Mini 916 ~ Brrr Mafia. GAME OVER

[Zachrulez]

I want a claim from DTMaster.

And in what way would that help. He has admitted to lying before and what makes you think he wont lie again and say he's town. Honestly what scum would claim to that fact. None. He could even try and claim doctor, if there is one, and in the slightest possibility it could be true but he could be just saying that to cover his ass and protect himself from a lynch. I don't think a claim would help any because we wouldn't know if he was lying or telling the truth. I don't believe we can trust him.

Sure if he's scum, he could lie about his role, but we ask anyway in order to minimize the threat of lynching a power role vs lynching someone without a claim.

[Regfan]

Alright its 6am. I'll type up my thoughts on the other few players sometime tomorrow. I apologize that I couldn't get it all done tonight. And please pleaseeee don't have another 7 pages for me to read when I get on tomorrow.

[DTMaster]

@Wacky
You are apologizing for pressuring people? The heck? You are supposed to be scum hunting, not apologizing for scumhunting. You are using Lynching all Liars when I clearly outlined why I chose to use my fake

Kills

as a reaction tool.

You also ignore the fact that out of everyone in this thread, I've generate the most reads off each player. You might as well lynch me for this statement if you fervriously belive in LAL: I am girl, 25, watching you sleep. Lol.

Your statement:

is extremely scummy because you just implied: no amount of reasoning is justifiable in my actions as a town-DTM. AKA you are set in stone with a lynch and will not listen to me.

Wacky = wall now.

@Nikanor
1. Yes. But have you looked at the people who are on the DTM wagon. Out of everyone here: the only one who doesn't even give off a protown wagon approach is Jasper. Jason jumped on my case well after he should have and brought up points that just parrot the one you did.

The Jasper with Jason and Nikanor defence is just one big echoing of the same argument. Again:

why are you answering for him

2. I was envisioning scum at the bottom. If you put in the correction: my post makes much more sense. Why are you saying that my correction to my post -> Jasper is scummy -> which defines my number one scum pick -> is covering my ass? HMMMM? I clearly outlined who I think is town and scum and you still think I'm covering my ass with vauge details?

Iffy and Seven are more guilty of this then anything.

3. You are Wacky 2.0. read above. Read Jasper's posts. I asked for a meta refrence. Jasper refused.

Jason gave the refrence

Like, oh my god. I asked for a fucking meta refrence and you and Jasper are blowing this up as:

OMG THIS GUY IS SCUMMY FOR ASKING FOR METAS KILL HIM NOW BECAUSE REFRENCING TO YOUR GAMES IS SCUMMY.

THEY INVENTED THE URL TAG TO LINK TO YOUR LINKS GOD DAMNIT. THIS MESSAGE BOARD WAS ENCODED TO PROVIDE LINKS IF SOMEONE WANTED TO. YOU ARE MAKING IT EXTREMLY UNREASONABLE BY SAYING: LINKAGE = SCUMMY

/rant.

@Jb
Yes. But the possiblity exists. Hence I voted Jee to test this. It is a normal game: Yes. The chances of a role like that: lower then normal. Can it exist? Yes, why not. Why shouldn't I test this by a bandwagon?

@Reg
I approve of his posts.

td;dr version:

1.Wacky: Lynch all Liars argument = you won't listen to my reasoning. Aka you are set in stone.

2. Nikanor: Let Jasper talk in his defence. You and Jason are talking on his behalf for his defence and Jasper has done nothing to add on to it. It looks like he is hiding behind his buddies: Jason and Nikanor

3. JB - The role can exist. Hence I wanted to test this by voting.

4. Reg - I like.

My role?

I am the Vanilla Townie with a Note

: It says [/b] trust your insincts and make sure you do a clear reread. The action Kill is going to be a vital part of this game [/b]. My role information is diffrent from the sample one posted. Discuss.

Also Do no hammer until Reg finishes his reread. We have time for this, I request that you do so. Play nice

[DTMaster]

@Mod
Er If blue is an illegal colour, you can change it.

[jasonT1981]

My role?

