Mini 942: Gonzo Mafia - Game Over!

[Locke Lamora]

What do you class as legitimate? If you think my tone or method of investigation is scummy, then surely you have a legitimate reason to question me? I'm trying to draw a line under it because there's nothing else that I can say in response. I've explained my frame of mind and my aims with the questions; you've detected what you think is me trying to make Zach look scummy and then backing off. If my explanation has not satisfied you, I'm not sure what you're looking for. As far as I can see, the only way this discussion would continue is you keep saying you think I'm scum who made a failed attempt at making Zach look bad, and I keep repeating the reasons I already gave for my actions.

[VP Baltar]

He was a first-time offender from Phoenix, serving work-release time in the Library on a six-year Attempted Rape charge that happened when he wandered into the Ladies' Room at the airport and got in a fight with two Mexican women who said they were paid police informants and turned him in as a Sex Offender when the airport police finally ran him down in a false doorway at the far end of the Lost Luggage hangar and dragged him away in handcuffs to the Red Carpet Club where they subjected him to a loud and humiliating Strip Search and beat him on the kidneys with iron gloves.

---

Vote Count 1-7

:

flinter ~ L-3 (Zachrulez, ortolan, Debonair Danny DiPietro, kyle99)

Percy ~ L-5 (Vi, hohum)
kyle99 ~ L-5 (flinter, ekiM)
Sotty7 ~ L-5 (xRECKONERx, Locke Lamora)
Locke Lamora ~ L-6 (Sotty7)
xRECKONERx ~ L-6 (Percy)

Not Voting:

With

12

alive, it takes

7

to lynch. Deadline is March 31 at roughly 3 p.m. (GMT -4).

[Vi]

I have played on another forum before, with a small group of players.

This isn't the kind of answer I wanted...
How experienced, qualitatively, would you say you are with Mafia?

In case you don't, could you please unvote, because your name is so long that I thought I was lynched when I saw that votecount

This doesn't have to be malicious.

The cheese was endearing on Page 2. You can stop now.

flinter, what are you doing to find scum?

---

Is the Percy-hate all predicated on his talk about post restrictions?

Not really; what would give you that impression?

---

@xRECKONERx: You have mentioned twice that you have a meta-town-read on Vi, but you've retracted that now. What made you think that her play was town-Vi?

This isn't the right question.
The right question is "Why are you now obsessing over retracting your Town read?".

Yeah, I'll try to catch up and get some content here soon. I'm posting this in all my games: this is an incredibly stressful/busy week for me. Two mid-terms, a six minute short film project to edit, a ten minute oral Spanish presentation, and a ten page script are all due within the next five days.

Mafia has to take a backseat for a bit.

So... you don't have anything to say about the game and aren't caught up at all, but had this pressing need to warn everyone that I'm not easy to read (in spite of like nobody really calling me Town). Plus you're hanging around GD.
"Reporter Casually Acknowledges Possible RL Commitments; Disregards Them As Smokescreen", end quote.

---

I'm not sure where to go. At this point I don't care if flinter lives or dies. I'm still think it's not impossible to believe Percy is doing a ham job, but his responses today haven't been particularly terrible. ortolan is megalurking more than DDD, which is something of a dubious achievement. And xRx has pretty much inverted my Town read.

Hey hohum. Let's go back to xRx; he had more support and I think he needs the pressure more.

Unvote: Percy
Vote: xRECKONERx

(L-5)

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

ortolan is megalurking more than DDD, which is something of a dubious achievement.

