Mini 829 - Internal Struggle Mafia (Over)

[hiphop]

@idk I must follow up on the question that para asked you, because you didn’t answer it. I was thinking the same thing that he asked you when I read post 543. How is my vote opportunism? I unvoted because I was getting a town read from you. It would opportunism to stay because easily you would have been lynched. Drk would have without a doubt cast the hammer vote. I find it better to lynch Jason instead of you. You are looking too hard for a reason for my every post.

just because some of ik's recent actions make him look town, it shouldn't excuse his earlier play.

It is about time somebody told you happened on page 2,3,and 4 since you will not read them. I look the most suspicious on those pages, should I not be excused earlier play like IK?

[RedCoyote]

RC, I hate policy lynches. It's one thing to hate anti-town behavior (I still don't get how it was), it's another to lynch someone purely based off of one instance of it. Two wrongs don't make a right.

And I'm not rationalizing. I'm reasoning. Of course, you wouldn't accept that if I told you, would you?

Ik, in as inoffensively and non-personally as I can say it, you are not playing this game well. I'm not trying to be rude, insult you, or anything like that. Look, I'm not trying to pin you to anything here, okay? Gloves off for a second, off the record, whatever you want to call it: Do you really, truly, deep down, not see anything wrong with calling attention to players you think are power roles?

---

What is your case on Jason? And could you show us your patented scumscale?

At the sake of sounding as though I am piggybacking, jason has, frankly, been a little fake sounding. I'm none too happy with his ability to chime in, coincidentally, when he feels threatened. He asks questions that, if he follows up on them, seem to lead no where. He makes aimless observations that never seem to feel like they have much meaning to them,

And again [DRK seems] happy to go with the majority of the town... happy with whatever lynch. I would not be a sorce of good information... im less blatently scummy than IK, even your gut is saying IK in your own words but then you vote me right after saying those three things?

Weird

Or you are just pandering to us... Sacrificing Townie, make himself look good... town thinks no... wont lynch,

you know what is better than lynching a townie? lynching a scum!

He follows others and doesn't seem to have his own, unique voice,

right now I am feeling that IK is by far the best lynch for today... I have highlighted what I thought about him in my post
however mostly everything has been covered by everyone else. Zach I am also slightly suspicious off as I feel he has been the biggest lurker, just saying he will catch up and has not. and now will not be about for a few more days.

As wrong as I think, say, Ik is, I will at least give him he is bold and unafraid to say what he feels. Shrine and ryan would be two other examples of players I don't necessarily agree with, but at least they have a clear vision on the game that they are unafraid to persue. I know jason has kind of been on the tail end of an Ik lynch for most of this game, and he voted DRK at one point. I think I could point to most other players and give you a decent summary about what they are up to and who they think is scum, but jason or Toro would likely be the hardest ones to do that with.

Another thing, for a while I had been a little weary of DTM's pushing of jason, because I am still not very comfortable with DTM, but I am comfortable with DRK, and to a lesser extent don, and I think they are both making sincere efforts to scumhunt. All three of these players have made their suspicions of jason known, which makes me feel a little more at ease than if just DTM did. This way I feel very safe that there are likely 2, maybe even 3, honest-to-goodness townies who see something wrong with jason.

And I would be glad to show you my scumscale!

[

Town

]---Paradox-----DRK--don--Ik--Toro-hiphop[

∙

]-Shrine---DTM---ryan----Zach-jason---[

Scum

]

I respect your opinion in this game a lot, Paradox. I was scratching a bit at Zach earlier, but I was sidetracked and I think he was able to smooth talk his way through to me, but I see something deeper in Zach's awkward choices of votes, and I will talk about this a little more later in the post in a response to DTM. I'm not happy with ryan's "confirm vote", which, surprise surprise, turned out to be a load of nonsense. ryan is playing a bit awkwardly as well, and I have the added benefit of having played in a game with ryan as a townie. I replaced into that game some 15 pages in, and I think that gave me a unique perspective of reading quite a bit of ryan and how the other players interacted with him. Maybe because ryan hasn't felt any real pressure this game is the reason why he is, in my opinion, having sort of a non-factoring, not-seeing-the-forest-for-the-trees kind of play. Check out post 550. ryan sounds like a bird the way he fencesits so badly there. "Toro is poor, jason is scummy, DRK seems odd too!" I don't know, I don't even know what happened to hiphop. Didn't ryan have like 5 FoS's at one point? I can't blame him too much for suspecting everybody (although I feel as though I've found a little more confidence in my read of this game since a little while ago), but I think he needs to get a grip on his play if he is town (which, as you can see, is not what I would bet on at the moment).

