Pledge of Allegiance (Game Over! Page 76)

[Plum]

Yoyoyo.

Who wants me lynched and why? What can I get informed on briefly, because I have an AP test tomorrow I really ought to be cramming for?

[Plum]

Nah, I'm lucky, I'm doing Bio. What're you doing taking Physics, young'n?

[Plum]

Yup. Lucky math people (I'm considered one of them, but it's only relative, and I've never taken Physics in my life. Still consider myself a science person, though).

[Plum]

Ojanen is Town cf. Post 413

I seem to remember both LlamaFluff and DGB preferring to play Town over scum; this impression is both much stronger for Llama and it's more likely that he actually followed that inclination. Neither of them feel much off in what little I've skimmed of them.

I believe Gamma's Town. Just by the way, Gamma awesome.

Thus game is perfect for UNBREAKABLE ALLIANCES but I don't see one's suggested. If Spy's stuck modding/setting up for this game I guess I'll have to do it myself.

Nico has very little scum experience at all and I an believe him not trusting himself to play scum against a decent playerlist. If he's scum we'll probably see it fairly soon.

I like moderately the early game xvart wagon based on Post 101, mostly because of the knee-jerk reaction to Elli mentioning a quicktopic earning double FOSes. Not because he should have know that Elli and DGB hydra sometimes and such, but . . . the reaction shouldn't be 'When did town aligned peeps get QTs??' As I see others have said, scum aren't so completely idiotic as to quote their quicktopics in the game thread like that. And if it were, why FOSes and not votes? Also I hope some people brought up Neighborzes here, because just reading xvart is iso is giving me hives and I'm not going to spend time rehashing stuff people ought to have discussed previously. Besides the continuous harping on ordering of suspicions re: Parama. When I talk about gut and something else it's usually because it's a blend of gut and something I can basically put my finger on but can't express well, so it'll come out 'because he reads bad gutwise - and I dunno but I feel like every post he makes seems to almost be not trying to be logical just trying to sound it'.

ut then Pops could go too. The random number generator WIFOM is a big mass of WIFOM. If you like playing Town you'll just pick Town and not have to care much about self-preservation ... either way, I believe he prefers playing scum to Town and I don't see that much reason to believe that he didn't choose it and made up a pretty story about random numbers. But even more than that I usually hate catching up most, by far, when I'm scum, and the more there is to catch up on the more I hate having to do it. I loathe it; as Town it's usually but not always much better. But I suppose some meta on Pops could be found re: whether he also sometimes dislikes catching up as scum or not.

I'll look into the Fishy case sometime.

##Unvote

##Vote: xvart

This is just a cobbling together; we'll see what else can be done soonish.

[Plum]

At a glance (oh I'm up much later than I wanted to be) I don't see anything immediately off with UK, can see the spat between her and my predecessor but I don't see that much worthwhile to pursue there immediately. Am trying to figure out if UK's hatred of being VT would outpace her hatred of being scum, but I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt there for now. I'd like to get Xvart-wagon rolling again or possibly Pops, I guess; would like to start integrating the people I'm decently confident are Town into a lean mean scum lynching machine so yeah.

[Plum]

Oh and I think pop's post was before Parama was edited in to the post as the name of the modkilled player.

[Plum]

Chrono, Llama happens to be ubertown and your OMGUS is frankly not helping my opinion of you.

##Vote: Red

in the meantime; I'll trust my Town reads for a bit. Wagon started by Elli is a good thing. Who says nay and why?

I'll look into farside-imagine-fishy, Elli; any you think might be neutral there?

[Plum]

Oh? *eyebrow raise*

[Plum]

##Unvote

## Vote: Fishy

[Plum]

You got it.

##Unvote

[Plum]

I swear to god if people unvote, I am going to lose it.

There's a reason why we lynch anyone not town. If not really obvious to you now, it will be later in the game.

Individual independent Non-hostile claimers can and

will

be dealt with. I'd ask them to claim now and promise not to lynch them unless we got wind that they're, you know, actually lying scum (and that includes playing scummy and not doing everything asked of them immediately). In fact, if you're Part of the Executive, Legislative, or Judicial branches

please claim now

. If you're pro-Town-type Other, as Fishy claims he is, you'll be doing the Town overall a favor, even though you might not want to claim. You have another incentive: You don't claim now, well, there's at least one and possibly more investigative PRs who will assume you to be hostile if they get a non-Town, or even an Other result on you, should you not claim immediately. Vig(s) will be encouraged to shoot only claimed Neutrals who are uncooperative, showed signs of scumminess in the Town's/Vig's estimation, or seemed to have a wincon which involved helping scum instead of Town. Again, these guys are not Hostile Other and we can win with them around.