Hugs.

~~~

@xRECKONERx: You have mentioned twice that you have a meta-town-read on Vi, but you've retracted that now. What made you think that her play was town-Vi?

This isn't the right question.
The right question is "Why are you now obsessing over retracting your Town read?".

Yeah, I'll try to catch up and get some content here soon. I'm posting this in all my games: this is an incredibly stressful/busy week for me. Two mid-terms, a six minute short film project to edit, a ten minute oral Spanish presentation, and a ten page script are all due within the next five days.

Mafia has to take a backseat for a bit.

So... you don't have anything to say about the game and aren't caught up at all, but had this pressing need to warn everyone that I'm not easy to read (in spite of like nobody really calling me Town). Plus you're hanging around GD.
"Reporter Casually Acknowledges Possible RL Commitments; Disregards Them As Smokescreen", end quote.

This is also quite the fun expose. Tack it to forced casework from earlier and we've got a new number one who was also an old number one.

Unvote; Vote: xRecx

[flinter]

Sotty: logic is better for arguing, and bringing your point across, I think.

Zach his posts on

page three

are seriously weak: Reck had a point here. Zach is making 2 active lurking cases already, and saying Hohum isn't aggressive enough. Sorry, 3 active lurking cases: on me too. (locke and sotty were the others). Votehopping isn't the problem,

it is that the votes are not very different, and weak.

Active lurking is scummy. Besides, the reason I voted you was because you weren't scumhunting.

The efforts you've been putting forth are just really weak at this point.

I don't really feel like they are genuine

and are more forced suspicions in response to the fact that people find your lack of scum hunting suspicious.

I have bolded the two key words: page three. Oh, and they are. I already said that. But seemingly, they did make sense, as you are not even trying to argue, you are only trying to discredit me.

how did we call that: ad hominem?

Nothing you quoted there by Zach amounts to an ad hominem attack if that is what you are suggesting.

I've bolded my first suspicion of zach, and I italicized his response.

This is a full ad hom. In stead of answering my argument, zach says I'm not honestly suspecting him, and I shouldn't be active lurking.

Hohum becomes more towny for me.


Vi: I'm still voting for my scum, who hasn't posted a lot lately.

Further, other suspects like locke have posted, but I didn't find this interesting.

I think going for Reck is wrong. I was going to look at what was said about Percy, because I didn't fully understand it always, but I'm afraid I forgot to do that.


Oh, and I think I'm moderately experienced. But I notice the way you play here is a little different.



Although I like that DDD is finally off me, his vote makes me doubt him a bit. He bandwagons.

[hohum]

I can get behind an xRec lynch, if for nothing more than the sheer volume of shitposting.

I'd rather wait for Percy to respond to my last post before I change my vote though, mostly because I have a major problem with anyone that stands over a fire with a can of gasoline in one hand and a cell phone ready to dial 911 in the other.

[hohum]

I can get behind an xRec lynch, if for nothing more than the sheer volume of shitposting.

The sheer volume of early shitposting, the plea for attention at the beginning of the game, the excuses for lurking, the reactionary stance, ad nauseam

[ortolan]

Vi: I'm not lurking deliberately, I've simply been rather busy. I just replaced out of one game cause I couldn't keep up and in the other I have also been attacked purely for being inactive. But I appreciate that that makes me harder to read so...yer. Do you normally move your vote around so much on day one by the way? I can't recall you having done it to such a great extent in the past.

Also, why did you abandon the xRx wagon in favour of the flinter wagon?

I didn't see this question first time round. I wasn't really conscious of the fact I was voting xReckonerx when I made that post, it was just I guess that I strongly reacted against what I saw as flinter's bullying/pushing a mislynch on kyle which I know scum is likely to do. I will say more recently that I explicitly feel reckoner is not as likely to be scum as I first thought. It's not just his further commentary on Vi which still reads as genuine but the way he clumsily referenced an ongoing game and earlier asked a totally irreverent/irrelevant question which seems more like his town self from the one game my meta of him is based on (I don't know of any scum games).

