Mini 955 - Classic Mafia - Over

[Seacore]

This is the downside of the auto-lynch.

People are happier to sit back.

We need a post from Hero and CDB explaining why they aren't voting.

[AlmasterGM]

Day 2, Vote Count 7 - The Final Vote Count

Votes

Exilon - 4 (MagnaofIllusion, Seacore, Deer, Ythill)

ChannelDelibird - 1 (Wickedestjr)
MagnaofIllusion - 1 (Exilon)
Wickedestjr - 1 (podium123456)

Not Voting - 2 (Hero764, ChannelDelibird)

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The clock struck 9 and Exilon let out an audible sigh as he glanced at the chaos around him. Despite being trapped in the council chambers for over 12 hours, the group had yet to reach any sort of consensus. After yesterday's disaster at the river, he'd thought a more civilized approach would have yeilded better results. Apparently not. He banged his gavel.
"Come on, people!" he cried. "It's not THAT hard, for god's sake! Magna's the one we want!" But the room would have nothing of it.
"I still think it's Wickedestjr..." podium123456 drawled slowly through a mouthful of potato chips. "But maybe Hero764 and ChannelDelibird have something to add?"
The room glanced over to the duo, both of whom were tilted back in their chairs, fast asleep.
"I have an idea," Ythill said loudly, standing up. "What about Exilon? Who put you in charge?" He pointed an accusatory finger in Exilon's direction.
"I agree!" MagnaofIllusion added. "This is a democracy. We're taking you down."
"You guys can't be serious," Exilon said. "Me? Me? I mean..."
"Somebody get a syringe," Seacore quipped.
"I've got it," Deer said.
"Please, guys, I swear, I'm on your side," Exilon pleaded. "Besdies, how is this a democracy when you don't even have a majority?"
"Do we look like we need a majority?" Ythill chuckled sarcastically. "It's four against one. And we're a lot tougher than you."
"And actually, we technically don't even need a majority," MagnaofIllusion said matter-o-factly. "According to...hold on, let me find it..."
He scanned through the 8 point font of the 1450 page City Charter manual. "This rule," he pointed.
Exilon just stood there. "Give it your best shot," he said.

Twenty miniutes later, Exilon's body lay dead on the table, his heart stopped by lethal injection. The silence was deafening.
"Uh...soo...should we go check out his house or something?" Seacore suggested.
"Yeah, let's do it," Deer concured.

A few hours and one ransack later, the town's motley crew left Exilon's mansion empty handed, with nothing to show for the day's work except a dead body and Exilon's now-unemployed Butler.

Exilon - Vanilla Town - lynched Day 2.

[AlmasterGM]

Mini 955 - Classic Mafia - Night 2

"Leave the gun, take the cannolis."



Night 2 will last until Thursday, May 27 2010 at 9:00 AM EST.

[AlmasterGM]

"What a shame," MagnaofIllusion said aloud to himself as he slowly lifted Exilon's lifeless body off the floor of the City Council chambers and onto a stretcher. Not the death, of course - after all, he had clammered for that all day. The real shame was that he had to stick around and play cleanup crew while the rest of the town got to go home and sleep. You'd think that with 8 years of higher education and 4 years of residency they could hire an intern or something to deal with this sort of situation.

As he waited for the elevator, MagnaofIllusion pulled his cell phone from his pocket and dialed the dispatch for the local hopsital. Despite knowing that Exilon was long gone, he would still have to be transported there to be given an official death certificate before being hauled to the cemetary.
"At the very least, it's nighttime," Magna thought. "So it won't take the ambulance long to get here."

The Paramedics arrived approximately 10 minutes later to find MagnaofIllusion's body slumped over top of Exilon's, a knife driven straight through his heart. His hand was reaching helpelessly towards his defilibrator. Two death certificates were issued the following morning.

MagnaofIllusion - Town Doctor - killed Night 2

[AlmasterGM]

Mini 955 - Classic Mafia - Day 3

"I never lie to any man because I don't fear anyone. The only time you lie is when you are afraid."

The deadline is Friday, June 11th 2010 at 11:59 PM EST.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I'd say Bah but I just got knifed through the heart.

Go Town!!!

