Mini 843- The Fast and the Furious Mafia! (Over-Mod Error)


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Post Post #150 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:36 am

Post by Tjoe Min Ja »

Starbuck wrote:
@Tjoe

Tjoe Min Ja wrote:
Faraday wrote:There is no real one place scum want to be. Trying to read his mind will get us no-where, I think he just simply jumped on the bandwagon. There's nothing particularly suspicious about that in and of itself.
NOWHERE?...not entirely true.some scum may use MordyS' lead as momentum to bring more vote
While what you say is true, you left off one part. What if Mordy is scum trying to lead us onto a bandwagon?

And I do agree with you that a quicklynch in no way benefits the town.
MordyS wrote:Ok, let's get things moving.

Unvote
Vote: Boxman
that's true but MordyS statement isn't strong enough to build a bandwagon
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@RossWilliam


In post 105, it seems as though you are piggybacking off of a few others cases and not making your own. There's something about your post that I really don't like. It almost seems like an overreaction without anyone actually attacking you.

Then once you are called out on it, you reply with post 114. I really don't feel that it is genuine.

You seem to just be skirting along on the backs of everyone else's cases and I do not like it.

Vote: RossWilliam
I've been asking about Ross statement there...
Tjoe Min Ja wrote:you still haven't answer my first question....look's like you are just following people and trying to build bandwagon
RossWilliam wrote:I didn't answer your first question Tjoe because it makes no sense.
Doombunny9 wrote:I may know whatTjoe was trying to say so I'll try to explain.
Ross wrote:I agree with most things being said right now about Kodamma
Now I think Tjoe was wondering what you disagree about what people are saying against kodamma. Meaning a lot of people are talking about kodamma. You agree with most. What are the things you don't agree with. I hope I've explained it well and you can answer it soon.
so I'll wait till he came with some answer.
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Post Post #151 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:51 am

Post by MordyS »

I don't buy Starbuck's case on RossWilliam. There's no evidence, or even indication of scum-behavior. The best she rises to is: You don't seem to be scum-hunting on your own. But the worst is just insinuations and interpretations:
Starbuck wrote:It almost seems like an overreaction without anyone actually attacking you.
Starbuck wrote:Then once you are called out on it, you reply with post 114. I really don't feel that it is genuine. You seem to just be skirting along on the backs of everyone else's cases and I do not like it.
I think Starbuck avoided commenting as long as possible, and then, when she had to contribute, offered some lackluster readings and some scummy scum-hunting (ie: Manufacturing scuminess where it doesn't appear to be). I'm not going to claim RossWilliam is participating as much as he could be, but that goes for a couple people. Moreso, she ironically goes after him for piggybacking in post 105, when it contains the much more infamous "giving aid and comfort (and advice) to scummies" controversy. Also, I found 114 genuine. I can't imagine a scum-ster would ACTUALLY give advice to scum. That's beyond ridiculous. No scum is that stupid.

So without further-ado, I give you scum:

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Post Post #152 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:52 am

Post by MordyS »

(Not to mention that she called me scummy, and left her vote on me, until it became evident to everyone involved that her readings on me were poor at best, and totally stretching the truth at worst. Halving her losses, she unvotes me and finds a new target. I feel pretty confident that she's scummy.)
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Post Post #153 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:15 am

Post by Starbuck »

I commented on why I unvoted you. I still think you are scummy, but I found RossWilliam to be scummier. Our vote is the only thing that we as town have, and I placed it on the person I found scummiest. Also, up until this point I really didn't have anyone scummier. I think you also forget that my original vote on you is from RVS. So the part about finding a new target is rather null when you think about it.

You are really holding the fact that I was delayed on replying because I'm in the military against me? I explained where I was, not that it is any of your business, but because with my type of job, that has to come first before anything.

You give scum? Lawl, I love when people are wrong.
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Post Post #154 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:24 am

Post by MordyS »

You are really holding the fact that I was delayed on replying because I'm in the military against me?


Yes. I hate to do so, but I've seen people use surgeries and deaths in the family as excuses to avoid culpability as scum. As far as I'm concerned, out-of-game excuses, unless accompanied by a V/LA, need to be ignored. If I didn't go after someone because they had a valid out-of-game excuse, scum could just start producing excuses whenever they needed to lurk. I'm sorry if you've got stuff going on that precludes you from playing as often as you'd like, but I can't take that as an alibi for scumity.

