Newbie 960 - Game Over

[Sotty7]

I advocate a policy lynch on andrew right now. He makes little or no sense, sounds very scummy, and is very anti-town even if he is not scum.

No. Newbie games are not the place for policy lynches. Either you think he is scummy so you vote for him, or you spend time explaining to him how things work to help him be more clear. These are games were people come to learn, policy lynching goes against that.

You also shouldn't link ongoing games, even if you are dead in them.

If we do find a better reason for a lynch, for instance if you find a good case against me, then definitely, go for that one.

I am only advocating a policy lynch right now because andrew is playing pretty anti-town. Whether that means he is scum or not is matter for discussion.

That was a very... Strange thing to say. Left me scratching my head. However your view on Ren bussing Andrew was actually pretty good and I never thought about it that way. Of course, it is waaaaay too early to be talking about partners and bussing, but something to think about if either flips scum later.

Why didn't you move your vote at this point?

1. What is your primary language?

2. Have you had any experience with Mafia outside of this website? It can be real-life Mafia, IRC Mafia, forum Mafia, anything Mafia- or Werewolves-related.

3. Do you feel Mafia theory has any place in scum hunting? Why or why not?

4. Should town players ever lie? Why or why not?

5. What is your preferred method of scum hunting? Why? (If this is your first time playing Mafia, I don't expect you to answer this question as thoroughly as everyone else, but I'd still like to hear your thoughts.)

6. What do you think about fence-sitters, the people who don't have a position either way? Is it an anti-town thing to do? Why or why not?

7. This question is very important. It must be answered. Coca-Cola or Pepsi?

1] English, but sometimes my dyslexia would have you think otherwise.

2] I've played on another website as well as this one. Never played in real life though

3] Sure. Mafia theory is a good place to start, but if you start debating theory in thread I'm going to find that scummy. It's called information over analysis and means you are really talking about the game. I say take what you learn from the wiki or MD and apply it to the game.

4] Never is a strong term. I will say that town shouldn't lie 99.9% of the time, and defiantly never in newbie games.

5] I'm from the pressure/ask questions school. Force people to take a position, make them take a stand. Reactions are the best way to scum hunt in my humble opinion.

6] Fence-sitters are scummy. You're trying to have it both ways and I don't like it. You'll probably earn my vote if you fence sit.

7] Pepsi.

Okay, I don't think I ever popped in recently, but I just happened to randomly vote someone I'm comfortable keeping my vote on for now. So I'm gonna keep my vote on andrew94 for a while, until someone else comes up.

I find this pretty scummy. No comments on anything that is going on in the thread, not sure if he has even read the thread. Also ignores Nom's excellent post 107 right above him talking about scum motivations. Instead is “comfortable” in keeping his vote on the leading bandwagon for... What?

There is absolutely nothing going on in this game,

so I am going to do something to spark discussion.

Vote: andrew94

For lack of anything else to go on, I am going to push for the policy lynch.

The bold is clearly a lie, since we're on page 6. This post so scummy it hurts my teeth.

Vote: Memnon

Cuz hes town but hes acting pretty anti-town so he is more of a hindrance to the town than a help. Therefore we policy lynch him. Not that my vote matters a whole lot, as it is still only L-2.

So you are voting for someone you think is town. Not helpful.

= = = = =

Desipte not liking his obsession with RVS/Ren at the start, the latest posts from Nom make me feel comfortable with him. I was also liking mb53's energy, shame he had to replace out.

My top suspects are Memnon, Titiboo and now Equinox. Equinox because she seems to be still fence sitting, pushing on Andrew while making excuses for his behavior and for how she is encouraging useless theory discussion in post 161. Equinox needs to post thoughts on the players ASAP.

Both Titiboo and Memnon's votes on Andrew are awful and they are one and two on my list because of that. Equinox isn't that far behind.

Ren is harder to read. I had an initial gut town read on them, but they need to stop tunneling on Andrew and offer thoughts on others. Andrew is sadly, probably town. He did start off looking bad, but as the game goes on he feels more of a newb town that is an easy target. Will keep an eye on him however.

---

Vote Count

Day 1; 9 alive, 5 to lynch

andrew94 (2) - Titiboo, Memnon
Titiboo (2) - NomDePlume, mb53
Memnon (1) - Sotty7

Yet to vote (4) - andrew94, Equinox, I Am Innocent, Ren

[I Am Innocent]

Just got home from a picnic and saw I replaced in. Give me a day or so to catch up, but as NDP can attest, I post alot, so just bare with me until I catch up. I will probably start my analysis tomorrow at work as the rest of this day is still pretty hectic for me...

