Mini 201 - Game Over!

[kadath32]

Hezlucky, I'd like you to explain your attack on ENYH.
You came after him with a quick change in vote and "trying to find justification for his vote." However, ENYH gave a spurious reason for his vote, effectively making it a random vote. I thought it was pretty obvious that it was not serious, and sympathized with his reaction ("What the hell"). I think your actions were scummy. Then you confirmed your vote on ENYH citing his switch of votes to you and defensiveness. It looks to me that you engineered a bandwagon of ENYH. Why?

[HezLucky]

Scummy actions do not indicate scum. Look closer and you will find your scum.

He did seem defensive to me. I didn't like his reaction at the time and still don't. Remember, <someone has to start the bandwagon>. There is very little to go on during Day 1 ... how else do you expect to get someone lynched? All of these people defending EYNH seems awfully fishy to me ... though its possible that one of the mafia has voted him.

This seems to be why I often get lynched early. I start a lot of bandwagons. My reasoning is that the person's defense can tell us about their alignment and frankly, I didn't like EYNH's defense (it didn't seem citizen-like to me ... read between the lines and you might see why ... If I were to tell you why, I'd be accused of "crap logic" ... whatever that is.).

To nullify blackberry's argument on me: Notice that I have not switched my vote from EYNH at all since my first random vote. That's over 100 posts of people posting and me not switching my vote. Do you seriously think that I'm throwing a vote on EYNH RANDOMLY? I'm not. Take the hint.

Re-reading the thread quickly, I get:

Post 82: EYNH claims that he would vote for vikingfan ... earlier he accused me of bandwagoning and now he wants to do the same thing. I look through the thread and find others arguments on vikingfan to be pathetically weak. He doesn't mention me or his vote on me in this post, possibly to make sure that he doesn't get a reaction out of me.
Post 101: EYNH throws an FOS on DP for voting for him even though DP said it was nothing personal ... he seems to take a lot of things personally for someone who is "not mafia"... Blackberry found this a bit odd, I find this downright disgustingly obvious... I can't believe you aren't jumping on EYNH already.

Confirm FOS: kadath

I'm starting to grow more suspicious of kadath at the moment ... but I will keep my vote on EYNH. There is no point in switching it now.

Respond to me! I want to say more! I feel that I haven't done my argument any justice.

[vikingfan]

Couple things, Hez. For one, I don't think you can argue that ENYH is necessarily innocent just because he hasn't been lynched yet. Anybody just suddently voting and killing ENYH will be on the chopping block, whether town or scum- it just isn't done. What we're doing right now is that we have 2 bandwagons, and we have to pick one.

Second, ENYH can make exactly the same argument you're making-investigator will check me and mafia will kill me at night to nullify the inspection.

I'm going to wait for more info before I change anything, if I do.

[HezLucky]

Yes but that argument would only be truthful if he weren't mafia.

[vikingfan]

I dunno- it seems to me at this point that both of you can make pretty similar arguments, and we really can't judge truth unless A) we get a claim(and not necessarily even then), or B) killed.

[kadath32]

This seems to be why I often get lynched early. I start a lot of bandwagons. My reasoning is that the person's defense can tell us about their alignment and frankly, I didn't like EYNH's defense (it didn't seem citizen-like to me ... read between the lines and you might see why ... If I were to tell you why, I'd be accused of "crap logic" ... whatever that is.).

I'd like to hear your explication and analysis of ENYH's defense. If your reasoning can't stand public scrutiny, why are you voting on it?

Respond to me! I want to say more! I feel that I haven't done my argument any justice.

I'd like to hear more from you.
1. Why did you treat a spurious vote as "trying to find justification for voting"?
2. Why are you trying to avoid answering the first question? I've asked it repeatedly.
3. Summarize your argument against ENYH to a few simple points.

[Dragon Phoenix]

checking in, keeping vote.

[Phoebus]

A confirm FOS! Now that's fresh!

I have limited access next twelve days. Will try to check in every 48 hours or so. Hopefully daily. I will not be requiring prods please. If I feel that I need replacement, I shall contact the mod somehow.

[HezLucky]

Well, it looks like kadath is trying to get some information out of me to help his scum. Well, I'm only going to give you enough to help the town so too bad:

First of all, why isn't EYNH talking? It seems like he's lurking scum right now hoping that I'm going to say something so that he can twist my words around and say I'm scum. It's July 7, he hasn't said anything since July 2... C'mon now, who would you rather vote for? a lurker or someone like me who posts who you can get information out of later (regardless of my role)? I say get rid of him now. None of you can make sure that he isn't mafia and if you lynch me instead of him, he can just keep flying under the radar until the end of the game where his mafia squad will win. Kadath, you're my next vote just simply for the fact that you can't pick up on these clues (call it an OMGUS vote or whatever) ... I've FOSed you a couple of times already I think this calls for a default vote on Day 2.

