Mini 897 - OpenSource Mafia - Game over!!

[Glork]

Don't see it working. I don't see how my gender has factored into this actually.

I'm aware. Course, if you want to keep complimenting me, go ahead ^-^.

Also notice how virtually every response to a part of my post starts with a short, snippet of a sentence.
Was that something that happened on purpose in that you had planned?
Or did it just sort of turn out that way?
Now, its not uncommon for you to have a such response, but look at the concentration.

Ugh, how is this relevant to ANYTHING? People have different posting styles. I can't even tell if you're trying to raise this as a point

against

UK. If you are, how do short responses make her more likely to be scum? If not, why did you make this post at all?

I understand where UK is coming from regarding Iece's "worrying about how people percieve him," but I don't necessarily agree with it.

I love Vaya's posting so far. I really do. Many of his thoughts eerily parallel my own, and he's actually digging into the crux of why I voted Pom to begin with. He's very vote-hoppy right now (three vote changes between Posts 356 and 375), but that's not a point against his alignment.

Pom's post against Alma feels like mere deflection. She may even believe that it's not truly OMGUS, but it's still her stammering and going "look at this guy" immediately after someone said "she's never actually made a firm case or voted anyone."

Regarding SSK's response to Pom (you're hypocritical, and IIoA is outdated):
-- I disagree with him on the hypocrisy site. I used to say that hypocrisy is a scumtell in everyone but me, and I didn't just say it for the irony. I understand where Pom coming from here
-- I agree with him completely on the IIoA site. Well, mostly... I didn't think IIoA was a big deal or a reliable scumtell to begin with

I'm getting a good vibe from Almaster, although his claim, upon a second look, looks really a scumclaim. Truth be told, I'd rather lynch him first than try to convert him (I rather lose a townie than create another scum). Almaster, if you are really town, then you wouldn't want me to target you. And thus, I ask again, do you want me to target you tonight?

I think we should let alma get the alleged alignment change. It will help town.

Ah, if you hadn't had claimed cop-something, I'd be voting for you now. Do you understand the risks of me performing my power on a town, right?

Vote: Glork

This is interesting.

She expresses that Alma's claim "looks really like a scumclaim," says she would rather lynch than convert, then votes for me for reasons unexplained. I'll bite. Why me, and why now?


Alma, can you explain exactly what changed your mind between these two posts:

That was a serious post. I can change a player's alignment during night. Only one per night, though. I was thinking that it was easy to create a happy ending if mafia just outed themselves and I turned them into town. As UK said, you can test it with your weakest member.

Use it on me, please. This is not a joke.

I'm getting a good vibe from Almaster, although his claim, upon a second look, looks really a scumclaim. Truth be told, I'd rather lynch him first than try to convert him (I rather lose a townie than create another scum). Almaster, if you are really town, then you wouldn't want me to target you. And thus, I ask again, do you want me to target you tonight?

No.

For now, I'm keeping my vote on Pom.

[Snow_Bunny]

SB, the stuff on page 10 isn't a case on Pome; it's the drama where I voted SP. Its only relevance to Pome is that there's a possible Pome/UK connection, but isn't it a bit early to worry about that sort of thing, etc.

The case on Pome is that she is not a very energetic scumhunter.

I suppose you're going somewhere with that Glork vote? It doesn't really seem reflective of your post as a whole.

Then, I ask again. What's the case with Pom?

[Snow_Bunny]

@Glork: The vote was just to pressure you, to get you to post something.

Unvote

.

With Almaster this is the thing: if he is indeed a miller, I wouldn't want to convert him, as I *think* I would end up turning him into scum. If he's scum, I'd rather convert him than lynching him. But as I can't be sure, I prefer to take the less riskier way and lynch him (between those two choices).

[Josh Lyman]

SB, the stuff on page 10 isn't a case on Pome; it's the drama where I voted SP. Its only relevance to Pome is that there's a possible Pome/UK connection, but isn't it a bit early to worry about that sort of thing, etc.

The case on Pome is that she is not a very energetic scumhunter.

I suppose you're going somewhere with that Glork vote? It doesn't really seem reflective of your post as a whole.

Then, I ask again. What's the case with Pom?

Reading comprehension FTL.

This, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof) earns you

unvote
vote: Snow_Bunny

[AlmasterGM]

Reading comprehension FTL.

This, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof) earns you

unvote
vote: Snow_Bunny

Reading comprehension FTL? More like "not posting for eight days and this is all you've got" FTL.

Unvote. Vote: Josh.