---

I think we could get more info out of Jason on D2

What does this mean? I really don't understand your vote for Toro after your post 543.

---

stay the course. lynch ik. his actions have been questionable and people are tieing themselves to the wagon one way or the other. would another wagon net info as well? absolutely, but we shouldn't be forgetting that ik has already claimed vanilla. with one pr out in the open and a second speculatively soft claimed, further pushing is a bit ludicrous.

I understand your point, but this contradicts your earlier position that you would be comfortable lynching jason. I can't let you get away with that sort of shift.

mod: i approve a deadline extension.

In case anyone is wondering, this should be seen unmistakably as a townie move.

I would also have supported this, for what it's worth.

---

Now that we have enough players voting for an extension,

unvote: jason

. We have 48 extra hours and there's no use letting them go to waste

Why are you unvoting without revoting? This is a little bit of pot calling the kettle black, I admit, but at least when I unvoted earlier the don't lynch Ik sentiment was already taking hold and I specifically quoted something that made me nervous about the lynch. This move seems a little too much like pandering, in my opinion.

---

i find you to be a perfectly acceptable day 1 lynch. if you flip town then i think you will have helped town tremendously as it would confirm many of the suspicions currently being discussed.

Explain the second sentence more clearly please.

---

Well we are/were in a deadline situation. Any lynch is better than none is it not?

Zach, in as clearly and in as few words as possible, according to your own read of the game, you don't see anything so prohibitively townie in either jason, Toro, DRK, or Ik that you would be uncomfortable lynching them? I am not talking about last minute, you have the hammer situations, although you are welcome to include that caution if you'd like.

---

I am town, I can see your POV, but you might be looking too hard into it.

The question was rhetorical, by the way. I'm sure you don't have anything up your sleeve but perhaps a calculator wrist watch. XD

Anyways, we shall see. I'm basing at least some of my future read based on some of these connections I am picking up...

Also can you outline the connections that you see right now, this could be important for the coming days.

Absolutely. It's a little preliminary, on account that we have nothing sure to go off of, but I see a Zach and jason connection like nobody's business. jason oh-so-subtlely showed what I think to be fake suspicons of Zach earlier on in this game in what may have been an attempt to distance. I think they're fake because I don't recall jason ever really following through with them, which strikes me as odd because it's not as though jason had much else uniquely going for him. I'm kind of working on a hiphop-DRK thing, and as well as something between you and Ik, but given my inability to comfortably put you as town or not, I'm not sure how safe I feel calling anything reliable based on it.

My prediction right now is either Zach and jason are both scum, or one of them is. I do not think they are both town.

---

Mod

, is it time to give Shrine a prod? I just want to make sure he gets another post in before the deadline.

[Idiotking]

@idk I must follow up on the question that para asked you, because you didn’t answer it. I was thinking the same thing that he asked you when I read post 543. How is my vote opportunism?

Should I have flipped town, you wouldn't have

anything

going for you. It's very possible for you to have unvoted simply to not show up on the final bandwagon. Given my opinion of your play/experience level, that wouldn't be hard to believe at all.

Ik, in as inoffensively and non-personally as I can say it, you are not playing this game well. I'm not trying to be rude, insult you, or anything like that. Look, I'm not trying to pin you to anything here, okay? Gloves off for a second, off the record, whatever you want to call it: Do you really, truly, deep down, not see anything wrong with calling attention to players you think are power roles?

Nope. I think info should be made readily available for all the town to see. If somebody breadcrumbs/soft claims, there's no point

not

to call them out on it. I hate soft claims.

Besides, I don't think Toro even has a power role. I've seen too many scum say things like "Oh look at me, I've got an awesome game-winning power role if you just let me live one more day!" to trust it. Not to mention he wasn't at immediate risk of being lynched. There was no call for it.

I think we could get more info out of Jason on D2

What does this mean? I really don't understand your vote for Toro after your post 543.

Post 543 was based on inaccurate information. I didn't know Toro was on his second game on this site and hiphop was on his first. As for Jason, I'd rather pursue his lynch on D2 if things remain the same. I'd support his lynch, but I'm not going to actively push for it. Suffice it to say I think there are better targets, and those are the ones I'm going for.

[alexhans]

My computer at work doesn't start up...

I'm using a coworker's PC right now...

Votecount soon. Prods soon.

Remember...

