kikuchiyo wrote:Interestin gpoint her. Trouble is, that the rest of this post which was snipped actually contained some scumhunting. In fact, Narn actually points to a link between bv310 and dybeck. Granted they are masons, but masons make up an informed minority which is similar to a scum team. Picking out the connection is actually good scumhunting. He also points out bv310's "hypocrisy" in finding Star suspicious for behavior he exhibited himself. If you just read the quote and comment by Snail, then it seems as though Snail's comment is accurate, but Narn didn't just "not want to lynch Starbuck". He had another suspect and concrete reasoning behind it.
I didn't mean to imply with that quote that he didn't have another suspect. I pulled out the ISO to establish his baseline opinion on Starbuck at that point.
kikuchiyo wrote:I find this to be a mischaracterization. Narn is "committing" to the vanilla townie lynch. Makes much more sense than pushing for further information from manho. Also, Narn clearly stated that he preferred the bv310 lynch and even committed his vote there. The bv lynch was not happening. His iso 10 is pto town. Not pushing for more info in the absence of a counterclaim helps town more than scum.
I don't have a problem with the switch in itself. Starbuck made sense as a lynch. What I found scummy was the non-committal way in which the switch was done. The way it is worded suggests a Starbuck lynch is inevitable and I felt like it was a way of escaping responsibility.
kikuchiyo wrote:Starbuck actually didn't need any votes. Her lynch was pretty solid for most of the second half of the day. There was less than 24 hours between his unvote of bv and his vote of Starbuck. When he voted Star he also said, nobody hammer in case we get a counterclaim. Granted, L-1 votes are always going to be suspicious, but I don't see this(upon reread) as "testing the waters". Narn was on bv. Its not like he was fencesitting.
He's testing the waters in the sense that that post was like a soft switch onto the Starbuck wagon. It provides justification for a later Starbuck vote without being seen as pushing for the lynch explicitly.
kikuchiyo wrote:It was day 1. I have mentioned it before, but vanilla claims should never "stop" a lynch. I think the approach here was pro town. Narn repeatedly stated he wanted the bv310 lynch. It could be clever scum, but with bv flipping town, I don't see the motivation to choose one over the other. Hackerhuck was pushing for more Susan info which is way scummier imo. Its a reach at best.
I never said the vanilla claim should stop the lynch. I don't have a problem with Narninian switching to the Starbuck wagon at that point. It's the way in which he does it, the wording and the timing of his vote. There is an inevitability in it, a lack of responsibility. It felt like he knew Starbuck was going to turn up town and didn't want to be attacked for it later.
Taken together, Narninian was quite wishy-washy about Starbuck, saying her claim wasn't lynch-worthy at first and then pretending as if the lynch was inevitable. I find both attitudes strange (Rumblebuffin isn't a particularly strong claim and no lynch is inevitable).
kikuchiyo wrote:I believe it was an RVS vote. Some players think bandwagons are a good way out of the RVS. This is a debatable subject, but I personally don't think RVS interactions are scummy until you can associate them to a flipped scum(which we can't).
Fair enough. This was largely a gut feeling about J.R.
kikuchiyo wrote:Overall, The way the initial case was framed made it appear to have merit. But reading Narn in iso leads me to see much more protown behavior than is presented. There are far scummier interactions going on yesterday. Granted, I am thoroughly unimpressed with Narn today, but I think this case is no good, possibly fabricated.
I think this is a bit unfair, even if you do disagree with my conclusions. But perhaps I should have been clearer about the fact that it was the way in which he made the switch that I found scummy and not the switch in principle.
My vote stays.
