Mini 839 -- Mafia Invasion! (Game Over)

[Porkens]

I am also a vanilla town

[Sotty7]

I really don't want to lynch imaginality today. I think he is town, considering that he called CC as a power role in our night talk the night before he claimed cop is a big thing for me.

However I realize I am in the strong minority here so there is little I can do. I think we should be no lynching today. If we aren't then I will be voting Sigma.

[Porkens]

bump?

[charter]

Sorry this reread is taking this long.

[sigma]

@sotty: how many scum do you think are left?

if you're thinking 2, who do you think my scum-partner is? since you're voting me, i assume you think i'm one of the scum.

@imaginality: same questions.

[imaginality]

I gave it some thought later in the night, when Sotty said she thought 1 scum is more likely than two. I don't see clear evidence of links between the remaining players, so I lean a little more towards there being one scum left, and my suspicions run: you > Porkens > charter/Cruciare/Sotty. (Yes, Porkens would have to be godfather if he's scum, but I don't think a GF and framer scum team would be unbalanced.)

If there are two left, I'm not sure who your scumbuddy is. I'd rather wait and decide that after no-lynching today and seeing who gets nightkilled, when there are fewer possibilities to consider.

Vote: no lynch

[Cruciare]

What does everyone think of Charter?

[RedCoyote]

"You think they'll find us without Johnny Law around?"
"Nah, they don't know which way is up."
"Are those boots?"
"Yeah, well, you know, that's all they had"
"You think I could get a pair?"...

---

Vote Count 4.1

• Not Voting

  (charter - Sotty7 - sigma - Cruciare - Porkens -

  imaginality

  )
  
  
  No Lynch
  (imaginality)

With six alive, it takes four to lynch.
The current deadline is set for

October 22nd

.

[Sotty7]

Right now I think there is only one scum.

Vote: No lynch

Cruciare, why are you asking about charter?

[sigma]

@Sotty, imaginality:

You guys are both leaning towards one scum. How do you reconcile my TMJ vote on day 1 with me being scum? You're both saying I bussed my mafia framer who was my only scum partner when the outcome of the day's lynch was still in doubt? Sure, bussing gives townie cred, and scum do it, but that's a big hole for one scum to crawl out of, given the likelihood of a cop in the game.

Really, this argument applies to everyone left except imaginality and cruciare. I just don't see bussing as being very likely with only two scum in the initial setup.

[Porkens]

No-lynch is for suckers.

Vote: Imaginality

[charter]

Alright, time for a reread finally.

Post 260, this was the votecount
popsofctown (Tjoe Min Ja - Cruciare - sigma - Vi - imaginality)
Tjoe Min Ja (Col.Cathart - popsofctown)

269, Porkens unvotes whoever he was voting and votes TMJ
283, jammer (me) unvotes whoever and votes TMJ
319, Sotty unvotes whoever and votes TMJ
328, sigma unvotes pops and votes TMJ
333, Vi hammers.

Actually, this makes Cruciare look really bad too. I dunno. I'm not buying that it's porkens, Sotty, or sigma. I REALLY think that it has to be one of imaginality or Cruiciare. I really don't think that any of the people voting someone without a chance of being lynched that switched on to TMJ would be his buddy. It makes no sense, why not push harder for whoever they were voting? Same thing with sigma, if he's scum, why not just push slightly harder on pops? Just not buying one of these.
Now to go back and look at each individually towards the end of day one.

imaginality

imaginality seemed to kind of test the waters before voting for pops. Says how he is happy to lynch pops at some point (mislynch in the future, perhaps?) but doesn't think we should lynch him day one.

In 233, he parrots sigma's reasons for voting pops, and votes pops. Pretty contradictory. Then, further justifies his vote by saying "So, let's lynch pops. It seems to be what he wants anyhow." which is just terrible.

312, adds another reason he's voting for pops. This was really short, and it actually seems like he was lurking before deadline. Need to see if he did this day two as well. (bah, the modkill, so can't tell)

In short, he tested to see if a pops vote would be acceptable. Flip flops on when he thinks we can lynch pops. Uses a lot of other people's reasons for his vote, trying to reduce his accountability, I think.

Cruciare

Cruciare has his vote on pops from before when I went back to (page 9).

242, kind of plays both sides of the pops issue, giving him a possible out if needed later.

290, says he won't push hard on pops because he has claimed doc and it will be too hard. What?!?? Since pops wasn't scum, this seems like pretty blatant distancing from a mislynch.

295, he softclaims doc. Missed this before.

316, pretty hard push for pops over TMJ. Even throws in a bit about lynching jammer over TMJ.

325, defends TMJ hard.