You give scum? Lawl, I love when people are wrong.


I love when scum don't respond to my accusations (you still haven't dealt with the reasons why your case on me was a poor and manufactured reading, and now have totally ignored that I'm calling you out on your bad RossWilliam case). If I'm wrong, defend yourself.
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Post Post #155 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:26 am

Post by Faraday »



@Faraday


In post 97, you seem to be picking apart Kodamma's response to find anything damning against him. That may not be how you meant it, but it's definitely how I read it.
Interesting interpretation, I'd say. What I meant to do was show I was in no way happy with his explanation. I don't like the last line here. I may not have meant it? Do you think I did mean to ...'find anything damning against him'.Seems to me here just because you found his post solid I should do the same, but that'd be just craaaazy.

Also what particularl parts of my post do you think I'm ....well reaching (as it seems that's what you're accusing me of).
Your response to Kodamma definitely perked my interest in you, and I think I'll be reading you in iso later.
Perked it...how? I assumed you mean you think I'm scummy/slightly scummy, but you seem to be hesitant to say so.


Welcome Spyrex. Are you scum?

More later, if you'll excuse me I'm off to get wasted.
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Post Post #156 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:00 am

Post by Starbuck »

Perked it as to I'm still neutral on my read of you, and that I need to re-read you or view you in iso.
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Post Post #157 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:11 am

Post by SpyreX »

Howdy I am your esteemed replacement.

Gimme a few to catch up on all the riveting 7 pages of action.
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Post Post #158 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 7:57 am

Post by SpyreX »

Well this is something. I'll get more detailed later today after I get all my ducks in a row but all and all not a bad start. One town and two I'd be willing to lynch. The town can stay secret for now *gasp*.

The scums though (full cases later)

RossWilliam - The classic interloper, just pokin the fires without actually contributing in the important ways... like actually voting for Kodamma when he says he's scum. And the qualitative language to boot.

Shadow Knight - Not a lot of anything. Which is disconcerting because what he DOES say (wagons like the quick wagon are null, check my meta, I only comment when "necessary" and yet that somehow isn't the major bulk of topics at hand...) makes me shake my head.

Unvote, Vote: Shadow Knight


There's a couple other reasons for this but they can wait, until the fruit is ripe.
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Post Post #159 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:13 am

Post by Shadow Knight »

Orly? I think Spyre needs to pump the brakes a bit because part of that post looks like misrepresentation. You're using "check my meta" as though I told someone to do so. In reality, someone asked me to provide meta on myself, and I declined. You're cutting "quick wagons are null" and leaving out "early on day 1". I challenge you to find examples where scum were caught starting a bandwagon right out of the RVS. As far as "the major bulk of topics" please ask me a direct question and I'll be happy to answer you.
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Post Post #160 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:18 am

Post by don_johnson »

^^^ who do you think is scum?
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Post Post #161 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 8:44 am

Post by Starbuck »

That word "misrepresentation" is being tossed around quite a bit, I think the correct word might be "misinterpretation".
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Post Post #162 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:27 am

Post by Shadow Knight »

He's mistating what I said in a manner so as to convince others of my guilt. That is misrepresentation. Misinterpretation is more benign (at least that how I use them.)

Next post will have my twisted arm given scum. I want to read a couple people in iso first.
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Post Post #163 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 10:31 am

Post by SpyreX »

Orly? I think Spyre needs to pump the brakes a bit because part of that post looks like misrepresentation. You're using "check my meta" as though I told someone to do so. In reality, someone asked me to provide meta on myself, and I declined. You're cutting "quick wagons are null" and leaving out "early on day 1". I challenge you to find examples where scum were caught starting a bandwagon right out of the RVS. As far as "the major bulk of topics" please ask me a direct question and I'll be happy to answer you.
Dag, that sure didn't take long.

But, allow me to explain in detail the issues.

1.) Meta:

You were asked by Faraday to provide meta in regards to your laying low statement.
You then said you aren't going to provide your own meta.
You then give the tools to provide said meta.

No, you didn't SAY "check my meta" but your actions bespoke the desire to have your meta checked.