[Exilon]

I like miracles, they tend to happen - that's why I'm dead but my voice still echoes.

Good luck and go town!

[Wickedestjr]

Well, I am very surprised Magna flipped town. He was one of my top suspects. I'm going to have to give the thread another look.

I would like to ask Ythill, Seacore and Deer who they each believe to be scum.

I would also like to hear what CDB and Hero think about Seacore and Ythill. I'd prefer if CDB answered the question first though.

CDB, what do you think of Seacore and Ythill?
Hero, what do you think of Seacore and Ythill?



Also, it is probably LyLo right now. Time for mass claim?

[podium123456]

Also, it is probably LyLo right now. Time for mass claim?

Hell, i can probably answer that for you right now... 1 vig/sk and 6 villagers.



and.... now that i think about it, there's probably no need in outing the vig (if it's a vig)... its the only advantage we have left.


arent you experienced enough to realize all this? or am i missing something with my thoughts here?

[podium123456]

edit: after seeing that you have been in 10 games, you are more than experienced enough to realize what i wrote. So, unless my reasoning is off, i think asking for a mass claim in this situation is a pretty bullsh%& move.

Some off the cuff thoughts here:

Wicked: I still regard him as a top scum pick... scummy play overall, and his rebuttals have been the weakest of anyone, by far. Also, asking for mass claim here hurts town, IMO. The only thing going for him is that he hasn't resorted to OMGUS.

(Also, if he was maf, i would expect him to want to kill his biggest opponent (me) and that hasn't happened. But that is very wifomy and not really factoring into my analysis of him.)

Deer: I havent iso'd him recently, but i dont recall any of his input striking me as being overly scummy. However, he seems to pride himself on brevity and i dont feel the same. Brevity is useful when you use it to keep arguments short... but when your overall input is thin, i feel it is detrimental to town. Allows him to play safe as mafia, and, if town, it prevents us from scumhunting for slips, etc.

CDB: Sigh. Either play or get out. Based on TCC's play d1, i call this a strong scum pick. So be it.

Ythill/Seacore: i am much more susp. of these two today. i noted earlier that i felt like they were working together. seacores d2 play seemed different than d1 play. Seacore is the scummier between the two, IMO. Ythill has come off as pro town, but his experience keeps me on guard. Dont know... will have to review things.

Hiphop/Hero: another sigh. another play or get out. who knows. i dont recall hiphop being that scummy to me. So be it.

[Ythill]

It's definately LYLO. We should be careful with votes.

We should also massclaim. IMO, CDB should go first but it really doesn't matter much to me.

@podium:

At this point, we don't want the vig/SK shooting unless it's a guarenteed hit anyway. Massclaim gives us several advantages: revealing the second killer narrows the pool for mislynch and forces the mafia to kill that player tonight. There's also the chance of a vig counterclaim but I don't think the scum in this game are that stupid.

I haven't reread D2 yet, and will do so before making any definitive scumpicks. However, I don't mind giving my off-the-cuff guesses now. Podium and Deer still look obv-town to me. The scum are among CDB, Wicked, Seacore, and Hero. CDB is at the top of the list. Over the next couple of days I'll go through the evidence and narrow it down to three.

@Wick:

So you're going to ask for the suspicions of everyone except podium, and then not give your own? Bad.

[Ythill]

Crossposted.

The only thing going for him is that he hasn't resorted to OMGUS.

Actual OMGUS is a towntell, IMO. Lack of it is a scumtell in new players but null in determining the alignments of people with more experience. Anyway, I agree with your reads except that part where I'm a little scummy.

I'm done working with Seacore for the moment. Today I plan on working with you and Deer. I think we should form a bloc.

[Seacore]

I'm pro mass claim.

I'm done working with Seacore for the moment

*sniff* was it something I said? I can change!

I'm really not happy with Wicked. Can somebody explain to me why he can't be an SK?
I'd like Hero or CDB to claim first.

seacores d2 play seemed different than d1 play.

There is an obvious reason for this.
Day 1 involved a search to discover who was scummiest. I was aggressive in seeking this out. I found the scummiest person (who turned out to be a VI-Cop *sigh*), built my case and got the person lynched.
Day 2 involved finding the second scummiest person, which happened immediately (and turned out to be another VI), nobody was arguing well against that lynch, most people were lurking, there was nothing to post.

