Mini 836: Commie Mafia (Game Over)

[Cyberbob]

I think both sides of this argument are overreacting. I'm not sure that "Oh look this person is overreacting...SCUM" is entirely applicable when you have so many new players around (who, I've found, tend to be a tad more emotional in their posting).

The wagon was kind of dumb but I don't think it was scummy. These things happen.

Dang it, I need to get a random vote in before discussion starts:

vote mathcam

because I suck at math.

This is a pretty terrible vote. "Before discussion starts"? You're only two pages late on that score... are you sure that it's the only reason?

Vote: Peabody

[Harumafuji]

Post, Cyberbob good.

If Cyberbob, Stained glass Peabody interesting choices in this quote? Something I can not see the name of Peabody.

If the point of RVS is to get discussion rolling, why is hoopla already at L-2?

Something fishy is going on

. Honestly, I'd say I agree with CoCo, le Chat and Col.Cathart on this subject. A L-2 is not good this early.

FoS: Peabody

However, the players here and I "Coco" Finally I can read the 21 polling day.

[Talitha]

1.) Bandwagon good

2.) Coco... Not sure

3.)

vote: Peabody

That was a weird random vote when there was plenty else going on.

[Talitha]

er,

unvote: Hoopla
vote: Peabody

[CoCo]

Unvote

FOS Charter.

Early reports say both Hoopla and Vaya are town. Coco looks pretty suspect with his Vaya inquisition but ignoring the bandwagon votes of others. Looks like he's trying to build up a lynch on Vaya rather than question bandwagon votes.

unvote, vote CoCo

Charter, why are you getting a town reading on Hoopla and Vaya? Can you please point out specific posts that make you come to this conclusion?

Hoopla's reaction to the wagon on her wasn't scummy, so I'm leaning town on her.

Pretty much every post of Vaya's I've agreed with, so town there as well.

Vaya, I wouldn't continue to waste your breath defending yourself against CoCo (aka it's way too early in the game for quote wars). I can't imagine anyone is actually buying what he's selling, I'm certainly not.

Like I said, these aren't reports. They aren't even facts.

FOS Mathcam

Early reports say both Hoopla and Vaya are town. Coco looks pretty suspect with his Vaya inquisition but ignoring the bandwagon votes of others. Looks like he's trying to build up a lynch on Vaya rather than question bandwagon votes.

unvote, vote CoCo

Was going to make the same piont myself.

Unvote, vote: Coco.

.

Cam

Ahhh...I suspect Haru is a non-native speaker. That should be interesting.

And I don't think we need to be too harsh on CoCo -- certainly common wisdom raises an eyebrow at a 5-person bandwaggon in the first few posts of a game. That he finds this suspicious is not that surprising. The whole "The bandwaggon is scummy" vs. "No its not" quote war isn't particularly informative, imho.

Cam

If that's how you feel, then why are you voting for him?

Cuz there's a difference between finding someone scummy and being condescending to them?

Cam

Looks like both of them have shabby reasons for voting for me. I think some REAL explanations are due.

[charter]

It's just a phrase. Obviously I don't have any facts on anyone, it's like three pages in to the game.

My reason isn't shabby. You claimed to be questioning bandwagoners, but you weren't questioning everyone who was doing it, just Vaya. This makes me think that you don't care one way or the other about bandwagoners, you just wanted to build up a case on Vaya. You were selectively applying the logic.

Now you're OMGUSing as well.

Peabody wagon is good.

[CoCo]

Ummm, no. Where are these "early reports?" You're twisting the argument.

[charter]

Those were just my thoughts. Saying "early reports say blah and blah" is just another way of saying "well, I think blah".

[CoCo]

I don't think so. Your choice of words makes it sound as though you had additional information.

[le Chat]

no CoCo, even I understood the 'early reports' to be a phrase of speech and not a claim to have game information.

i think Harumafuji's posts make everything interesting. :]

Can we all vote to embrace Communism & Joseph Stalin? Then we all win with none of that unsightly bloodshed.

I don't know about

you

but I love America and by God I'm going to lynch all the Commie bastards.

It was a completely random early bandwagon vote. I doubt anyone on it has any real intention of getting here lynched yet, so I don't see anything wrong or scummy about it.

