detection. My guess is no.

unvote

Hmm, it's not a useful abillity for scum, really is it? The only way it could be seen as useful is to make them look town or to give them a confirmable abillity or something like that.

I've never heard of a scum lie detector though.

[Sajin]

That power is interesting. Can you use it on posts from day 1 on day 2? Or is it only statements made that day?

[Mr. Flay]

(mind you that this, of course, isn't the absolute best use of it because if Flay IS scum he, of course, is going to say I am telling the truth but hay)

This.

He's just going to say you were gentled, and even if you weren't

you're

not going to contradict him, I believe you were btw but this is kinda testing Flay...so idk

Huh? Why would I (lie and) say he was gentled when I've been arguing all along that we don't know he's gentled?

Flay, I can understand not giving out details on your ability ... So, couple questions before I make up a bunch of statements to check the validity since I think I am a good pig for it.

I am perfectly willing to target you with it again, since you seem a good candidate in that you already have a non-AS claim out there, and you are a big question mark in my book.

1.) Do you get a "X has lied" or "This statement by X is a lie."

I get the whole post back, with both lies and truthful statements marked.

2.) Further, and this is tricky: does it have to be, like the aes sedai, where if they believe it it is true OR is it a binary (this is a lie / this isn't a lie) regardless of whether or not they believe it.

I don't know what happens if the post has subjective statements, but my guess is they'll either be unmarked or marked truthful if the mod doesn't know outright that they're a lie/false "belief". That seems to dovetail with the Aes Sedai prohibition on lying.

Flay's claim is kinda bleh. Go ahead and lynch him.

This post makes no sense. Expand please on why you think it's "bleh"? The lack of details on mechanics? Stay tuned...

That power is interesting. Can you use it on posts from day 1 on day 2? Or is it only statements made that day?

I'd rather not say at present.

[Faraday]

(mind you that this, of course, isn't the absolute best use of it because if Flay IS scum he, of course, is going to say I am telling the truth but hay)

This.

He's just going to say you were gentled, and even if you weren't

you're

not going to contradict him, I believe you were btw but this is kinda testing Flay...so idk

Huh? Why would I (lie and) say he was gentled when I've been arguing all along that we don't know he's gentled?

I was saying from the point of view if you didn't have the abillity and were winging it (which is kinda what the test is to prove right?) that you'd just say he was gentled, as SpyreX would be unlikely to contradict you. meh maybe it didn't make much sense though.

Anyway

Unvote

I already said I think it's pretty believeable aswell as being a helpful abillity.

[SpyreX]

Flay, I was thinking more along the lines of "hypothetically" I went:

"The person posting the notes is town."

See, -I- dont know if that is true or false. However, the mod would know if that was a factual statement.

[Yosarian2]

MoS, I volunteer to have Flay lie-detect my sleeping location last night.

I don't see how this confirms anyone. MBL could lie and/or Flay could lie about this. I don't see how Yos's suggestion works either. Mod's not going to tell us anything one way or the other. All either of these things would do is force us to lynch one or the other of Flay and his lie-detecting target.

Huh?

No, the mod won't tell us. If Flay is telling the truth, the mod will tell him the results of his "investigation", and then MBL (or whoever) can either confirm or deny that, and we'll know if Flay was telling the truth or not. It wouldn't "force" us to lynch anyone; unless you are suggesting that you think MBL and Flay are scum together and they're orcistrating this whole thing for the town's benifit?

And, yes, really this isn't going to help because scum should be REAL good at faking lie detector.

Huh? I don't get this. How? If MBL says "I was in the stables last night", there's no way the scum would know if he was telling the truth or not. If Flay is lying about his lie-detector ability, we should be able to trap him in a lie here.

Nor, really, is it going to be useful because if its one target per day short of us all going "I am town" EVERY day and Flay hitting the right person (i.e. playing cop) are the scum going to overtly lie.

Eh, it actually looks like a pretty powerful investigative role to me he's claiming; not quite a cop, but pretty strong, probably stronger then, say, a tracker.

[Slicey]

43rd post: wait wait wait. If Issac can detect OP, and he detected it at the Blacksmith, that would mean either Kairyuu or MBL used One Power and probably killed SK. Kairyuu is a claimed motivator. MBL must have used the OP to kill SK.

Isacc said that dismemberment kills aren't one power, and SK died by dismemberment. KoC was the one who was actually burned. Why would you accuse me of killing SK instead of KoC with the OP?

Screw your head on, son. I'm not scum. If I was, and if Isacc had the slightest evidence I was scum, he would have said so. Instead, he said "one of MoS, MBL, armlx are scum because they're following Yos". Give me a break.

And did Isacc even have OP detection? Where are you getting that?

I suppose it took a lot of effort for you to put together that post, but man it's off-base. Keep trying though--it's better than being silent.

And for the final time, I was right about Kairyuu and Isacc. There was something fishy there, I traced it to their real life friendship, and it turned out that Kairyuu made a terrible play because he

trusted a real life friend

who turned out to be the Serial Killer

even though they disagreed on everything in-game

. Putting pressure on them got Isacc to confess. They let their real life friendship contaminate this game, they were spanked, and we're done with it. Move on.

I didn't really understand that post, which is why I most likely misinterpreted it. And I think you said he had OP detection... oh wait, I just checked, and you said you thought Issac had OP detection, and then auto assumed that that was Kairyuu using OP to kill SK. But yeah, I misinterpreted that post. My apologies.

As for Flay's claim... I'm not totally sold on it. Does it make sense flavor wise for a horse trader to be a lie detector? And plus, there's no way to really prove it until whoever Flay checked dies.

[MacavityLock]

It wouldn't "force" us to lynch anyone; unless you are suggesting that you think MBL and Flay are scum together and they're orcistrating this whole thing for the town's benifit?

Yes, this is totally plausible. Not only that, if MBL is scum and Flay isn't, MBL might not confirm. I don't think that the location-confirming test tells us anything.

[Kison]

Since everyone presumably told the truth about where they slept(or would be unwilling to admit to lying as it would have been a deceitful act), I can't think of any fool-proof way of putting Flay's ability to the test

today

. I agree that using it on Spyrex seems to be the best course of action at this point, and then having a multitude of lies/truths in a post at some point tomorrow. I'm also against selecting the person who tells the truth/lie on the basis of volunteering, as we need to be as sure as we can that whoever it is that Flay is 'lie detecting' is not aligned with him.

I'm not really sure I believe the claim, but I think we can afford to test it as long as we do so wisely.

[Benmage]

I think we should test in on SpryeX

[Mastermind of Sin]

V/LA till Tuesday, then V/LA from Thursday to Monday next week.

[armlx]

Mod, see sig. If necessary, replace me