So yes, my play was different, because the situation was different.

[podium123456]

At this point, we don't want the vig/SK shooting unless it's a guarenteed hit anyway. Massclaim gives us several advantages: revealing the second killer narrows the pool for mislynch and forces the mafia to kill that player tonight.

Hmmm, i suppose that's right. Due to the circumstances, a vig isn't going to shoot... so that role is more useful to us as a clear, than as a killer.

I retract all that stuff i said previously, and wicked you dont have to respond to it.

[Deer]

I'm up for a mass claim. Also up for CDB going first.

As for Wicked's question, I think CDB, you, and possibly Hero.

[ChannelDelibird]

Vote: Seacore

[Seacore]

Really?

That's all?

Where's your "catch up" post

Where's your reasons?

Where's your claim? Or at least an explanation as to why you won't claim?

Ladies and Gentlesirs, I give you our scum.

[Ythill]

CDB, massclaim. You're first.

*sniff* was it something I said? I can change!

Your play was weak yesterday. I'm not convinced you're scum but you're on the B list.

I'm really not happy with Wicked. Can somebody explain to me why he can't be an SK?

His meta's all wrong. Plus it looks like our second killer is town. What difference does it make anyway? Only scum want to hunt a SK in LYLO. Are you scum?

@Deer & podium:

Neither of you responded to my bloc suggestion. We can include our least likely scum candidate after massclaim and control the lynch for the rest of the game, but we have to work together. Are you interested?

[Wickedestjr]

Ftr, my suspicion of Seacore has been increasing. I will explain later.

[podium123456]

@Deer & podium:

Neither of you responded to my bloc suggestion. We can include our least likely scum candidate after massclaim and control the lynch for the rest of the game, but we have to work together. Are you interested?

Oh, i thought you were making a joke.

Mmmmm... i suppose so.

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Vote: Seacore

translation: im scum

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YO... HERO....

say

something.

[Wickedestjr]

No. I'm not pursuing it because (1) your tone and actions were markedly different in Mafia in Sienna and (2) you get town cred in other places while other players seem(ed) scummier than you by a fair amount.

(2) Why does that mean you would ignore a point against me?

he specifically said that he didn't think he was scum for it though

Exilon's self vote is anti-town, but I can't see him doing that as scum

1: Wicked. So you're avoiding taking a stance here too?
2: I found your actions and Deer's actions anti town. I specifically said I didn't find them scummy, but wanted those kinds of actions to stop because they didn't help town.
That was my stance.
It was an obvious stance.

1: No. I said I can't see him self-voting as scum, meaning I got a town read from it. That is a stance.

2: In that case, I don't understand why you didn't express any suspicion (FoS or a vote) to apply pressure to them. The RVS was just ending and you didn't have any suspects. Why not pressure somebody who has done something anti-town? Seems like the strongest lead you could've had imo.

This comment shows me that you are getting caught arguing something you can't justify, and is the closest sign i've seen all game of an absent minded scum mistake.

1: If he specifically said he wasn't scum, then he is taking a much firmer stance than what you said would be required to avoid the argument (i find that townish/scummish)

2: As a matter of fact, i remember reading his line about you when he made it (i dont think he's scum, i think he's an idiot) and thinking to myself it was a bold statement to make at that point in the game.

1: My goodness! He said he didn't think we were scum

for our actions

. He wasn't saying he didn't think we were scum. He was saying he didn't find us suspicious at all for our actions. I can't believe you still don't understand this.

2: The only stance he is taking when he made that statement was that he thought I was an idiot. Which isn't even game relevant. That statement didn't tell us anything about what he thought my allignment was. He's even admitted that. What is so bold about that statement?

Additionally, so what if he said he didn't think he was scum... that doesn't change my point.

Can a townie do something that is anti-town? Yes. Would that action necessarily be described as 'scummy' if it's assumed that it wasn't intentional? No, it would just be an anti-town action.

Therefore, there was no additional stance he could have taken besides what he stated.

See my response to 490.

I missed that, sorry.

