Last Will Mafia (Over)

[tatetothetot]

Had a busy day and now about to go to work. Will post some more thoughts tonight.

I think the discussion on our mayor today is about wrapped up so...

elect: Rayfrost

For those who are voting Yos for mayor, please consider that he is not an altogether favorite. There are several people who consider Yos to be a bad choice yet no one has said anything negative about Rayfrost who is generally a solid player. I suggest we give the double vote to the most trusted town player which at the moment is Ray.

[Netopalis]

I've not seen anything against Yosarian that's not just vague fear, uncertainty and doubt. RayFrost is a good choice, but I think that Yosarian is marginally better.

[Gayle]

Because your post was obvious garbage, and I assumed you knew that when you were posting it. If you're saying that it's not, then you're probably scum.

I'm saying that is not. What you are saying here is "I didn't respond to your post because you knew it was crap". How does that even make sense? If you think it was a misrepresentation, why not call me out on it instead of ignoring it?

Now, you can agree with me or you can disagree with me, but what you seem to be doing is pretending I said something completely different so you can attack me for it, and the more you do that, the more you just look like scum.

For example?

This argument is scummy, and it is at least the second time it has been used (I don't remember if the other time was by you). Person A doesn't want Person B to have an extra vote, therefore Person A must believe that Person B is scum.That's wrong and it allows you to call into question anyone who mentions that they don't want Yos to be the mayor.

Wait, what?

Your whole argument was "I don't want Yos to become mayor because I don't trust him", wasn't it? That's not quite the same as "I believe he's scum", but it is the same as "I think he's likely to be scum", isn't it? If that's not what you're saying, then I'm confused about what your point is.

A question: Is that supposed to be the example, or are these separate?

If the former, I asked you to give me an example of where I am pretending that your words are one thing when they are actually another. The line you quoted was addressed to Netopalis, so it can hardly be me twisting your words.

If the latter, my point is that the "You must find Yos scummy if you don't want him elected" argument is disingenuous and is being used to call into question players that mention they do not want to elect you.

[vikingfan]

Gayle's barbs, referred by isolation post number:

1: Well, I guess I'll keep my vote on Netopalis. I have faith in his theory discussion.

- Reference to a game we both played in where I got lynched for talking too much about theory on D1.

7: Also itt, Netopalis is scum.

11: It is really difficult trying to argue strategy with Mafia Theory PhDs like Netopalis, so I decided to go campaigning instead.

13: I know you theory types don't have emotion, but it feels to me that you two are trying to concentrate power in Yos. And based on that feeling, I would like to elect anyone but Yos.

14: This is strange. Several minutes have passed and Netopalis hasn't replied. Something must have happened to him. Someone find his address so I can direct the police there immediately.

17: The post that Netopalis made me dig up. Proof that not even Netopalis reads Yos's megaposts.

Netopalis, save for "Netopalis is scum", all of those are jokes. You made a joke about ten ninjas so I thought you had a sense of humor. <--

actual barb

another joke
As for 7, calling people scum in a mafia game is now an insult?

'Net's not online, therefore he's scummy'.

Excuse me, sir, where did you see me say anything like that?

What else am I supposed to make of post 234?

[vikingfan]

174, I mean?

[Gayle]

I think you read to read the top part of the post you just quoted, Vik.

[Gayle]

I think you

read

need to read the top part of the post you just quoted, Vik.

[vikingfan]

Yes, I know that 'now', but at the time, what else was I supposed to make of it? You didn't clear it up until after I made that post.

[Gayle]

Yes, I know that 'now', but at the time, what else was I supposed to make of it? You didn't clear it up until after I made that post.

When someone talks about sending police to someone's house just because they haven't posted for a few minutes, why would you conclude that that person is saying "Net's not online, therefore he's scummy"?

[vikingfan]

well, I had no idea what to make of it...you didn't indicate that it was a joke. That was my best guess to interpret your post.

anyway, enough of that...moving on.

[pwnman]

Well what happened to RF's DK?

[Socrates]

V/LA until Monday.

[raider8169]

fos gayle

since voting is useless here.

You say that like fos' arent useless.

[Yosarian2]

If the latter, my point is that the "You must find Yos scummy if you don't want him elected" argument is disingenuous and is being used to call into question players that mention they do not want to elect you.