Alma, can you explain exactly what changed your mind between these two posts:

SB keeps saying she's pretty sure her ability won't work on me. To be honest, I think SB is either wrong about how her role works or lying about being protown. The role just seems so stupid in the context she's spinning it. Like here:

With Almaster this is the thing: if he is indeed a miller, I wouldn't want to convert him, as I *think* I would end up turning him into scum. If he's scum, I'd rather convert him than lynching him. But as I can't be sure, I prefer to take the less riskier way and lynch him (between those two choices).

If we know who scum are, SB's right - why wouldn't we just lynch them? And using this role randomly in the night seems way to dangerous. That's what leads me to believe her role does work on me (it would fit perfectly with the flavor, anyway) OR SB isn't actually town and is associated with a third party (Apple, perhaps).

[Iecerint]

Alma, I could believe that, except that you responded to her initial request, which was of the form "come claim, please, scum." It's not as if she started off more vague, then trapped you by clarifying that her ability was only useful when scum targeted her.

If SB is 3rd party, FF is probably her scumbuddy, since he has also claimed Apple-user at present. I doubt they're individual Apple-users; if they were, I think SB may've responded to his claim in some way.

JL, I was literally about to make the same post as you, but I agree with Alma's sentiment. On the other hand, Alma is the one who made it.

[SlySly]

Phate now replaces Vala Mal Doran. Vote count coming sometime today.

[MafiaSSK]

@Glork: The vote was just to pressure you, to get you to post something.

Unvote

.
.

Do you even know who Glork is? Do you not see the award below his name? There is no way this is the real reason for your vote.

[UncertainKitten]

SB, the stuff on page 10 isn't a case on Pome; it's the drama where I voted SP. Its only relevance to Pome is that there's a possible Pome/UK connection, but isn't it a bit early to worry about that sort of thing, etc.

The case on Pome is that she is not a very energetic scumhunter.

I suppose you're going somewhere with that Glork vote? It doesn't really seem reflective of your post as a whole.

Then, I ask again. What's the case with Pom?

Reading comprehension FTL.

This, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof) earns you

unvote
vote: Snow_Bunny

And...this is yet another reason why Josh is a good lynch if Alma hadn't claimed scum.

Hell, it's still tempting.

[Snow_Bunny]

@Glork: The vote was just to pressure you, to get you to post something.

Unvote

.
.

Do you even know who Glork is? Do you not see the award below his name? There is no way this is the real reason for your vote.

No, I don't know. And I don't get your reasons for pointing this out.

SB, the stuff on page 10 isn't a case on Pome; it's the drama where I voted SP. Its only relevance to Pome is that there's a possible Pome/UK connection, but isn't it a bit early to worry about that sort of thing, etc.

The case on Pome is that she is not a very energetic scumhunter.

I suppose you're going somewhere with that Glork vote? It doesn't really seem reflective of your post as a whole.

Then, I ask again. What's the case with Pom?

Reading comprehension FTL.

This, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof) earns you

unvote
vote: Snow_Bunny

If what you bolded it's the case against Pom, then I must say it is really weak. For that matter, I rather lynch you (Josh).

Reading comprehension FTL.

This, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof) earns you

unvote
vote: Snow_Bunny

Reading comprehension FTL? More like "not posting for eight days and this is all you've got" FTL.

Unvote. Vote: Josh.

Alma, can you explain exactly what changed your mind between these two posts:

SB keeps saying she's pretty sure her ability won't work on me. To be honest, I think SB is either wrong about how her role works or lying about being protown. The role just seems so stupid in the context she's spinning it. Like here:

With Almaster this is the thing: if he is indeed a miller, I wouldn't want to convert him, as I *think* I would end up turning him into scum. If he's scum, I'd rather convert him than lynching him. But as I can't be sure, I prefer to take the less riskier way and lynch him (between those two choices).

If we know who scum are, SB's right - why wouldn't we just lynch them? And using this role randomly in the night seems way to dangerous. That's what leads me to believe her role does work on me (it would fit perfectly with the flavor, anyway) OR SB isn't actually town and is associated with a third party (Apple, perhaps).

After reading this post, I can't get out of my mind that Almaster is trying to fish for more information that I don't want to give as of now. I tried to believe that you are a miller, but you this post gave me a very bad vibe (paired with a previous request of more info). And thus, as I said before, I rather take the risk of lynching you than converting you.

Vote: Almaster

Lyman is another good choice, but for now let's lynch the claimed scum.

[Glork]

@Glork: The vote was just to pressure you, to get you to post something.

Unvote

.
.

Do you even know who Glork is? Do you not see the award below his name? There is no way this is the real reason for your vote.

Pfffft.


SnowBunny, I had posted V/LA until Monday night. That's why I didn't post during that time. When I got home Monday night, I was exhausted from driving from VA to OH through snow, so I said I was going to wait until Tuesday to read/post here. That's all there was to it.