New Deadline:

Thursday 27th - 1000 hs (GMT - 3)

[DeathRowKitty]

Why are you unvoting without revoting?

Two reasons:
1) If everyone keeps their votes, the extension is effectively meaningless. I wanted to keep my vote completely open, even if I don't currently plan on changing it.
2) It's better to have people decide who's scummy based on their own feelings, not how many votes people have. By taking votes off, it would force others to make their own opinions. Of course, my unvote probably didn't help this much since no one else unvoted.

Besides, I don't think Toro even has a power role. I've seen too many scum say things like "Oh look at me, I've got an awesome game-winning power role if you just let me live one more day!" to trust it.

Do you really think it will hurt to let him live a little longer, perhaps long enough to have a chance to validate his claim? There's no reason to lynch a claimed townie PR day 1 unless there's very strong evidence that person is lying.

Mod, I think/hope you meant

Thursday

27th.

I do... Fixed. That's what you get for using Ctrl-c...

[alexhans]

Those in danger of suppression #22:

Idiotking (4)

-

don_johnson, Toro, jasonT1981, Zachrulez

toro (3)

-

Shrinehme, ryan2754, Idiotking

jasonT1981 (2)

-

hiphop, RedCoyote

Zachrulez (1)

-

Paradoxombie

Not Voting (1)

-

DTMaster, DeathRowKitty

Happiness with Posting Level:

HAPPY

Deadline:

Thursday 27th - 1000 hs (GMT - 3) (~=47 hs from now)

With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

[Zachrulez]

Nope. I think info should be made readily available for all the town to see. If somebody breadcrumbs/soft claims, there's no point

not

to call them out on it. I hate soft claims.

Besides, I don't think Toro even has a power role. I've seen too many scum say things like "Oh look at me, I've got an awesome game-winning power role if you just let me live one more day!" to trust it. Not to mention he wasn't at immediate risk of being lynched. There was no call for it.

Funny coming from you. Or are you different/special because you're not a power role and full claimed rather than softclaimed?

[alexhans]

Shrinehme has been prodded (3rd time).

[don_johnson]

^^ absolutely. that's two power role claims you disbelieve and two claimed pr's you seem to want lynched.

rc: the second sentence is what i've been saying all along. many of us have suspicions of others that are based around their interaction with the ik wagon. without confirming ik's alignment the suspicions don't hold as much water. yes, another wagon and another flip would help to confirm things as well, but ik has claimed. i don't see the benefit of forcing another claim with less than 48 hours to deadline when we have a good(and relatively safe) suspect to lynch. just because we are secondguessing his alignment doesn't change the fact that he has now voted for two claimed pr's. am i skeptical of toro? a bit, but not enough to out and out push for a lynch on someone who may be able to be confirmed in other ways. ik is just playing terrible here and is either scum or misguided town. if he flips town he will be a good information lynch and town won't lose a potential power role nor risk outing yet another claim on DAY 1.

i'll lynch jason to avoid a no-lynch. but if he's scum he'll be here tomorrow. if we have a vig they might take him out tonight. we need information to have a productive day 2 and pushing someone else closer to lynch this close to deadline can be extremely detrimental to town.

[Paradoxombie]

Zach, there's a difference between being willing to vote people at deadline, and developing suspicions on those people. In a relatively short time you've developed suspicions of Toro, Jason, and IK. There were previous cases on them since much earlier, but they all became suspects of yours as it became clear they would be the best potential lynches. I understand being willing to lynch, but your suspicions read as opportunistic. All of them basically besides the one on DRK which is just strange. It makes sense to hop off the IK wagon and look for another possible lynch before deadline. But you put your vote in a strange place so close to deadline while saying how you now suspect all the possible lynches. Why wouldn't you vote someone with potential for a lynch if you suspect so many? Unless you're purposely trying to look like you're not doing what you criticized DRK for. It doesn't look genuine. You look opportunistic and your vote on DRK may just be an attempt to mask that.

^^ absolutely. that's two power role claims you disbelieve and two claimed pr's you seem to want lynched.

rc: the second sentence is what i've been saying all along. many of us have suspicions of others that are based around their interaction with the ik wagon. without confirming ik's alignment the suspicions don't hold as much water. yes, another wagon and another flip would help to confirm things as well, but ik has claimed. i don't see the benefit of forcing another claim with less than 48 hours to deadline when we have a good(and relatively safe) suspect to lynch. just because we are secondguessing his alignment doesn't change the fact that he has now voted for two claimed pr's. am i skeptical of toro? a bit, but not enough to out and out push for a lynch on someone who may be able to be confirmed in other ways. ik is just playing terrible here and is either scum or misguided town. if he flips town he will be a good information lynch and town won't lose a potential power role nor risk outing yet another claim on DAY 1.

i'll lynch jason to avoid a no-lynch. but if he's scum he'll be here tomorrow. if we have a vig they might take him out tonight. we need information to have a productive day 2 and pushing someone else closer to lynch this close to deadline can be extremely detrimental to town.