[grumbles] I can't believe I have to do this on Day 1. Blame Blackberry and kadath if you must. [/grumbling]

(1) I re-read now and see that it was sa random vote. I did not believe this at the time. However, I've played a few more day ones and see others doing this as well so I cannot base my vote on that.

(2) I just answered 1.

(3) However, with that being said, I still don't like his response. The way I see it, if someone changes their vote within three minutes, they aren't paying much attention to the game. I interpret this as "I can vote for whomever I want because I'm scum so it doesn't matter who I vote for so long as I lynch a citizen..." ... careless voting can be citizen-like but I see it as scum-like.

I think he over-reacted slightly as well ... you claim that frustration = townie but remember that anybody with a computer can type any set of words conveying any emotion they like. A scum cuold've just as easily typed that. Perhaps had he typed paragraphs and paragraphs I could've believen the frustration = townie but to convey frustration in two lines takes little effort and anybody with any role could do that.

The only defense you all seem to provide against me is that "but this doesn't mean he's scum" ...

... I could just as easily provide the counterargument in that anything that I have done up to this point "indicates I'm not scum" for future games ... simply because I'm not.

Anything more I say I have said in previous posts. Please RE-READ my previous stuff.

and vote for EYNH... His lying low disgusts me and I don't see how you couldn't have figured it out by now. A citizen would defend himself, not lie low like scum in the face of two bandwagons (one of which is on him).

I won't talk more until I hear from EYNH. This is disgusting. Vote for him already.

[EnterYourNameHere]

Ugh. I've forgot about this thread...

Don't have time to post what I want to right now, I have to leave for work. I'll be back around 9:30 PST, and will post then.

[Yanqush]

Been busy these few days....
Trying to digest everything

[Someone]

Hard to follow game with post restriction. Will try to be more active.

Am gone until monday, though.

[Phoebus]

Heh.
I skimmed through HezLucky's last post.
He's more convinced about kadath being scum through his (kadath's) actions and yet he's still voting for EYNH, calling him lurking scum, with no other proof as such, with EYNH furthermore having posted he's lost track.

Go figure.

[HezLucky]

Put it this way ... too many people are defending EYNH for my liking.

Your comment just sweetens the deal.

[Blackberry]

This game is going so slow... or maybe I'm just new and they all go like this O_o. I'm keeping my vote on HezLucky. I want to hear what EYNH wants to say.

[EnterYourNameHere]

OK, I'm here.

First of all,

Unvote HezLucky

. I don't think a scum would be hell-bent on lynching one particular player at this stage of the game. I think he's just a pro-town player who believes I'm scum.

Second of all, I don't know WHERE people are getting the idea that vikingfan is confirmed innocent. We're not sure. I believe his roleclaim, but there's still the possibility of a mafia roleblocker. A bully who beats people up doesn't seem like a pro-town role to me, but there's always the possibility it's just an improbable role. At this point, I would not vote him, but don't put him on your "confirmed" lists quite yet.

Thirdly, blackberry and kadath, I'm a bit concerned that you guys keep defending me. But I don't think it's scummy: if you guys were scum, you'd most likely jump on the bandwagon against me, not waste time defending me. (Yeah, yeah, I know you guys are thinking "what if they're partners", but, well, I'm not scum.)

I'm not sure who we should be voting for right now. I'll just stay with no vote for now.

[Dragon Phoenix]

A bully who beats people up doesn't seem like a pro-town role to me, but there's always the possibility it's just an improbable role.

Actually, this type of role is not exactly improbable, but rather often used, although more frequently in the form of a complete post blocking rather than limitation.

[vikingfan]

Methinks halo needs to follow up on his 'must post every two days' rule if we're going to get anywhere.

[HezLucky]

yeah lets prod the mafia

[halo freak]

Prodding Kadath32 now.

[kadath32]

Ow - stop poking me. I'll re-read the thread in the evening and post.

[kadath32]

Before I leave, I have one question for you, HezLucky: Are you actually the cop?
Your tenacity in attacking ENYH makes me think that you're either scum trying to get an innocent lynched and not knowing when to quit, or a cop who investigated ENYH and got guilty.

Anyway, I'll be on later.

[Phoebus]

Oh my dear lord...

[Dragon Phoenix]

[halo freak]

Vote Count

EnterYourNameHere - 4 (HezLucky, Dragon Phoenix, LoudmouthLee, vikingfan)
HezLucky - 3 (Someone, Blackberry, Kadath32)
kadath32 - 1 (Phoebus)

6 votes to lynch.