I am the Vanilla Townie with a Note

: It says [/b] trust your insincts and make sure you do a clear reread. The action Kill is going to be a vital part of this game [/b]. My role information is diffrent from the sample one posted. Discuss.

Also Do no hammer until Reg finishes his reread. We have time for this, I request that you do so. Play nice

WAIT.... So once again you are changing your role? You are a vinilla townie with a differnt role PM than the one posted on the front page?

The action Kill is going to be a vital part of the game? explain please? It does seem you are trying to make your role more important than it is.

I am dreadfully confused by your post.

[DTMaster]

@Jason

Again point out where my offical role claim is besides this point?

I'm a VT with information. You may treat it as a VT claim.

[DTMaster]

Also it's quite obvious I'm not a VIG of any kind because of the lack of kills, that you can infer.

[DTMaster]

Oh sorry ignored your question: My note is that the action kill will be an important part to this game. The rest is some scum hunting advice. My role isn't like the front of the page. What more is there for me to claim? That is all.

[DTMaster]

Also ITT Jason is setting off more townie vibes.

[b[ Unvote [/b]

Vote: Jasper

[jasonT1981]

@Jason

Again point out where my offical role claim is besides this point?

I'm a VT with information. You may treat it as a VT claim.

I was getting at the point you have chopped and changed the specifications of your role a few times.

Also Vinilla townie with an information type role (If I am reading correctly, Please, correct me if I am wrong as I am not fully undersatanding right now) is not a vinialla townie. as a VT is just that... plain townie with no powers or extra role specifications, unlike what you seem to be claiming.

Your claim seems to contridict that in my view.

[jasonT1981]

Oh sorry ignored your question: My note is that the action kill will be an important part to this game. The rest is some scum hunting advice. My role isn't like the front of the page. What more is there for me to claim? That is all.

OK, thanks for clearing that up a bit better.. I am still confused though.

[DTMaster]

You can treat it as a VT with an Alice note from Tar's game. IE: A VT with a little extra information. Estentially I have no powers other then this piece of information that I have just reviewed. No Day actions. No night actions.

FYI for those who are slow: Scum would quick hammer calling BS. Town are more likely to ask for a clarification on a full claim. :p

[jasonT1981]

Also it's quite obvious I'm not a VIG of any kind because of the lack of kills, that you can infer.

Well, being fair though.. a Vig can work in the night also and is more common I believe, and not have Day Kills. Though a day kill Vig is a veriation I have come across once in Mafia.

[DTMaster]

Well: if there was a tradtional night vig: you start analyzing that on Day 2.

A day vig is obviously much easier to spot for very obvious reasons.

[jasonT1981]

Well: if there was a tradtional night vig: you start analyzing that on Day 2.

A day vig is obviously much easier to spot for very obvious reasons.

Yea... If you were, someone would be dead by now and more questions would have been asked. Given your earlier play.

[Regfan]

Echo’s

lurking is quite suspect, however this may just be due to the case that he’s busy or unable to get on, thus I cannot count this lurking as a solid scum tell. His vote on DT is understandable given his reasoning and the time when he voted.

Overall Thoughts – Unsure, leading on townie.

jbernier93,

seems to be a townie to me, none of his posts strike me as suspicious.

I voted for Seven in the random stage... he did not post anything, so I was happy with my vote. He then posted something that was incredibly out of place, so I was still happy with my vote. Now it looks like Seven is actually attempting to contribute, so I will unvote but keep my eye on him.

This post to me shows that he has taken time to think things through and had made an attempt to scumhunt, it assumes me he is town even more.

Yeah, so after think about it, this is a wagon I can get behind... his actions are totally illogical and scummy...
vote: DTMaster

I don’t like this post, but I don’t find it scummy. I’d rather he listed his reasons, rather than just using terms such as illogical and scummy. Him linking to quotes that DT said would help.

Anywho, unvote because DTM's latest posts are just screaming town in my mind, for whatever reason...

Again shows signs of thinking and considering the options.

Overall Thoughts – Fairly positive he is a townie.