[Equinox]

Equinox because she seems to be still fence sitting, pushing on Andrew while making excuses for his behavior and for how she is encouraging useless theory discussion in post 161. Equinox needs to post thoughts on the players ASAP.

I will admit to staying on the fence regarding andrew94's behavior. Some of the wording he's used suggests he's trying to hide something, but I cannot push a case based on that without considering the possibility that his guard can be linked to off-site meta.

I chose to ask those theory questions because that's where my RQS questions happened to be, and I was working off those. I thought it would be weird to ask questions in RQS, get responses, and then never address them again. Since we're getting some discussion now (hopefully), I suppose those questions are unnecessary now.

I'll post my thoughts as soon as I get a full player list to work with. I couldn't analyze half of the players due to lack of content (and not necessarily low post count). I've mentioned before that I believe there is at least one scum among the replacers; I'll return to that assessment when I hear more from I Am Innocent and whomever replaces mb53.

[I Am Innocent]

Cuz hes town but hes acting pretty anti-town so he is more of a hindrance to the town than a help. Therefore we policy lynch him. Not that my vote matters a whole lot, as it is still only L-2.

How are you so sure he is town? Also, is it good to ever waste a lynch on a townie? There is a 50% chance we don't have a doctor, in that case you get 2 mislynches. After that, LyLo.

[I Am Innocent]

Fair enough. I didn't think about it that way. Point taken.

However, what I meant was that I don't think he is scum but he is anti-town enough to make me want to have him removed. He hasn't done anything productive except, as you say, inadvertently provoke discussion. If I get a scum read on someone, rest assured that they will take priority.

How are you going to get a scum read on someone else, if your focus stays on Andrew?

[I Am Innocent]

Memnon: What do you think of NomDePlume's case against Titiboo?

I think it is pretty weak, seeing as Titiboo has posted a total of 5 times, and never more than 2 lines or so, but therein lies the problem. He is lurking a LOT. Or is he just not coming back? I hope not. Then we will need three replacements.

Still, NDP's case on Titiboo is better than the one on andrew. I guess I have to admit that.

I was gonna say we need more activity, but if three people have to be replaced, I guess it can't be helped.

The case on Titiboo is weak, but it is still better than the one on Andrew? And yet you continue to push for his lynch?

[I Am Innocent]

My Top 2

Memnon

Vote: Kenman

cuz my graphing calc said so!

I hate random votes.

We're trying to find scum, not prevent innocent townies from being lynched. That is our main focus. Obviously we don't want to lynch an innocent townie, but scumhunting comes first. Besides, there is no danger of anyone getting lynched at this point.

This last sentence just felt like a hint to a teammate to chill out, you're obv not in danger yet.

???????? This is very scummy...

There is no need for you to lie at all. If you see where Ren has lied, please share.

I advocate a policy lynch on andrew right now. He makes little or no sense, sounds very scummy, and is very anti-town even if he is not scum.

@mb53 I just read a game with razorback in it, and yeah, there are definitely similarities.

Unvote

Two Days later, he advocates the policy lynch, but yet doesn't go to L-1. Considering bussing a teammate?

There is absolutely nothing going on in this game, so I am going to do something to spark discussion.

Vote: andrew94

For lack of anything else to go on, I am going to push for the policy lynch.

Only when he gets to L-3 does Memnon vote for Andrew. Would seem like a safer place if Andrew is town.

@Everyone

Name your thoughts on the most likely scum pair in your mind. We need something to talk about. Even if it's a big stretch, tell us.

Equinox, because she is leading the entire thread, and I'm uncomfortable having to rely on one person.

Titiboo because he has been the most lurkerish.

These are very very weak, so take them with a grain of salt.

Andrew is not mentioned at all? Does Memnon see that there is still hope for Andrew?


******************

Andrew

He still has not voted anyone yet. He asked for another player's role, and the lie is still too much for me. Townies never need to lie.

Like I said earlier, these two could be teammates and Memnon was looking to bus, or Memnon was just hoping for the easy policy lynch on a townie target. Since both scenarios have Memnon as scum:

vote: Memnon

[Sotty7]

I'll post my thoughts as soon as I get a full player list to work with. I couldn't analyze half of the players due to lack of content (and not necessarily low post count). I've mentioned before that I believe there is at least one scum among the replacers; I'll return to that assessment when I hear more from I Am Innocent and whomever replaces mb53.