Well, I never said "you must find Yos scummy if you don't want him elected." Hell, I don't want me elected. But I find it incredibly disingenuous on your part that on the one hand, you keep going on about how you don't trust me and have bad think I'm trying to manipulate the town in order to get more power, but on the other hand, you claim that you don't find me scummy, and that I'm somehow being unfair in saying that you do.

Hell, you even FOS'd me. Why did you do that if you don't think I'm scummy?

[Gayle]

Well, I never said "you must find Yos scummy if you don't want him elected."

Which is why that is not addressed to you.

But I find it incredibly disingenuous on your part that on the one hand, you keep going on about how you don't trust me and have bad think I'm trying to manipulate the town in order to get more power, but on the other hand, you claim that you don't find me scummy, and that I'm somehow being unfair in saying that you do.

Yos, I never said anything about you being "unfair". I really hate the use of that word. The part of that post after the horizontal rule was addressed to Netopalis.

Hell, you even FOS'd me. Why did you do that if you don't think I'm scummy?

Because it is the beginning of the game and I am trying to

find out

if you are scummy. I can't vote you, so I used FoS, which I would normally be loathe to use.

[Netopalis]

So, you don't trust him but don't find him scummy. Let's say that there was a theoretical role that could switch the alignments of all players, and this role was activated. Would you trust Yosarian then? What if the roles were rerandomized? Does your distrust have anything to do with alignment?

Also, if not Yosarian, who do you find scummy, then?

[Gayle]

So, you don't trust him but don't find him scummy.

Do I trust Yos with the double vote? No. Do I think that he is scum? Not necessarily, but I do have my misgivings. As I've explained at least twice now, I would like to give the vote to someone I don't have such misgivings about.

Also, if not Yosarian, who do you find scummy, then?

It's like your not even reading my posts.

[Netopalis]

But you haven't really explained why you have those misgivings, at least not in a way that is convincing to anybody else. Still, you seem to think that we should all follow up on your gut reaction that none of us can experience. Why is that?

[Gayle]

But you haven't really explained why you have those misgivings, at least not in a way that is convincing to anybody else. Still, you seem to think that we should all follow up on your gut reaction that none of us can experience. Why is that?

Are you asking me why I want people to agree with me? I think the purpose of your post was to say "Gayle's reason for not wanting to elect Yos is only gut" rather than to actually ask such a question.

Let me ask you this: If you thought some of the posts of Player A were disingenuous, and Player B, whom you find to be rather scummy, wanted to elect that player, would you want to elect Player A?

No? Then what is the point of this line of questioning? Do you find me scummy or are you just questioning me because I don't want to elect Yos?

[Netopalis]

I'm trying to divine the source of your feeling of disingenuity. You seem to be of the opinion that because

you

find him disingenuous,

we

should pick somebody else. Nothing that you've said is really anything that anybody else can put stock in and say, "Yes. This makes me second-guess my choice to go for Yosarian." I can understand you not wanting to elect him. I can't understand you telling everybody else that we shouldn't elect him.

[Gayle]

I'm trying to divine the source of your feeling of disingenuity. You seem to be of the opinion that because

you

find him disingenuous,

we

should pick somebody else. Nothing that you've said is really anything that anybody else can put stock in and say, "Yes. This makes me second-guess my choice to go for Yosarian." I can understand you not wanting to elect him. I can't understand you telling everybody else that we shouldn't elect him.

What can't you understand? I found some of Yos's posts questionable, I find his top supporter scummy. Why should I not suggest we elect someone else? Are you saying that if other people don't agree with me, I have no reason to suggest such a thing?

[Netopalis]

I'm saying that you need something to point to to convince other people. You seem to be manufacturing that proof from whole cloth.

[Gayle]

I'm saying that you need something to point to to convince other people. You seem to be manufacturing that proof from whole cloth.

I've already "pointed to something to convince other people".

[Netopalis]

And it wasn't...really all that convincing. You even admitted that yourself in the post.

[Gayle]

And it wasn't...really all that convincing. You even admitted that yourself in the post.

You don't agree with me. Noted. Again, is there a point to this line of questioning? The whole problem seems to be that I don't want to elect Yos and you don't like it.

Also, I admitted no such thing.