In defense of a question regarding your play in this game.

2.) Wagoning:
The boxman wagon looked the the typical run-of-the-mill attempt to get out of RVS to me. I find wagons like that to be a null tell on day one. Now if someone gets run up like that tomorrow, it becomes a useful tool for comparing interactions.
You're saying quick wagons are null day 1. Which is just as false as "quick wagons are null" the general statement. As for your challenge about finding games where such a thing did happen I'm not about to go on the meta hunt but if you REALLY push me I sure will. However, if such a thing is to pass then prepared to get lynched my good man.

There is always something to be taken from every wagon. Always. Even if a wagon isn't going to get to lynching it MAY get to claiming and it also, shocker, may force a reaction that scum can bounce on. Calling it null isn't helpful.

3.) Content:

a.) Its not a function of "direct questions". Thats not how this works. It is a function of what you are participating with. Which we'll look at in depth thus:

0 - confirm
1 - be back later
2 -
Well in my initial read, I've got DJ listed as town- his posts seem genuine. I'm also interested in hearing from kodamma, although I'll hold my vote for now.
3 -
After his response, I'm willing to back off a bit for now, but I'll still be watching him. His response seems to come from a townie mindset, which is really all I've got to go one at this point in the game. He's gotten himself back to even footing, but I'm not prepared to label him a townie yet. He's correct about his vote sparking discussion (and about it putting him in the spotlight). He gets bonus points for ending the RVS (which I've never been a fan of, but that just means I like him as a player). I like that we now have interactions to analyze for later in the game as well. Overall, I'd say I'm neutral on kodamma for now. Further posts from him will hopefull change that.
4 -
When I say townie mindset, I mean that it seems like something I would post as town without sounding too... contrived is the only word I can think of to use here right now.
Bonus points don't mean town or scum (or I would have called them townie points for scum points). I just meant that I like him as a player more because he ended the RVS quickly. I meant it when I said as far as town/scum goes, my reading on him is neutral.
While townies aren't afraid to piss people off, good townies realize that while the spotlight is on them, it isn't on scum. I generally try to keep my head down during the first day unless I spot a blatant scumtell.
5 -
Sorry, for the absence. Sick friday and then I'm always busy on the weekends.
No, I'm not going to post links to previous games because I wouldn't trust a metagame analysis someone posted of themself, so I don't provide metagame analysis of myself.
As far as lurking, I don' t feel that I am. I'm commenting on everything I feel its necessary to comment on. The reason I haven't FOS'd anyone is because I don't really use FOS's. If I find someone scummy, I vote them. I haven't found anyone scummy yet this game, hence me not voting anyone yet. I don't feel the need to park my vote somewhere until its needed. I'll vote when when I make a case against someone or see a case I can agree with.
6 -
The boxman wagon looked the the typical run-of-the-mill attempt to get out of RVS to me. I find wagons like that to be a null tell on day one. Now if someone gets run up like that tomorrow, it becomes a useful tool for comparing interactions.
If your looking for long range meta, you can also check my old account both here and MTGS. I used to be draygn_mage, although I daresay my playstyle has changed in the years I was gone.
7 -
Orly? I think Spyre needs to pump the brakes a bit because part of that post looks like misrepresentation. You're using "check my meta" as though I told someone to do so. In reality, someone asked me to provide meta on myself, and I declined. You're cutting "quick wagons are null" and leaving out "early on day 1". I challenge you to find examples where scum were caught starting a bandwagon right out of the RVS. As far as "the major bulk of topics" please ask me a direct question and I'll be happy to answer you.
So, lets break this down.
0 - fluff
1 - fluff
2 - DJ is town. Interested in hearing more from Kon.
3 - Kon is neutral.
4 - Kon apparently isn't neutral (town). Rhetoric.
5 - Not going to give meta. Argument against the lurking claim. Defending having no vote placed.
6 - Wagon was null (yet, look at 3). Wagons later (which rarely, if ever, happen) would not be null.
7 - Quick reply to my post saying I'm misrepping him. Including the start of a strawman challenge!

So, what's missing?

Well, input on most of the game. I read it once and I already have a dead ringer for super town that isn't mentioned. Or analysis of the pressure on Tjoe. Or the vote on Starbuck. Or...

