Mafia 96 - Murder in Emerald City (Game Over!)

[Xylthixlm]

so roflcopter - did you think wickedestjr was scummy before the claim, or not?

not particularly. i found him less scummy because you were voting him, actually

So wait

You found him less scummy because you thought I was scum and I was voting him

You found me scummy because I was voting him and you didn't think he was scum

Do I have the logic right there?

[roflcopter]

i immediately found you scummy for starting the day by making a commentless vote based on your idea yesterday that wicked and mastin were linked. the fact that this vote was on wicked, who i didn't find particularly likely to be cerulean, made me less suspicious of him altogether, because i don't find you particularly likely to be cerulean either, and i didn't think you would be voting for your partner.

simple, really.

[Xylthixlm]

So your real assumption here is that I care which sort of scum I lynch, and therefore the fact that I was voting someone who I should think is Cerulean is the wrong move

First, your assumption that I care which scum I lynch is wrong

Second, even if I can tie someone to one scumteam or another, we want to lynch Cerulean first and eliminate them to reduce the number of nightkills. If we got Cerulean today that would put us in a very good position for the rest of the game (assuming 3 scum per team)

Once you've got that out of the way, you're basically voting me for voting someone based mostly on gut, which you know very well is part of my normal town play

[Xylthixlm]

Actually scratch that second point, lynching Vermillion is better. I always get the relative power of 1st and 2nd mafia on a team confused

[Xylthixlm]

Of course, as said before, I'd be perfectly happy lynching either one

[curiouskarmadog]

In short, about the claims - I think it's possible we have 2x neighbors and 1x masons but I suspect one of the neighbors to have scum in the pair. If we get a claim from the remaining neighbor - that doesn't help scum, but it will confirm there being 2 sets and we can then have a look and see if one of the remaining neighbors look particularly scummy.

The other neighbour may be scum. Which means they probably won't claim just to drop me in the soup.

What makes you say that? The other neighbours were town, why would your partner be scum?

I would like to know who your partner is.....if your partner denies being your partner, then we nail him tomorrow...there is no reason for your partner (at this point in the game) not to back up your claim.

[Xylthixlm]

I am an Emerald Neighbour. My neighbour was Empking's Alt - and only him. This evidently means that there is another neighbour pairing in Mufasa and someone else.

[molestargazer]

What makes you say that? The other neighbours were town, why would your partner be scum?

I would like to know who your partner is.....if your partner denies being your partner, then we nail him tomorrow...there is no reason for your partner (at this point in the game) not to back up your claim.

You misunderstand.
My partner is dead. Therefore, someone else must have been neighboured with Mufasa.
They might be scum or town, we don't know.

[Xylthixlm]

unvote, vote mastin

. I am mufasa's alt.

Hmmmmmm.

[curiouskarmadog]

ah missed that.

unvote, vote mastin

. I am mufasa's alt.

Hmmmmmm.

Lowell care to comment? (doubtful).

[Hayker]

interesting find.

So who here is willing to accept 4 mafia members in each?

[Xylthixlm]

If the power role density in the remaining protown players is anything like the density in the dead protown players, 4 members in each mafia is a distinct (and scary) possibility.

[Xylthixlm]

I went back to look at this, thinking wicked's "result" might have been a mason breadcrumb if it was on hayker, but no it wasn't. It's still really strange. It totally looks like a backpedal. This was a big reason for my attack on wicked.

I got an innocent result from Kmd last night too. I was just interested in hearing what others thought about him. I am not worried about Kmd being suspicious of me. He said it was only gut any way.

Oh, I read Kmd in iso last night. And I got a town read on him. Sorry that I worded that strangely.

Wicked, can you reconstruct the thought process that caused you to word "I got a town read" as "I got an innocent result"?

[Kmd4390]

we are NOT testlynching a mason

No, testlynching would be dumb. We only lynch if we think they are scum. Right now, I'm nowhere near sure enough. Moar Nam votes plz, kthx.

kmd, what criteria are you using to order your suspicion list.

Players who I think are more likely to be scum go higher on the list.

you are not a colossal idiot, so stop acting like one. you utterly failed to actually answer my question, and you know it.

You want me to explain why I think players are scum. Well, I am a gut player. I use gut to find scum. If I need to build a case based on logic, I'm only doing it to convince everyone else. Well, that and I trust VC analysis.

the more i look at it, the more ridiculous that suggestion to testlynch a mason becomes.

Quit using this term. It's not a testlynch if you think they are scum.

So let's see if I understand this

I brought up a possible partner-based tell on Wickedestjr. Because I linked him to Mastin, and therefore thought he's Cerulean, roflcopter accused me of selective scumhunting. Mastin came up Vermillion, and now roflcopter is pressing the case that ... I am selectively scumhunting for Ceruleans by linking people to Vermillions?