DGB, I agree with you on Zorblag in general. I could dissect up a case, but the direct poking at Chronopie is something recent which rubbed me very wrong.

##Vote: Zorblag

. I'd endorse this wagon.

[Plum]

Crud hold the thought on that massclaim a second please. Lemme think.

[Plum]

The downside is that it

could

help the scum determine who's most worth killing. That could possibly be remedied depending on how we ask the Non-Hostiles to claim and to what degree we'll be coopting their powers for the Town's uses.

[Plum]

@Plum, should I take it that you've got no problems with Chronopie's story about what happened at the start of day two?

Nope. Fishy out-and-out claimed third party after Chrono claimed stuff on him. Scum/Hostile Other Cop or whatever is possible, sure, but not the biggest concern - and in any case, why would that have an effect on whether he'd post before seeing his PM? What do you think about my plan to have every Non Hostile claim that now, Zorblag?

If we're not going to lynch Fishy he's not going to target a PGO just because we tell him to, is he? I wouldn't object, but if you really don't trust Fish

[Plum]

Jack - I remember that game too, of course, but the timing here seems much more plausible, that and the fact that Fishy admitted to Otherhood.

[Plum]

@Plum, I think that if Fishythefish was given the choice between being lynched today and getting the chance to transmit a track on Gammagooey to someone he thought was town he'd probably take it. Like I said, I'm not sure that it actually behooves him to try to be on lynches as I'd guess he's got a better chance of hitting town than scum which hurts him so I'm not overly convinced he'd mind dying in a way that helped the town as a town win does benefit him so long as he's telling the truth.

Maybe maybe not. He'd probably try to transmit to someone he thought was prob Town anyway, skip the suicide, and hope the Town would find a reason not to go after him. Waste of our time. If you truly don't trust Fishy, you'll want to lynch him now.

[Plum]

When did this happen?

A few days ago.
Am I the only one that wants all the non-obvtown people to claim?

Nope, you're not the only one.

I'm okay with a Nico wagon, still like the Zorblag one, let's see a votecount and we'll settle it up.

[Plum]

It's plausible but I disagree that the quote shows it and it's not a big concern at this point either way.

[Plum]

But but my gut is hating on Troll so much harder :O He IS a better lynch than fishy though.

TROLL AND NICO CAN BOTH DIE!
WIN WIN WIN!

EXCELLENT. I'M SO UP FOR THIS.

FARSIDE, are you explicitly claiming non-Other? Would you do so at if you'd be lynched if we found out you lied? You laying your life on the line claiming that you're definitely NOT OTHER?

[Plum]

Looks pretty good to me. I'll see if I can rustle up a pretty response to Troll but I've got other things I need to do today.

[Plum]

Anyone want to claim Non-Hostile Other before Day 3? It's a juicy chance. Freeclaiming NOW will have us leaving you alone so long as you don't act overtly scummy. It'll keep scum off your back because they won't be accidentally shooting at you because they can win with you alive. It'll prevent us having to lynch you if you're run up to claim and claim truthfully. There's no indication that other Non-Hostiles have actual killing power, so they won't be shooting at you even if you confess. It'll even be fairly hard for them to push wagons on you without extremely good reasons. Any Vig will be certain to shoot away from you.

If you don't claim now, then any (Non-Hostile) Other claim or investigation will be killed on sight.

Debating whether to just ask our top non-Town/scum suspects {Shotty, RC, d3x, Nico} to claim whether they're Town or other (or Mafia or Hostile, I'm not objecting) and abstainers go on the lynch list, as does anyone found to have lied.

Heck.

Shotty, RedCoyote, dx3, Nicodemus

, claim in your next post your ALIGNMENT. Abstaining or lying is grounds for immediate lynch. Claiming Non-Hostile Other is

not

grounds for immediate lynch. You're already our top suspects, give or take. Spill. Preferably before Day 3 starts, please. No other information is demanded at this time.

[Plum]

##Vote: d3x

Still want claims from him and RC; Chrono, I'd investigate one of these tonight. Shotty needs what it says on the tin, but an investigation would be better used on one of the two I mentioned above.

Unsurprised at the result on Jack.

[Plum]

If all went well, someone should have received a transmitting track result. If so, they should probably claim it.