Zachrulez,

although he joined midway through the day its evident he has done the re-reading to catch up. He shows signs of questioning others thoughts but not all that much scum hunting.

Also didn't like his pressure on Jasper for links to games where he encountered all the types of scum. Mainly because I don't see what Jasper has to PROVE he's encountered all different types of scum. It just seems like a pointless, pretending to scum hunt point.

I disagree with this; any past links that you’ve played in or that you’ve witnessed allow us to create a form of Meta around the player giving us a better read on them.

No one should hammer until DTMaster at least gets a chance to post again.

Just going to say that now in case someone tries to slip a hammer in and tries to claim they didn't know it was L-1.

This post seems quite townish to me, he makes sure that town doesn’t accidently screw up and quick lynch. This is further backed up by the unvote that followed.

Overall Thoughts – Mixed tells from him. Probably townie.

Almost fully caught up, another 10 minutes and I'll be done.

[DTMaster]

It depends on the flip. However, your thoughts on Town-DTM/Scum-DTM?

Your recent posts show hesitance. Why?

[DTMaster]

Er nvm lol. i requested the replacement gets some rereading time. :p. But I would love to see your verdict given that you are one of many to control my lynch.

[Echo]

So I skip a day and I get 2 pages of posts >.> I'm in the middle of a larger post, but I'm doing a full reread while writing it, so it might take some time. Sorry for the lack of posts so far.

---

In the meantime, @DTM:
Imo your reasoning and analysis is fine - however, your method of getting there is a mess. If you were a confirmed townie, then anyone of us can easily take your word for it. But you're not a confirmed townie. If you lied about your first role, what's to stop you from lying about being a vanilla townie? It's like the boy who cried wolf all over again.

[Regfan]

Jasper has been actively lurking, a decent amount of posts but nothing deep in any of them. The only real attack you’ve done was on DT where the reasons you provided were;

His constant "I want examples"... coming down to demanding I give him a link.

His weak daykill explanation.

His seemingly good work at trying to push the attention away from him.

The example demanding as I already stated allows a meta to be made, which in turn helps town. Thus voting him for this is a bit odd. His daykill explanation is currently explained by the role he just said he has, unless you wish to challenge that role this excuse is also invalid. You say he attempts to push attention away from himself, I only see the opposite, he tries to get in the middle of everything, so again excuse you are using is invalid. You seem to be tunneling in on DT for no good reason; this either makes you a bad townie or mafia. Reading earlier that you’ve had multiple years experience I mafia makes me doubt that you’re a confused townie.

You also state;

You want a Jasper wagon. Why? Because I refused to give you a link? Because I refuse to sit here and let you intimidate me? Sorry DTM, not working.

Seems to be overplaying the link excuse, I think you should rethink the reasons for your vote and either tell me what they are or unvote to be honest.

Overall Thoughts – Scummy, possibly mafia.

Just one more person to go.

[Regfan]

JasonT1981, seems to be looking at everything with a clear head. His first summary of everything that’s gone on was in depth and quite insightful.

That is a very interesting point I didn't actually pick up upon... If this was a post restriction game I could understand it... but your right, this is a mini-normal.

DTM, can you explain a bit further please?

Shows active questioning and an attempt at scum hunting and reading DT here. Another example of this is shown in;

1fifi - just for clarification, Are you saying he is 100% townie or his actions are that of a 100% townie?

I do believe, Jason lacks a bit of scum hunting and would love to see their reads on everyone else not just DT. Although my gut says that Jason is town, I can not find enough proof to back this up entirely so I’m not certain of his alignment.

Overall Thoughts – Not positive, but I think he’s town.


About DT's claim, I don't think he would attempt to make something like that up as mafia, I personally think he isn't he best lynch for today. I would much rather vote out McZombie.

Sorry for having my information in so many posts, I just prefer to work with bits at a time, not one massive chunk.

[The1fifi]

@Reg : Really good job.