All 5 of you have bandwagoned Hoopla without any real intention of getting her lynched yet? I don't understand.

What do you not understand about it? Every time you bandwagon, do you always have the intention of pushing it to a lynch?

No, what I should have emphasized was the "All 5 of you" because I found it odd that you could speak for the alignment of everyone on the wagon. Sorry for seemingly digging that back up but I hadn't had a chance to respond even though things have developed after it.

I do not yet know what to think about Vaya v CoCo. I can absolutely understand now that the bandwagon didn't really threaten Hoopla (at first I saw 5 votes and immediately kneejerked "scum is on there!") once I think that if people would have made the last two votes they would have been extremely suspect so i bet nobody would hammer and that, yes, the wagon did bring about a lot of discussion more effectively than I had expected. However, CoCo is pushing very hard against Vaya and does not seem to come to the same understanding as I am. Right now though I feel like choosing between the two is just a false dilemma.

Hoopla why is it still your birthday this is ridiculous.

[le Chat]

Charter, why are you getting a town reading on Hoopla and Vaya? Can you please point out specific posts that make you come to this conclusion?

Hoopla's reaction to the wagon on her wasn't scummy, so I'm leaning town on her. Pretty much every post of Vaya's I've agreed with, so town there as well.

what would a scummy reaction from hoopla @ her 5man wagon be?

pertaining to Peabody, I understand that pb was late with the RVS vote and could have simply remarked on the game's goings-on instead but i dont see how that is a scumtell.

[Vaya]

No, what I should have emphasized was the "All 5 of you" because I found it odd that you could speak for the alignment of everyone on the wagon. Sorry for seemingly digging that back up but I hadn't had a chance to respond even though things have developed after it.

I wasn't saying that everyone on the wagon is town, I was simply saying that the act of jumping on the bandwagon probably didn't have scummy motivations behind it. So if anyone on the wagon is scum, I don't think their voting on the wagon is a sign of it.

Also, seconding what Le chat said about Peabody. I don't get why people are voting him either.

[Peabody]

This is a pretty terrible vote. "Before discussion starts"? You're only two pages late on that score... are you sure that it's the only reason? Vote: Peabody

Yup, I'm sure its the only reason.

Harumafuji, I don't see what's wrong with my wording in the quote you bolded.

Hoopla's reaction to the wagon on her wasn't scummy, so I'm leaning town on her. Pretty much every post of Vaya's I've agreed with, so town there as well.

Charter, I fail to understand your reasoning for calling both Hoopla and Vaya town. I hardly heard anything from hoopla, and the Vaya reading seems a little weak. You said you agree with everything Vaya said so far? Honestly, I find some of Vaya's posts a bit disagreeable. Can you please point out which post exactly you are referencing when you say you agree with Vaya?

Unvote; Vote Charter

[CoCo]

Exactly, Peabody. But I'm not going to vote until Mathcam explains himself (or tries to) before I make any votes.

[CoCo]

^Woah, too much coffee today, you think?

[mathcam]

What do you mean explain myself? I gave the exact reason for my vote:

Coco looks pretty suspect with his Vaya inquisition but ignoring the bandwagon votes of others. Looks like he's trying to build up a lynch on Vaya rather than question bandwagon votes.

In post 59, you call out Vaya for being opportunistic, but no one else on the bandwagon. charter mentions this in his quote in post 62. You ignore this question. He then asks again in 72:

CoCo, what makes Vaya's vote so scummy but not Sens' and mine?

You again ignore this, posting in 74, 76, 78, and several more. It's only when Vaya asks it that you respond to the argument in post 87, and even then it's a pretty pathetic excuse for a reason:

Is this post a good enough reason?

Most of the argument in that post occurred

after

Charter and I wanted an explanation, so no, it's not a good enough reason. Not by far.

You can forgive us for finding it scummy that an argument that two people agreed was a strong point against you was ignored for so long. Perhaps because you couldn't think of a valid response?

That you think

you

now deserve an explanation is laughable.

Cam

[CoCo]

Your quotes in my post 104 say otherwise.

[mathcam]

I have no idea what you're talking about. You quoted those quotes without making any additional commentary, and seem to think you've made a point. Most of those quotes are meta-mafia and hardly seem relevant.