Well anything besides DJ being townish and Kon being neutral.

So, yea.
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Post Post #164 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:05 am

Post by afatchic »

animorpherv1 will be replacing Kodamma. Everyone give him a warm welcome, and make him feel right at home.

Also, I will be doing a votecount and all that good stuff tonight when i get home from work.
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Post Post #165 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:34 am

Post by Doombunny9 »

Welcome Spyre and animorph.

Spyre, you surprise me. I never really expect people to jump right into a lynch when they replace someone (at least you didn't jump onto a bandwagon right away :P) My question for you is why did you jump right on SK so early?

Animorph-What are your thoughts on the game so far and who do you think is the most scummy?
Mordy wrote:I think Starbuck avoided commenting as long as possible, and then, when she had to contribute, offered some lackluster readings and some scummy scum-hunting (ie: Manufacturing scuminess where it doesn't appear to be).
I don't like this, while it is true that she should have put a V/LA (if she knew she was going to be gone). People have their reasons to be gone. Now could you please explain your 2 day absence between post 107 and 131 or I may have to lynch you.

As for the rest of the game, things seem to be picking up which is awesome and I hope to post again soon.
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Post Post #166 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:39 am

Post by SpyreX »

Hit em hard. Hit em fast. No mercy.

More specifically, I just laid out my initial thoughts on scum. SK's response was 1.) fast and 2.) reactionary which forced me to pull the full hand.

We'll see how it goes from here. It's fairly hard to persuade me especially when the initial response is I'm misinterpreting to push through a bad lynch :P
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Post Post #167 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 11:57 am

Post by Faraday »

ill cvommetn tomorrow.

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Post Post #168 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:05 pm

Post by animorpherv1 »

hello.

For now, I'll
unvote
before I do anything stupid, and read the first 7 pages.
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Post Post #169 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 1:31 pm

Post by Boxman »

Welcome ani and Spyre. :D

Spyre jumped in really fast. I like that. I'll wait on a few posts from each before doing some analysis maybe.
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Post Post #170 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:20 pm

Post by Doombunny9 »

@all the nonreplacements who FoSed Koamma- Do you still think spyre is scummy for what kodamma did? Explain if you can please :D
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Post Post #171 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 3:26 pm

Post by SpyreX »

I didn't replace for Koa, sheesh. :P
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Post Post #172 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 4:55 pm

Post by Doombunny9 »

D'oh :oops:

I'm sorry, the new question for everyone that FoSed kodamma is Do you think animorph is scummy for what kodamma did? Please explain if you can.
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Post Post #173 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:55 pm

Post by MordyS »

Doombunny9 wrote:I don't like this, while it is true that she should have put a V/LA (if she knew she was going to be gone). People have their reasons to be gone. Now could you please explain your 2 day absence between post 107 and 131 or I may have to lynch you.
I don't know how to read this comment of yours. So you think that as long as a legitimate excuse is given, no one should ever be taken to task for disappearing? What if someone strings together "legitimate excuses" throughout an entire game? What if the legitimate excuse comes up whenever they're under pressure? Not to mention that she included in her comment that she shouldn't have to explain where she's been. She's right that she doesn't, but I don't have to respect her attempts to legitimize her absence. She disappeared from the game immediately after I put pressure on her, and I still have yet, even with her return, to see her deal with that pressure at all.
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Post Post #174 (ISO) » Tue Sep 15, 2009 5:59 pm

Post by MordyS »

Doombunny9 wrote:I'm sorry, the new question for everyone that FoSed kodamma is Do you think animorph is scummy for what kodamma did? Please explain if you can.
Is this question intentionally inane, or are you scum trying to look active with poor postings?

Either way, I'll treat the question seriously, even tho it doesn't deserve to be treated that way: If Kodamma did something scummy, then the suspicion carries over to the new player. If the new player acts in a way that suggests Kodamma was merely a poor town player, then it might mediate that suspicion. But why would a replacement remove any suspicion from the original player (and the role that they are playing)? It might be harder to pin down an accusation on the new player (since they can always plead ignorance and it's a hard plea to analyze), but it doesn't mean that the suspicion just vanishes. Who has ever heard of such a thing?
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