This was in response to Ythill's post 493. I find it very hard to believe that a townie would simply backoff so easily like this. He doesn't know that Ythill is town, so why doesn't he follow his own beliefs? (Hint: It's because he's not town.)

[Wickedestjr]

I really don't have much to say. Exilon seems to be digging himself into deeper and deeper holes.

This strikes me as a very unhelpful and irrelevant observation. More like an observation coming from somebody outside the game as opposed to somebody actually playing.

Hell, i can probably answer that for you right now... 1 vig/sk and 6 villagers.



and.... now that i think about it, there's probably no need in outing the vig (if it's a vig)... its the only advantage we have left.


arent you experienced enough to realize all this? or am i missing something with my thoughts here?

Well, are we supposed to not have a mass claim just because we don't think it will reveal that much information? In general mass claims are good to have if you think you are in LyLo.

I haven't reread D2 yet, and will do so before making any definitive scumpicks. However, I don't mind giving my off-the-cuff guesses now. Podium and Deer still look obv-town to me. The scum are among CDB, Wicked, Seacore, and Hero. CDB is at the top of the list. Over the next couple of days I'll go through the evidence and narrow it down to three.

@Wick: So you're going to ask for the suspicions of everyone except podium, and then not give your own? Bad.

Didn't you say earlier that you thought Seacore was town? Why is he still one of your possible candidates for scum?

As for my suspicions, I'm getting to that.

I'm really not happy with Wicked. Can somebody explain to me why he can't be an SK?

This is a change. Earlier you decided to ignore this point because of Ythill. What's changed?



I strongly dislike Ythill's bloc suggestion. Ythill, have you ever made that suggestion before?

[podium123456]

1: If he specifically said he wasn't scum, then he is taking a much firmer stance than what you said would be required to avoid the argument (i find that townish/scummish)

1: My goodness! He said he didn't think we were scum

for our actions

. He wasn't saying he didn't think we were scum. He was saying he didn't find us suspicious at all for our actions.

Actually, he flat out said he didnt think you were scum. Later, he stated he had a null read on you. (which are stances) Additionally, he pointed out things you two did that were anti-town.

Look, i get your point... you think he should have called yourself or deer suspicious because you did a suspicious thing. I think that isn't a valid argument, see the end of this post for yet another explanation.

2: As a matter of fact, i remember reading his line about you when he made it (i dont think he's scum, i think he's an idiot) and thinking to myself it was a bold statement to make at that point in the game.

2: The only stance he is taking when he made that statement was that he thought I was an idiot. Which isn't even game relevant. That statement didn't tell us anything about what he thought my allignment was. He's even admitted that. What is so bold about that statement?

Oh, i dont know... maybe the part where he said he didnt think you were scum. What in the hell did you think i was referring to? Seriously.

I dont like the way you argue. It doesn't feel genuine.

See my response to 490.

I'll repeat the questions. Can a townie do something that is anti town? Does that mean that person should always be considered suspicious, based on that action?

You are trying to pin a scum argument on seacore on what is essentially a subjective observation -- but you are requiring him to adopt

your

subjectivity. Example: look at my summary post above. I imply that i dont think deer is scum, and then i say that i think brevity is detrimental to the town.

Apparently you think i should FOS him because i pointed out something he was doing that i thought didnt help the town. But i dont find him suspicious because of that. But you are going to penalize me for not thinking he is. But i dont. repeat to infinity.

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IMO, unless CDB is unable to read, he was aware people wanted thoughts/claims from him when he made his vote post. Based on his previous lack of posting i'm not going to hold my breath and wait 2 weeks for a claim that never comes. So, if we want to mass claim, i say we go ahead. How do you guys want to proceed?

Also:

VOTE: ChannelDelibird

Seems painfully obvious that he is scum now. A townie wouldnt read all the requests for his inputs, and then make a post like that. Even if he wasn't that into the game (due to replacing) he would say

something

if he was town.

[Wickedestjr]

podium, please unvote. Please remember we are in LyLo.

[Wickedestjr]

Seacore and Ythill are scum. The third one is either Hero or Deer. I found CDB's slot suspicious until 1.) I looked at the slot in iso and 2.) I saw post 540. I'm 95% certain that podium is town.