I am thinking it's imaginality. He immediately votes for Cruciare at the start of day two. Severely hypocritical, the reasons he's voting Cruciare all apply to himself as well.

vote Imaginality

Soooo, Porkens is town, I'm town, Sotty and sigma I think are town based on how they went about voting TMJ day one. That leaves imaginality and Cruciare. Based on imaginality's trying to get Cruciare lynched after day one, I think the only thing left is lynch imaginality and rejoice. Am I missing anything?

[Cruciare]

Cruciare, why are you asking about charter?

Because I want to know? Must I really answer this question before people start complying? Is it so difficult to give your opinions on Charter? Why did three people just blatantly ignore me?

[Porkens]

What do

you

think about charter?

[Cruciare]

I'm very suspicious of him. What about you?

[imaginality]

I am thinking it's imaginality. He immediately votes for Cruciare at the start of day two. Severely hypocritical, the reasons he's voting Cruciare all apply to himself as well.

If I recall correctly I actually agreed I deserved to be under suspicion for being on the pops wagon rather than the TMJ wagon and said that the lynch should be one of me, Cruciare or DRK. So how is it hypocritical for me to then vote for Cruciare?

[Porkens]

The last time you mentioned Charter, you said he was Null for you. What changed?

[sigma]

As I mentioned to you last night, Cruciare, I think charter is likely to be scum should there be two left: If two scum are left, the best guess is that one is a scum neighbor and the other is not. charter and porkens are the only members of this latter set. Since porkens was investigated and turned up innocent, this makes charter more likely to be scum in this scenario (although not confirmed because of GF possibilities.)

I think imaginality is scum in either a one or two-scum scenario. If we lynch imaginality and he flips town and the game's still going, I would probably be more inclined to lynch you than charter.

I'm going to

Vote: No Lynch

. The night-kill target isn't completely obvious, so we might as well get a little more information before we lynch, IMO.

[Cruciare]

The last time you mentioned Charter, you said he was Null for you. What changed?

Three people died. Now Porkens, what do

you

think about Charter?

[charter]

I am thinking it's imaginality. He immediately votes for Cruciare at the start of day two. Severely hypocritical, the reasons he's voting Cruciare all apply to himself as well.

If I recall correctly I actually agreed I deserved to be under suspicion for being on the pops wagon rather than the TMJ wagon and said that the lynch should be one of me, Cruciare or DRK. So how is it hypocritical for me to then vote for Cruciare?

Admitting you did something scummy doesn't negate the fact that you did it. It's hypocritical because you're voting him for something you've done as well. Seems pretty simple.

sigma, where has this 'charter is scum' nonsense come from?

Cruciare, why are you suspicious of me? Why has people dying made any difference?

[imaginality]

Why would I vote myself for doing something scummy?

If I believe (as I did at the time, though less strongly now) that at least one scum was on the pops wagon, it makes absolute sense for me to vote for another person on that wagon. I absolutely disagree that that's a hypocritical vote.

[Sotty7]

I don't think charter is scum

[sigma]

sigma, where has this 'charter is scum' nonsense come from?

Do you have anything to argue about with my point? If we have two scum left, I'm pretty sure one of them is a neighbor and one of them is from the set of charter/porkens. You're more likely to be scum then Porkens, IMO. So, if we lynch scum on our next lynch, and the game's still going, you're going to be my target. However, if there's only one scum left, that downgrades the likelihood of you being scum a lot.

I wouldn't entitle that analysis 'charter is scum', personally -- if that's what you got from my analysis, I don't think you're reading closely enough.

@Cruciare: Do you want to no lynch? If so, I think you should go ahead -- I wouldn't hold my breath on getting anything from Porkens. If not, I'd like to hear why.

[charter]

Why would I vote myself for doing something scummy?

If I believe (as I did at the time, though less strongly now) that at least one scum was on the pops wagon, it makes absolute sense for me to vote for another person on that wagon. I absolutely disagree that that's a hypocritical vote.

I would hope you wouldn't vote yourself, but when you vote someone for doing the same thing you did, it comes off as very scummy. Like you're trying to push a case on someone else for a scummy action they did while you want everyone else to ignore it from you.

Do you have anything to argue about with my point?

Um, I can argue that you're basing that entirely off setup speculation, which many times leads to catastrophic town meltdowns that are easily preventable by relying on scumhunting rather than setup speculation. Perhaps the reason there is two sets of neighbors is because there is a scumbag in each of them. Slight omgus, but you pushing this logic is the first I've really had to suspect you.

[charter]

Did anyone even read what I posted about imaginality/Cruciare? If you could and post if you agree/disagree and why, that would be awesome.