Something I don't like is hohum's preaching to/criticising Percy in ISO 14. I've seen hohum berate before for policy reasons when he was scum (in that open game we played in with all the town PGOs) and suspect one of his scum tactics might be to deliberately feign annoyance/outrage at policy antitown actions. This would also make sense as an alternate analysis of hohum's "you're more concerned about reputation" comment to Vi earlier in the game.

[hohum]

Ort:

Before I even begin to get into your last post please comment on this post.

Are you going to make an effort to be more active in this game now? You've dropped other games so that should give you a bit more time to focus on this one.

If you're not going to rectify your lurking problem and you're going to continue to randomly appear in thread to do nothing but snipe at people then I'm not going to take you seriously at all.

[ortolan]

Ort:

Before I even begin to get into your last post please comment on this post.

I already did comment on it (specifically), to say it was scummy.

Are you going to make an effort to be more active in this game now?

Of course, otherwise I would ask to be replaced. I don't need you to deal with that for me

You've dropped other games so that should give you a bit more time to focus on this one.

Yes that was the idea.

If you're not going to rectify your lurking problem and you're going to continue to randomly appear in thread to do nothing but snipe at people then I'm not going to take you seriously at all.

I'm usually equally effective at catching scum regardless of how much attention I'm paying to a game but I understand the whole reciprocity of posting frequency thing. That said I do think you are legitimately scummy.

[hohum]

So you think calling out lurkers in a game with tight deadline is scummy? We should continue to allow people to lurk?

I don't care what you think of your scum catching abilities, because if you're lurking you aren't scum hunting, and you're dragging the rest of us down with you.

[hohum]

That said I do think you are legitimately scummy.

Then put your vote where your mouth is, or are you afraid that it isn't going to bode well for you when I flip?

[ortolan]

That said I do think you are legitimately scummy.

Then put your vote where your mouth is, or are you afraid that it isn't going to bode well for you when I flip?

Yes I am afraid that the flip which will ensue when I place the L-6th vote on you will bode badly for me. This scummy comment did tip you over the threshold for me though so I'll oblige.

Unvote

Vote: hohum

[hohum]

It's less about a L-6 vote and more about you pushing a shit case, but meh, do as you please.

[Zachrulez]

Sotty: logic is better for arguing, and bringing your point across, I think.

Zach his posts on

page three

are seriously weak: Reck had a point here. Zach is making 2 active lurking cases already, and saying Hohum isn't aggressive enough. Sorry, 3 active lurking cases: on me too. (locke and sotty were the others). Votehopping isn't the problem,

it is that the votes are not very different, and weak.

Active lurking is scummy. Besides, the reason I voted you was because you weren't scumhunting.

The efforts you've been putting forth are just really weak at this point.

I don't really feel like they are genuine

and are more forced suspicions in response to the fact that people find your lack of scum hunting suspicious.

I have bolded the two key words: page three. Oh, and they are. I already said that. But seemingly, they did make sense, as you are not even trying to argue, you are only trying to discredit me.

how did we call that: ad hominem?

Nothing you quoted there by Zach amounts to an ad hominem attack if that is what you are suggesting.

I've bolded my first suspicion of zach, and I italicized his response.

This is a full ad hom. In stead of answering my argument, zach says I'm not honestly suspecting him, and I shouldn't be active lurking.

Hohum becomes more towny for me.


Vi: I'm still voting for my scum, who hasn't posted a lot lately.

Further, other suspects like locke have posted, but I didn't find this interesting.

I think going for Reck is wrong. I was going to look at what was said about Percy, because I didn't fully understand it always, but I'm afraid I forgot to do that.


Oh, and I think I'm moderately experienced. But I notice the way you play here is a little different.



Although I like that DDD is finally off me, his vote makes me doubt him a bit. He bandwagons.

Hi.

I think you need to read that before you claim I'm using ad_hominem argument, because upon reading it you'll realize that I actually am not.

Few other thoughts in response to your post.

Why is the Reckoner wagon wrong? This just feels like such a categorical thing to say. I'm don't find a Reckoner wagon appealing, but I can understand why people might want to vote him.