You don't even care about alignment in this choice; the mere amount of suspicion on a person makes them worth lynching? Your logic basically justifies every vote on the IK wagon, so I can't see how your going to go after the people who voted just like you.

[Paradoxombie]

mod: i approve a deadline extension.

In case anyone is wondering, this should be seen unmistakably as a townie move.

I would also have supported this, for what it's worth.

---

It seems more like a neutral tell to me since a player(me) had already asked about a deadline extension and the mod just explained how we could have one with a majority vote. I'd expect any sane player scum or town would be instantly agreeing to one.

Thinking about it though don probably would've gotten his wish of an IK lynch if there was no extension. Did you consider that don? You read as eager for night so why do you want the extension?

[Zachrulez]

Zach, there's a difference between being willing to vote people at deadline, and developing suspicions on those people. In a relatively short time you've developed suspicions of Toro, Jason, and IK. There were previous cases on them since much earlier, but they all became suspects of yours as it became clear they would be the best potential lynches. I understand being willing to lynch, but your suspicions read as opportunistic. All of them basically besides the one on DRK which is just strange. It makes sense to hop off the IK wagon and look for another possible lynch before deadline. But you put your vote in a strange place so close to deadline while saying how you now suspect all the possible lynches. Why wouldn't you vote someone with potential for a lynch if you suspect so many? Unless you're purposely trying to look like you're not doing what you criticized DRK for. It doesn't look genuine. You look opportunistic and your vote on DRK may just be an attempt to mask that.

All 3 of Jason, Toro, and IK look suspicious. DRK looks suspicious to me.

I'm most willing to lynch IK now, and I would pressure DRK if we had more time. I like to have my vote on people I would have it on under normal circumstances until pretty close to the last minute actually. (As close as I can get with my availability anyway.)

I will take a lynch of Jason or Toro if they are the only ones I can get, but would prefer others.

Take that as you will. If my actions look opportunistic because I didn't explain my thought process very well then that's just the way they look.

[Paradoxombie]

heh I didn't mean to put that emoticon in, but I kind of like how it punctuates the whole post.

[jasonT1981]

i'll lynch jason to avoid a no-lynch. but if he's scum he'll be here tomorrow. if we have a vig they might take him out tonight. we need information to have a productive day 2 and pushing someone else closer to lynch this close to deadline can be extremely detrimental to town.

I really am uncomfortable with this comment, just like I have a few of Dons posts. He will lynch just to avoid a no lynch... yet admits to not reading the game in full nor will he read the game.

He is only going on what has been posted since he came into the game and latched onto everyone elses suspicions.

Just seems he wants a lynch, any lynch without doing the work... he has already admitted he does not want to do the work (reading the game and forming his own opinions)

[hiphop]

Should I have flipped town, you wouldn't have

anything

going for you. It's very possible for you to have unvoted simply to not show up on the final bandwagon. Given my opinion of your play/experience level, that wouldn't be hard to believe at all.

It wouldn't of mattered what you flipped. I could always of said I honestly had believed you were scum. I don't now, so I unvoted. There was only one person who openly said you were most likely scum and wasn’t voting for you, and that was Drk. I believed he would of cast the hammer vote eventually if my vote remained. I don’t think you would be lynched without my vote.

It's better to have people decide who's scummy based on their own feelings, not how many votes people have. By taking votes off, it would force others to make their own opinions. Of course, my unvote probably didn't help this much since no one else unvoted.

Drk your recent unvote bothers me. Why not push for the person who you think is the most scummiest, if there is a chance that they might lynch? If others follow you wouldn’t it be better for you because you got your number one suspect of being lynched. Instead you seem to be voting and unvoting and not making any real votes. The town shifts this way and you vote. The town shifts the other way and you unvote. It doesn’t make any sense to me. Follow your own advice and push for the person who is on the top of your list that has a good chance to be lynched. You decide who is most scummy based on your decision not what the town in leaning toward.

[DeathRowKitty]

I believed [DRK] would of cast the hammer vote eventually if my vote remained. I don’t think you would be lynched without my vote.