Why not post thoughts on the players that are here and worry about the others when they finally post? This sounds like stalling. If you think there is scum among the replacers, who and why? Come on, get your hands dirty already. Sitting back and asking theory questions isn't helping

this

game move forward at all.

[inHimshallibe]

ToG will be replacing mb53. Titiboo has failed to respond to his prods and will also be replaced. We should see smoother participation now.

[Memnon]

@I Am Innocent & Sotty7

I gave up the case on andrew a while ago, I just didn't formally state said event. Also I haven't taken my vote off him yet cuz there is nowhere to move it yet.

Oh btw you're not gonna include RVS in your case against me are you?

[Equinox]

I gave up the case on andrew a while ago, I just didn't formally state said event. Also I haven't taken my vote off him yet cuz there is nowhere to move it yet.

You could unvote.

[Memnon]

Touche. Lol. Didn't occur to me. *facepalm*

Unvote

[Memnon]

Back to square one, for me anyway.

[I Am Innocent]

@I Am Innocent & Sotty7

I gave up the case on andrew a while ago, I just didn't formally state said event. Also I haven't taken my vote off him yet cuz there is nowhere to move it yet.

Did you not list a Top 2 Suspects? How about starting there? Fencesitting is anti-town.

Oh btw you're not gonna include RVS in your case against me are you?

I take RVS & RQS for what they are, discussion starters. I think someone that uses a graphing calculator or excel random function generator is scared to draw attention. Town cannot afford to be scared to draw attention, we want everyone to get their fair share. It is the only way to catch scum really. Having people talk and having them make mistakes.

With that said, why exactly did you use a calculator to determine your vote?

[Memnon]

Why did I use a calculator? Look up random in the dictionary.

[ToG]

Hi,

I start answering the different questions and then I will do a complete reread of this thread.

1. What is your primary language?

German, also hoping to improve my english a little bit in this game.

2. Have you had any experience with Mafia outside of this website? It can be real-life Mafia, IRC Mafia, forum Mafia, anything Mafia- or Werewolves-related.

None, but I read through some games.

3. Do you feel Mafia theory has any place in scum hunting? Why or why not?

I think it is a good place to start, you shouldn't relay to much on it. But you can't ignore it.

4. Should town players ever lie? Why or why not?

A town player should never lie, it will only get him lynched and we don't want to lynch townies.

5. What is your preferred method of scum hunting? Why? (If this is your first time playing Mafia, I don't expect you to answer this question as thoroughly as everyone else, but I'd still like to hear your thoughts.)

I've got no idea, I think a good start will be if I read the thread again concentrating only on one player, to see how he interacts with the others. I did this already with mb53 to test my skills. He was playing very passive and mostly only repeating what Ren already did say. I will do this for every player and then post a town-scum list. Then I will start pressuring the guy at the top of my scum list.

6. What do you think about fence-sitters, the people who don't have a position either way? Is it an anti-town thing to do? Why or why not?

Fence-sitting means for me to not generate any content that can be analysed which is bad. Without content our lynch will be blind and mostly hit a townie.
So fence sitting is anti-town.

7. This question is very important. It must be answered. Coca-Cola or Pepsi?

Coca-Cola.

[Sotty7]

I gave up the case on andrew a while ago, I just didn't formally state said event. Also I haven't taken my vote off him yet cuz there is nowhere to move it yet.

You could unvote.

Hi.

I'll post my thoughts as soon as I get a full player list to work with. I couldn't analyze half of the players due to lack of content (and not necessarily low post count). I've mentioned before that I believe there is at least one scum among the replacers; I'll return to that assessment when I hear more from I Am Innocent and whomever replaces mb53.

Why not post thoughts on the players that are here and worry about the others when they finally post? This sounds like stalling. If you think there is scum among the replacers, who and why? Come on, get your hands dirty already. Sitting back and asking theory questions isn't helping

this

game move forward at all.

Unvote, Vote: Equinox

[ToG]

If mb53 has been voting anyone

Unvote

Ok, I have now completed my complete reread.

Town

Scotty7
I Am Innocent
Ren
NomDePlume
Equinox
Andrew94
Memnom

Scum

While Scotty7 hasn't posted much all hist post seem Pro town. Also him liking the play of mb53 and me knowing the alignment of mb53, helps a lot.