Also just remembered that your vote was still on Kyle. I can't remember a good reason for it being there, but it feels like the safest lurker vote ever. (He is lurking, but to me it his play looks exactly the same as his play in Kittymo's mini 922, where I replaced him as a town mason.)

So yeah... why are you voting for him again?

[Sotty7]

What do you class as legitimate? If you think my tone or method of investigation is scummy, then surely you have a legitimate reason to question me? I'm trying to draw a line under it because there's nothing else that I can say in response. I've explained my frame of mind and my aims with the questions; you've detected what you think is me trying to make Zach look scummy and then backing off. If my explanation has not satisfied you, I'm not sure what you're looking for. As far as I can see, the only way this discussion would continue is you keep saying you think I'm scum who made a failed attempt at making Zach look bad, and I keep repeating the reasons I already gave for my actions.

Well I asked that question because of response you gave in post 169 made it sound like you thought my questioning of you was completely ridiculous. But I re-read the post this morning and it doesn't feel as pissy as it did yesterday. With that said you are right, we can only go in circles at his point so lets put a pin in that and move on.

What do you think of Vi's case on Percy? Any opinions on ortolan?

flinter, your post 179 is awful. Look up what ad hom is then get back to me. Also any input as to why hohum is becoming more townie for you?

I think going for Reck is wrong.

So you think he is town?

Although I like that DDD is finally off me, his vote makes me doubt him a bit. He bandwagons.

What is your obsession with Triple D's vote?

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Although I like that DDD is finally off me, his vote makes me doubt him a bit. He bandwagons.

What is your obsession with Triple D's vote?

I am pretty important.

[hohum]

It's less about a L-6 vote and more about you pushing a shit case, but meh, do as you please.

I also just noticed that you completely ignored the first post I made and jumped right on the "logical fallacy" train.

*tsk*tsk*

[flinter]

Reck is making mistakes, not being scummy. The wagon might be appealing, but is quite a random one.

I know very well what ad hominem means. As far as I know, Zach didn't even read my accusations, he just went on how bad I am as a player.

Now, he may think that fun, and all, but that doesn't mean that his votes on page 3 were well reasoned, or that there was any need for a votechange between them (the cases were very similar) Zach never replyed to this.

unvote vote zach

. You may have a friend in Sotty, but that doesn't mean you are right. Please tell me why you needed to votehop there.

[flinter]

Although I like that DDD is finally off me, his vote makes me doubt him a bit. He bandwagons.

What is your obsession with Triple D's vote?

I am pretty important.

He just made that vote. I am pretty sure I am allowed to comment on that, but maybe Sotty has a reason why I shouldn't?

[flinter]

Also just remembered that your vote was still on Kyle. I can't remember a good reason for it being there, but it feels like the safest lurker vote ever. (He is lurking, but to me it his play looks exactly the same as his play in Kittymo's mini 922, where I replaced him as a town mason.)

So yeah... why are you voting for him again?

are you blaming me because you can't read well? I didn't mention lurking as a reason for it, nor was kyle lurking at that moment. He was, however, defending Reck in a wishy washy manner, which is absolutely not his style. And that was my case.

(it wouldn't have been too hard to iso me, I hope?)

[Zachrulez]

Hi.

Totally saw that vote coming after I called out the Kyle vote.

[flinter]

I actually read it in the way I replyed to it, but I don't expect you to believe me.

Why wasn't that reason in the original post where you voted? Because that was a simple active lurking case.

[Locke Lamora]

Sotty: I thought Vi's case on Percy was quite indecipherable, actually. I had to go back and read it a few times before I got all of it. I don't think Percy's scummy and nothing much seems to have come of it. As for Ortolan, I think he's made some easy votes on Reckoner and Flinter and hasn't offered much else. My own personal experience of hohum is that he can frequently be quite hostile and berate people (for policy reasons or otherwise) as town, so I'm dubious about whether that scum meta reference is of any worth.

I'm going to be busy over the next few days so my posting frequency will probably go down, just wanted to let everyone know.

Mod: possible V/LA until Monday

[xRECKONERx]

Sotty's 190 is nothing but fluff.