You're kidding, right? I had the opportunity to hammer and I specifically said that no one should hammer until we were closer to the deadline. I seem to recall even suggesting that someone unvote. If we got close to the deadline (probably several hours) and IK was still alive, I would have hammered him, but no sooner. Read the thread before you make comments like this.

As for the second part, you're misinterpreting my motives. Here were the biggest lynch candidates withing the past week or so (in no particular order):
IK
jason
toro
dj

Toro and dj are now safe from lynch due to claims, leaving IK and jason, my two top suspects. Having extra votes out just gives scum something to latch onto and a way to blend in with a wagon near a deadline.

I've voiced my opinions throughout the thread. They're there for you to read. It's time for players who have been less vocal to commit to a lynch. I'm on often and I still have plenty of time to put my vote back. If you want something more committal than that, my suspicions are completely sufficient to put my vote back on jason and if nothing changes, my vote will be on jason well before deadline.

[ryan2754]

@Ryan
1. They wouldn't make a move on IK's BW? Can you elaborate this more?

I don't understand what you are completely asking. Could you make a reference to what you are confused about?

2. Can you also expand on your gut feeling with DRK?

It's mainly based off our previous game together. Granted, I have only played one game with him, but in it, he was scum with me, and although being fairly new to the boards (IIRC), he was a very meticulous player. Granted, I usually not try to bring too much meta information on, and in this instance as well, since all I have seen him play as is scum. However, I think what it was was I was misinterpreting a little of what he said in it with the whole "less blatantly" thing, which he discussed two posts after my post.

His last post just seemed to come off forced as if there was a motive.

I do as well agree that right now, although I absolutely hate softclaims or what not or implying you have a PR when you are in no danger of a lynch, I too agree that those should be addressed D2.

Also, DRK... whats with the vote hoping as of late?

Just to point out, I've used my vote conservatively this game as compared to last game, where I voted 9 times for 6 different people on Day 1.

Just because you vote hopped less this game so far doesn't mean you aren't necessarily NOT doing it this game.

[

Town

]---Paradox-----DRK--don--Ik--Toro-hiphop[

∙

]-Shrine---DTM---ryan----Zach-jason---[

Scum

]

I am actually intrigued as to why I am third on your scumlist. I feel you haven't really addressed me that much, but that's just me. Why is it that you waited until deadline to provide a case against me?

I'm not happy with ryan's "confirm vote", which, surprise surprise, turned out to be a load of nonsense.

May I ask why you consider it nonsense?

Maybe because ryan hasn't felt any real pressure this game is the reason why he is, in my opinion, having sort of a non-factoring, not-seeing-the-forest-for-the-trees kind of play.

I don't know what you mean. You think I am being a non-factor? I condier Toro a non-factor, not myself.
What do you mean by not-seeing-the-forest-for-the-trees?

Check out post 550. ryan sounds like a bird the way he fencesits so badly there. "Toro is poor, jason is scummy, DRK seems odd too!" I don't know, I don't even know what happened to hiphop.

No, you are misinterpreting my words.
Let's take a look at the post:

My opinion hasn't changed since my last post.
Toro's response to DTM was extremely subpar.

I feel IK's lynch would give information and what not, and has sparked debate, but I am less suspicious of him than I was before. I agree that his second go around with trying to get the wagon on him again is a move scum WOULDN'T make.

As for Jason, his 500 seemed more like an attempt to fit in and act as though he was scumhunting. Doesn't seem genuine.

I as well have a weird feeling about DRK's most recent post.

I mention my opinion hasn't changed. I still think Toro's response was subpar, then asks if I want him to defend himself, which I responded with "Good Lord."
I mention my opinion on IK as finding him less suspicious, which by definition means I am not fencesitting on him. Everyone has been over the whole Ik situation, and general consensus seems to think that information wise he is a good deadline lynch. Calling me somewhat suspicious for that is interesting considering I think at least have the game feels the same way.
I never say Jason is scummy - you are putting words in my mouth. Based on in his 500, I find him very suspicious. I don't understand how that is fencesitting.
With regards to DRK, I say his play strikes an odd feeling from me, a sort of gut. I expanded on that earlier in this post. I never say he is scummy or not for it, since it's just a gut feeling. It was something I wanted to say. If I had to put DRK on the ladder right now, I'd be thinking town.
What do you mean, "I don't know what happened to hiphop?"
So, having 3 suspects (toro, Jason, hiphop) is considered scummy/fencesitting if I do it, yet you have your scum list above which pretty much equates to three people? I mean, in 611, Zach calls 4 people suspicious. Is he fencesitting?