I agree with all attacks from I am Innocent, therefore he is on the 2. place of top.

Ren, good catch on the slip of andrew, also liking the possibility of a double Townie.

NomDePlume, I don't agree with the attack on the lurker.

Equinox, I think he lead the town good so far, also him stopping Ren from tunnelling Andrew was a good move. I like the Spreadsheet, I don't like that he is doing it.

Andrew94, Lying is bad.

Memnom, I don't like it how he is trying to lynch town for being noob. But he has somehow a point. This is a noob game, we are here to learn. If a player gets lynched for something. They will probably stop doing it. But I will never lynch a player of who I am not convinced is Scum.

Titiboo, soon getting replaced, therefore missing in the list.

@everyone who is interested in Ren, Read 909, they explain a little bit about them and Did.

@Ren in 909 Post 161 you say that you are 19, here you say that you are 21. That means that you life on a planet that rotates 6 times as fast as earth. Why do you lie about your location ?

@Equinox How do you interpret your own vote sheet ?
Is it legal to communicate from the grave through your spreadsheet with us ? What is the reason you are providing us with this spreadsheet ?

[Equinox]

I'm giving short responses because I'm still reading. I'll post something more substantial later.

Is it legal to communicate from the grave through your spreadsheet with us ? What is the reason you are providing us with this spreadsheet ?

I've mentioned in all the games in which I'm doing this that I'll continue the spreadsheet even if I'm dead. Now that you mention it, I should send PMs asking if that's okay... I'll go do that.

I'm making the spreadsheet for my own reference. I thought I might as well share it. I can't misrepresent anything on the spreadsheet anyway, since anyone can cross-reference it with the moderator's vote counts and their own tallies.

[Equinox]

Why not post thoughts on the players that are here and worry about the others when they finally post? This sounds like stalling. If you think there is scum among the replacers, who and why? Come on, get your hands dirty already. Sitting back and asking theory questions isn't helping this game move forward at all.

I was thinking of probability when I said I thought scum would be among the replacements. With four replacements needed, chances are there's one mafia among them.

I'm stalling because I don't like working with half a game. Lynch me for that if you will, but I think scum would be a bit more eager to push rather than sit back. There are plenty of cases to piggy back right now.

Is it legal to communicate from the grave through your spreadsheet with us ?

I got a "no" from one of the moderators, so I'll do the same thing here.

Spreadsheet

If I'm dead, spreadsheet dies with me.

---

Now that I've done a run through...

I'm tempted to call a Ren + andrew94 team based on their interaction, since it looks like distancing taken a bit too far. Both of them have been tunneling each other to the exclusion of all else.

I've defended andrew94's defensiveness before, but I can't deny that he appears to be hiding something.

Sotty7, I Am Innocent, and ToG appear to be fine, so my initial statement that one of the replacers is scum might not apply. Of course, we still need to hear from Titiboo's slot. Leaning town for NomDePlume.

Not sure what the obsession with Memnon's graphing calculator is. Sure, it's as bad as a dice vote, but scum could just as easily make up some reason during RVS as town. Not significant.

Null on Memnon. It looks like a bunch of newb tells to me, rather than scum tells.

I'll admit all that makes it look like I'm fence-sitting. Ugh.

---

We will still try to get on to post when we can but we will be really busy with work every day till monday and then things should go back to normal.

Ren last posted on Friday, and they'd previously hinted at limited access until today.

Requesting prod of Ren if they don't post by Tuesday afternoon.

what i meant was because all you are asking is questions, it is very hard to find YOUR slips

andrew94 last posted on Saturday with no indication of V/LA.

Requesting prod of andrew94.

[Equinox]

EBWOP:

I'm going insane. Today

is

Tuesday.

Just plain

requesting prod of Ren

. Thanks!

[andrew94]

[quote="ToG"]If mb53 has been voting anyone

Unvote

Ok, I have now completed my complete reread.

Town

Scotty7
I Am Innocent
Ren
NomDePlume
Equinox
Andrew94
Memnom

Scum

quote]

i am going to comment on this spreadsheat.
usually on my other website, mafia puts their teammate on the most suspicious people list as to not achieve suspision. also, since i am innocent justifies and some other guy agrees with him, you then place memnom on the most bottom. this is kinda sus cos you really look like your distancing yourself from him.


just my 2cents

[andrew94]

Why not post thoughts on the players that are here and worry about the others when they finally post? This sounds like stalling. If you think there is scum among the replacers, who and why? Come on, get your hands dirty already. Sitting back and asking theory questions isn't helping this game move forward at all.