[Phate]

Here. Typing from phone. Reading thread. Expect post in <30 hours.

[SlySly]

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 7

SocioPath

- 0 -

UncertainKitten

- 0 -

Pomegranate

- 2 - Glork, MafiaSSK

Vaya

- 0 -

Josh Lyman

- 2 - UncertainKitten, AlmasterGM

MafiaSSK

- 0 -

Snow_Bunny

- 1 - Josh Lyman

Glork

- 0 -

Phate

- 1 - Vaya

AlmasterGM

- 3 - Pomegranate, Iecerint, Snow_Bunny

Fishythefish

- 0 -

Iecerint

- 2 - SocioPath, Fishythefish

Players not voting: Phate

Deadline(short extension due to holidays and recent replacement): 7pm(central), Friday, Jan 8

[Iecerint]

SB, Alma has not claimed Miller. FF has claimed Miller. Alma claimed that he was a town-aligned Windows user who wanted to use Linux. He implied that there was a role out there that could give him Linux and consequently give him extra abilities of some kind.

I agree with UK/SB that JL looks like a good lynch target. But it makes more sense to lynch Alma, I think, all things considered. If someone strongly believes that lynching JL is better than lynching Alma, please make your case; maybe I've missed something.

[UncertainKitten]

I agree with UK/SB that JL looks like a good lynch target. But it makes more sense to lynch Alma, I think, all things considered. If someone strongly believes that lynching JL is better than lynching Alma, please make your case; maybe I've missed something.

Bias. Honestly, I'm going to likely vote to lynch Alma shortly. I just don't like giving up the scum I worked for for the scum that turned themselves in. It's irrational, and stupid, and honestly makes me look bad. Worse on the off chance JL is town.

So, in other words, it's not necessarily better, it's just me clinging to the "b-b-but I pointed him out~!" thing.

SB, Alma has not claimed Miller. FF has claimed Miller. Alma claimed that he was a town-aligned Windows user who wanted to use Linux. He implied that there was a role out there that could give him Linux and consequently give him extra abilities of some kind.

Reviewing that I really don't see how this isn't a scum claim, lol. Also, how vague he was about "Well um...I don't NEED to be switched to win but um...it'd be nice" kinda adds to that.

/me sighs.

Honestly, either of them are amazing lynches, and I will lend my support to the Alm wagon if it is shown that JL cannot be achieved.

[Glork]

Unvote, Vote: Alma

wagonwagonlynchlynchgogogogogo

[AlmasterGM]

This wagon makes absolutely zero sense. I made that claim more than 10 pages ago and it's becoming a wagon NOW? And started by Pomegranate no less, who has been incredibly scummy up until a page ago (and is still scummy, IMO). Ridiculous. I have never claimed scum. I'm town. I speculated SB's ability might work on me. Turns out, after clarification, it probably won't. Do I find this incredibly suspicious on SB's part? Yes. Given her vote for me despite the possibility of conversion and the fact that her denial does not fit with flavor, I think it's highly possible SB is lying. Regardless, the point is as follows: I stated my position on speculation up front. I have never changed my story once. There is nothing scummy about what I have done.

Moreover, lets stop and think - even if I AM scum (which I am not), why the hell wouldn't you just use SB on me? That way, we get rid of the "claimed" scum AND get to lynch someone scummy. Win-win. There are NO downsides.

There are actual scummy posts and people in this game. Lynching me today is outright stupid.

[Pomegranate]

The case on Pome is that she is not a very energetic scumhunter.

But for anyone who knows my meta, I don't scumhunt energetically.

Pom's post against Alma feels like mere deflection. She may even believe that it's not truly OMGUS, but it's still her stammering and going "look at this guy" immediately after someone said "she's never actually made a firm case or voted anyone."

Possibly you missed it while catching up, but I was asked who I found scummiest, and why. My answer was Alm, thus I proceeded to make a case on him.

This wagon makes absolutely zero sense. I made that claim more than 10 pages ago and it's becoming a wagon NOW? And started by Pomegranate no less, who has been incredibly scummy up until a page ago (and is still scummy, IMO). Ridiculous. I have never claimed scum. I'm town. I speculated SB's ability might work on me. Turns out, after clarification, it probably won't. Do I find this incredibly suspicious on SB's part? Yes. Given her vote for me despite the possibility of conversion and the fact that her denial does not fit with flavor, I think it's highly possible SB is lying. Regardless, the point is as follows: I stated my position on speculation up front. I have never changed my story once. There is nothing scummy about what I have done.

Moreover, lets stop and think - even if I AM scum (which I am not), why the hell wouldn't you just use SB on me? That way, we get rid of the "claimed" scum AND get to lynch someone scummy. Win-win. There are NO downsides.