...
but I think he needs to get a grip on his play if he is town (which, as you can see, is not what I would bet on at the moment).

What the hell is this supposed to mean?

Not gonna lie, but Hiphop's accusation in 614 on DRK seems to turn into buddying/coaching. Anybody else think so?

Jason seems to be deflecting in 613.

Unvote, Vote: Jason

[DTMaster]

@RC
I don't understand why my partial pushing of Jason makes me somewhat suspicious. If you read my posts I focused more on a Toro case until the soft claim, where I dropped it like with my thoughts on don. (Sorry though I couldn't reply more, I got back to back work shifts :<)

I've outlined some suspicion on Jason throughout the day (see ISO 71). Earlier I attacked him in my ISO 39 , ISO 30 (a reminder on ISO 21) and my ISO 18/19 was my initial attack on Jason. I don't know how I was secretive about my dislike about Jason's posts but at least I made an effort to scum hunt him. You can also tack on the current town arguments against him but I'd prefer to not repeat and rehash the same things over and over when I post something.

I also agree that don's move is more pro-town considering he was the first person to request the extension. The rest of the votes should be considered null tells (even mine) for obvious reasons (ie due to time zones and such...). Even the people who didn't request an extension.

@Jason
No-lynch on day one is disastrous from an information point of view. No-lynch on mylo is a different story from a statistics point of view. Either way we should focus on a resolution by the end of the day. (This reads as a scummy statement, I know but I agree with don's statement that a lynch should occur today.)

You also ignored my question:

@Jason
Since this was asked of my by DRK, is it worth it to push a lynch on don right now? Even when I voted I felt the ideal time to deal with PR claims are day 2 onwards since the NK will serve as stronger evidence to convict or clear a person's alignment. I'm not suggesting we drop don's case, I'd prefer to revive it on day 2, same with Toro.

Also what do you have to say to the recent accusations of your scumminess based on your vote on IK?

Do you see pursing a case on don today optimal right now? Lately don has been providing a lot of town-signs rather then scum-signs. His reasoning is very sound from an information standpoint, but yours is very emotionally based. Since time is crunching down I would lean towards the more objective view that don presents. Can you elaborate why you dislike his stand point?

@Town
My judgement is: I'm uncomfortable with an IK lynch just due to all the gut and meta reasoning that is done, but I am a willing hammer. Normally I would pursue Toro, but his case is best dealt with day 2 onwards. This leaves me with my second choice and that is Jason with all the rehashed arguments that we've gone over.

Vote: Jason

[Paradoxombie]

I also agree that don's move is more pro-town considering he was the first person to request the extension. The rest of the votes should be considered null tells (even mine) for obvious reasons (ie due to time zones and such...). Even the people who didn't request an extension.

Actually I was the one to request an extension.

So you don't think IK is suspicious for posting without voting for an extension?

[DTMaster]

"rereads" Oh ok, change that reasoning to Paradox instead of don then. :3 Thanks for pointing it out!

@Your question
And, somewhat but looking at the timing IK could have easily have been in reply mode while the mod granted the deadline. He was within 10ish minutes of the post. I won't deny that IK could have posted something afterwards and you can find a scummy interpretation in that post, but it is a bit weak to submit as evidence against him.

The other evidence/arguments are much stronger anyways.

[Idiotking]

Funny coming from you. Or are you different/special because you're not a power role and full claimed rather than softclaimed?

Toro softclaimed so he could stay alive longer. I fullclaimed fully intending to die. Yes, there's a difference, if only in the reasoning behind the claims.

^^ absolutely. that's two power role claims you disbelieve and two claimed pr's you seem to want lynched.

Both were completely unnecessary and suspicious claims. And again, I hate softclaims.

[Idiotking]

And folks, I'm going to have incredibly limited activity for the next week. Tomorrow is move-in day, and I'll be busy for a very long time. I'll be as active as I can be, but I can't make any promises.

[Toro]

@IK: You really

really

want to lynch the town roleblocker? Do it.

[DeathRowKitty]

@Toro
...and you figured

now

would be the right time to claim that??? I'm pretty sure IK is the only one still looking to lynch you (except possibly shrine) and you're at

L-5

. Knowing we have a roleblocker doesn't help us much. Knowing we have a roleblocker could potentially help scum more. Why did you just claim???

[Toro]

'cause I wanted to clear my name. Why else?