I was thinking of probability when I said I thought scum would be among the replacements. With four replacements needed, chances are there's one mafia among them.

I'm stalling because I don't like working with half a game. Lynch me for that if you will, but I think scum would be a bit more eager to push rather than sit back. There are plenty of cases to piggy back right now.

Is it legal to communicate from the grave through your spreadsheet with us ?

I got a "no" from one of the moderators, so I'll do the same thing here.

Spreadsheet

If I'm dead, spreadsheet dies with me.

---

Now that I've done a run through...

I'm tempted to call a Ren + andrew94 team based on their interaction, since it looks like distancing taken a bit too far. Both of them have been tunneling each other to the exclusion of all else.

I've defended andrew94's defensiveness before, but I can't deny that he appears to be hiding something.

Sotty7, I Am Innocent, and ToG appear to be fine, so my initial statement that one of the replacers is scum might not apply. Of course, we still need to hear from Titiboo's slot. Leaning town for NomDePlume.

Not sure what the obsession with Memnon's graphing calculator is. Sure, it's as bad as a dice vote, but scum could just as easily make up some reason during RVS as town. Not significant.

Null on Memnon. It looks like a bunch of newb tells to me, rather than scum tells.

I'll admit all that makes it look like I'm fence-sitting. Ugh.

---

We will still try to get on to post when we can but we will be really busy with work every day till monday and then things should go back to normal.

Ren last posted on Friday, and they'd previously hinted at limited access until today.

Requesting prod of Ren if they don't post by Tuesday afternoon.

what i meant was because all you are asking is questions, it is very hard to find YOUR slips

andrew94 last posted on Saturday with no indication of V/LA.

Requesting prod of andrew94.

so basically, your still fence sitting? telling the mod to pod ppl is a way of not getting off the middle of the fence? correct me if i am wrong

[ToG]

If mb53 has been voting anyone

Unvote

Ok, I have now completed my complete reread.

Town

Scotty7
I Am Innocent
Ren
NomDePlume
Equinox
Andrew94
Memnom

Scum

i am going to comment on this spreadsheat.
usually on my other website, mafia puts their teammate on the most suspicious people list as to not achieve suspision. also, since i am innocent justifies and some other guy agrees with him, you then place memnom on the most bottom. this is kinda sus cos you really look like your distancing yourself from him.


just my 2cents

Why do you think I need to try to distance myself from Memnom ? I only told everyone what I am thinking about his attack and tried to understand his reasoning.

Could you please provide me with a link to a game where you previously played as town ?

Who is your most suspicious player ?

No comment on me catching Ren lying ?

every1 lies in this game, someone would lie about their age, others would lie about their time zones, some would lie about thier roles, others would lie about their EXPERIENCE

Oh and about your method of catching scum:

5. What is your preferred method of scum hunting? Why? (If this is your first time playing Mafia, I don't expect you to answer this question as thoroughly as everyone else, but I'd still like to hear your thoughts.)
this game is random because we dont even know all the roles, there are 4 different kinds? normally at other website some shit happens first day with a joker claiming everything, eventually most of the time wolf time loses due to jumpibng on lynch

The problem with this method is that we only got one week left. If we don't lynch till then we will get a nolynch. Therefore I don't think scum will hammer. They only need to wait to get a free kill...

Why do you need to know all 4 Roles to lynch ?
@ Andrew and Memnon
Which player would you be fine to lynch ?
Which player would you prefer get not lynched tonight ?

[I Am Innocent]

If mb53 has been voting anyone

Unvote

Ok, I have now completed my complete reread.

Town

Scotty7
I Am Innocent
Ren
NomDePlume
Equinox
Andrew94
Memnom

Scum

ToG, I do something similar on my own spreadsheet....ranking each player based on suspicion, as well as keeping voting histories and post counts.

I do not like publicizing such lists cause if we all say who we think is most town, it gives the scum easy night targets to pick off as these are people they most likely won't be able to get lynched.

Best Pro-Town advice I can give, list your top few mafia suspects, and also list anything scummy you notice along the way. If you do not find anything scummy or suspicious in a player and you do die, we can iso your posts and the lack of suspicion on some players will be telling enough.

Make sense?