Gona be busy for next day guys, sorry

[Sotty7]

7th Vote count of day one

DTMaster 6: (Wacky, Jasper, Echo, jasonT1981, McZombie, Nikanor)

The1fifi 2: (Regfan, Zachrulez)
Regfan 1: (The1fifi)
Jasper 1: (DTMaster)

Not Voting 2:

Seven, jbernier93

-With 12 alive it takes 7 to lynch
-Deadline is 2/22/10 @ 10am CTS.

@Mod
Er If blue is an illegal colour, you can change it.

I changed it to kick ass purple. Blue is just the color I use when I edit other posts, I don't want people using the color to try and impersonate me. Yours seemed like a genuine mistake as you realized/remember right after. No harm no foul.

[Nikanor]

Nikanor seems to be hanging back a bit, not as aggressive as other players. I don't think that personally is scummy or a town tell either, but I'd like to see more of his thoughts on who he believes to be town.

I've been 'hanging back' because I've been busy for the past couple days. I was actively scumhunting before my busy streak, and I plan to resume my scumhunting now that I'm not so busy any more. I explained this already.

The order of scum being top or bottom really means nothing, it's just a scale where you can order your thoughts on everyone. I think this is just Nik trying to 'create' reasons to push this DT lynch even further and thus makes me suspect him.

jason asked DTM why he put Jasper at the bottom of his list. DTM said that he put Jasper at the bottom because was remembering the scum lists that Spinach wrote, where scum was at the bottom. Since Spinach didn't do that, DTM is lying. That's what I got from what DTM said, anyway.

1.

A.

Yes. But have you looked at the people who are on the DTM wagon. Out of everyone here: the only one who doesn't even give off a protown wagon approach is Jasper. Jason jumped on my case well after he should have and brought up points that just parrot the one you did.

B.

The Jasper with Jason and Nikanor defence is just one big echoing of the same argument. Again: why are you answering for him

A. Including fifi? Anyway, I'm not looking at your wagoners until we know your alignment for sure.
B. I never answered for Jasper. Never. I defended him from your unfair questioning because I had a suspicion that you'd attack him for something that wasn't scummy (not providing links to experience of something that is common knowledge), which you did.

2. I was envisioning scum at the bottom. If you put in the correction: my post makes much more sense. Why are you saying that my correction to my post -> Jasper is scummy -> which defines my number one scum pick -> is covering my ass? HMMMM? I clearly outlined who I think is town and scum and you still think I'm covering my ass with vauge details?

I think you tried to reasonlessly change your mind on something, got called on it, and are now covering your ass, yes.

Iffy and Seven are more guilty of this then anything.

Where, specifically? You have piqued my interest with this.

3. You are Wacky 2.0. read above. Read Jasper's posts. I asked for a meta refrence. Jasper refused. Jason gave the refrence Like, oh my god. I asked for a fucking meta refrence and you and Jasper are blowing this up as:

OMG THIS GUY IS SCUMMY FOR ASKING FOR METAS KILL HIM NOW BECAUSE REFRENCING TO YOUR GAMES IS SCUMMY.

No. You're scum for trying to make Jasper look scummy for not providing links to experience when that is in fact not scummy at all. Tell me what possible motivation scum would have as opposed to town for not giving the references and I will drop this.

2. Nikanor: Let Jasper talk in his defence. You and Jason are talking on his behalf for his defence and Jasper has done nothing to add on to it. It looks like he is hiding behind his buddies: Jason and Nikanor

Again, I've only ever defended Jasper for the reference thing. Don't try to make it look like I've leaped to Jasper's aid every time he gets attacked, because that's not what is happening.

About DT's claim, I don't think he would attempt to make something like that up as mafia

WIFOM.

I would much rather vote out McZombie.

Then why aren't you voting McZombie? You're caught up. Hesitance is scummy.

Hey fifi, can you change your signature to something less space-consuming? Thanks.

[Echo]

Ok, so after my reread, I don't really have much to add other than what's been said before. However, there's this: if DTM has an anti-town role, then I don't think it's scum. I feel that his posts are pretty much equally suspicious of every single person in the game. Call it WIFOM if you will, but I've never seen scum able to put another scum on the chopping block so convincingly before.