Someone did receive a result of, eh, something. Which is to say, not containing all the info I'd assumed would be included in such a transmission. Not sure it was yours, to be honest.

[Plum]

I received another pm, just a minute ago. Plum, 'fess up, who'd you visit? and why?

Shotty. It was an information-gathering action. Need more details?

No, I got "someone vistited X" where I know X but not the someone.

[Plum]

Ooh. A weak amnesiac watcher. An indication, possibly, that there is another points factions with somewhat similar/symmetrical abilities to my own.

Apparently.

As I said, Shotty wouldn't be amiss getting what it says on the tin - a shot to the body - preferably at the hands of Zorb. It's not urgent, but probably a nicer bet than Fishy, who's been relatively helpful in comparison.

[Plum]

@ UK: At the end of the day, do you or do you not suspect me? 'Cause I'm fine with either at the moment, so long as I can tell which, y'ken.

[Plum]

Troll can shoot Shotty and the noose ought to be plenty empty for dx3. I give you my word, kk?

[Plum]

I assure you that only the first clause of Special Program will be at all necessary, unless - and this is a slight but plausible situation - that Shotty is an Other who's not in the Government, which probably means he's Hostile and anyway would be a pleasant noose candidate.

[Plum]

Because you're useless and you're not Town. Do you disagree on either count?

[Plum]

You personally or you your group have abilities that benefit the Town?

Because Zorblag really, I'll bet, wants to shoot people, and so far I think I'd be happier if he shot you than Fishy.

[Plum]

Hmmmm.

Okay Elli, y'got a point.

Pun unintended.

[Plum]

@Plum, would you like to confirm that it was Chronopie that you got your transmission about? I think that you left that vague. Same question to you about alignment reveal as DrippingGoofball just got.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

Yeah. In full, that someone visited Chrono last Night. The Someone is left unspecified.

I'm still reading Charter as Town. Charter, do you mind claiming whether you're Town or Other, though?

I was told that I would show not to be town aligned on investigation. I don't know if that means mafia in particular, I'd assume so.

Whaaaaaaat?

Oh hell.

Way to tie yourself to farside22.

Hm? How so and what do you care to imply by saying so?

[Plum]

Um, not policy lynching non-Town indiscriminately. Read my posts, please. I'm in for outing them indiscriminately and am more interested in seeing clearly who's what. There

is

a reason for this. Separating out true Other claims from fake ones helps see where our pool of true scum actually is. That's why, for example, I'm happy we have outed d3x and Shotty as Other, and have Zorblag at the very least to help test such claims.

Again, check my posts and note that while I talk a lot about outing Others as a good thing, I clearly stand

against

policy lynching them.

[Plum]

It appeared that #1379 was advocating Shotty's policy lynch. I'll look through tomorrow.

No, it was a statement of fact supporting why I would have been pleased to see Shotty dead, and both were factual. I did not want to use a lynch on Shotty; I wanted Zorb to possibly use an Other-killing shot against him, as he was not merely Other but useless. Because Zorb's shot is effective at taking out useless Others and that's basically the extent to which it can be used to our benefit (unless we definitively uncover a points-faction which helps scum, in which case the best use would be taking down counter-productive Other, but I digress), Shotty would have been an excellent target and him gone would have been no unhelpful thing, in my opinion. Zorb using his shot to hunt Non-Hostile Other is as valid a way of using it, I suppose, so it's okay if he does that on our orders.

[Plum]

Uh, no, just interested in explaining to SC that his interpretation is incorrect. I was not the only one to desire your death at the time and frankly the reasons for not needing or particularly wanting you around still apply. I'm fine with waiting, no desire to per se rush things. Where, may I ask, did you get that idea?

[Plum]

I WANT TO HEREBY CONFIRM THAT CHARTER'S INFO IS ACCURATE.

THAT IS. PARAMA'S ROLE

DID

WORK AS HE DESCRIBED. PARAMA'S ROLE DID

NOT

GIVE RESULTS ON MOTIVE, ONLY OTHER/NOT OTHER, DESPITE THE NAME.

THIS DOES NOT RULE OUT CHARTER BEING SCUM IN AND OF ITSELF, BUT IT SHOULD BE KNOWN.

[Plum]

@Plum, you seem to have forgotten to take part in the mass claim there.

Yeah, because I was going to mention that my school computer is schizo and will occasionally allow me access to random thread pages but usually nada. I took what I had time and ability to see and responded. There seemed to be a massclaim going but I had no way to tell if there was going to be a set order or what and figured that it could wait a few hours.