Cam

[Hoopla]

The back and forth between Coco and co. is starting to become an irrelevant typing contest. The only thing of note coming from that was Coco's 104 which is rife with OMGUS and over-defensiveness.

I think both sides of this argument are overreacting. I'm not sure that "Oh look this person is overreacting...SCUM" is entirely applicable when you have so many new players around (who, I've found, tend to be a tad more emotional in their posting).

The wagon was kind of dumb but I don't think it was scummy. These things happen.

Dang it, I need to get a random vote in before discussion starts:

vote mathcam

because I suck at math.

This is a pretty terrible vote. "Before discussion starts"? You're only two pages late on that score... are you sure that it's the only reason?

Vote: Peabody

Good posting. This wagon needs to generate more steam.

Vote: Peabody

[Cyberbob]

This is a pretty terrible vote. "Before discussion starts"? You're only two pages late on that score... are you sure that it's the only reason? Vote: Peabody

Yup, I'm sure its the only reason.

Yeah that question was (obviously) kind of rhetorical. I'm really after a response to two questions: firstly, why you made the "random" vote in the first place when there had been 2 pages of discussion already on which you could have made a "real" one and secondly, given the aforementioned 2 pages of discussion, why you thought "before discussion starts" was an appropriate thing to say when that boat had clearly sailed.

Charter, I fail to understand your reasoning for calling both Hoopla and Vaya town. I hardly heard anything from hoopla, and the Vaya reading seems a little weak. You said you agree with everything Vaya said so far? Honestly, I find some of Vaya's posts a bit disagreeable. Can you please point out which post exactly you are referencing when you say you agree with Vaya?

Unvote; Vote Charter

This is another questionable vote. Are you always this jumpy?

[Col.Cathart]

D'oh. Late to the party, everything is said already ~^

CoCo: At first I was agreeing with you, when you argued with Vaya, but now you're just pushing the limits with Charter and Mathcam. You caught two quotes from them both, and you're mangling them to death. They both answered it. Clearly. You may like the answer or not, but there's no reason to go into circular posting. You had a question, they answered. Like it? Leave it be. Don't like it? Vote. I don't think anything more can be squeezed from this.

I think for now, that Peabody's vote was a simple mistake, not a real scum-tell. His jumpiness to vote others IS quite suspicious though.

Also, can someone translate Harumafuji's posts to me? As not an English native speaker, those posts are giving me real hard time

[CoCo]

Allow me to make myself clear.

Charter posts about early reports showing Vaya as town. When asked, he says its simply because he agrees. I want to know exactly what posts he agrees with that point town on Vaya.

Second, Mathcam quotes the post by Charter and says he was "about to make that point himself."
What point? There was nothing to go on in that post. Also, he later tells people not to be so hard on me because the wagon did indeed look suspicious. When confronted about why he's voting for me in that case, he responds saying there is a difference between finding someone scummy and being condescending. After making 104, he responds with YET ANOTHER reason that has nothing to do with the quotes in question.

And this isn't OMGUS. I actually have a reason for wanting to vote for one of them. It appears their reasons are lacking substance.

[Cyberbob]

coco/vaya/mathcam/charter argument is a giant mass of red herring, overreaction and nulltell

[charter]

I think for now, that Peabody's vote was a simple mistake, not a real scum-tell. His jumpiness to vote others IS quite suspicious though.

Why are you defending Peabody? If Peabody comes up scum, you're the first to go.

unvote, vote Peabody

coco/vaya/mathcam/charter argument is a giant mass of red herring, overreaction and nulltell

Um, no. Go back and read my post (62).

[Col.Cathart]

I think for now, that Peabody's vote was a simple mistake, not a real scum-tell. His jumpiness to vote others IS quite suspicious though.

Why are you defending Peabody? If Peabody comes up scum, you're the first to go.

unvote, vote Peabody

So I should take my torch and follow the angry mob, without even looking at the case? No thanks, this isn't Medieval. I like to see the situation from all of the angles, before deciding anything.

Also, I'm not defending him. That's his job, not mine. From my point of view, not so random 'random' vote, and little jumpiness with voting is definitely not enough for vote, especially now, when he has 4 votes already. Mild FoS at best, but nothing more IMO.