If you believe that I have a bridge in brooklyn to sell you

Wait, Mastin

was

Cerulean

shit, I need to do this when I'm awake

Ok, I'm having trouble WIFOMing this myself, so I'm gonna what others think. If Xyl honestly forgot what team Mastin was, he's town. If he was scumbuddies with Mastin, he'd have remembered. If he wasn't scum with Mastin, but was scum, he'd have remembered. Variables include: he somehow forgot anyway, he misspoke, he did this intentionally. I was starting to think Xyl is scum, but not so sure now.

interesting find.

So who here is willing to accept 4 mafia members in each?

It's possible.

[roflcopter]

what i want to know, kmd, is why nam is a better lynch than xyl. give me something more than "gut."

[Kmd4390]

Rofl,

So let's see if I understand this

I brought up a possible partner-based tell on Wickedestjr. Because I linked him to Mastin, and therefore thought he's Cerulean, roflcopter accused me of selective scumhunting. Mastin came up Vermillion, and now roflcopter is pressing the case that ... I am selectively scumhunting for Ceruleans by linking people to Vermillions?

If you believe that I have a bridge in brooklyn to sell you

Wait, Mastin

was

Cerulean

shit, I need to do this when I'm awake

Ok, I'm having trouble WIFOMing this myself, so I'm gonna what others think. If Xyl honestly forgot what team Mastin was, he's town. If he was scumbuddies with Mastin, he'd have remembered. If he wasn't scum with Mastin, but was scum, he'd have remembered. Variables include: he somehow forgot anyway, he misspoke, he did this intentionally. I was starting to think Xyl is scum, but not so sure now.

[Wickedestjr]

Every game I have played prior to this game. I have been lynched. And I have played 5 games of mafia prior to this one. Not all on this site though. Regardless of my allignment, I always give people the impression that I am scum. That is probably the reason why you and Xyl think I am scum.

Appeal to emotion isn't going to change the pattern.

I wasn't planning on having everybody being sympathetic towards me because of that quote. I was just pointing it out.

[roflcopter]

kmd, that explanation fails hard, because xyl's little he's-red-no-he's-blue maneuver came

after

you decided nam deserved your vote more than xyl

why was nam more deserving of your vote than xyl WHEN YOU PLACED THE NAM VOTE

[Kmd4390]

kmd, that explanation fails hard, because xyl's little he's-red-no-he's-blue maneuver came

after

you decided nam deserved your vote more than xyl

But I was going to switch until that.

why was nam more deserving of your vote than xyl WHEN YOU PLACED THE NAM VOTE

Are you asking me to build a case on Nam? All I have right now is gut/VC analysis, but I'm willing to go through his posts for a case if you'd like.

[roflcopter]

no, i understand the case on nam, i want you to go through your thought process when it came time to vote one or the other and explain why you chose nam

[roflcopter]

So, conclusions:
Vermilion is 2 of:

Wicked

Nam
Serial

Xyl

Cerulean is 1 of:
Lowell
Faraday
Molest
Xyl

Ok, Xyl fits as either I think. I still say he could have bussed as his vote was relatively late and Mastin was pretty much going to be lynched. Also, I'm removing Wicked. He's a mason with Hayker.

Vote Nam

you made a valid point against xyl yet still voted nam...

what makes you think nam could be vermillion but not cerulean?

[Wickedestjr]

I went back to look at this, thinking wicked's "result" might have been a mason breadcrumb if it was on hayker, but no it wasn't. It's still really strange. It totally looks like a backpedal. This was a big reason for my attack on wicked.

I got an innocent result from Kmd last night too. I was just interested in hearing what others thought about him. I am not worried about Kmd being suspicious of me. He said it was only gut any way.

Oh, I read Kmd in iso last night. And I got a town read on him. Sorry that I worded that strangely.

Wicked, can you reconstruct the thought process that caused you to word "I got a town read" as "I got an innocent result"?

If this is one of the reasons for why you wanted me lynch, then why did you not say it until now? Also, when I said I got an innocent result, I meant the result from my iso reading of him. I am sure I have said this somewhere else.

[Xylthixlm]

Wicked, can you reconstruct the thought process that caused you to word "I got a town read" as "I got an innocent result"?

If this is one of the reasons for why you wanted me lynch, then why did you not say it until now?

I usually start bandwagons without giving all (or any) of my reasons. It helps figure out who is actually scumhunting.

Also, when I said I got an innocent result, I meant the result from my iso reading of him. I am sure I have said this somewhere else.

I know that's what you said. I want to know if you can explain what would lead you to make that mistake in the first place.

[Wickedestjr]

What is VC analysis? I saw Kmd mention it a few times.

Also, I still don't understand what neighbours are. Can somebody explain to me what they are? Once I get a better understanding, I may be able to give my opinion about it.

Also, what is strawman?

[Xylthixlm]

VC = vote count

"Neighbour" is another name for unconfirmed mason

Strawman is the classical logical fallacy where you misrepresent your opponent's argument then attack the misrepresentation