There are actual scummy posts and people in this game. Lynching me today is outright stupid.

Regarding this post, 'specially the italicized: But we don't

know

if you're scum. The downside is you being town and misinterpreting your flavor, therefore causing SB to target you, and turn you into scum.

[AlmasterGM]

Regarding this post, 'specially the italicized: But we don't know if you're scum. The downside is you being town and misinterpreting your flavor, therefore causing SB to target you, and turn you into scum.

So the alternative is to lynch me?? If you don't think I'm scummy enough for SB to target me at night, I don't think you should have your vote on me.

[Iecerint]

Turns out, after clarification, it probably won't.

Again, this would make sense except that SB was PERFECTLY CLEAR in her first post that her ability turned scum into town. Her only clarification was that the ability might also turn town into scum, which is irrelevant to your apparent scumclaim. If there's some specific clarification that stands out for you, please specify it, but I think you'd have to have misread her initial post for any subsequent SB post to have clarified things.

Moreover, lets stop and think - even if I AM scum (which I am not), why the hell wouldn't you just use SB on me? That way, we get rid of the "claimed" scum AND get to lynch someone scummy. Win-win. There are NO downsides.

Scum can almost certainly stop SB's ability from working on you. Or, at least, it would shock me if they couldn't. Even if they can't, we're probably left with WIFOM with regard to whether or not the ability took/was real/etc.

There are actual scummy posts and people in this game. Lynching me today is outright stupid.

Like Pome? Who else?

[SlySly]

The General Rules have been appended. Everyone please review and take notice of General Rule #10.

[Phate]

Vote: Josh Lyman

Josh has less posts in this game than there are pages in this game. His first 12 posts occur on Dec 16-17. They consist of his random Glork vote, his folding under the pressure of an early bandwagon, eventually culminating in his unvoting his random vote, receiving heat for it, and posting these placating statements in his 9th post.

Jokes tend to fall a bit flat when they need to be explained; I'm learning that Mafia isn't quite the time nor the place for it. Slowly, I'm learning. (I can be thick.)

Yeah, I need to pay more attention to my playstyle and how it is viewed by other people. Outward-looking, as opposed to inward-looking, and all that.

He posts twice more on the 19th: nothing consequential, but more placation. He agrees to start scumhunting

As for my role-related questions to SB, I see now that they weren't exactly pro-town; lessonlearned. I would retract the question, but the damage seems to have been done.

On the 21st, he picks Pomegranate's post seemingly at random to accuse.

Pre-post edit: I can't make a post better than this ATM, because I'm having trouble with the site, and I can't set up a separate window to look at more posts. I'm sorry, hopefully it will clear up very soon.

Please. Even *I* could come up with a better excuse. You're not even trying.

Vote: Pomegranate

I hope the above post looks as ridiculous to the rest of you as it does to me. On his next post, 8 days later (he hasn't mentioned any VLA, just lurked for 8 days), he votes Snow_Bunny when she misses a line in a post, based on "this, connected with some very bizarre reasoning (and lack thereof)".

The case against Josh, summarized.

1) Lurking.
2) Active-lurking (he didn't scumhunt until he was specifically ordered to, while being wagoned)
3) The placating, camaraderiffic, agreeable tone he displayed under pressure.
4) His continued lack of scumhunting (the two votes against Pom and SB are the only things that could even be called attempts at scumhunting, and they look more like random attacks on players to blend in than anything else)

Josh, I would like you to make a case on Snow_Bunny to justify your vote, ideally without echoing any points previously made by other players.

[Phate]

Josh has

fewer

posts in this game than there are pages in this game.

Fixed.

[Pomegranate]

Regarding this post, 'specially the italicized: But we don't know if you're scum. The downside is you being town and misinterpreting your flavor, therefore causing SB to target you, and turn you into scum.

So the alternative is to lynch me?? If you don't think I'm scummy enough for SB to target me at night, I don't think you should have your vote on me.

In this game, I don't

know

anyone's alignment but my own. I

suspect

you are scum, and my opinion is that you are most likely to be scum. But I wouldn't risk converting you to scum, thus losing a townie, and adding another scumbag. I don't think the potential reward outweighs the risk.

[Glork]

Possibly you missed it while catching up, but I was asked who I found scummiest, and why. My answer was Alm, thus I proceeded to make a case on him.

No, I realize that completely. My point is that even after I said "wow, Pom hasn't done a darned thing all game," you continued to not make an attack on someone or to change your vote until someone directly told you to do so.



I would still rather lynch Pom, but at this point I will shamelessly wagon anybody who I believe has an above-verage chance of being scum. Yes, I realize this is a big red X beside my name. Don't care at this point.