@Plum: How convenient.

Isn't it? I'm not trying to save 'obvscum Charter' I need to check what he might have recently done to earn that epithet, sure. And his claim does bother me for other reasons. I'll get to

that

in a second.

Look, if we're a two-man 'can't let him die' faction, as Pops just suggested, we're screwed. We wouldn't be Mafia in that case (a two-man Mafia setup is possible, but not one where potential for complete and devastating loss is so easy and likely) so Zorb &c. could just shoot one of us and we'd be dead.

Anyway. I'm a

Contractor

and my role is

Universal Backup

. I'm not just doing this for the money. I'm doing it for a, um, a

whole lot

of money. Anyway, I activated when Charter did - on Chronopie's death. Same Role PM, same role. My focus on getting Others to claim might in retrospect have been too forceful, but my idea was to use the role to an advantage: catching Mafia fakeclaiming Other. That was my take on Shotty today. Notice how I state definitively that he's not Town (not that he's scum) and that I'd like Zorb to shoot him and that I'm very confident that the shot would kill him when this is discussed. Basically I investigated him and got a result of Other.

But having thought about it, I'm less freely confident in my 'oh nevermind outguessing the setup makers as to whether they'd double up Universal Backup' + Town read on Charter. However, declaring him fakeclaiming scum about the Motive Cop role mechanics is not a productive path.




[/hr]

[Plum]

Chrono: I'm a Universal backup, and except for rolename/Motive flavor most things went exactly as Charter described them. And last Night I targeted Shotty and got a result of 'Other'.

[Plum]

Oh. I got Parama's Other/Non-Other investigation ability. If I screwed up and put some other username in there I'm sorry. It's Other/Regular-Mafia-or-Town-but-no-indication-which as possible results.

[Plum]

Okay DGB is an awesome lynch am I missing anything/anyone need to say something before I hammer?

[Plum]

RedCoyote is Not Other (so, is either Town or Mafia).

Does Chronopie's Milleresqueness involve Death Millerhood or am I remembering wrong?

[Plum]

Gamma - bad idea. As far as I can tell it falls to pieces if UK is Town, which I think is very very likely. In any case, I don't see clear enough evidence this no lynch would provide better info or outcome than just following through this deal, which is at worst a one-for-one Town for Scum/Hostile Other trade. No lynch might theoretically give an outside chance of catching the whole scumteam which empirically would be a nil chance, while giving the scum more time to winnow us down . . . which I assume is what you mean by 'lynch the majority' - that is, we'd have just given up a Day we could have lynched scum to see if the scum would set themselves on the temple altar, grab the knife, and ceremoniously remove their own still-beating virgin heart to spare us the bother of getting our hands bloody ourselves.

I suppose we

could

lynch a secondary suspect today and see what we find out tomorrow but I'm inclined against it.

##Vote: Chronopie

UK is quite Town after the DGB escapade yesterday and besides which no one else is claiming her kills. Outside chance she's Other but the likelihood of her as SK pulling off the win even if we lynch Chrono and he's Town is slim to none. And everything Farside said on the subject, which is the same ideas only prettier and more fleshed out.

[Plum]

Gamma - I can rustle up a few for you, but I know a lot of Mods are partial to listing factional abilities in a separate section from personal abilities and will allow one of each or such, so a scum Roleblocker can in many cases block and kill on the same Night (or for the end of the same Day). And furthermore see the sample Town PM the Mod posted at the beginning of the game:

Factional Abilities:
<none>

Passive Abilities:
<none>

Active Abilities:
<none>

[Plum]

Question: What was including the potential alignment

Unknown

for, setup creators/Mod?

[Plum]

Question: What was including the potential alignment

Unknown

for, setup creators/Mod?

Well you know me; on occasion I throw out roles that make no sense and just tell them to do their best.

Actually, I think that was just zorotter trying to be complete. But I really should do that sometime.

Still, it wasn't as if you could choose Unknown as your alignment (though that would be a cool trainwreck because, if I may say so, I'd expect an even split between Other and Unknown in that case, assuming the Unknownness was known to be able to be rescinded midgame by some force or other).

I was telling SpyreX somewhere before I replaced in that I was expecting a really high number of Other choices.

[Plum]

I'm always up for a little (little) Bastard Moddery myself, so long as I/everyone else knows that they're getting into something a slight bit twisted.

[Plum]

I don't even think I had a Night 4 target, to my shame.